Zone1 Apostles and Prophets are the foundation of the Church of Jesus Christ

Many active LDS temple goers do not believe that at all and have told me so. They believe that it was a cabal of apostles led by Brigham Young and Willard Richards that brought forth the practice. They had their plan to kill Joseph at Carthage fulfilled and seized the leadeship of the Church.
 
At times in the Old Testament God allowed the practice of plural marriage. We know that Abraham was married to Sarah, Hagar and Keturah. Jacob or Israel was married to Rachel, Leah, Bilhah, and Zilpah. David and Solomon were married also to many wives. This was allowed by God at times but only when God allowed it to be so.

In the New Testament we read that there was to be a dispensation of the fulness of times. In that time, God would bring about a restitution of all things spoken of by all the prophets since the world began.

Ephesians 1:10
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

Acts 3:19–21
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

In the dispensation of the fulness of times, God would restore, for a time, that which was had among all the prophets of times past. This includes the practice of plural marriage. This practice was restored to the prophet Joseph Smith. Now that the prophecy has been fulfilled, it is no longer required to be practiced. It was part of the restitution of all things which God hath spoken by the mouth of all the holy prophets since the world began. The revelation given to the prophet Joseph Smith can be found in the Doctrine and Covenants 132.

Joseph Smith was the first prophet who opened the dispensation of the fulness of times. Through him, the ancient practice of plural marriage was restored as part of the restitution of all things which God hath spoken by the mouth of all the holy prophets since the world began.
 
John Edgar Slow Horses said:
Many active LDS temple goers do not believe that at all and have told me so. They believe that it was a cabal of apostles led by Brigham Young and Willard Richards that brought forth the practice. They had their plan to kill Joseph at Carthage fulfilled and seized the leadeship of the Church.
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Yes, there are those who wish to think that it was not a practice from the Lord. However, the church still holds to the revelation of Doctrine and Covenants 132 as being from the Lord. Below is a writing on the practice of plural marriage found on our church's website regarding plural marriage practiced in the early days of the church:

Plural Marriage and Families in Early Utah​

The Bible and the Book of Mormon teach that the marriage of one man to one woman is God’s standard, except at specific periods when He has declared otherwise.1
In accordance with a revelation to Joseph Smith, the practice of plural marriage—the marriage of one man to two or more women—was instituted among members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in the early 1840s. Thereafter, for more than half a century, plural marriage was practiced by some Latter-day Saints. Only the Church President held the keys authorizing the performance of new plural marriages.2 In 1890, the Lord inspired Church President Wilford Woodruff to issue a statement that led to the end of the practice of plural marriage in the Church. In this statement, known as the Manifesto, President Woodruff declared his intention to abide by U.S. law forbidding plural marriage and to use his influence to convince members of the Church to do likewise.3
After the Manifesto, monogamy was advocated in the Church both over the pulpit and through the press. On an exceptional basis, some new plural marriages were performed between 1890 and 1904, especially in Mexico and Canada, outside the jurisdiction of U.S. law; a small number of plural marriages were performed within the United States during those years.4 In 1904, the Church strictly prohibited new plural marriages.5 Today, any person who practices plural marriage cannot become or remain a member of the Church.
This essay primarily addresses plural marriage as practiced by the Latter-day Saints between 1847 and 1890, following their exodus to the U.S. West and before the Manifesto.
Latter-day Saints do not understand all of God’s purposes for instituting, through His prophets, the practice of plural marriage during the 19th century. The Book of Mormon identifies one reason for God to command it: to increase the number of children born in the gospel covenant in order to “raise up seed unto [the Lord]” (Jacob 2:30). Plural marriage did result in the birth of large numbers of children within faithful Latter-day Saint homes.6 It also shaped 19th-century Mormon society in other ways: marriage became available to virtually all who desired it; per-capita inequality of wealth was diminished as economically disadvantaged women married into more financially stable households;7 and ethnic intermarriages were increased, which helped to unite a diverse immigrant population.8 Plural marriage also helped create and strengthen a sense of cohesion and group identification among Latter-day Saints. Church members came to see themselves as a “peculiar people,”9 covenant-bound to carry out the commands of God despite outside opposition, willing to endure ostracism for their principles.10
For these early Latter-day Saints, plural marriage was a religious principle that required personal sacrifice. Accounts left by men and women who practiced plural marriage attest to the challenges and difficulties they experienced, such as financial difficulty, interpersonal strife, and some wives’ longing for the sustained companionship of their husbands.11 But accounts also record the love and joy many found within their families. They believed it was a commandment of God at that time and that obedience would bring great blessings to them and their posterity, both on earth and in the life to come. While there was much love, tenderness, and affection within many plural marriages, the practice was generally based more on religious belief than on romantic love.12 Church leaders taught that participants in plural marriages should seek to develop a generous spirit of unselfishness and the pure love of Christ for everyone involved.
During the years that plural marriage was publicly taught, all Latter-day Saints were expected to accept the principle as a revelation from God.13 Not all, however, were expected to live it. Indeed, this system of marriage could not have been universal due to the ratio of men to women.14 Church leaders viewed plural marriage as a command to the Church generally, while recognizing that individuals who did not enter the practice could still stand approved of God.15 Women were free to choose their spouses, whether to enter into a polygamous or monogamous union, or whether to marry at all.16 Some men entered plural marriage because they were asked to do so by Church leaders, while others initiated the process themselves; all were required to obtain the approval of Church leaders before entering a plural marriage.17
The passage of time shaped the experience of life within plural marriage. Virtually all of those practicing it in the earliest years had to overcome their own prejudice against plural marriage and adjust to life in polygamous families. The task of pioneering a semiarid land during the middle decades of the 19th century added to the challenges of families who were learning to practice the principle of plural marriage. Where the family lived—whether in Salt Lake City, with its multiple social and cultural opportunities, or the rural hinterlands, where such opportunities were fewer in number—made a difference in how plural marriage was experienced. It is therefore difficult to accurately generalize about the experience of all plural marriages.
Still, some patterns are discernible, and they correct some myths. Although some leaders had large polygamous families, two-thirds of polygamist men had only two wives at a time.18 Church leaders recognized that plural marriages could be particularly difficult for women. Divorce was therefore available to women who were unhappy in their marriages; remarriage was also readily available.19 Women did marry at fairly young ages in the first decade of Utah settlement (age 16 or 17 or, infrequently, younger), which was typical of women living in frontier areas at the time.20 As in other places, women married at older ages as the society matured. Almost all women married, and so did a large percentage of men. In fact, it appears that a larger percentage of men in Utah married than elsewhere in the United States at the time. Probably half of those living in Utah Territory in 1857 experienced life in a polygamous family as a husband, wife, or child at some time during their lives.21 By 1870, 25 to 30 percent of the population lived in polygamous households, and it appears that the percentage continued to decrease over the next 20 years.22
The experience of plural marriage toward the end of the 19th century was substantially different from that of earlier decades. Beginning in 1862, the U.S. government passed laws against the practice of plural marriage. Outside opponents mounted a campaign against the practice, stating that they hoped to protect Mormon women and American civilization. For their part, many Latter-day Saint women publicly defended the practice of plural marriage, arguing in statements that they were willing participants.23
After the U.S. Supreme Court found the anti-polygamy laws to be constitutional in 1879, federal officials began prosecuting polygamous husbands and wives during the 1880s.24 Believing these laws to be unjust, Latter-day Saints engaged in civil disobedience by continuing to practice plural marriage and by attempting to avoid arrest. When convicted, they paid fines and submitted to jail time. To help their husbands avoid prosecution, plural wives often separated into different households or went into hiding under assumed names, particularly when pregnant or after giving birth.25
By 1890, when President Woodruff’s Manifesto lifted the command to practice plural marriage, Mormon society had developed a strong, loyal core of members, mostly made up of emigrants from Europe and the Eastern United States. But the demographic makeup of the worldwide Church membership had begun to change. Beginning in the 1890s converts outside the United States were asked to build up the Church in their homelands rather than move to Utah. In subsequent decades, Latter-day Saints migrated away from the Great Basin to pursue new opportunities. Plural marriage had never been encouraged outside of concentrated populations of Latter-day Saints. Especially in these newly formed congregations outside of Utah, monogamous families became central to religious worship and learning. As the Church grew and spread beyond the American West, the monogamous nuclear family was well suited to an increasingly mobile and dispersed membership.
For many who practiced it, plural marriage was a significant sacrifice. Despite the hardships some experienced, the faithfulness of those who practiced plural marriage continues to benefit the Church in innumerable ways. Through the lineage of these 19th-century Saints have come many Latter-day Saints who have been faithful to their gospel covenants as righteous mothers and fathers, loyal disciples of Jesus Christ, and devoted Church members, leaders, and missionaries. Although members of the contemporary Church are forbidden to practice plural marriage, modern Latter-day Saints honor and respect these pioneers who gave so much for their faith, families, and community.
 
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onefour1 said:
From the days of Moses, the Israelites were under a lesser law known as the law of Moses. They were headed by the Aaronic priesthood which was a lesser priesthood than the Melchizedek priesthood. When Jesus came upon the earth, he restored the Melchizedek priesthood and called Apostles and Prophets to lead the church. Jesus began to teach the Israelites the true nature of God and that the godhead consists of The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.

Matthew 28:19
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are three separate and distinct beings and persons. The Father is an immortal man with an immortal body of flesh and bones. The Son was a spirit before coming to this earth and taking on a body of flesh and bones. He then suffered and died for the sins of all the world and then was resurrected and now has an immortal body of flesh and bones. The Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit and does not have a body of flesh and bones. Eventually he too will receive an immortal body of flesh and bones but his mission in this life for now is to be a spirit. All three of these beings represent the one true God.

The true church of Jesus Christ was established under the higher priesthood of God and was to have Apostles and Prophets until we all come to the unity of faith.

Matthew 3:16-17
16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
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No matter what you think do or say--God was never a trinity=100% fact of life.
 
onefour1 said:
When Christ established His Church while He was on the earth, He called Apostles and Prophets to lead the church. Thus the church was founded upon Apostles and Prophets.

Ephesians 2:19-22
19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Ephesians 4:11-14
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

We learn from the above that as long as the church was upon the face of the earth that it would contain Apostles and Prophets for the work of the ministry and the edifying of the body of Christ until we all come in the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ. Thus unless we are perfected in Christ, we should always see Apostles and Prophets leading the true church of Jesus Christ. By this you can know if a church is not the true church of Jesus Christ if they do not have Apostles and Prophets that lead the church.

Apostle​

The word means “one sent forth.” It was the title Jesus gave (Luke 6:13) to the Twelve whom He chose and ordained (John 15:16) to be His closest disciples during His ministry on earth and whom He sent forth to represent Him after His Ascension into heaven. The calling of an Apostle is to be a special witness of the name of Jesus Christ in all the world, particularly of His divinity and of His bodily resurrection from the dead (Acts 1:22; D&C 107:23).
Twelve men with this high calling constitute an administrative council in the work of the ministry. When a vacancy occurred with the death of Judas Iscariot, Matthias was divinely appointed to that special office as a member of the council (Acts 1:15–26). Today twelve men with this same divine calling and ordination constitute the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The title was also applied to others who, though not of the number of the original Twelve, yet were called to serve as special witnesses of the Lord. Paul repeatedly spoke of himself as an Apostle (Rom. 1:1; 1 Cor. 1:1; 9:1; Gal. 1:1). He applied the title to James, the Lord’s brother (Gal. 1:19), and also to Barnabas (1 Cor. 9:5–6; see also Acts 14:14). The New Testament does not inform us whether these three brethren also served in the Council of the Twelve as vacancies occurred therein, or whether they were Apostles strictly in the sense of being special witnesses for the Lord Jesus Christ.
Jesus is referred to as an Apostle in Heb. 3:1–2, a designation meaning that He is the personal and select representative of the Father.

Prophet​

A person who has been called by and speaks for God. As a messenger of God, a prophet receives commandments, prophecies, and revelations from God. His responsibility is to make known God’s will and true character to mankind and to show the meaning of His dealings with them. A prophet denounces sin and foretells its consequences. He is a preacher of righteousness. On occasion, prophets may be inspired to foretell the future for the benefit of mankind. His primary responsibility, however, is to bear witness of Christ. The President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is God’s prophet on earth today. Members of the First Presidency and the Twelve Apostles are sustained as prophets, seers, and revelators.
  • Would God that all the Lord’s people were prophets, Num. 11:29.
  • If there be a prophet, I the Lord will make myself known unto him in a vision, Num. 12:6.
  • The Lord testified against Israel by all the prophets, 2 Kgs. 17:13 (2 Chr. 36:15–16; Jer. 7:25).
  • I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations, Jer. 1:5, 7.
  • He revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets, Amos 3:7.
  • He spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, Luke 1:70 (Acts 3:21).
  • All the prophets witnessed of Christ, Acts 10:43.
  • God hath set prophets in the Church, 1 Cor. 12:28 (Eph. 4:11).
  • The Church is built on a foundation of Apostles and prophets, Eph. 2:19–20.
  • The people have rejected the words of the prophets, 1 Ne. 3:17–18 (2 Ne. 26:3).
  • By the Spirit are all things made known unto the prophets, 1 Ne. 22:1–2.
  • Christ came to the Nephites to fulfill all he had spoken by the mouths of his holy prophets, 3 Ne. 1:13 (D&C 42:39).
  • Those who will not give heed to the words of prophets shall be cut off, D&C 1:14.
  • Those who believe the words of the prophets have eternal life, D&C 20:26.
  • The prophet’s word ye shall receive, as if from mine own mouth, D&C 21:4–6.
  • Revelations and commandments for the Church come only through the one appointed, D&C 43:1–7.
  • The duty of the President is to preside over the whole Church and to be like unto Moses, to be prophet, D&C 107:91–92.
  • We believe in prophets, A of F 1:6.
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Jesus Christ is the "chief cornerstone" (Eph. 2:19-22) which compares the church that Christ built (Matt. 16) with a body in order to demonstrate that no one part of the body is more or less important than another, with the exception of the Blood where the "life of the all the flesh" is located (Lev.17:11-14) .....JESUS CHRIST IS THAT BLOOD. (Romans 5:9).


A house or body that is already constructed.......no longer requires a foundation, if that foundation is UP TO CODE. The church/body was fully established by the "Saints" in the 1st century AD. (Jude 3).........a foundation exists only ONCE......once for all (time)....even though some fake religions have attempted to re-construct that foundation thousands of years after the Christ's foundation was completed.

JUDE 3 deals with false teachers "Beloved, although I was eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend FOR THE FAITH THAT WAS ONCE FOR ALL (time implied) DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS."
 
kjw47 said:
No matter what you think do or say--God was never a trinity=100% fact of life.
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God, Godhead​

There are three separate persons in the Godhead: God, the Eternal Father; His Son, Jesus Christ; and the Holy Ghost. We believe in each of Them (A of F 1:1). From latter-day revelation we learn that the Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bone and that the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit, without flesh and bone (D&C 130:22–23). These three persons are one in perfect unity and harmony of purpose and doctrine (John 17:21–23; 2 Ne. 31:21; 3 Ne. 11:27, 36).

GOD THE FATHER​

It is generally the Father, or Elohim, who is referred to by the title God. He is called the Father because He is the father of our spirits (Num. 16:22; 27:16; Mal. 2:10; Matt. 6:9; Eph. 4:6; Heb. 12:9). God the Father is the supreme ruler of the universe. He is all powerful (Gen. 18:14; Alma 26:35; D&C 19:1–3), all knowing (Matt. 6:8; 2 Ne. 2:24), and everywhere present through His Spirit (Ps. 139:7–12; D&C 88:7–13, 41). Mankind has a special relationship to God that sets man apart from all other created things: men and women are God’s spirit children (Ps. 82:6; 1 Jn. 3:1–3; D&C 20:17–18).
There are few recorded instances of God the Father appearing to or speaking to man. The scriptures say that He spoke to Adam and Eve (Moses 4:14–31) and introduced Jesus Christ on several occasions (Matt. 3:17; 17:5; John 12:28–29; 3 Ne. 11:3–7). He appeared to Stephen (Acts 7:55–56) and Joseph Smith (JS—H 1:17). Later He appeared to both Joseph Smith and Sidney Rigdon (D&C 76:20, 23). To those who love God and purify themselves before Him, God sometimes grants the privilege of seeing and knowing for themselves that He is God (Matt. 5:8; 3 Ne. 12:8; D&C 76:116–118; 93:1).

GOD THE SON​

The God known as Jehovah is the Son, Jesus Christ (Isa. 12:2; 43:11; 49:26; 1 Cor. 10:1–4; 1 Tim. 1:1; Rev. 1:8; 2 Ne. 22:2). Jesus works under the direction of the Father and is in complete harmony with Him. All mankind are His brothers and sisters, for He is the eldest of the spirit children of Elohim. Some scripture references refer to Him by the word God. For example, the scripture says that “God created the heaven and the earth” (Gen. 1:1), but it was actually Jesus who was the Creator under the direction of God the Father (John 1:1–3, 10, 14; Heb. 1:1–2).

GOD THE HOLY GHOST​

The Holy Ghost is also a God and is called the Holy Spirit, the Spirit, and the Spirit of God, among other similar names and titles. With the aid of the Holy Ghost, man can know the will of God the Father and know that Jesus is the Christ (1 Cor. 12:3).
 
Clyde 154 said:
Jesus Christ is the "chief cornerstone" (Eph. 2:19-22) which compares the church that Christ built (Matt. 16) with a body in order to demonstrate that no one part of the body is more or less important than another, with the exception of the Blood where the "life of the all the flesh" is located (Lev.17:11-14) .....JESUS CHRIST IS THAT BLOOD. (Romans 5:9).


A house or body that is already constructed.......no longer requires a foundation, if that foundation is UP TO CODE. The church/body was fully established by the "Saints" in the 1st century AD. (Jude 3).........a foundation exists only ONCE......once for all (time)....even though some fake religions have attempted to re-construct that foundation thousands of years after the Christ's foundation was completed.

JUDE 3 deals with false teachers "Beloved, although I was eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend FOR THE FAITH THAT WAS ONCE FOR ALL (time implied) DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS."
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No building can stand without its foundation. Again, the Apostle of Jesus Christ known as Paul taught the following:

Ephesians 4:11-14
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

According to the Apostle Paul, Jesus gave us Apostles and Prophets among other offices of the church for the perfecting of the saints and the work of the ministry and for the edifying of the boy of Christ UNTIL we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ. I don't think that any group of church members have reached that goal. Thus the church should still have Apostles and Prophets. It is the foundation on which Jesus built his church and if you destroy the foundation the church will fail. The church established by Jesus Christ in the meridian of time was persecuted and the world killed the Apostles of Jesus Christ. The church fell into apostasy but after that it was again restored to the earth through the calling of new Apostles and Prophets in 1830 through the prophet Joseph Smith. Today the true church of Jesus Christ has been restored through revelations and anyone can join the church and receive the blessings of the gospel. again.

The woman, who is the church, is no longer in the wilderness and has been restored before the coming day of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ at his second coming.

Revelation 12:6
6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
 
kjw47 said:
Not a single attendee of the synagogues EVER knew God as a trinity. WHY? Because God is not a trinity.
Yes Jesus true religion serves the same God taught, served and worshipped by the Israelites.= The Abrahamic God= a single being God=YHVH(Jehovah) = 0 doubt in all creation.
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YOU DONT EVEN KNOW WHAT THE TRINITY IS.
 
onefour1 said:
No building can stand without its foundation. Again, the Apostle of Jesus Christ known as Paul taught the following:

Ephesians 4:11-14
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

According to the Apostle Paul, Jesus gave us Apostles and Prophets among other offices of the church for the perfecting of the saints and the work of the ministry and for the edifying of the boy of Christ UNTIL we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ. I don't think that any group of church members have reached that goal. Thus the church should still have Apostles and Prophets. It is the foundation on which Jesus built his church and if you destroy the foundation the church will fail. The church established by Jesus Christ in the meridian of time was persecuted and the world killed the Apostles of Jesus Christ. The church fell into apostasy but after that it was again restored to the earth through the calling of new Apostles and Prophets in 1830 through the prophet Joseph Smith. Today the true church of Jesus Christ has been restored through revelations and anyone can join the church and receive the blessings of the gospel. again.

The woman, who is the church, is no longer in the wilderness and has been restored before the coming day of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ at his second coming.

Revelation 12:6
6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
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Having comprehension problems? Eph 4:13 "TILL WE ALL COME IN THE UNITY OF THE FAITH.....AND THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE SON OF GOD, UNTO A PERFECT MAN.......(perfect in the original Koine Greek translates to COMPLETE/WHOLE.......

In the book of James we find the PERFECT (complete/whole) LAW OF LIBERTY (complete N.T. revelations) has already been delivered........(James 2:25)

THE FAITH....as delivered to the Saints (which made up the foundation of the body/church) has been delivered ONCE FOR ALL TIME (James 3)

What source is used to make the "man of God" perfectly complete in acquiring the knowledge necessary for salvation of the body? The Word of God makes the man of God.......PERFECT/WHOLE (in the original Koine Greek) -- 2 Tim 3:16-17 There is nothing new under the sun (Eccl 1.9)..........the knowledge that can make the man of God perfect was the same in the 1st century as it is in the 21st century. There can be ONLY ONE FOUNDATION. And that foundation was not established/built in the middle of the 19th century (the propaganda used by the Mormon Cult and the con artist Joseph Smith).......the foundation of THE FAITH of CHRISTIANITY was established ONCE FOR ALL in the 1st century.

The Christ has died in vain if we do not have access to the knowledge to make the human soul PERFECT (without sin).
 
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Clyde 154 said:
Having comprehension problems? Eph 4:13 "TILL WE ALL COME IN THE UNITY OF THE FAITH.....AND THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE SON OF GOD, UNTO A PERFECT MAN.......(perfect in the original Koine Greek translates to COMPLETE/WHOLE.......

In the book of James we find the PERFECT (complete/whole) LAW OF LIBERTY (complete N.T. revelations) has already been delivered........(James 2:25)

THE FAITH....as delivered to the Saints (which made up the foundation of the body/church) has been delivered ONCE FOR ALL TIME (James 3)

What source is used to make the "man of God" perfectly complete in acquiring the knowledge necessary for salvation of the body? The Word of God makes the man of God.......PERFECT/WHOLE (in the original Koine Greek) -- 2 Tim 3:16-17 There is nothing new under the sun (Eccl 1.9)..........the knowledge that can make the man of God perfect was the same in the 1st century as it is in the 21st century. There can be ONLY ONE FOUNDATION. And that foundation was not established/built in the middle of the 19th century (the propaganda used by the Mormon Cult and the con artist Joseph Smith).......the foundation of THE FAITH of CHRISTIANITY was established ONCE FOR ALL in the 1st century.

The Christ has died in vain if we do not have access to the knowledge to make the human soul PERFECT (without sin).
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You know as well as I do that Paul was not referring to the word of God but was referring to Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Pastors, and Teachers for the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry for the edifying of the body of Christ. The body of Christ is the Church. Apostles and Prophets were needed for the edifying of the body of Christ or his church. Paul tells us that these ministers of the gospel were needed until we all come in the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ. So my question to you is, have we all come to a unity of the faith and a knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ? I know that this has not occurred and that we are still in need of the edifying of these ministers. Yes, they use the word of God to go about preaching but we have not all come to the perfect man. You are a fool if you think this has occurred. The foundation of Christ's church from the beginning of when he established his church was built upon this principle of having Apostles an Prophets. This foundation was to remain in Christ's church until we all came to the unity of the faith. We are nowhere near that goal. The reason that many churches do not have Apostles and Prophets is because they have gone apostate from Christ's true church. True, the foundation was established during Christ's ministry on the earth, but through apostasy, this truth was lost and needed to again be restored upon the earth. It was again restored in the 19th century and does now exist upon the face of the earth.

Ephesians 4:11-14
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
 
onefour1 said:
You know as well as I do that Paul was not referring to the word of God but was referring to Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Pastors, and Teachers for the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry for the edifying of the body of Christ. The body of Christ is the Church. Apostles and Prophets were needed for the edifying of the body of Christ or his church. Paul tells us that these ministers of the gospel were needed until we all come in the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ. So my question to you is, have we all come to a unity of the faith and a knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ? I know that this has not occurred and that we are still in need of the edifying of these ministers. Yes, they use the word of God to go about preaching but we have not all come to the perfect man. You are a fool if you think this has occurred. The foundation of Christ's church from the beginning of when he established his church was built upon this principle of having Apostles an Prophets. This foundation was to remain in Christ's church until we all came to the unity of the faith. We are nowhere near that goal. The reason that many churches do not have Apostles and Prophets is because they have gone apostate from Christ's true church. True, the foundation was established during Christ's ministry on the earth, but through apostasy, this truth was lost and needed to again be restored upon the earth. It was again restored in the 19th century and does now exist upon the face of the earth.

Ephesians 4:11-14
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
Click to expand...
Paul? Paul declared that the supernatural gifts of the Spirit that helped lay the foundation to the church/body would "FAIL" when the Perfect was achieved.....i.e, when the infant church matured and no longer required a nanny. James declared the Perfect Law of Liberty (New Testament of Jesus Christ) was already in existence in the mid 1st century. (James 1:25).......the Greek Word PERFECT (TELEIOS) used in James is the same Greek Word used by Paul in 1 Cor. 13 it means MADE WHOLE or COMPLETE in English.....The perfect is a THING to be hoped for.......not a person or God such as Jesus Christ.

Read.........Comprehend 1 Cor. 13 in context. Paul is informing the Corinthians they should not abuse the Supernatural Gifts given to them by the laying on of an Apostles Hand.......they were making a show for entertainment out of the gifts instead of using them to help spread the gospel truth and build up the infant church/body of Christ. The people of Corinth had a history of practicing paganist religions......Paul is the one that helped spread the gospel to such people (Paul was the Apostles to the Gentiles) PAUL was more or less Chastising these people.........in a loving manner.

Paul informs us these Gifts of the Spirit would cease, "Love never ends. As for PROPHECIES......they will PASS AWAY, as for TONGUES....they will CEASE, as for KNOWLEDGE (as in supernatural knowledge gained through the gift of the Spirit instead of learning), IT WILL PASS AWAY.........

When were these supernatural gifts and prophecies to fail or cease? ".........for we now (in the 1st century) see in part and PROPHESY, BUT WHEN THE PERFECT (teleios: whole/complete/finished) COMES (the perfect is not addressing the 2nd coming of the Christ but the completion of the PERFECT (teleios) LAW OF LIBERTY -- James 1:25

Paul informs them that no one person is in possession of the whole truth.....the truth of the gospel is being spread through the help of the Holy Spirit.......men in the infant stages of the church/body KNEW ONLY IN PART (those under the New Testament of Christ did not have formal scripture to study and use as doctrine as existed under the old law (which was nailed to the Cross of Christ).........the truth of the Gospel was being spread through different people......until ALL THE INFORMATION REQUIRED for DOCTRINE was delivered to the body/church from Heaven. In 2 Tim. 3:16-17 we learn that man....through the scriptures delivered by the Holy Spirit through the Apostles and saints (those with the gifts of the spirit)....man NOW (in the 1st century) had all that was required of God to find salvation.........THE WORD OF GOD...........all ALL SCRIPTURE is a product of God's Holy Spirit delivered once for all time in the 1st century.


Do the gifts of the spirit exist today? Of course.........but they are limited to Faith, Hope and Charity/Love......God has no respect of person. 1 Cor. 13 ends with the remaining revelations gifted to mankind through the Spirit. LOVE is above all other gifts. For all the other gifts other than faith and hope were designed to fail once they fulfilled their purpose.......and the infant church grew into maturity. Paul explains it best........the people at Corinth were acting like children with new toys instead of properly using the gifts of the spirit. "When I was a child I thought like a child, I spoke as a child, I reasoned like a child.........WHEN I GREW UP, I PUT AWAY CHILDISH THINGS.." -- 1 Cor. 13:8

After God revealed to mankind ALL THAT WAS REQUIRED of God for man........THE PERFECT LAW OF LIBERTY (scripture; revelation from God) existed in the 1st century and its endured through the 21st century. WHO can stop GOD........those with lying tongues attempt to stop the Perfect Law of Liberty from being exercised........instead of acting like adults they worshiping false prophets and con artists......they demand a SHOW like a pagan.

GROW UP stop playing church and pretending you have these gifts..........like children. Become mature Christians and accept the fact that you are master of your own faith through the gift of free will...........emulate the LOVE of CHRIST, don't declare you have the power of the Spirit when its obvious (you can't preform the same acts of the Apostles of Christ).
 
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onefour1 said:

God, Godhead​

There are three separate persons in the Godhead: God, the Eternal Father; His Son, Jesus Christ; and the Holy Ghost. We believe in each of Them (A of F 1:1). From latter-day revelation we learn that the Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bone and that the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit, without flesh and bone (D&C 130:22–23). These three persons are one in perfect unity and harmony of purpose and doctrine (John 17:21–23; 2 Ne. 31:21; 3 Ne. 11:27, 36).

GOD THE FATHER​

It is generally the Father, or Elohim, who is referred to by the title God. He is called the Father because He is the father of our spirits (Num. 16:22; 27:16; Mal. 2:10; Matt. 6:9; Eph. 4:6; Heb. 12:9). God the Father is the supreme ruler of the universe. He is all powerful (Gen. 18:14; Alma 26:35; D&C 19:1–3), all knowing (Matt. 6:8; 2 Ne. 2:24), and everywhere present through His Spirit (Ps. 139:7–12; D&C 88:7–13, 41). Mankind has a special relationship to God that sets man apart from all other created things: men and women are God’s spirit children (Ps. 82:6; 1 Jn. 3:1–3; D&C 20:17–18).
There are few recorded instances of God the Father appearing to or speaking to man. The scriptures say that He spoke to Adam and Eve (Moses 4:14–31) and introduced Jesus Christ on several occasions (Matt. 3:17; 17:5; John 12:28–29; 3 Ne. 11:3–7). He appeared to Stephen (Acts 7:55–56) and Joseph Smith (JS—H 1:17). Later He appeared to both Joseph Smith and Sidney Rigdon (D&C 76:20, 23). To those who love God and purify themselves before Him, God sometimes grants the privilege of seeing and knowing for themselves that He is God (Matt. 5:8; 3 Ne. 12:8; D&C 76:116–118; 93:1).

GOD THE SON​

The God known as Jehovah is the Son, Jesus Christ (Isa. 12:2; 43:11; 49:26; 1 Cor. 10:1–4; 1 Tim. 1:1; Rev. 1:8; 2 Ne. 22:2). Jesus works under the direction of the Father and is in complete harmony with Him. All mankind are His brothers and sisters, for He is the eldest of the spirit children of Elohim. Some scripture references refer to Him by the word God. For example, the scripture says that “God created the heaven and the earth” (Gen. 1:1), but it was actually Jesus who was the Creator under the direction of God the Father (John 1:1–3, 10, 14; Heb. 1:1–2).

GOD THE HOLY GHOST​

The Holy Ghost is also a God and is called the Holy Spirit, the Spirit, and the Spirit of God, among other similar names and titles. With the aid of the Holy Ghost, man can know the will of God the Father and know that Jesus is the Christ (1 Cor. 12:3).
Click to expand...
Father and son both have personal names---HS=0
Father and son both called king--HS=0
Father and son both seen on a throne---HS=0
Father shares honor-glory and the such with Jesus---HS=0
One must know Father and son to get eternal life--HS=0
 
ninja007 said:
YOU DONT EVEN KNOW WHAT THE TRINITY IS.
Click to expand...
Yes i do, a creation by Catholicism in 381 ce at the council of Constantinople=100% recorded history fact. No trinity was served by any follower prior to them making God into a trinity. No true follower ever served a trinity.
 
onefour1 said:
Is it really a "knowitall" attitude to point out that the church of Jesus Christ was founded on Apostles and Prophets and that they should always be present in the church until we all come to a unity of the faith? Is it surprising that the church of Jesus Christ should always have Apostles and Prophets until we come to the measure of the fulness of the stature of Christ? I don't personally find that to be a "knowitall" statement.
Click to expand...

Well, they did make up their own Bible stories.

Moses 4

How Satan became the devil—He tempts Eve—Adam and Eve fall, and death enters the world.
www.churchofjesuschrist.org
 
So many say the Mormon story is made up.
 
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