America's Debt: Shame on Them

[Toro]

WE cannot balance the budget without both raising taxes and reducing spending, folks.

To attempt to do it without doing some of BOTH would destroy this nation.

When is the last time Congress raised revenues by raising taxes and didn't see that as license to increase spending? That is the fallacy in your statement. A balanced budget that does not include spending cuts only means higher and higher taxes for all of us and huge growth of the misery index. So lets get the spending cuts first and the balanced budget. Then we can carefully ease into increased revenues if that should be necessary. (I suspect I won't be.)

Both Bill Clinton and George HW Bush raised taxes in the late 80s and early 90s, and spending to GDP fell. George W Bush cut taxes and spending to GDP rose.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

WE cannot balance the budget without both raising taxes and reducing spending, folks.

To attempt to do it without doing some of BOTH would destroy this nation.

When is the last time Congress raised revenues by raising taxes and didn't see that as license to increase spending? That is the fallacy in your statement. A balanced budget that does not include spending cuts only means higher and higher taxes for all of us and huge growth of the misery index. So lets get the spending cuts first and the balanced budget. Then we can carefully ease into increased revenues if that should be necessary. (I suspect I won't be.)

Both Bill Clinton and George HW Bush raised taxes in the late 80s and early 90s, and spending to GDP fell. George W Bush cut taxes and spending to GDP rose.

Assume we have a can opener

 

[Foxfyre]

There were also tax cuts in the Clinton administration which are at least a factor in economic good times in his second term. And revenues increased significantly under GWB after the tax cuts; unfortunately so did spending.

Spending under both increased significantly as did the national debt. Even during the time we had a so-called 'surplus', the debt clock was still running. When we have a true surplus that is used to pay down the debt, the debt clock will run backwards. We haven't seen that in a very long time.

So how about we don't make this issue a whose is blackest thing?

Let's think about what kind of fiscal conduct we expect from our fearless leaders of whatever political party and hold their feet to the fire until they meet our expectations.

 

[Toro]

When is the last time Congress raised revenues by raising taxes and didn't see that as license to increase spending? That is the fallacy in your statement. A balanced budget that does not include spending cuts only means higher and higher taxes for all of us and huge growth of the misery index. So lets get the spending cuts first and the balanced budget. Then we can carefully ease into increased revenues if that should be necessary. (I suspect I won't be.)

Both Bill Clinton and George HW Bush raised taxes in the late 80s and early 90s, and spending to GDP fell. George W Bush cut taxes and spending to GDP rose.

Assume we have a can opener

We would, if the commies hadn't stolen them all...

 

[Neotrotsky]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsrFa9jrpv8]YouTube - ‪Child's Pay 2‬‏[/ame]


--
"Unemployment Rate Won’t Matter in 2012" - Obama Adviser Plouffe

 

[Neotrotsky]

And we have it.
According to late night phone call...the "deal" is really no deal.
They will "cut" $2 trillion in spending without including a "no new spending clause".
In other words they will cut $2 trillion in one place - but will not guarantee it won't be simply moved to somewhere else.
And there will be no new taxes.

So tomorrow - the Dems will say they tried but the republicans won't work with them, and the republicans will say they tried but the Dems refused to take cuts seriously.
Trouble is - they are both right.
The Dems are not taking cuts seriously - at all - and the republicans won't agree to any tax increases no matter what.

And once again - our government on both sides fail us.

Fear not! The left has come up with a plan that will cost us very little
and the money will still come from the Chinese. A new approach to finance our Progressive Utopia

 

[007]

Again, why? How? Just because you claim it doesn't make it true.

Budget deficits are bad because they cause Global Warming.

In addition to that, "Poor and minorities are hardest hit".

Especially all those paying no taxes at all.

 

[007]

WE cannot balance the budget without both raising taxes and reducing spending, folks.

To attempt to do it without doing some of BOTH would destroy this nation.

..... PUUUUURE....

 

[007]

I maxed out a cc in college, asked for a higher limit, was denied, and then I continued to pay off my debt. I never defaulted. I'm just not getting all this trumped up end of the world, armageddon stuff if we don't raise the limit. If anything, it will show that we're serious that we're gonna STOP racking up debt.

S&P said they will lower our credit rating to a D if we do not raise the debt ceiling. Comment on that? And furthermore, do you know the implications if S&P does that?

Let's see, we can raise the debt ceiling and risk our credit rating going from AAA to AA+ some time in the future, or we can not raise the debt ceiling and watch our credit rating go from AAA to D immediately.

Hmmmm ...

D is where it should be.

 

[Article 15]

WE cannot balance the budget without both raising taxes and reducing spending, folks.

To attempt to do it without doing some of BOTH would destroy this nation.

When is the last time Congress raised revenues by raising taxes and didn't see that as license to increase spending? That is the fallacy in your statement. A balanced budget that does not include spending cuts only means higher and higher taxes for all of us and huge growth of the misery index.

Tax increases are being proposed in conjunction with spending cuts.

So lets get the spending cuts first and the balanced budget. Then we can carefully ease into increased revenues if that should be necessary. (I suspect I won't be.)

That's not realistic and it ain't gonna happen.

 

[Modbert]

Let's see, we can raise the debt ceiling and risk our credit rating going from AAA to AA+ some time in the future, or we can not raise the debt ceiling and watch our credit rating go from AAA to D immediately.

Hmmmm ...

Such a tough choice, eh?

 

[Modbert]

Yeah, the liberal/leftist/communist Economist!

lol

Anything left of The Cato Institute and their ultra-right Conservative sources is communist to them.

 

[Modbert]

D is where it should be.

I hope nobody pays you for your advice on economics. Seriously.

 

[xsited1]

Yeah, the liberal/leftist/communist Economist!

lol

Anything left of The Cato Institute and their ultra-right Conservative sources is communist to them.

Cato relies on ultra-right conservative sources?

Modbert is always good for a laugh. Does anyone here take him seriously???

Didn't think so.

 

[Modbert]

Cato relies on ultra-right conservative sources?

Modbert is always good for a laugh. Does anyone here take him seriously???

Didn't think so.

If I was saying that The Cato Institute was a ultra-right Conservative institution, I wouldn't have made it separate from that. The Cato Institute is a Libertarian think tank.

But nice try at trolling as always.

 

[Londoner]

Where was the Republican outrage when Reagan exploded the debt ceiling (twice) . . . eclipsing the Carter debt by a criminal amount?

Where was the Republican outrage when HW Bush raised the debt ceiling?

Where was the Republican outrage when GW Bush raised the debt ceiling?

Why is it that Republicans are only fiscally responsible when they're not in control of the White House?

We know that Democrats like to spend. It's part of their governing philosophy to stimulate the economy with middle class programs, to make up for the fact that monopoly capitalism tends to drive down wages and benefits and thus over-concentrate wealth on top, leaving consumers and the consumption economy over-dependent on credit.

BUT LET'S FACE IT. When the middle class consumer has money to spend, the capitalist must add jobs and innovation to capture that money. Jobs will not be added merely with tax cuts; jobs won't be added until the strapped middle class consumer has money to spend. Look at the economic growth during 50s and 60s, a time when there was MASSIVE middle class stimulus and high taxes on the ultra wealthy. Look at the results. The consumer spent and spent, and the capitalist kept adding jobs to soak up all the excess demand. The result was OUR GREATEST ECONOMIC GROWTH EVER. (Funny how it happened during the height of the liberal, Keynesian period) So... we know democrats spend.

However, what we don't know is why Republicans like to run up bigger debts than the Democrats when they have the White House. Running up massive debts is what GOP presidents always do. Look at the numbers. Reagan and the Bushes were a disaster.

America is about to fall for it again in 2012. They will give us a Republican president and a Republican congress, like under Bush. The result, like under Bush, will be a disaster. Most likely we will see a revitalized War on Terror - the fog of war: the same old trick they always use... to win elections through fear and shovel money to the special interests which keep them in office.

Reagan spent twice as much as Carter, and Bush spent twice as much as Clinton.

(We can't afford for a Republican to spend twice as much as Obama, but you know they will )

(they always do)

(they always do)

 

[Trajan]

WE cannot balance the budget without both raising taxes and reducing spending, folks.

To attempt to do it without doing some of BOTH would destroy this nation.

When is the last time Congress raised revenues by raising taxes and didn't see that as license to increase spending? That is the fallacy in your statement. A balanced budget that does not include spending cuts only means higher and higher taxes for all of us and huge growth of the misery index. So lets get the spending cuts first and the balanced budget. Then we can carefully ease into increased revenues if that should be necessary. (I suspect I won't be.)

Both Bill Clinton and George HW Bush raised taxes in the late 80s and early 90s, and spending to GDP fell. George W Bush cut taxes and spending to GDP rose.

true but the deal as written never materialized , yes he got 'savings', but not what he supposedly shook hands on, they never do, and Herbert Bush took it in the shorts for, well, not what he was promised.

without an amendment any future congresses as has happened in past will just ignore what was done before them. the dems will tell us granny needs more medicare/medicaid (and how would this effect obama care a 3.5(or 8)% tax increase btw on the RICH already on the offing) and that will be that. Heartstrings always turn the tables......

 

[xsited1]

Cato relies on ultra-right conservative sources?

Modbert is always good for a laugh. Does anyone here take him seriously???

Didn't think so.

If I was saying that The Cato Institute was a ultra-right Conservative institution, I wouldn't have made it separate from that. The Cato Institute is a Libertarian think tank.

But nice try at trolling as always.

Reading comprehension alludes you. Try again. (Or just not post at all. You are good for a laugh, however.)

 

[Modbert]

UK slashes spending, raises VAT and taxes banks | Reuters

Germany cuts jobs, raises taxes - thestar.com

Germany to Raise Taxes on Tobacco, Cut Energy Subsidies Less Than Planned - Bloomberg

FT.com / Europe - France unveils

Austria to Cut Deficit to 3.2% of GDP With Taxes - Businessweek

Dutch insurance premium tax increase to 9.7% in 2011

Japan to raise taxes for quake rebuilding, reports say - The Globe and Mail

Japan raises taxes on cigarettes | Local | House of Japan - Japan News Technology Autos Culture Life Style

Indonesia to raise 2011 tobacco excise tax by 5 pct | Reuters

UPDATE 1-Albania to raise taxes on telecoms, banks -PM | Reuters

Spain, Struggling With Weak Economy, Raises Taxes, Attacks Business | Centurean2′s Weblog

Putin Raises Russia

I could go all day really. Point is, saying nobody is raising taxes or has raised taxes is nothing short of ignorance.

Since I guess I didn't post enough links the first time for some people:

Balkans.com Business News : Turkish government to raise taxes on cars or car loans-Analysis

Turkey raises taxes on cars, tobacco, alcohol and fuel - Hurriyet Daily News

Romania News Watch: Romanian government plans to raise income taxes, scrap 16 percent flat tax

BUCHAREST, Romania (AP) - Romania's finance minister says the cash-strapped government plans to scrap the 16 percent flat tax and introduce higher income taxes starting next year, according to a financial newspaper.

Portugal to raise taxes, trim salaries - International News - livemint.com

Ireland raises taxes in austerity budget and unveils agency to buy toxic assets - Telegraph

Ireland Raises Taxes, Cuts Spending to Narrow Deficit - Businessweek

Czechs to Raise Tobacco Taxes | NACS Online > News & Media Center > News

Euro hopeful Latvia raises taxes | Video | Reuters.com

Hungary to Raise Taxes on Targeted Sectors - WSJ.com

Hungary Government To Cut Drug Subsidies, Raise Taxes - Report - FoxBusiness.com

Brazil Raises Tax on Purchases Abroad - WSJ.com

UPDATE 4-Chile to raise taxes, issue debt for quake rebuild | Reuters

Netanyahu to raise taxes in 2011 - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News

Laos raises profit tax on foreign firms but baulks at beer tax - Monsters and Critics

Laos govt to raise tax on cigarettes, alcohol

Noy to consider tax raise in 2012 | The Philippine Star » News » Headlines

Egypt Raises Taxes To Ease Poverty | Kuwait E-Gate NewsFeed

Australia to raise taxes to pay for floods | koaa.com | Colorado Springs | Pueblo |

Australia Increases Cigarette Taxes | NACS Online > News & Media Center > News

Australia may raise taxes to help fund healthcare system - Taipei Times

BBC News - S Korea mulls oil tax cut to cushion crude price surge

 

[Neotrotsky]

Laos; Egypt,Turkey
The Dems should run with that one



Some of your links are dated

German Government To Borrow Less In 2012, Cut Taxes