American Terrorism

[MasterChief]

Morally you did the right thing by the Kuwaiti people, but what it does bring up is where do you draw the line with regard to peoples' perception of you?

Have you not read The Prince by Niccolo Machiavelli? I thought that was required reading in both high school and college. It was for me.

 

[eots]

The Secret Government (CIA Overthrow of Mossadeq


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaGCJmCAJ40[/ame]

 

[Dr Grump]

Have you not read The Prince by Niccolo Machiavelli? I thought that was required reading in both high school and college. It was for me.

I am a New Zealander, so the book was not required reading at any level here although I am aware of The Prince and who Machiavelli was. And? Is that book the bible of how politics should be in the world?

 

[Psychoblues]

Murder by Americans don't matter to these idiots, DG. Post a comprehensive examination of most any subject and watch them go like dogs for a single piece of meat (as they perceive it) and ignore the rest of the very rich nutrients of the example.

It's comical, don't you know?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! That's why I come here often. It really does beat the hell out of the shallowness of FoxNews. These cats reduce it even further to more gutteral and hilarious screeds of otherwise uninformed yet intense pleas for somehow forgiveness.

It kicks my ass!!!!!!!!!! What about you?!!!?!?!?!?!??!?!!?!?!

 

[eots]

Spies, Communism, and Bananas: How and Why the CIA overthrew a government that led to 40 years of brutal repression : Part Three of the Cold War unit

A note: I recommend using all three parts of this lesson plan so students get a real feel for the period, but if you don't have time any of them can be done separately.

Grades: 9th-12th

Time:

A. Coup overview research to select topic: one day
B. Research and presentation writing: two weeks
C. Presentation: 10-15 minutes per student
Overview: In 1954, a CIA-backed coup overthrew the democratically elected government of Guatemala and established a brutal military dictatorship in its place. Though the U.S. denied its participation at the time, the evidence is overwhelming, particularly since the Freedom of Information Act has made available many documents which leave little doubt of U.S. involvement. In early 1999, President Clinton even made an almost apology for the U.S. role in Guatemalan politics.


The coup resulted in 40 years of repression and the killing of over 200,000 Guatemalans.

The reported motivation for the violent coup was Jacobo Arbenz's communist leanings. He had the support of communists for many of his policies, including his desire to provide land to the many poor, landless peasants. He also encouraged unions among the workers at United Fruit Company, a United States based firm that had a stranglehold on much of Guatemala. United Fruit was very displeased with Arbenz's election and sought to undermine his government by pressuring the U.S. government to take action, and providing money to fund that action. In 1954, they finally got their wish.

Materials: Internet and library access.

Objectives:

Acquire a thorough understanding of the CIA-backed overthrow of Guatemala
Practice good research skills
Gain confidence in delivering effective oral presentations

Activities:

A. Have students deliver short (10 or 15 minute) talks on different aspects of the Guatemalan coup. Give them a day to come up with their own topic after reviewing some of the sites below. Some topic suggestions (all have corresponding web sites below




http://www.nancymatson.com/CLDWR3.HTM

 

[Psychoblues]

It don't get much more clear, eots.

Spies, Communism, and Bananas: How and Why the CIA overthrew a government that led to 40 years of brutal repression : Part Three of the Cold War unit

A note: I recommend using all three parts of this lesson plan so students get a real feel for the period, but if you don't have time any of them can be done separately.

Grades: 9th-12th

Time:

A. Coup overview research to select topic: one day
B. Research and presentation writing: two weeks
C. Presentation: 10-15 minutes per student
Overview: In 1954, a CIA-backed coup overthrew the democratically elected government of Guatemala and established a brutal military dictatorship in its place. Though the U.S. denied its participation at the time, the evidence is overwhelming, particularly since the Freedom of Information Act has made available many documents which leave little doubt of U.S. involvement. In early 1999, President Clinton even made an almost apology for the U.S. role in Guatemalan politics.


The coup resulted in 40 years of repression and the killing of over 200,000 Guatemalans.

The reported motivation for the violent coup was Jacobo Arbenz's communist leanings. He had the support of communists for many of his policies, including his desire to provide land to the many poor, landless peasants. He also encouraged unions among the workers at United Fruit Company, a United States based firm that had a stranglehold on much of Guatemala. United Fruit was very displeased with Arbenz's election and sought to undermine his government by pressuring the U.S. government to take action, and providing money to fund that action. In 1954, they finally got their wish.

Materials: Internet and library access.

Objectives:

Acquire a thorough understanding of the CIA-backed overthrow of Guatemala
Practice good research skills
Gain confidence in delivering effective oral presentations

Activities:

A. Have students deliver short (10 or 15 minute) talks on different aspects of the Guatemalan coup. Give them a day to come up with their own topic after reviewing some of the sites below. Some topic suggestions (all have corresponding web sites below




http://www.nancymatson.com/CLDWR3.HTM

Do you actually think any of these idiots will absorb any of it? Uh,,,,,If you can absorb it, I wasn't talking about you.

 

[Taomon]

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3269531,00.html

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/795327.html

http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=22900&Cr=rights&Cr1=council

http://www.unog.ch/80256EDD006B9C2E...F6E82E6D19674ABBC1257360003E6E0B?OpenDocument

http://www.un.org/news/dh/pdf/english/2007/26102007.pdf

 

[Taomon]

Perhaps the alleged witness lied. Perhaps the invasion of Kuwait was not very bloody. Answer me yes-or-no: All things considered, do you think that America was justified in helping free Kuwait from Iraq?

No

 

[Taomon]

Very astute of you, though I don't know why you put a question mark at the end of a statement.

Because I was asking you - as in, don't you see me as...

 

[Taomon]

College students are conditoned to be liberal. They will believe anything their professors tell them...it's what college conditions them to do.

No, the teachers I had so far were all business professors and very conservative.

 

[Taomon]

I am not the niece of anybody, jerkoff, and I know what I saw and STILL see in the middle of the freakin' night, jackass. Do tell us what it was you saw with your own two eyes ....

Do you know ANYTHING? Saddam invade Kuwait because he claimed the oil Kuwait was pumping came from an oil field in Iraq, and that Kuwait was a historic province of Iraq.

Saddam demonized himself by invading an "arab brother" and getting the other Arab nations up in arms over his actions.

You have got to be one of the most uneducated fruitloops I've ever encountered.

Gunny, the witness I was speaking of was the 15 year old volunteer from the hospital, not you. This is just more evidenc that all you do is blindly disagree with everything I post. That is not debating and that is not proof that I am wrong. You are just barking like an anonymous dog in the night.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/gulf/script_a.html

"NARRATOR: But the most compelling testimony came from an anonymous 15-year-old Kuwaiti girl.

2nd WITNESS: _volunteered at the Aladein hospital with 12 other women who wanted to help, as well.

NARRATOR: She said she witnessed first-hand Iraqi soldiers removing Kuwaiti babies from hospital incubators and then stealing the incubators.

2nd WITNESS: While I was there, I saw the Iraqi soldiers come into the hospital with guns. They took the babies out of the incubators, took the incubators and left the children to die on the cold floor!

Rep. JOHN PORTER, (R) ILLINOIS: We have never heard in all this time, in all circumstances, a record of inhumanity and brutality and sadism as the ones that the witnesses have given us today.

NARRATOR: Only later was it discovered that the girl was actually the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador and that there were doubts about whether she had actually seen the events she described."

 

[Taomon]

No...that is incorrect. You are accepting the Iraqi propaganda the Iraqis put out right after the invasion. There is a book you need to read, written by Middle Easterners, Saddam: A Political Biography. The research shows that it had nothing to do with borders, it had everything to do with money. Kuwait loaned Saddam over six billion dollars to finance his war against Iran. When the war was over he felt since his nation had provided the blood in stopping the Ayatollah from taking over the Gulf and the Gulf states should provide the treasure. He wanted Kuwait to forgive the loan. Not only did Kuwait say no, but they depressed the world price of oil which made it harder for Iraq to rise the funds to pay off the debt. Saddam went nuts and basically decided to rob the bank that give him the loan. So the border stuff is just a ruse that is now often mindlessly repeated.

And who, praytell is the author of this book that proves Saddam is wrong and the Kuwaitis right? Efraim Karsh who has an anti-Islamic agenda. It is okay to be anti-Islamic, it is another thing to allow that bias to distort facts to fit your agenda.

 

[CSM]

No, the teachers I had so far were all business professors and very conservative.

You missed the point. Let me be a bit more blunt. My statement was a parody of your assertion that vets are conditioned in a certain way...the implication is that students are conditioned in a certain way.

 

[Gunny]

Gunny, the witness I was speaking of was the 15 year old volunteer from the hospital, not you. This is just more evidenc that all you do is blindly disagree with everything I post. That is not debating and that is not proof that I am wrong. You are just barking like an anonymous dog in the night.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/gulf/script_a.html

"NARRATOR: But the most compelling testimony came from an anonymous 15-year-old Kuwaiti girl.

2nd WITNESS: _volunteered at the Aladein hospital with 12 other women who wanted to help, as well.

NARRATOR: She said she witnessed first-hand Iraqi soldiers removing Kuwaiti babies from hospital incubators and then stealing the incubators.

2nd WITNESS: While I was there, I saw the Iraqi soldiers come into the hospital with guns. They took the babies out of the incubators, took the incubators and left the children to die on the cold floor!

Rep. JOHN PORTER, (R) ILLINOIS: We have never heard in all this time, in all circumstances, a record of inhumanity and brutality and sadism as the ones that the witnesses have given us today.

NARRATOR: Only later was it discovered that the girl was actually the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador and that there were doubts about whether she had actually seen the events she described."

Opinions that agree with your opinions are not fact. I don't "blindly" disagree with you. You're just pretty damned dumb on most every topic you've tried to argue, and you don't even understand the basic rules of debate. Nothing blind about that. It's obvious, and all over this board.

 

[Gunny]

And who, praytell is the author of this book that proves Saddam is wrong and the Kuwaitis right? Efraim Karsh who has an anti-Islamic agenda. It is okay to be anti-Islamic, it is another thing to allow that bias to distort facts to fit your agenda.

Let's see ... are you not the one that says "never kill" is your standard operating procedure?

Yet, despite all your peacenik crap in one thread, you're okay with a thug using force of arms to invade, subjugate, and rape a sovereign nation?

Something you don't seem to comprehend from one thread to another is the unprovoked aggressor is the one who is wrong.

You trying to defind him with the poor man's version of a relativist argument simply because it disagree the the US's stance are equally in the wrong.

One can only marvel at YOU accusing ANYONE of distorting facts to fit your agenda since I'm still awaiting your presentation of your FIRST unbiased fact.

 

[Gunny]

You missed the point. Let me be a bit more blunt. My statement was a parody of your assertion that vets are conditioned in a certain way...the implication is that students are conditioned in a certain way.

He misses everyone's point. He's too steeped in his own bullshit rhetoric to hear a word anyone else says.

 

[Taomon]

You missed the point. Let me be a bit more blunt. My statement was a parody of your assertion that vets are conditioned in a certain way...the implication is that students are conditioned in a certain way.

I know. The thing about printed words is that sarcasm can be missed. My reply was sarcastic.

 

[Taomon]

Opinions that agree with your opinions are not fact. I don't "blindly" disagree with you. You're just pretty damned dumb on most every topic you've tried to argue, and you don't even understand the basic rules of debate. Nothing blind about that. It's obvious, and all over this board.

You blindly disagree with everything I say. If I said the sky was blue you would say it was gray and then tell me I was stupid.

 

[Taomon]

Let's see ... are you not the one that says "never kill" is your standard operating procedure?

Yet, despite all your peacenik crap in one thread, you're okay with a thug using force of arms to invade, subjugate, and rape a sovereign nation?

Something you don't seem to comprehend from one thread to another is the unprovoked aggressor is the one who is wrong.

You trying to defind him with the poor man's version of a relativist argument simply because it disagree the the US's stance are equally in the wrong.

One can only marvel at YOU accusing ANYONE of distorting facts to fit your agenda since I'm still awaiting your presentation of your FIRST unbiased fact.

NO I don't condone the US invading, raping and subjugating a soveriegn nation, nor do I condone England doing nor do I condone Israel. I think I made that pretty friggen clear numbnuts.

 

[Taomon]

He misses everyone's point. He's too steeped in his own bullshit rhetoric to hear a word anyone else says.

Look who is talking. I was posting a statement about the Kuwaiti neice of the Ambassador who testified to Congress about alleged atrocities committed by the Iraqi army when they invaded, and you instantly thought I was talking about you.