All 4 former Ukraine regions vote to join Russia

[Toddsterpatriot]

And you don't think any of that ties into NATO expanding east? And your link says Ukraine returned nukes Russia had stationed there

First time you're hearing about this?

 

[Dayton3]

Show me these treaties. And show me how Putin didn't honor his word when the West has broken there's time and time again as you just admited Clinton did

The "word" or "promise" of a U.S. president means nothing. If you want something at least somewhat binding sign a treaty with the United States and wait for it to be ratified by the U.S. Senate.

 

[Stann]

And I showed you that and showed you official NATO transcripts on the dissolution of the USSR and NATO policy moving forward to which you shoved your finger up your nose, said "her derr" and ate a booger

And as you have already said yourself, the USSR doesn't exist anymore.

 

[Rust_Cohle]

And you don't think any of that ties into NATO expanding east?

First time you're hearing about this?

And why would Russia take back its nukes from Ukraine? Sounds like the deal RFK made in regards to the Cuban missile crisis. What sort of guarantees do you think they were given?

 

[Rust_Cohle]

And as you have already said yourself, the USSR doesn't exist anymore.

The unification of Germany and Fall of the USSR both had their own deals you're a fool if you think not

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

And why would Russia take back its nukes from Ukraine? Sounds like the deal RFK made in regards to the Cuban missile crisis. What sort of guarantees do you think they were given?

And why would Russia take back its nukes from Ukraine?

Russia didn't want Ukraine to use Russia's nukes against Russia.

What sort of guarantees do you think they were given?

 

[Dayton3]

The unification of Germany and Fall of the USSR both had their own deals you're a fool if you think not

No doubt. But the fact remains that "back of the book", "handshake" deals are in no way binding in the field of international diplomacy and foreign relations.

 

[Rust_Cohle]

And why would Russia take back its nukes from Ukraine?

Russia didn't want Ukraine to use Russia's nukes against Russia.

What sort of guarantees do you think they were given?

View attachment 705390

According to three memoranda? Memos now but mine were not good enough eh LOL

Still sounds like a lot of deals made through memo, words and handshakes etc

 

[Rust_Cohle]

No doubt. But the fact remains that "back of the book", "handshake" deals are in no way binding in the field of international diplomacy and foreign relations.

And memos are?

 

[Stann]

And why would Russia take back its nukes from Ukraine? Sounds like the deal RFK made in regards to the Cuban missile crisis. What sort of guarantees do you think they were given?

www armscontrol.org Ukraine nuclear weapons and security assurances at a glance. By 1996, Ukraine had returned all of its nuclear weapons to Russia in exchange for economic and security assurances.

 

[Stann]

www armscontrol.org Ukraine nuclear weapons and security assurances at a glance. By 1996, Ukraine had returned all of its nuclear weapons to Russia in exchange for economic and security assurances.

www.armscontrol.org

 

[theHawk]

3-6 million people are still living there.



Ah yes, Bucha war crimes. Here, see a family slaughtered by Russians, and burned in Bucha. I'm sure they would have voted to join Russia.

View attachment 702506



Why of course they "voted" to join Russia in 2014. They were invaded, and had guns to their backs. What makes todays "referendum" any different?

Why are you complaining about the war? Washington has wanted this war for a long time. They had to get rid of Trump to make it happen though. Now their Establishment stooge who has never said no to a war, has given them a new war. This is what you voted for, a return to “normalcy”. Four years of no new wars was abnormal.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

According to three memoranda? Memos now but mine were not good enough eh LOL

Still sounds like a lot of deals made through memo, words and handshakes etc

These memos were actually written out, signed and announced.

Not magically discovered 3 decades later.

 

[Rust_Cohle]

www armscontrol.org Ukraine nuclear weapons and security assurances at a glance. By 1996, Ukraine had returned all of its nuclear weapons to Russia in exchange for economic and security assurances.

Security assurances now we're getting somewhere and what sort of security assurances do you think Russia wanted also?

 

[Rust_Cohle]

These memos were actually written out, signed and announced.

Not magically discovered 3 decades later.

So in other words your memos are ok cause reasons but to suggest Russia had any sort of security assurances is magical thinking. Got it

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So in other words your memos are ok cause reasons but to suggest Russia had any sort of security assurances is magical thinking. Got it

Everybody knew about "my memos" when they were created and signed.

When did anybody find your transcripts (that didn't back your claim)?

Was it when Putin started whining a few years ago?

 

[Rust_Cohle]

Everybody knew about "my memos" when they were created and signed.

When did anybody find your transcripts (that didn't back your claim)?

Was it when Putin started whining a few years ago?

Bush and Baker knew about them when they happened as did Russia, as did anyone paying attention you must be young.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Bush and Baker knew about them when they happened as did Russia, as did anyone paying attention you must be young.

Bush and Baker knew about them when they happened as did Russia,

Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says “No”​

Western leaders never pledged not to enlarge NATO, a point that several analysts have demonstrated. Mark Kramer explored the question in detail in a 2009 article in The Washington Quarterly. He drew on declassified American, German and Soviet records to make his case and noted that, in discussions on German reunification in the two-plus-four format (the two Germanys plus the United States, Soviet Union, Britain and France), the Soviets never raised the question of NATO enlargement other than how it might apply in the former German Democratic Republic (GDR).

Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says "No" | Brookings

Russian President Vladimir Putin has made it well known his antipathy towards NATO, claiming the Alliance took advantage of Russian weakness after the collapse of the Soviet Union in violation of promises allegedly made to Moscow by Western leaders. Steven Pifer argues that no such promises were...

www.brookings.edu

 

[bravoactual]

The Russian Army Is Retreating So Fast They Are Leaving The Unburied Bodies of Their Soldiers.

Retreating Russians leave their comrades' bodies behind

LYMAN, Ukraine (AP) — Russian troops abandoned a key Ukrainian city so rapidly that they left the bodies of their comrades in the streets, offering more evidence Tuesday of Moscow's latest military defeat as it struggles to hang on to four regions of Ukraine that it illegally annexed last week.

apnews.com

The Russians retreating so fast they are taking their fallen dead with them, not a good sign. Armies always make the great effort to either retrieve their dead and bury them in place. Leaving bodies behind is the hallmark an army in disarray.

 

[Rust_Cohle]

Bush and Baker knew about them when they happened as did Russia,

Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says “No”​

Western leaders never pledged not to enlarge NATO, a point that several analysts have demonstrated. Mark Kramer explored the question in detail in a 2009 article in The Washington Quarterly. He drew on declassified American, German and Soviet records to make his case and noted that, in discussions on German reunification in the two-plus-four format (the two Germanys plus the United States, Soviet Union, Britain and France), the Soviets never raised the question of NATO enlargement other than how it might apply in the former German Democratic Republic (GDR).

Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says "No" | Brookings

Russian President Vladimir Putin has made it well known his antipathy towards NATO, claiming the Alliance took advantage of Russian weakness after the collapse of the Soviet Union in violation of promises allegedly made to Moscow by Western leaders. Steven Pifer argues that no such promises were...

www.brookings.edu

So Brookings is an authority on this now? Lol