Actual gun defense..robber has gun pointed at victims...and loses to armed good guy...

[Iceweasel]

That is usually the answer. But you all insist you need them loaded and ready to go. Paranoid? I haven't had to use one either. Bill has said that he hasn't either. You guys need to chill a bit. You must be scared all the time thinking you need a gun. I go out without one everyday and am not scared at all.

So the video was meaningless to you? That proves anti-gunners are stupid and ignorant.

 

[Roadrunner]

Did the punk even fire his weapon?
Didnt look like he was prepared to use it,to bad for him.

That is the point I have made to brain....the criminal, even with his gun pointed at the victim, is now in the reaction mode....and he has to think before he pulls the trigger and he is doing the thinking under the time pressure of reacting to the victim firing his weapon......he has to see the threat, while he is suffering from tunnel vision due to an adrenaline dump, he has to analyze the threat, he has to decide on wether he wants to cross the line from robbery to murder, or if he should escape instead, and then implement the decision.......the victim sees the threat and decides to shoot...all in his head where it can't be seen and shoots......and we see the outcome...and not only in this shooting but in many others......

Old Westerns can be deceiving. The one that wins a gunfight is not the one that draws first, but the one with the most determination. You're right about it being two different mindsets. If I'm being robbed and I have a gun, the robber is just thinking about getting my money and running, I'm thinking about pulling my gun out and ending his existence on this planet. He's determined to rob, I'm determined to kill. That's why he hesitates and that's why I won't.

Anybody that watches old Westerns and thinks that a .45 Long Colt or a .44/40 can "wing you", or inflict "just a flesh wound" or an "it's only in the shoulder wound" knows nothing of bullets and their impact.

I wonder if the guy in the video hit the second guy?

 

[Iceweasel]

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves.

So? I've never needed my fire extinguishers but they are ready if I do. Only a full on retard would decide not to prepare themselves because someone pointed out most people won't need it.

 

[Roadrunner]

Don't be fooled into thinking the good guy always wins:
defender killed Civilian Gun Defense Blog Page 3
There are a lot of dead people who thought that.

I'll take my chances with a gun rather than be an unarmed victim.

That is your option. But you are probably aware it might be the last thing you ever do.

Taking a shit tomorrow morning might be the last thing you do.

You might do an Elvis and have a heart attack on the shitter.

Does that mean you probably shouldn't shit?

Just chaps your ass a punk got wasted by a good guy with a gun, doesn't it?

 

[Boatswain2PA]

That is usually the answer. But you all insist you need them loaded and ready to go. Paranoid? I haven't had to use one either. Bill has said that he hasn't either. You guys need to chill a bit. You must be scared all the time thinking you need a gun. I go out without one everyday and am not scared at all.

A sheep isn't scared as they graze on the field. It is not until the wolf is at their heels do they start bleating for the sheepdog.

Let's hope that you never have to bleat for a sheepdog. And if you ever do, I pray that an armed sheepdog is close to protect you and your sheep family.

 

[PredFan]

"Might", sure. That is undeniable logic. It's highly unlikely however.

Lotta dead people probably thought that too.

Even more dead people found themselves wishing they had a gun.

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

 

[Boatswain2PA]

Did you READ that blog page you linked to? Story after story of "good guys" loosing their life defending their family, home, and business. But most of these stories result in the families being saved (ie:fiancee sacrificed his life to save his girlfriend from two home invaders in Atlanta, or girlfriend hiding in closet wasn't raped/murdered in Cleveland), or the perpetrator being arrested because he was also shot in the event.

How many of these cases would have resulted in dead innocent people anyway? Or worse, raped and then murdered, or murdered and then robbed?

Guns are the not the "perfect answer" to self-protection, but they are one of the best answers.

Bill has been making it sound like the good guy wins 100% of the time. That link is proof that doesn't happen.

I don't think Bill has been making it sound like that. He has said that the person who is "most ready", and chooses to act first, most often is the "winner" in these situations.

Of course the goodguy doesn't win 100% of the time. But when the sheep are unarmed, the wolf will win everytime.

 

[Brain357]

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves.

So? I've never needed my fire extinguishers but they are ready if I do. Only a full on retard would decide not to prepare themselves because someone pointed out most people won't need it.

Sure spend all your time being scared and paranoid if you want.

 

[Brain357]

Did you READ that blog page you linked to? Story after story of "good guys" loosing their life defending their family, home, and business. But most of these stories result in the families being saved (ie:fiancee sacrificed his life to save his girlfriend from two home invaders in Atlanta, or girlfriend hiding in closet wasn't raped/murdered in Cleveland), or the perpetrator being arrested because he was also shot in the event.

How many of these cases would have resulted in dead innocent people anyway? Or worse, raped and then murdered, or murdered and then robbed?

Guns are the not the "perfect answer" to self-protection, but they are one of the best answers.

Bill has been making it sound like the good guy wins 100% of the time. That link is proof that doesn't happen.

I don't think Bill has been making it sound like that. He has said that the person who is "most ready", and chooses to act first, most often is the "winner" in these situations.

Of course the goodguy doesn't win 100% of the time. But when the sheep are unarmed, the wolf will win everytime.

He has been basically saying it in another thread. Well if somebody just wants your wallet and you pull a gun making him shoot you, who is the winner?

 

[Brain357]

Lotta dead people probably thought that too.

Even more dead people found themselves wishing they had a gun.

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

I would be shocked if you can come up with stories daily. I usually count about 50 a year.

 

[Boatswain2PA]

BTW - it's nice to see people be able to disagree in a civil manner like you (we) have been doing here. Maybe most of the USMB whacko's (Luddy, Dean, Teapartyhater, etc) have gone back on their medicine....

 

[Anathema]

Interesting. You must hangout in questionable areas or are really old? You are really going against the statistics. Would both these people agree that it was a defense on your part and not something else?

I live around and often travel into the second largest city in New England. I'm also the sort of person who doesn't play around. I don't wait for things to go down. I act rather than react.

The first one probably doesn't remember the incident as he was either drunk or high. Possibly both.

The second one was writing checks with his mouth that his body may or may not have been able to cash. He stepped. I drew. He ran.

 

[PredFan]

Even more dead people found themselves wishing they had a gun.

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

I would be shocked if you can come up with stories daily. I usually count about 50 a year.

Every single day. I gave an actual job and a family and cannot devote my life to providing proof each day just to defeat a Progressive who doesn't have the honesty, integrity, or maturity to ever admit that he's wrong no matter what I do.

 

[Brain357]

Lotta dead people probably thought that too.

Even more dead people found themselves wishing they had a gun.

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

Do you really think lots of people will need a gun? I mean I'm pretty old and haven't. I know a lot of gun owners and none of them have. If you look at the homicide rate it is quite unlikely to have to defend your life. Now if you are involved in criminal activity that is a different story, but for law abiding citizens it's very unlikely.

 

[Brain357]

Interesting. You must hangout in questionable areas or are really old? You are really going against the statistics. Would both these people agree that it was a defense on your part and not something else?

I live around and often travel into the second largest city in New England. I'm also the sort of person who doesn't play around. I don't wait for things to go down. I act rather than react.

The first one probably doesn't remember the incident as he was either drunk or high. Possibly both.

The second one was writing checks with his mouth that his body may or may not have been able to cash. He stepped. I drew. He ran.

Right so both would probably say some crazy guy pulled a gun on them without much justification. The second sounds like it could have been as much intimidation as defense.

 

[Brain357]

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

I would be shocked if you can come up with stories daily. I usually count about 50 a year.

Every single day. I gave an actual job and a family and cannot devote my life to providing proof each day just to defeat a Progressive who doesn't have the honesty, integrity, or maturity to ever admit that he's wrong no matter what I do.

I think you'd be lucky to get one a week. I know I can post more accidental shooting stories than you can defenses.

 

[Roadrunner]

Even more dead people found themselves wishing they had a gun.

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

Do you really think lots of people will need a gun? I mean I'm pretty old and haven't. I know a lot of gun owners and none of them have. If you look at the homicide rate it is quite unlikely to have to defend your life. Now if you are involved in criminal activity that is a different story, but for law abiding citizens it's very unlikely.

So what exactly is your point here?

Nobody is impressing you into a militia and demanding you have a gun.

We have a legal right to own a gun, and many of us have had to use a gun to protect life and/or property.

I am 35 miles from the nearest law enforcement office, and my sheriff advised getting an AK-47 for where I live, because he can't help in time.

The deputy assigned to my area covers 750 square miles of mostly forest land.

I'd be lucky if one got here within a half hour if I called and said I had a dead body.

 

[PredFan]

Even more dead people found themselves wishing they had a gun.

Doubtful.

We can both play that idiotic game of back and forth can't we? Your "lotta dead people probably thought that too" is a worthless statement.

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves. The statistics show that. You choose to carry and I hope it does protect you. My link has a long list of defenders who were themselves shot and killed. And that woman with the bra holster carried to protect herself and ended up killing herself on accident. I just think people need to put a lot of thought into what they are doing.

The problem we have with you is that in order for you to think any one has "put a lot of thought into what they are doing" means they have to agree with you.

The reason I stated that it was highly unlikely that I would get killed us that I have put a lot of thought and training into my own defense. But I'm sure that isn't enough for you.

Lying with statistics is not only easy, it's very common. Especially here at USMB.

Your stats do not count the number of people who were not killed because they had a gun, and no statistics exist that show how many lives were saved because a potential assailant worried that the person might have a gun. They don't exist because ibviously that isn't recorded.

I have shown in my thread "more people saved by guns" that there are an enormous number of people and property saved every day. You know too, you have participated in that thread.

Do you really think lots of people will need a gun? I mean I'm pretty old and haven't. I know a lot of gun owners and none of them have. If you look at the homicide rate it is quite unlikely to have to defend your life. Now if you are involved in criminal activity that is a different story, but for law abiding citizens it's very unlikely.

Here is a reality check for you:
1. No one is saying that any one person will need a gun every day. There are too many gun owners in this country to count and the number who are forced to use them is extremely small in comparison. That won't matter if you end up being one of those who do.
2. You are not everyone. Just because you haven't doesn't mean no one will.
3. Why would you want to deny ANY person the ability to defend the self from assault?

 

[Iceweasel]

Yet I have no doubt it is true. And yes we can both play that game. But the fact is the majority of people will not ever need a gun to defend themselves.

So? I've never needed my fire extinguishers but they are ready if I do. Only a full on retard would decide not to prepare themselves because someone pointed out most people won't need it.

Sure spend all your time being scared and paranoid if you want.

You keep making the assertions when you get cornered (by pretty much everybody). It's like shooting fish in a bathtub.

We just keep you around for target practice.

 

[Anathema]

[Right so both would probably say some crazy guy pulled a gun on them without much justification. The second sounds like it could have been as much intimidation as defense.

First one was sitting on the hood of my car and unwilling to move after several requests. He then chose to become verbally abusive, so I gave him a better reason to move.

The second one knocked my girlfriend over while we were walking down a sidewalk. I demanded an apology from him as I helped her up. He asked what I would do to force him to apologize. I told him he didn't want to know. He stepped with a closed fist. I drew. He ran like a little girl.

Whether you agree with those two uses as defenses or not I don't care.