CDZ A Week of Gun Violence Does Nothing to Change the N.R.A.’s Message

[2aguy]

Why should it,if anything it proves how dangerous life can be.
Gun crazies want to disarm the people.what kind of logic is that?

Yes, taking guns from law abiding citizens is like targeting the drug war on people who don't do drugs and drunk driving programs on people who don't drink. Fact and logic, liberals take to them like fish take to cameras and fire flies

But in order to keep drugs from addicts, doctors have severely limited pain prescriptions to ALL patients. And doctors and pharmacies share pain prescription information on all patients to catch those abusing them. And to limit drunk drivers, all drivers can be stopped and tested, bars can be held liable for serving to someone already three sheets to the wind, regardless of whether they're driving. To limit gun violence, perhaps guns need to be limited for all. Fair? Maybe not. Who told you life is fair? I said limited, not completely gone, btw.

It IS limited.

The fact that there are mountains of gun control laws on the books seems to be utterly ignored every time gun control is brought up.

300 million guns is not limited, imo.

Felons are not allowed to have guns...they are already on a list.

The dangerously mentally ill can't have guns....if we could trust anti gunners like you we could get that fixed.

You can't commit crimes with guns.

That is realistic limitation on gun ownership.

 

[2aguy]

Why should it,if anything it proves how dangerous life can be.
Gun crazies want to disarm the people.what kind of logic is that?

Yes, taking guns from law abiding citizens is like targeting the drug war on people who don't do drugs and drunk driving programs on people who don't drink. Fact and logic, liberals take to them like fish take to cameras and fire flies

But in order to keep drugs from addicts, doctors have severely limited pain prescriptions to ALL patients. And doctors and pharmacies share pain prescription information on all patients to catch those abusing them. And to limit drunk drivers, all drivers can be stopped and tested, bars can be held liable for serving to someone already three sheets to the wind, regardless of whether they're driving. To limit gun violence, perhaps guns need to be limited for all. Fair? Maybe not. Who told you life is fair? I said limited, not completely gone, btw.

And so people buy drugs ... illegally. My point. You may have heard about that, it's been in the news ...

No. The point is actually that many addicts began by being prescribed opiates for a bonafide medical issue. Then they got hooked and tried "doctor shopping" and emergency room jumping to get more as their need increased. And when that no longer worked, they switched to heroin. Focusing on the root of the problem, where it started, will hopefully save the upcoming generation from a similar fate. To me, it makes equal sense that if the root of the illegal gun problem--guns in circulation--were addressed, it would help keep them from the wrong hands by the sheer weight of the numbers.

When you ban guns for law abiding people who do not use them for crime.....criminals will still get them.....that is how it is all around the world.......the criminals have guns, normal people do not......

 

[2aguy]

Why should it,if anything it proves how dangerous life can be.
Gun crazies want to disarm the people.what kind of logic is that?

Yes, taking guns from law abiding citizens is like targeting the drug war on people who don't do drugs and drunk driving programs on people who don't drink. Fact and logic, liberals take to them like fish take to cameras and fire flies

But in order to keep drugs from addicts, doctors have severely limited pain prescriptions to ALL patients. And doctors and pharmacies share pain prescription information on all patients to catch those abusing them. And to limit drunk drivers, all drivers can be stopped and tested, bars can be held liable for serving to someone already three sheets to the wind, regardless of whether they're driving. To limit gun violence, perhaps guns need to be limited for all. Fair? Maybe not. Who told you life is fair? I said limited, not completely gone, btw.

access to guns is already limited.....

And doctors and pharmacies share pain prescription information on all patients to catch those abusing them.

that is what you call Felons.....they are already prohibited from buying, owning or carrying guns...and just like drug addicts, they get people to buy their drugs/guns for them...or they steal their drugs/guns....

And to limit drunk drivers, all drivers can be stopped and tested,

If you are stopped by police and found to have an illegal gun...you can be arrested...already, under current law....

bars can be held liable for serving to someone already three sheets to the wind,

If you are found to be a straw buyer...someone using their clean record to buy guns for criminals, you can already be arrested...I have linked to these stories in other threads over the last year...

Guns are already limited......you cannot use a gun to commit a crime, if you do you go to jail. If you are felon caught with a gun, you go to jail......if you are dangerously mentally ill, you are not allowed to have a gun at all......

You guys keep acting like guns are just given away to criminals and the dangerously mentally ill, they simply do what people intent on doing bad things do....they get around your gun laws.....so you want more gun laws, which they also get around....

The French have every single gun law you want...to the point they do not have gun stores, they do not have gun shows and fully automatic rifles are completely illegal....and criminals and terrorists in France get the guns easily........

You guys focus all of your energy on normal, law abiding gun owners when we know that to solve the problem...you actually need to focus on criminals.....

If you really want to stop gun violence...put a 30 year sentence on gun crime..by actual criminals...not the law abiding gun owner who didn't realize that being a legal gun owner in New York made him a criminal if he crossed the border into New Jersey.....

We have had these conversations so many times before that you already know I support enforcing existing gun laws. Guns, however, are not "limited" when Americans have amassed 300,000,000 of them. I have seen you explain away the fact that European countries with strict gun laws have many fewer gun deaths than the U.S. by citing their "cultures." It is also possible that the limited availability of guns makes gun violence less easy to commit.

No...you want to confiscate guns.....so you vote for gun grabbers.....

 

[OldLady]

Most are illegal but they began their lives as newly minted guns from a factory somewhere and were originally sold shiny and new in some store. That is a start.

Why is that? You're going to make 300 million guns disappear?

And it's hard to take this seriously from someone who thinks we should keep our borders open to anyone who wants to cross them ... carrying whatever they want to carry. Including ... guns ...

We can't keep pot away from high schoolers. But we're going to keep guns away from criminals, yeah.

So no, your plan to keep guns from honest citizens isn't a "start," it's a red herring

Put away your paint roller, buster. I never said borders should remain open to anyone who wants to cross them.
Why is WHAT? Where did I say limiting semiautomatic rifles was making "300 million guns disappear."

 

[rightwinger]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

We don't know exactly what happened.....but if he reached when he wasn't supposed to....and he was a possible suspect in the eyes of the cop considering the BOLO that had been put out...then race had nothing to do with it....

You think this cop just shot this man because he was black? Is that what you think?

I think a black male does not receive the benefit of the doubt before being shot

A white male reaching for his wallet would not receive the same reaction

 

[2aguy]

Most are illegal but they began their lives as newly minted guns from a factory somewhere and were originally sold shiny and new in some store. That is a start.

Why is that? You're going to make 300 million guns disappear?

And it's hard to take this seriously from someone who thinks we should keep our borders open to anyone who wants to cross them ... carrying whatever they want to carry. Including ... guns ...

We can't keep pot away from high schoolers. But we're going to keep guns away from criminals, yeah.

So no, your plan to keep guns from honest citizens isn't a "start," it's a red herring

Put away your paint roller, buster. I never said borders should remain open to anyone who wants to cross them.
Why is WHAT? Where did I say limiting semiautomatic rifles was making "300 million guns disappear."

One...because when you say semi automatic...you think you know what you mean......to an anti gun politician...that means any weapon that is semi auto...including pistols....that is the bait and switch I keep posting about......

By banning semi autos.....you can lump in any weapon that fires one bullet for each pull of the trigger...that means all guns.....then they can go as far as they think they can get away with.......

 

[OldLady]

Why should it,if anything it proves how dangerous life can be.
Gun crazies want to disarm the people.what kind of logic is that?

Yes, taking guns from law abiding citizens is like targeting the drug war on people who don't do drugs and drunk driving programs on people who don't drink. Fact and logic, liberals take to them like fish take to cameras and fire flies

But in order to keep drugs from addicts, doctors have severely limited pain prescriptions to ALL patients. And doctors and pharmacies share pain prescription information on all patients to catch those abusing them. And to limit drunk drivers, all drivers can be stopped and tested, bars can be held liable for serving to someone already three sheets to the wind, regardless of whether they're driving. To limit gun violence, perhaps guns need to be limited for all. Fair? Maybe not. Who told you life is fair? I said limited, not completely gone, btw.

The problem is that we simply don't trust you to stop at limited.

In all of the cases above except the painkiller one, there is no prior restraint. you have to do something bad before you can be punished for them.

And the idea of making it very very hard for people to get painkillers because some abuse them leads to people suffering for no reason other than the laziness of those out there trying to enforce the law.

Government has plenty of existing laws out there to combat gun crimes, and the ownership of guns by those who should not have them. I suggest they use those laws already existing before bringing up more laws, especially "shotgun" effect laws that attempt to solve a problem by punishing everyone, and not just those who want to break/actually break the law.

I agree wholeheartedly that we should be enforcing the laws with vigor. I don't know what the problem is, but if it's anything like around here, cops are pretty busy just putting out the local fires with more and more limited manpower. We've had a bad economy, ya know? Don't know if that might have something to do with it.

And you're right, Marty, you wouldn't want to trust ME about stopping at "limited." I'd like to go Australia on you folks. But semiautomatic weapons and replaceable magazines will be a suitable compromise. I know many gun owners, including in my own family, and I understand that there are many responsible gun owners out there who respect the sanctity of human life and do not misuse their killing machine. I can actually agree that we have a right to choose self protection, but America has gone way overboard. It's as much the fault of the firearm manufacturers and their greed as it is individuals. They've had one of the best marketing campaigns out there for years--better than tobacco in its day.

So you want law abiding citizens to only have revolvers? That is where you set the limit..right? 5 shot or 6 shot?

and I understand that there are many responsible gun owners out there who respect the sanctity of human life and do not misuse their killing machine.

Wrong.......not many the owners of 356,991,876 guns in private hands....vs. less than 8,124 gun murders....that isn't many that is not what you would call a majority...that is what you would call almost all gun owners....

Where exactly have you seen any advertising for the gun industry....? it wasn't until this year that I actually heard gun makers advertising on the local radio stations...so how effective has their adverstising been?

I think you ought to re-read my post. As for advertising, your question is too silly to bother with.
P.S. 5-6 shot revolvers sounds pretty good to me. Except you can't get your moose with one. We need to work that one out. I love wild game.

 

[2aguy]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

We don't know exactly what happened.....but if he reached when he wasn't supposed to....and he was a possible suspect in the eyes of the cop considering the BOLO that had been put out...then race had nothing to do with it....

You think this cop just shot this man because he was black? Is that what you think?

I think a black male does not receive the benefit of the doubt before being shot

A white male reaching for his wallet would not receive the same reaction

actually, you would be wrong. The Harvard study just released by the black, Harvard economist shows that blacks are not shot more than whites....he admitted it was the most surprising outcome he ever saw..since he expected it to skew toward more blacks being shot....he was wrong, you are wrong....

 

[OldLady]

I keep reading posts that say we already have lots and lots of gun laws and we don't need any more. The new gun laws that I have heard about are laws that loosen the restrictions on carrying guns openly or concealed in public places. I haven't heard about gun laws which restrict ownership. Are such laws now being passed?

Cali has a recent one where concerned citizens can report a gun owner displaying erratic behavior or homicidal/suicidal ideation and have the gun taken away while the cops investigate. It could help.

You mean like the co workers of the Orlando shooter.....on the FBI radar for 10 months, with 3 actual interviews, and an undercover agent.....like that....?

Nothing's perfect.

 

[2aguy]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

We don't know exactly what happened.....but if he reached when he wasn't supposed to....and he was a possible suspect in the eyes of the cop considering the BOLO that had been put out...then race had nothing to do with it....

You think this cop just shot this man because he was black? Is that what you think?

I think a black male does not receive the benefit of the doubt before being shot

A white male reaching for his wallet would not receive the same reaction

Here you go.....this link also has the study imbedded in it so you don't have to pay for it .......

Harvard police study shoots another hole in #BlackLivesMatter narrative

Add another set of facts, as analyzed in a just released Harvard study [full embed at bottom of post], reported in The NY Times:

A new study confirms that black men and women are treated differently in the hands of law enforcement. They are more likely to be touched, handcuffed, pushed to the ground or pepper-sprayed by a police officer, even after accounting for how, where and when they encounter the police.

But when it comes to the most lethal form of force — police shootings — the study finds no racial bias.

“It is the most surprising result of my career,” said Roland G. Fryer Jr., the author of the study and a professor of economics at Harvard. The study examined more than 1,000 shootings in 10 major police departments, in Texas, Florida and California.

The result contradicts the mental image of police shootings that many Americans hold in the wake of the killings (some captured on video) of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Mo.; Laquan McDonald in Chicago; Tamir Rice in Cleveland; Walter Scott in South Carolina; Samuel DuBose in Cincinnati; Alton Sterling in Baton Rouge, La.; and Philando Castile in Minnesota.

 

[2aguy]

I keep reading posts that say we already have lots and lots of gun laws and we don't need any more. The new gun laws that I have heard about are laws that loosen the restrictions on carrying guns openly or concealed in public places. I haven't heard about gun laws which restrict ownership. Are such laws now being passed?

Cali has a recent one where concerned citizens can report a gun owner displaying erratic behavior or homicidal/suicidal ideation and have the gun taken away while the cops investigate. It could help.

You mean like the co workers of the Orlando shooter.....on the FBI radar for 10 months, with 3 actual interviews, and an undercover agent.....like that....?

Nothing's perfect.

yeah...that's what democrats said when their Poll Taxes and Literacy tests kept blacks from voting.....

 

[rightwinger]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

We don't know exactly what happened.....but if he reached when he wasn't supposed to....and he was a possible suspect in the eyes of the cop considering the BOLO that had been put out...then race had nothing to do with it....

You think this cop just shot this man because he was black? Is that what you think?

I think a black male does not receive the benefit of the doubt before being shot

A white male reaching for his wallet would not receive the same reaction

actually, you would be wrong. The Harvard study just released by the black, Harvard economist shows that blacks are not shot more than whites....he admitted it was the most surprising outcome he ever saw..since he expected it to skew toward more blacks being shot....he was wrong, you are wrong....

Is this a percentage or just reflect the fact that there are three times as many whites as blacks?

 

[OldLady]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

they put out a statement....look it up....and where do you have link showing he was an actual permit holder......the last I saw the county had no record of him......

Actually, the last I heard is that it is illegal to make public who has a concealed carry permit in that area. Looks like it will come down to who we want to believe.

he's dead...it doesn't matter anymore.......

Would you please tell them that? So everyone could stop quibbling about it?

 

[2aguy]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

they put out a statement....look it up....and where do you have link showing he was an actual permit holder......the last I saw the county had no record of him......

Actually, the last I heard is that it is illegal to make public who has a concealed carry permit in that area. Looks like it will come down to who we want to believe.

he's dead...it doesn't matter anymore.......

Would you please tell them that? So everyone could stop quibbling about it?

Yes...it would be nice......I hope the cop had a camera on....would be nice to hear what happened from his side...but in a moment of extreme stress he did say he told the guy not to reach...and he did.....

 

[Fair&Balanced]

well, it's obvious logic isn't a requirement in the CDZ.

Related to the OP. After Lord knows how many Muslim attacks around the world, the liberals still don't change their tune visa vie Islamic terrorists.

 

[rightwinger]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

they put out a statement....look it up....and where do you have link showing he was an actual permit holder......the last I saw the county had no record of him......

Actually, the last I heard is that it is illegal to make public who has a concealed carry permit in that area. Looks like it will come down to who we want to believe.

he's dead...it doesn't matter anymore.......

Would you please tell them that? So everyone could stop quibbling about it?

Yes...it would be nice......I hope the cop had a camera on....would be nice to hear what happened from his side...but in a moment of extreme stress he did say he told the guy not to reach...and he did.....

What will the NRA response be?

Should CC holders be shot for making a wrong move while being stopped by police?

 

[Fair&Balanced]

Where is the NRA in condemning the killing of an innocent CC permit holder?

Doesn't apply to carrying while black?

they put out a statement....look it up....and where do you have link showing he was an actual permit holder......the last I saw the county had no record of him......

Actually, the last I heard is that it is illegal to make public who has a concealed carry permit in that area. Looks like it will come down to who we want to believe.

he's dead...it doesn't matter anymore.......

Would you please tell them that? So everyone could stop quibbling about it?

Yes...it would be nice......I hope the cop had a camera on....would be nice to hear what happened from his side...but in a moment of extreme stress he did say he told the guy not to reach...and he did.....

You notice that is something liberals just will not address. They will never admit that yes black folk need to start teaching their children to obey the police when they give a lawful order.

I'm sure though that that is an oversight and that discussing that is on the agenda right after discussing why black people commit a higher percentage of crimes than any other race and thus are targeted by police accordingly.

 

[2aguy]

well, it's obvious logic isn't a requirement in the CDZ.

Related to the OP. After Lord knows how many Muslim attacks around the world, the liberals still don't change their tune visa vie Islamic terrorists.

I know.....interesting isn't it? What does a vile, horrible muslim terrorist have to do to actually get credit for killing in the name of islam.........? They can't even drown people in cages or burn women alive who refuse to be raped and get credit for that either............by the way....did anyone say the NRA members or christians or Tea Party members were the ones responsible for those things yet.....?

 

[2aguy]

they put out a statement....look it up....and where do you have link showing he was an actual permit holder......the last I saw the county had no record of him......

Actually, the last I heard is that it is illegal to make public who has a concealed carry permit in that area. Looks like it will come down to who we want to believe.

he's dead...it doesn't matter anymore.......

Would you please tell them that? So everyone could stop quibbling about it?

Yes...it would be nice......I hope the cop had a camera on....would be nice to hear what happened from his side...but in a moment of extreme stress he did say he told the guy not to reach...and he did.....

What will the NRA response be?

Should CC holders be shot for making a wrong move while being stopped by police?

The NRA has responded.....you should look it up.....

And as Skull Pilot pointed out...the NRA advocates for gun safety, for keeping guns out of the hands of criminals and responsible concealed carry of guns..which is why they specialize in gun safety education........

 

[OldLady]

Why should it,if anything it proves how dangerous life can be.
Gun crazies want to disarm the people.what kind of logic is that?

Yes, taking guns from law abiding citizens is like targeting the drug war on people who don't do drugs and drunk driving programs on people who don't drink. Fact and logic, liberals take to them like fish take to cameras and fire flies

But in order to keep drugs from addicts, doctors have severely limited pain prescriptions to ALL patients. And doctors and pharmacies share pain prescription information on all patients to catch those abusing them. And to limit drunk drivers, all drivers can be stopped and tested, bars can be held liable for serving to someone already three sheets to the wind, regardless of whether they're driving. To limit gun violence, perhaps guns need to be limited for all. Fair? Maybe not. Who told you life is fair? I said limited, not completely gone, btw.

And so people buy drugs ... illegally. My point. You may have heard about that, it's been in the news ...

No. The point is actually that many addicts began by being prescribed opiates for a bonafide medical issue. Then they got hooked and tried "doctor shopping" and emergency room jumping to get more as their need increased. And when that no longer worked, they switched to heroin. Focusing on the root of the problem, where it started, will hopefully save the upcoming generation from a similar fate. To me, it makes equal sense that if the root of the illegal gun problem--guns in circulation--were addressed, it would help keep them from the wrong hands by the sheer weight of the numbers.

When you ban guns for law abiding people who do not use them for crime.....criminals will still get them.....that is how it is all around the world.......the criminals have guns, normal people do not......

How?