6 time convicted felon caught buying guns from individual seller at gun show, caught by the feds...

[2aguy]

Just like it happened in Germany, Britain, Australia,

You mean places where they have almost no gun violence.... yeah, that works.

Oh, Germany has pretty wide gun ownership, about one gun for every five people. They just don't let people have them because it's a "right" granted by sissies in powdered wigs 200 years ago.

no moron...they have little gun crime because their thug culture doesn't commit murder......moron....

 

[2aguy]

How many of the 8,124 guns used for murder were bought between private sales? can you answer that?

NO, because the NRA doesn't let hte government collect that kind of info.

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

 

[2aguy]

Guy............... Are you saying there is loophole at gun shows? Wow really? Or did you made a mistake posting this?

There is no gun show loophole. If you think there is, you are deluded. Private sales are not required to have background checks performed.

That was a private sale.

Then we should change the law that........... Private seller should require a back ground checks. Or no private seller at gun shows. How is that?

What will that do.....do you understand that private sales are not where criminals get their guns...they get them from licensed gun dealers using people with clean records to buy the guns or they steal them....

so....knowing that...if you force the widow Johnson to get a background check when she gives her son her dead husbands hunting rifle......what does that achieve......

And if a criminals wants to buy a gun from an individual seller....he can just use a straw buyer for that purchase too...

Do you understand that? Background checks don't work.....

Dude. Then we should out law private seller. So we ( not you) eliminate one more way on how criminals buy their guns.

here....learn something about the illegal gun trade...then you will actually post with more intelligence....

http://www.newsweek.com/gun-control-where-criminals-get-weapons-412850

But while a majority of owners obtain their guns in transactions that are documented and for the most part legal, the same is not true for criminals.

A transaction can be illegal for several reasons, but of particular interest are transactions that involve disqualified individuals—those banned from purchase or possession due to criminal record, age, adjudicated mental illness, illegal alien status or some other reason.

Convicted felons, teenagers and other people who are legally barred from possession would ordinarily be blocked from purchasing a gun from a gun store, because they would fail the background check or lack the permit or license required by some states.

Anyone providing the gun in such transactions would be culpable if they had reason to know that the buyer was disqualified, if they were acting as a straw purchaser or if they violated state regulations pertaining to such private transactions.

The importance of the informal (undocumented) market in supplying criminals is suggested by the results of inmate surveys and data gleaned from guns confiscated by the police.

A national survey of inmates of state prisons found that just 10 percent of youthful (age 18-40) male respondents who admitted to having a gun at the time of their arrest had obtained it from a gun store. The other 90 percent obtained them through a variety of off-the-book means: for example, as gifts or sharing arrangements with fellow gang members.

Similarly, an ongoing study of how Chicago gang members get their guns has found that only a trivial percentage obtained them by direct purchase from a store.

(This essentially means they did not personally buy the gun...they used a straw buyer who buys the gun legally....)

To the extent that gun dealers are implicated in supplying dangerous people, it is more so by accommodating straw purchasers and traffickers than in selling directly to customers they know to be disqualified.

The supply chain of guns to crime

While criminals typically do not buy their guns at a store, all but a tiny fraction of the guns in circulation in the United States are first sold at retail by a gun dealer—including the guns thateventually end up in the hands of criminals.

That first retail sale was most likely legal, in that the clerk followed federal and state requirements for documentation, a background check and record-keeping. While there are scofflaw dealers who sometimes make under-the-counter deals, that is by no means the norm.

If a gun ends up in criminal use, it is usually after several more transactions.

The average age of guns taken from Chicago gangs is over 11 years.

The gun at that point has been diverted from legal commerce. In this respect, the supply chain for guns is similar to the supply chain for other products that have a large legal market but are subject to diversion.

In the case of guns, diversion from licit possession and exchange can occur in a variety of ways: theft, purchase at a gun show by an interstate trafficker, private sales where no questions are asked, straw purchases by girlfriends and so forth.

And here is the key....the smart criminals don't trust private sales with an unknown seller genius.....

All in the family

So how do gang members, violent criminals, underage youths and other dangerous people get their guns?

A consistent answer emerges from the inmate surveys and from ethnographic studies. Whether guns that end up being used in crime are purchased, swapped, borrowed, shared or stolen, themost likely source is someone known to the offender, an acquaintance or family member.

Also important are “street” sources, such as gang members and drug dealers, which may also entail a prior relationship.

Thus, social networks are playing an important role in facilitating transactions, and an individual (such as a gang member) who tends to hang out with people who have guns will find it relatively easy to obtain one.

Criminals do not use private sellers...because they can't trust them because they are likely going to be cops...or they will snitch out the criminal if they are caught selling illegal guns.....

 

[JoeB131]

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

You mean why do you keep throwing out bullshit numbers? I have no idea.

yeah, I have a real problem with an organization that sees 20 dead children being wheeled out in body bags and their response is, "We need more guns!!!"

 

[2aguy]

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

You mean why do you keep throwing out bullshit numbers? I have no idea.

yeah, I have a real problem with an organization that sees 20 dead children being wheeled out in body bags and their response is, "We need more guns!!!"

Hey asshole.......the place where the children were killed....was a gun free zone created by you...specifically targeted by the shooter because it was a gun free zone...created by assholes like you...since he also had attended the Middle School and the High School...but they had armed security, the elementary school...gun free.........

Those deaths are on morons like you.

 

[2aguy]

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

You mean why do you keep throwing out bullshit numbers? I have no idea.

yeah, I have a real problem with an organization that sees 20 dead children being wheeled out in body bags and their response is, "We need more guns!!!"

Bullshit numbers.......you can't dispute them so you say they are bullshit.....

 

[Wilbur Right]

Bullshit numbers.......you can't dispute them so you say they are bullshit.....

Really? I dispute your Bullshit numbers all the time.

The big problem you have is you can't PROVE your Bullshit numbers. I you could you would.

How about a couple hundred DGUs from yesterday? Got them?
LMAO. Fuck no you can't PROVE your Bullshit.

 

[charwin95]

Guy............... Are you saying there is loophole at gun shows? Wow really? Or did you made a mistake posting this?

There is no gun show loophole. If you think there is, you are deluded. Private sales are not required to have background checks performed.

That was a private sale.

Then we should change the law that........... Private seller should require a back ground checks. Or no private seller at gun shows. How is that?

What will that do.....do you understand that private sales are not where criminals get their guns...they get them from licensed gun dealers using people with clean records to buy the guns or they steal them....

so....knowing that...if you force the widow Johnson to get a background check when she gives her son her dead husbands hunting rifle......what does that achieve......

And if a criminals wants to buy a gun from an individual seller....he can just use a straw buyer for that purchase too...

Do you understand that? Background checks don't work.....

Dude. Then we should out law private seller. So we ( not you) eliminate one more way on how criminals buy their guns.

Wrong...guns are a legal product......you arrest the people who break the law with them.....that is how you apply all laws...

Agree guns are legal product but private sellers should follow other license gun sellers at gun show that requires BG checks. Or out law private seller at gun shows.

 

[ClosedCaption]

See....this guy was not caught with a universal background check....and he didn't buy his guns from a licensed seller at a gun show.......but he was still caught....and now faces jail time.......we don't need more laws...we need to actually enforce the laws we have...

Wow, dude, seriously, you are complaining a felon used the gun show loophole to get guns?

There is no gun show loophole........

 

[charwin95]

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

You mean why do you keep throwing out bullshit numbers? I have no idea.

yeah, I have a real problem with an organization that sees 20 dead children being wheeled out in body bags and their response is, "We need more guns!!!"

Hey asshole.......the place where the children were killed....was a gun free zone created by you...specifically targeted by the shooter because it was a gun free zone...created by assholes like you...since he also had attended the Middle School and the High School...but they had armed security, the elementary school...gun free.........

Those deaths are on morons like you.

If a lunatic want to commit a mass shooting or murder........... Does he care if it's a gun free zones or not?
I don't think so.
Does a Gun Nuts like you even care or respect a gun free zones? I don't think so. You can easily hide your gun in your backpack, brief case or under your waste or arm or purse.
Dude be honest.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Guy............... Are you saying there is loophole at gun shows? Wow really? Or did you made a mistake posting this?

The "gun show loophole" does not exist.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Guy............... Are you saying there is loophole at gun shows? Wow really? Or did you made a mistake posting this?

There is no gun show loophole. If you think there is, you are deluded. Private sales are not required to have background checks performed.
That was a private sale.

Then we should change the law that........... Private seller should require a back ground checks. Or no private seller at gun shows. How is that?

Universal background checks are unenforceable w/o universal registration.
The anti-gun loons know this, which is why they push universal background checks.
No one wonders why they want universal registration.

 

[M14 Shooter]

That can't happen until a majority of voters agree that guns should be banned and confiscated. And if they do, it will be your fault for failing to compromise and give some respect to the safety of unarmed citizens.

As proven earlier... you do not seek compromise as you offer the pro-gun side in return for the restrictions you seek.

 

[OldLady]

See....this guy was not caught with a universal background check....and he didn't buy his guns from a licensed seller at a gun show.......but he was still caught....and now faces jail time.......we don't need more laws...we need to actually enforce the laws we have...

he should go to prison for 30 years.....or more...not just 8....

Felon gets 8 years for buying guns at gun show

According to court documents, agents surveilling “The Nation’s Gun Show” in Chantilly on April 25, 2015, saw Weiss give a seller a large amount of cash for two pistols and an AR-15. They followed him as he walked to the parking lot with two pistol boxes and the rifle.

Along with his behavior, Weiss bought pistols in Virginia but had Maryland tags on his car leading agents to suspect he had committed a crime. Under federal law, patrons can only buy handguns in the state where they live.

Wow...they used actual police work....and not a universal background check to catch this guy.....who knew....?

With six felony convictions, prosecutors said that Weiss “may not qualify as a career offender, but (he) is a person dedicated to a life of crime” and recommended 10 years in prison.

why didn't he get the 10 years?

One down and ... how many to go?

Ask obama.....he has reduced gun crime prosecutions by about 40% since he has been in office...why is that?

I didn't know Obama was a federal prosecutor. Thought he was president.

 

[OldLady]

That can't happen until a majority of voters agree that guns should be banned and confiscated. And if they do, it will be your fault for failing to compromise and give some respect to the safety of unarmed citizens.

As proven earlier... you do not seek compromise as you offer the pro-gun side in return for the restrictions you seek.

You didn't prove anything earlier. You decide it can't be "compromise" unless you get something in addition to what you've already got for gun rights. To me, with people who want to restrict the types of guns you can own, it is a legitimate compromise to talk about which ones you can keep. Since you have a ridiculous definition of compromise, I just stopped trying to discuss it with you.

 

[OldLady]

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

You mean why do you keep throwing out bullshit numbers? I have no idea.

yeah, I have a real problem with an organization that sees 20 dead children being wheeled out in body bags and their response is, "We need more guns!!!"

Yes, that was totally obscene.

 

[M14 Shooter]

That can't happen until a majority of voters agree that guns should be banned and confiscated. And if they do, it will be your fault for failing to compromise and give some respect to the safety of unarmed citizens.

As proven earlier... you do not seek compromise as you offer the pro-gun side in return for the restrictions you seek.

You didn't prove anything earlier. You decide it can't be "compromise" unless you get something in addition to what you've already got for gun rights.

Do you not understand the meaning of compromise?
noun: compromise; plural noun: compromises
1.
an agreement or a settlement of a dispute that is reached by each side making concessions.

You want something from me. You offer something in return for what you want from me. That's compromise.
You do not seek compromise because you only seek to take from gun owners with nothing given in return - you believe compromise means you get what YOU want with nothing more than a promise that you will later seek to take more.

That's not compromise, that's acquiescence; given your definition of the tr, there's no reason gun owners should ever compromise with you -- and then you have the audacity to cry about owners not giving you want you want, so you're taking your ball and going home.

Why do you not understand this?

 

[2aguy]

Bullshit numbers.......you can't dispute them so you say they are bullshit.....

Really? I dispute your Bullshit numbers all the time.

The big problem you have is you can't PROVE your Bullshit numbers. I you could you would.

How about a couple hundred DGUs from yesterday? Got them?
LMAO. Fuck no you can't PROVE your Bullshit.

Hey asshole......if you read the actual research....40 years of it from both government and private researchers in actual fields where they train to do research, most defensive gun uses do not result in the weapon being fired...the criminal runs away.....and therefore there is no call to police and no press coverage....the only ones that make the news are the bodies on the ground...and even then they have to have a hook that makes them good enough to use up time on the news casts.....

moron.......

40 years of actual research and you....talking out of your ass think you know the truth.....

 

[2aguy]

There is no gun show loophole. If you think there is, you are deluded. Private sales are not required to have background checks performed.

That was a private sale.

Then we should change the law that........... Private seller should require a back ground checks. Or no private seller at gun shows. How is that?

What will that do.....do you understand that private sales are not where criminals get their guns...they get them from licensed gun dealers using people with clean records to buy the guns or they steal them....

so....knowing that...if you force the widow Johnson to get a background check when she gives her son her dead husbands hunting rifle......what does that achieve......

And if a criminals wants to buy a gun from an individual seller....he can just use a straw buyer for that purchase too...

Do you understand that? Background checks don't work.....

Dude. Then we should out law private seller. So we ( not you) eliminate one more way on how criminals buy their guns.

Wrong...guns are a legal product......you arrest the people who break the law with them.....that is how you apply all laws...

Agree guns are legal product but private sellers should follow other license gun sellers at gun show that requires BG checks. Or out law private seller at gun shows.

Sorry.....the only reason anti gun leaders want normal people who sell their dads .22 rifle to get a background check is so they can then require gun registration...

There is no need for universal background checks...they don't stop criminals from getting guns, since all a criminal has to do is get someone with a clean record to buy the gun for them........

We have the laws we need to catch criminals already....new laws only impact normal people...so when the widow Johnson gives her son the dead husbands rifle.....and doesn't realize she now needs to do a background check on her son...congratulations....you just made her a felon......

Meanwhile, the gang banger gets his sister to buy the gun at the gun store for him...then sells it and 11 years later the police find it at a crime scene.....after it has been used to commit murder after murder....

 

[2aguy]

Wrong moron......what is your fixation with the NRA.....obama is the one not prosecuting gun crimes.....his prosecution for gun crimes is down about 40%....why is that genius?

You mean why do you keep throwing out bullshit numbers? I have no idea.

yeah, I have a real problem with an organization that sees 20 dead children being wheeled out in body bags and their response is, "We need more guns!!!"

Hey asshole.......the place where the children were killed....was a gun free zone created by you...specifically targeted by the shooter because it was a gun free zone...created by assholes like you...since he also had attended the Middle School and the High School...but they had armed security, the elementary school...gun free.........

Those deaths are on morons like you.

If a lunatic want to commit a mass shooting or murder........... Does he care if it's a gun free zones or not?
I don't think so.
Does a Gun Nuts like you even care or respect a gun free zones? I don't think so. You can easily hide your gun in your backpack, brief case or under your waste or arm or purse.
Dude be honest.

Yes, actually, they do....I have posted the shooters who selected gun free zones over and over again....they are not looking for a gun fight, they are looking to murder unarmed people who cannot resist...off the top of my head...

--Sandy Hook
--The Colorado theater shooter
--the Santa Barbara shooter
--the muslim jihadi who was going to target a mega church in Minnesotta
--the South Carolina Church shooter...


Then the rest....they don't have to make a choice because you guys have made almost every public space a gun free zone for them...no choice is needed.....

And yes....I respect gun free zones and will not carry in them...it is a class B misdemeanor here in Illinois.....and you can lose your permit to carry if you do.....for me there is an actual cost...for the mass shooter, there is no cost....