48%: The Democratic Party needs to face an ugly reality

[Oddball]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Any more questions.

President John F. Kennedy is probably looking down from Heaven thinking WTF?! Imagine JFK getting on his KNEES to SUBMIT to a feral mob of zoo animals? JFK was the LAST actual Liberal the Democrats had as a Presidential Candidate and on Economic Issues he was basically a Classical Liberal aka a Conservative, JFK was VERY VERY Anti-Marxist and certainly would have thrown out the Marxists who have now taken over and are in CONTROL of the Democrat Party.

View attachment 388506

There are no Marxist in the Democratic Party just like there are no fascist in the Republican party your illusions border on the disturbed

The below is one of the BLM groups who are SUPPORTED by the Democrat Party, I say they are SUPPORTED by the Democrat Party BECAUSE they do NOT CONDEMN them.

View attachment 388514

^^^^ This is what they want and IF Joe Biden and Co get elected they will be PRESSURED into giving in to them or else they will threaten to just burn America down.

 

[eagle1462010]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Yeah. This has been my main complaint for the last six months. It's seems like, if they really wanted to, the Democrats could erect a "tent" big enough to bury Trump. So why don't they?

Maybe I'm underestimating the challenge. To some extent, any movement to the "center", will cost them support from progressives. But on a one for one basis, that's a worthwhile trade. Progressives, even if they don't vote Biden, won't vote for Trump. Independents might.

But it's not all about left-right. There are cross cutting issues which might move independents and reluctant Trump voters their way, without costing them progressive votes. Abandoning the drug war, or at least dialing back on it, is something that would pull libertarian leaning voters their way. And what's wrong with simply admitting to past mistakes and correcting them? It might be a symbolic gesture at this point, but repealing the individual mandate, and acknowledging the basic wrongness of forcing people to buy insurance, would definitely get my attention.

But that's the problem. I don't think they really learned anything from 2016. They're basically us selling the same thing, hoping that the disaster of Trump's first term, and the entrenched Lo2e stupidity, will carry the day. They're doubling down on big government we-know-better-ism and interest group corporatism, with seemingly no awareness of how feed up people are with that shit.

Ultimately, I think they're just willing to stay the course and roll the dice. This is one of the biggest problems with the two-party death spiral. They have little interest in real consensus. They push their agenda as hard as they can, shooting for a slim majority rather than broad support.

You will vote for someone who can't win again..............and then go OH SHIT.......why did Biden Win.............

We fix this with a 50 year corrupt politician in bed with the Globalist.

Cool story bro..........but alas we WILL SAVE YOU FROM IT...........poor thing......

Hey......your plane is here.

I have no idea what you're rambling about here. Just mashing keys?

Yes you do know.............you just refuse to accept the Reality of the battlefield we face now...........Fantasy Island is where you belong.............and maybe one day you'll wake up to it.......................

We must fight the battle at hand.........not one in your imaginary world...............I do believe the enumerated powers need to come back...............and that the Original intent of the Constitution may have stopped this..............

But that is not on this battlefield today.

Hmm... I'm still not culling anything coherent from that. Maybe all the ellipses are throwing me off. Can you do normal sentences?

Whatever.............

 

[JakeStarkey]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Any more questions.

President John F. Kennedy is probably looking down from Heaven thinking WTF?! Imagine JFK getting on his KNEES to SUBMIT to a feral mob of zoo animals? JFK was the LAST actual Liberal the Democrats had as a Presidential Candidate and on Economic Issues he was basically a Classical Liberal aka a Conservative, JFK was VERY VERY Anti-Marxist and certainly would have thrown out the Marxists who have now taken over and are in CONTROL of the Democrat Party.

View attachment 388506

JFK would be decried as a fascist by today's lunatic moonbat mainstream of the Democrat Party.

JFK on the Dem Party then or now would laugh at the GOP. He could see how this election is going to turn out

The Dems are in a very good place.

 

[Oddball]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Yeah. This has been my main complaint for the last six months. It's seems like, if they really wanted to, the Democrats could erect a "tent" big enough to bury Trump. So why don't they?

Maybe I'm underestimating the challenge. To some extent, any movement to the "center", will cost them support from progressives. But on a one for one basis, that's a worthwhile trade. Progressives, even if they don't vote Biden, won't vote for Trump. Independents might.

But it's not all about left-right. There are cross cutting issues which might move independents and reluctant Trump voters their way, without costing them progressive votes. Abandoning the drug war, or at least dialing back on it, is something that would pull libertarian leaning voters their way. And what's wrong with simply admitting to past mistakes and correcting them? It might be a symbolic gesture at this point, but repealing the individual mandate, and acknowledging the basic wrongness of forcing people to buy insurance, would definitely get my attention.

But that's the problem. I don't think they really learned anything from 2016. They're selling us the same thing, hoping that the disaster of Trump's first term, and the entrenched Lo2e stupidity, will carry the day. They're doubling down on big government we-know-better-ism and interest group corporatism, with seemingly no awareness of how feed up people are with that shit.

Ultimately, I think they're just willing to stay the course and roll the dice. This is one of the biggest problems with the two-party death spiral. They have little interest in real consensus. They push their agenda as hard as they can, shooting for a slim majority rather than broad support.

Yeabbut.....but.....but......but......but....

ORANGE MAN BAD!!!

 

[22lcidw]

Meanwhile, back in reality, the Democrats are beating Trump and his cult like a gong.

Why?

The Democrats offer concrete policies across the board, while the Trump cult offers only fear and hate.

The Democrats act like patriots and decent human beings, while the Trump cult acts like Nazi sociopaths. Q-anon, the current Republican philosophy, is literally a Nazi conspiracy theory repackaged.

We can't save the Republican party. The treason runs too deep there. They simply hate everyone outside of their fascist cult, because the hating gives them a thrill. Pity. The USA needs two parties. Hopefully, a sane conservative party will rise out of the wreckage of the GOP.

Progs represent dictatorship. Both sides have enabled that direction.

 

[Blaine Sweeter]

Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to

Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons to vote for Mr Trump

Noted that you didn't list any.
If there's plenty, I'm sure you have a moment or two to share them on this board.

 

[Rye Catcher]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often a
llowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

The Democrats need to retake control of their party, they need to tell the Neo-Marxists to GTFO because NO Western nation and ESPECIALLY America wants Marxism and wants to collapse Capitalism and replace it with Anarchy and a Communist System.

Why do you continue to use the RED SCARE?

Q. Do you have a clue about what Marxism is?

Q. Do you belief the Democratic Party will actually take over General Motors, Ford and other industries to control the means of production?

If you do I have a bridge for sale cheap, it spans the opening from the Pacific Coast into San Francisco Bay. There is even and Island about a mile west of the bridge, it once was a Federal Prison and I'm sure Trump&Co. will sell it to you.

It's hard to tell exactly what democrats mean, like Bernie Sanders, when he refers to socialism, because he refers to both countries like Sweden and Cuba as if they were one in the same, when they could not be more different.

That is what scares the hell out of people, and rightly so. Then throw in the AOC train wreck who can't even tie their shoes and you are left with a very bad feeling if these demagogues ever take power.

Sanders and Moore need to STFU unless they want people like you, Trump&Co., to continue to exploit their comments; the large part of the hate and fear doctrine used by Trump&Co.; Trump and his lap dogs and press secretaries use Big Lies and half-truths, rumors, innuendos and false assassinations of the character of all Democrats.

Calling AOC a train wreck is one more example of a Big Lie; the only train wreck today is Trump's Lies and efforts to spin his total failure to protect We the People from Covid; his effort to not panic the people is absurd.

Read FDR's first inauguration speech to the people, that is what real leaders do!

The Avalon Project : First Inaugural Address of Franklin D. Roosevelt

 

[JakeStarkey]

We have Trump's goons in Congress taxing the working wealthy and the middle class to death to support the ultra-poor while letting the rich walk.

Boy are you one confused puppy.

The truth hurts you I know. The "ugly reality" in this OP is that the Dems are going to deliver a political round house to the GOP in Nov.

Yeah....Like Evan McMullin yanked the rug out from under Trump in Utah!

Not at all. You don't get Utah.

 

[mamooth]

the Democrats could erect a "tent" big enough to bury Trump. So why don't they?

They did. The Democrats now own the middle. Suburban America has swung to the Democrats.

This thread is Republican projection. The Republicans are stuck placating their loony right base, which is the majority of their party, so they can't move back to the middle. In contrast, the Democrats are mainly a party of the middle. Their liberal wing is a minority.

abandoning the drug war, or at least dialing back on it, is something that would pull libertarian leaning voters their way.

Which the Democrats are doing. But I doubt that will pull in libertarians. Libertarians have never cared much about actual liberty. The Democrats have always been far better on all liberty issues, and the libertarians have still always allied themselves with Republicans. Most libertarians are one-issue voters, that issue being getting more money in their own pocket.

 

[dblack]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Yeah. This has been my main complaint for the last six months. It's seems like, if they really wanted to, the Democrats could erect a "tent" big enough to bury Trump. So why don't they?

Maybe I'm underestimating the challenge. To some extent, any movement to the "center", will cost them support from progressives. But on a one for one basis, that's a worthwhile trade. Progressives, even if they don't vote Biden, won't vote for Trump. Independents might.

But it's not all about left-right. There are cross cutting issues which might move independents and reluctant Trump voters their way, without costing them progressive votes. Abandoning the drug war, or at least dialing back on it, is something that would pull libertarian leaning voters their way. And what's wrong with simply admitting to past mistakes and correcting them? It might be a symbolic gesture at this point, but repealing the individual mandate, and acknowledging the basic wrongness of forcing people to buy insurance, would definitely get my attention.

But that's the problem. I don't think they really learned anything from 2016. They're selling us the same thing, hoping that the disaster of Trump's first term, and the entrenched Lo2e stupidity, will carry the day. They're doubling down on big government we-know-better-ism and interest group corporatism, with seemingly no awareness of how feed up people are with that shit.

Ultimately, I think they're just willing to stay the course and roll the dice. This is one of the biggest problems with the two-party death spiral. They have little interest in real consensus. They push their agenda as hard as they can, shooting for a slim majority rather than broad support.

Yeabbut.....but.....but......but......but....

ORANGE MAN BAD!!!

And I agree. He is bad. Abysmally so. Yet voters chose him over Democrats in 2016. It could happen again.

 

[Oddball]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Any more questions.

President John F. Kennedy is probably looking down from Heaven thinking WTF?! Imagine JFK getting on his KNEES to SUBMIT to a feral mob of zoo animals? JFK was the LAST actual Liberal the Democrats had as a Presidential Candidate and on Economic Issues he was basically a Classical Liberal aka a Conservative, JFK was VERY VERY Anti-Marxist and certainly would have thrown out the Marxists who have now taken over and are in CONTROL of the Democrat Party.

View attachment 388506

JFK would be decried as a fascist by today's lunatic moonbat mainstream of the Democrat Party.

JFK on the Dem Party then or now would laugh at the GOP. He could see how this election is going to turn out

The Dems are in a very good place.

Yeah....sure.

You pouring whole, 2%, or skim milk on your paint chips?

 

[MisterBeale]

The problem, MAC, is you get all your information from the corporate media.

Wrong. So much for the rest of your point.

Meet your tribe Mac

Ask Beale where he gets information? Given his many posts I suspect he's a Fox hound and a Dittohead.

Oh yeah? Quote a post where I use Fox, go on. . .

 

[Blaine Sweeter]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often a
llowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

The Democrats need to retake control of their party, they need to tell the Neo-Marxists to GTFO because NO Western nation and ESPECIALLY America wants Marxism and wants to collapse Capitalism and replace it with Anarchy and a Communist System.

And the ugly reality the democrats need to face up to is this......the democrat party doesn't exist any longer.

The Republicans have turned their party over to Trump.
They are a bunch of spineless cowards who have allowed Trump to use the Constitution as his personal toilet paper.

 

[Redcurtain]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Lol polls haha you keep winning polls we will win elections

 

[JakeStarkey]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Any more questions.

President John F. Kennedy is probably looking down from Heaven thinking WTF?! Imagine JFK getting on his KNEES to SUBMIT to a feral mob of zoo animals? JFK was the LAST actual Liberal the Democrats had as a Presidential Candidate and on Economic Issues he was basically a Classical Liberal aka a Conservative, JFK was VERY VERY Anti-Marxist and certainly would have thrown out the Marxists who have now taken over and are in CONTROL of the Democrat Party.

View attachment 388506

JFK would be decried as a fascist by today's lunatic moonbat mainstream of the Democrat Party.

JFK on the Dem Party then or now would laugh at the GOP. He could see how this election is going to turn out

The Dems are in a very good place.

Yeah....sure.

You pouring whole, 2%, or skim milk on your paint chips?

That does sound like you, indeed. The Dems as a party are in a great place.

 

[Oddball]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

Yeah. This has been my main complaint for the last six months. It's seems like, if they really wanted to, the Democrats could erect a "tent" big enough to bury Trump. So why don't they?

Maybe I'm underestimating the challenge. To some extent, any movement to the "center", will cost them support from progressives. But on a one for one basis, that's a worthwhile trade. Progressives, even if they don't vote Biden, won't vote for Trump. Independents might.

But it's not all about left-right. There are cross cutting issues which might move independents and reluctant Trump voters their way, without costing them progressive votes. Abandoning the drug war, or at least dialing back on it, is something that would pull libertarian leaning voters their way. And what's wrong with simply admitting to past mistakes and correcting them? It might be a symbolic gesture at this point, but repealing the individual mandate, and acknowledging the basic wrongness of forcing people to buy insurance, would definitely get my attention.

But that's the problem. I don't think they really learned anything from 2016. They're selling us the same thing, hoping that the disaster of Trump's first term, and the entrenched Lo2e stupidity, will carry the day. They're doubling down on big government we-know-better-ism and interest group corporatism, with seemingly no awareness of how feed up people are with that shit.

Ultimately, I think they're just willing to stay the course and roll the dice. This is one of the biggest problems with the two-party death spiral. They have little interest in real consensus. They push their agenda as hard as they can, shooting for a slim majority rather than broad support.

Yeabbut.....but.....but......but......but....

ORANGE MAN BAD!!!

And I agree. He is bad. Abysmally so. Yet voters chose him over Democrats in 2016. It could happen again.

Demonstration of the point that this is the extent of the "reasons" given for voting Biden.

I've looked high and low, and haven't found any that don't involve the mention of the name "Donald Trump".

You and I are in the same place; we want something to be for...The Lo2E shit doesn't cut it.....Trite and stale as it is, "MAGA" is, at the very least, something to be in favor of.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Trump and the GOP is not the thing to be for.

Biden and the Dems are.

 

[JoeB131]

Mitlaufer Mac and his wrong Assumptions, going wrong again.

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

First, it's very unlikely Trump will get anywhere NEAR 48%. probably closer to 45%. Trump hasn't won over any more people than he won over in 2016, he's probably lost some, and a lot of people who sat out 2016 because they couldn't stand Hillary won't make that mistake again. Oh, yeah, and then there's the plague, the recession, the riots and so on. But even in 2008, after Bush fucked up everything, McCain got 45% and that's probably where Trump is going to land.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Actually, that's more a reflection of "don't want to admit we made a mistake" than, "We think he's doing an awesome job."

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

Uh, no, Stormy, that we aren't pandering to your White Greivance politics is not a good reason to start doing that.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often allowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

Again, if Biden is weak, it's because he's a weak, middle of the road candidate who doesn't stand for anything and no one is all that excited about... A guy who could make a full-throat advocacy of progressive principles would be wiping the floor with Trump right now.

Of course, the real problem is, this election only matters who wins six states out of 44. The other 44 are pretty much baked into the pie.

One more time. WE DO NOT NEED TWO REPUBLICAN PARTIES... One is doing plenty of damage, thank you very much.

 

[dblack]

the Democrats could erect a "tent" big enough to bury Trump. So why don't they?

They did. The Democrats now own the middle. Suburban America has swung to the Democrats.

I think you're kidding yourself. The polls don't indicate much has changed. It's still a fact that 45%+ of voters support Trump over Biden. That SHOULD be utterly embarrassing to Democrats. But they seem ok with it.

This thread is Republican projection. The Republicans are stuck placating their loony right base, which is the majority of their party, so they can't move back to the middle. In contrast, the Democrats are mainly a party of the middle. Their liberal wing is a minority.

Mac isn't a Republican. Neither am I. This thread is valid criticism of the Democrats.

abandoning the drug war, or at least dialing back on it, is something that would pull libertarian leaning voters their way.

Which the Democrats are doing.

It's not in their platform. And it's something Biden has opposed his whole career. So, your claim is hard to take at face value. Some Democrats are proposing rolling it back, but so are some Republicans. The election is for the President, and he's not on board.

But I doubt that will pull in libertarians. Libertarians have never cared much about actual liberty. The Democrats have always been far better on all liberty issues, and the libertarians have still always allied themselves with Republicans. Most libertarians are one-issue voters, that issue being getting more money in their own pocket.

Every single claim in this paragraph is wrong.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

This is just a guess, of course, but somewhere around 48% of those who vote in November will be voting for Donald Trump. Without going into the laundry list of obvious examples or any of the standard talking points, there are certainly plenty of reasons not to. Yet he has a perfectly reasonable chance of winning.

Right now, polls show that about 43% of Americans approve of the job he's doing. This, after everything that has happened, and that number should be a very sobering indication of where this country is right now. Personally, I try to understand how these people can do this, but I still only understand some of it.

Anyway, here's the point: Elections are about contrasts. Choices. How can that many people support this disaster of a person? For many of them, they're looking at the alternative. And when those who provide their information and opinions for them point at things like PC and Identity Politics and Cancel Culture and an overall culture in decay, they can make reasonable points not to vote for the Democratic party. Even with, amazingly, this profoundly damaged person in the White House.

It's certainly too late to make any changes before November, but the Democratic party had a chance to take over the middle, and I don't see that happening. There is no excuse, zero, none, for the race to be this close. Regardless of who wins, the Democrats have too often a
llowed the wrong voices to represent them. It allows the Trumpsters to tie all the silliest crap coming from the hardcore Left to the milquetoast, feeble Biden.

This should be a learning experience, but I'm doubtful.

The Democrats need to retake control of their party, they need to tell the Neo-Marxists to GTFO because NO Western nation and ESPECIALLY America wants Marxism and wants to collapse Capitalism and replace it with Anarchy and a Communist System.

And the ugly reality the democrats need to face up to is this......the democrat party doesn't exist any longer.

The Republicans have turned their party over to Trump.
They are a bunch of spineless cowards who have allowed Trump to use the Constitution as his personal toilet paper.

BEFORE The Donald the Republican Party was in the CONTROL of Neo-Conservatives and RINOs who's MAIN aim was to bang the War Drums for Perpetual Wars in the Middle East Shit Hole and have COUNTLESS young American soldiers DIE and be brought home in BODY BAGS on the ORDERS of a Foreign Group THEY are WORKING for who not ONLY HATE America but ALSO HATE ALL Western Nations, we call this Foreign Group - The International Globalists.

ONE of the reasons they HATE Trump is because he has REFUSED to start New Wars in The Middle East for them and is actually Pro-Peace and Anti-War, they are Pro-War and Anti-Peace.