Wow, the Left really turning on Obama

[frigidweirdo]

A crisis will do one of two things...either bring out the best in someone...or reveal what they lack.

Perhaps. Has Obama messed everything up? Not really. Things have got better, not amazingly, not badly.

However a crisis can change everything too. What would other presidents have been like in different circumstances? Who knows?

It can often be hard to judge people when things aren't the same as the others you're comparing them with. People will pick up on the things that suit them and ignore other things.

 

[Bfgrn]

Yea, I definitely disagree with that. And the fact that you can't see it makes you look foolish and just as partisan as you like to criticize.

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

Yeah, I hear that one from both sides.

.

Do me a favor...define the far left. Give me examples of positions and beliefs that are extreme that you hear or see from the left?

How about this one? The Left believes that the State should be able to confiscate through estate taxes the accumulated assets of Americans who have worked hard, saved their earnings and paid taxes on those earnings. The Left feels those assets belong to everyone to be distributed accordingly when those that have those assets simply wish to pass those assets along to their children. I find that to be an "extreme" position.

"confiscate the accumulated assets of Americans who have worked hard"

That sure does sound EXTREME.

So please tell us what the estate tax policy is in America? Does everyone pay this tax?? Does the 'state' confiscate all accumulated assets???

Is the left's position the extreme, OR, is it the right wing portrayal of the left that is the extreme?

 

[Bfgrn]

Yea, I definitely disagree with that. And the fact that you can't see it makes you look foolish and just as partisan as you like to criticize.

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

Yeah, I hear that one from both sides.

.

Do me a favor...define the far left. Give me examples of positions and beliefs that are extreme that you hear or see from the left?

Why is this so important to you? And when have you ever seen me use the word "extreme"?

Surely you know the issues that separate the ideologies and define the parties. Don't be obtuse.

If you have a point to make, make it.

.

You just made my point...

 

[Mac1958]

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

Yeah, I hear that one from both sides.

.

Do me a favor...define the far left. Give me examples of positions and beliefs that are extreme that you hear or see from the left?

Why is this so important to you? And when have you ever seen me use the word "extreme"?

Surely you know the issues that separate the ideologies and define the parties. Don't be obtuse.

If you have a point to make, make it.

.

You just made my point...

Okay, sure, whatever it is.

.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Why not answer the man's question, Mac?

 

[Freewill]

A cynic is a man who knows the price of everything but the value of nothing.
Oscar Wilde

Irony...

Your theory of hyper-partisanship on both sides of the aisle just got destroyed.


Democrats never agree on anything, that's why they're Democrats. If they agreed with each other, they would be Republicans.
Will Rogers

It was only "destroyed" in the minds of people like you, whose partisan ideology paralyzes them into thinking that any exception to the rule "destroys" the rule.

Life is a little more complicated than partisan ideologues see it. Both sides.

Left wing partisan ideologues are no better than right wing partisan ideologues. I know how much you want to disagree with that.

.

Yea, I definitely disagree with that. And the fact that you can't see it makes you look foolish and just as partisan as you like to criticize.

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

The absurdity of this statement can only be illustrated by asking you a question. When was the last time an incumbent democrat lost a primary? When did a major political arm, such as the Tea Party, form out of the Democrat party, and no we won't count the KKK or the dixicecrats I'll cut you a break.

Speaking for fear, the democrats want us to fear our veteran, ladies with Tea bags in their hats, the thermometer, and a host of other ideological points.

 

[Sarah G]

Wow, I'm not easily surprised by anything in politics any more, but it was an eye-opener to see Jonathan Alter going after Obama today:

Exposed The White House s Professor-in-Chief - The Daily Beast

Obviously it's now becoming stylish to pound on Obama now that he can't run for anything, and then line up for Hillary. But holy crap, Obama still has two years in office, gang.

Obama had/has neither the managerial skills nor the temperament to be President, but we put him in there twice. Part of the blame for that has to go to the GOP, which has completely and utterly failed to provide the country with a clear, unified, positive vision for this country.

And here we are. A pox on both houses.

.

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

 

[Mac1958]

Wow, I'm not easily surprised by anything in politics any more, but it was an eye-opener to see Jonathan Alter going after Obama today:

Exposed The White House s Professor-in-Chief - The Daily Beast

Obviously it's now becoming stylish to pound on Obama now that he can't run for anything, and then line up for Hillary. But holy crap, Obama still has two years in office, gang.

Obama had/has neither the managerial skills nor the temperament to be President, but we put him in there twice. Part of the blame for that has to go to the GOP, which has completely and utterly failed to provide the country with a clear, unified, positive vision for this country.

And here we are. A pox on both houses.

.

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

Yet another hardcore partisan ideologue who doesn't know my politics but thinks they do.

Binary, black & white, either/or, on and on and on.

How simple your world must be.

.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Hey Mac.........

It seems that many people misdiagnose your political leanings. Maybe you suck at stating your position? Is it possible that you might take some responsibility for how others view you?

No way, right? Everyone who reads your posts here is a moron and just doesn't have the ability to understand you.

You know I understand you very well, though. Don't you?

Earmuffs, bitch.

 

[Bfgrn]

A cynic is a man who knows the price of everything but the value of nothing.
Oscar Wilde

Irony...

Your theory of hyper-partisanship on both sides of the aisle just got destroyed.


Democrats never agree on anything, that's why they're Democrats. If they agreed with each other, they would be Republicans.
Will Rogers

It was only "destroyed" in the minds of people like you, whose partisan ideology paralyzes them into thinking that any exception to the rule "destroys" the rule.

Life is a little more complicated than partisan ideologues see it. Both sides.

Left wing partisan ideologues are no better than right wing partisan ideologues. I know how much you want to disagree with that.

.

Yea, I definitely disagree with that. And the fact that you can't see it makes you look foolish and just as partisan as you like to criticize.

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

The absurdity of this statement can only be illustrated by asking you a question. When was the last time an incumbent democrat lost a primary? When did a major political arm, such as the Tea Party, form out of the Democrat party, and no we won't count the KKK or the dixicecrats I'll cut you a break.

Speaking for fear, the democrats want us to fear our veteran, ladies with Tea bags in their hats, the thermometer, and a host of other ideological points.

The tea party just took the far right extreme, to a new extreme, very much like the evangelical right. Pragmatism has no extreme.

 

[Sarah G]

Wow, I'm not easily surprised by anything in politics any more, but it was an eye-opener to see Jonathan Alter going after Obama today:

Exposed The White House s Professor-in-Chief - The Daily Beast

Obviously it's now becoming stylish to pound on Obama now that he can't run for anything, and then line up for Hillary. But holy crap, Obama still has two years in office, gang.

Obama had/has neither the managerial skills nor the temperament to be President, but we put him in there twice. Part of the blame for that has to go to the GOP, which has completely and utterly failed to provide the country with a clear, unified, positive vision for this country.

And here we are. A pox on both houses.

.

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

Yet another hardcore partisan ideologue who doesn't know my politics but thinks they do.

Binary, black & white, either/or, on and on and on.

How simple your world must be.

.

I know what you say you are but actions speak louder than words.

 

[Mac1958]

Wow, I'm not easily surprised by anything in politics any more, but it was an eye-opener to see Jonathan Alter going after Obama today:

Exposed The White House s Professor-in-Chief - The Daily Beast

Obviously it's now becoming stylish to pound on Obama now that he can't run for anything, and then line up for Hillary. But holy crap, Obama still has two years in office, gang.

Obama had/has neither the managerial skills nor the temperament to be President, but we put him in there twice. Part of the blame for that has to go to the GOP, which has completely and utterly failed to provide the country with a clear, unified, positive vision for this country.

And here we are. A pox on both houses.

.

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

Yet another hardcore partisan ideologue who doesn't know my politics but thinks they do.

Binary, black & white, either/or, on and on and on.

How simple your world must be.

.

I know what you say you are but actions speak louder than words.

Only to the incurious, intellectually lazy mind.

.

 

[Bfgrn]

Wow, I'm not easily surprised by anything in politics any more, but it was an eye-opener to see Jonathan Alter going after Obama today:

Exposed The White House s Professor-in-Chief - The Daily Beast

Obviously it's now becoming stylish to pound on Obama now that he can't run for anything, and then line up for Hillary. But holy crap, Obama still has two years in office, gang.

Obama had/has neither the managerial skills nor the temperament to be President, but we put him in there twice. Part of the blame for that has to go to the GOP, which has completely and utterly failed to provide the country with a clear, unified, positive vision for this country.

And here we are. A pox on both houses.

.

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

Yet another hardcore partisan ideologue who doesn't know my politics but thinks they do.

Binary, black & white, either/or, on and on and on.

How simple your world must be.

.

I know what you say you are but actions speak louder than words.

Only to the incurious, intellectually lazy mind.

.

So you can't come up with anything that is extreme on the left, how about the right then?

 

[Freewill]

It was only "destroyed" in the minds of people like you, whose partisan ideology paralyzes them into thinking that any exception to the rule "destroys" the rule.

Life is a little more complicated than partisan ideologues see it. Both sides.

Left wing partisan ideologues are no better than right wing partisan ideologues. I know how much you want to disagree with that.

.

Yea, I definitely disagree with that. And the fact that you can't see it makes you look foolish and just as partisan as you like to criticize.

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

The absurdity of this statement can only be illustrated by asking you a question. When was the last time an incumbent democrat lost a primary? When did a major political arm, such as the Tea Party, form out of the Democrat party, and no we won't count the KKK or the dixicecrats I'll cut you a break.

Speaking for fear, the democrats want us to fear our veteran, ladies with Tea bags in their hats, the thermometer, and a host of other ideological points.

The tea party just took the far right extreme, to a new extreme, very much like the evangelical right. Pragmatism has no extreme.

Blah blah blah, more ideological crap. What is extreme about the Tea Party? When are they going to start jailing liberals? How more extreme can a person get then to equate marriage between a man and a woman to sodomy?

I provide you the follow which I think pretty much sums up the Tea Party platform. Which of the following do you find extreme? Which do you find excludes anyone? Which one of these do you honestly believe we don't need?

Tea Party Movement Platform
Preamble: The Tea Party Movement is an all-inclusive American grassroots movement with the belief that everyone is created equal and deserves an equal opportunity to thrive in these United States where they may “pursue life, liberty and happiness” as stated in the Declaration of Independence and guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States.

No one is excluded from participation in the Tea Party Movement. Everyone is welcomed to join in seeking to achieve the Tea Party Movement goals, which are as follows:

1. Eliminate Excessive Taxes
2. Eliminate the National Debt
3. Eliminate Deficit Spending
5. Abide by the Constitution of the United States
6. Promote Civic Responsibility
8. Believe in the People
9. Avoid the Pitfalls of Politics
10. Maintain Local Independence

 

[Mac1958]

Wow, I'm not easily surprised by anything in politics any more, but it was an eye-opener to see Jonathan Alter going after Obama today:

Exposed The White House s Professor-in-Chief - The Daily Beast

Obviously it's now becoming stylish to pound on Obama now that he can't run for anything, and then line up for Hillary. But holy crap, Obama still has two years in office, gang.

Obama had/has neither the managerial skills nor the temperament to be President, but we put him in there twice. Part of the blame for that has to go to the GOP, which has completely and utterly failed to provide the country with a clear, unified, positive vision for this country.

And here we are. A pox on both houses.

.

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

Yet another hardcore partisan ideologue who doesn't know my politics but thinks they do.

Binary, black & white, either/or, on and on and on.

How simple your world must be.

.

I know what you say you are but actions speak louder than words.

Only to the incurious, intellectually lazy mind.

.

So you can't come up with anything that is extreme on the left, how about the right then?

Good grief. Since I'm just DYING to know what your point is, I'll give you the most direct answer I can.

And since the word "extreme" has been over-used and diluted by people like you (much like "socialist" and "racist"), I'll have to go with my own definition.

Extremists on the left: None.

Extremists on the right: None.

Hardcore partisan ideologues like you, both sides: Oh, maybe 20% total of the electorate, best guess.

Now, my definition of "none": So few that their numbers are irrelevant.

There. I answered your questions directly and completely, although I can't get you people to extend the same courtesy to me.

Now, are you going to mercifully get to the point, or am I going to find myself in yet another endless game of 20 Questions with a hardcore left winger?

.

 

[JoeB131]

1. Eliminate Excessive Taxes
2. Eliminate the National Debt
3. Eliminate Deficit Spending
5. Abide by the Constitution of the United States
6. Promote Civic Responsibility
8. Believe in the People
9. Avoid the Pitfalls of Politics
10. Maintain Local Independence

Wow, those all sound nice, but they are kind of contradictory. For instance, you can't eliminate both taxes and deficit spending, much less pay down the debt. Get it?

I mean, every few years, you guys sell the "Supply Side" snake oil, and it fails.

 

[LoneLaugher]

It must be quite an eye opener for you lockstep gopers to see that in the real world, people disagree. We aren't so stupid out here that we need talking points and backup every minute.

Yet another hardcore partisan ideologue who doesn't know my politics but thinks they do.

Binary, black & white, either/or, on and on and on.

How simple your world must be.

.

I know what you say you are but actions speak louder than words.

Only to the incurious, intellectually lazy mind.

.

So you can't come up with anything that is extreme on the left, how about the right then?

Good grief. Since I'm just DYING to know what your point is, I'll give you the most direct answer I can.

And since the word "extreme" has been over-used and diluted by people like you (much like "socialist" and "racist"), I'll have to go with my own definition.

Extremists on the left: None.

Extremists on the right: None.

Hardcore partisan ideologues like you, both sides: Oh, maybe 20% total of the electorate.

Now, my definition of "none": So few that their numbers are irrelevant.

There. I answered your questions directly and completely, although I can't get you people to extend the same courtesy to me.

Now, are you going to mercifully get to the point, or am I going to find myself in yet another endless game of 20 Questions with a hardcore left winger?

.

Hardcore and extreme mean different things. That's the ticket. Yeah! That's it!

OK, then. Who are the hardcore partisan ideologues on the left? Obama? Pelosi? Reid? Biden? Clinton? Warren? Who is the most influential hardcore left wing ideologue in America?

How about here at the USMB? Name 5, please.

All you do is throw around terms and labels. You never explain who you are referring to. Why?

Earmuffs.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Yea, I definitely disagree with that. And the fact that you can't see it makes you look foolish and just as partisan as you like to criticize.

Partisan for which side?

Looking forward to this.

.

There are extremes on both sides, but the extremism on the right is MUCH broader and much less fact based. Most liberals are pragmatists. Conservatives are driven by ideology, dogma and FEAR.

The absurdity of this statement can only be illustrated by asking you a question. When was the last time an incumbent democrat lost a primary? When did a major political arm, such as the Tea Party, form out of the Democrat party, and no we won't count the KKK or the dixicecrats I'll cut you a break.

Speaking for fear, the democrats want us to fear our veteran, ladies with Tea bags in their hats, the thermometer, and a host of other ideological points.

The tea party just took the far right extreme, to a new extreme, very much like the evangelical right. Pragmatism has no extreme.

Blah blah blah, more ideological crap. What is extreme about the Tea Party? When are they going to start jailing liberals? How more extreme can a person get then to equate marriage between a man and a woman to sodomy?

I provide you the follow which I think pretty much sums up the Tea Party platform. Which of the following do you find extreme? Which do you find excludes anyone? Which one of these do you honestly believe we don't need?

Tea Party Movement Platform
Preamble: The Tea Party Movement is an all-inclusive American grassroots movement with the belief that everyone is created equal and deserves an equal opportunity to thrive in these United States where they may “pursue life, liberty and happiness” as stated in the Declaration of Independence and guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States.

No one is excluded from participation in the Tea Party Movement. Everyone is welcomed to join in seeking to achieve the Tea Party Movement goals, which are as follows:

1. Eliminate Excessive Taxes
2. Eliminate the National Debt
3. Eliminate Deficit Spending
5. Abide by the Constitution of the United States
6. Promote Civic Responsibility
8. Believe in the People
9. Avoid the Pitfalls of Politics
10. Maintain Local Independence

Too bad the TP'ers in Congress aren't willing to "Abide by the Constitution of the United States".

Then again they aren't willing to "Believe in the People" either.

As far as avoiding the "Pitfalls of Politics" goes they have managed to stumble into every single one that they have encountered to date up to and including trying to shut down the government and violate the Constitution by failing to uphold the credit worthiness on this nation.

So failing to abide by your stated principles is what makes you extremists in my opinion.

One more point, your fallacious claim that "Everyone is welcomed to join" goes, why is it that single women, gays, blacks and hispanics are conspicuous by their absence? Instead we see lots of angry old white people wearing funny costumes and carrying guns.

Words are meaningless unless you are willing to live by them. The TP'ers scream and shout a lot but their actions give them away.

 

[LoneLaugher]

This is really abandoning! Horrible. Nobody on the left appreciates the president any longer. No sir.

In Defense of Obama Rolling Stone

 

[LoneLaugher]

Look here. Fun with numbers!

The Obama Hope and Change Index 6 Years of Progress By the Numbers Rolling Stone