Would blacks have been happy if Lincoln shipped them back?

[OldLady]

Would the blacks that actually were slaves have wanted to go back?

TN, you should really read this whole article on the Back to Africa movement, which began when Lincoln was still in knickers.
According to the Encyclopedia of Georgia History and Culture, "as early as 1820, black Americans had begun to return to their ancestral homeland through the auspices of the American Colonization Society." By 1847, the American Colonization Society founded Liberia, a land to be settled by black people returning from the United States of America.[9] Between 1822 and the American Civil War, the American Colonization Society had migrated approximately 15,000 free blacks back to Africa.[10]

Notable members of the American Colonization Society included Thomas Buchanan, Thomas Jefferson, James Monroe, Abraham Lincoln, James Madison, Daniel Webster, John Marshall, and Francis Scott Key.[11]

Back-to-Africa movement - Wikipedia

 

[Third Party]

It would have been good if it was presented as an option.

In the 1968 Presidential Election, liberal George C. Wallace run on a platform to ship blacks back to Africa.

The people were given that opportunity and rejected it overwhelmingly. Mr. Wallace was rejected by a better than 6 to 1 margin, and his program was never enacted.

Pretty sure he wasn't a liberal.

 

[Polishprince]

It would have been good if it was presented as an option.

In the 1968 Presidential Election, liberal George C. Wallace run on a platform to ship blacks back to Africa.

The people were given that opportunity and rejected it overwhelmingly. Mr. Wallace was rejected by a better than 6 to 1 margin, and his program was never enacted.

Pretty sure he wasn't a liberal.

There is nothing "conservative" about forcing people out of their homes and shipping them against their will someplace else- whether its shipping Israelites out of their homes in Judea and Samaria on the so called "West Bank" or if its shipping African Americans out of their ghetto tenements that they call home.

 

[OldLady]

It would have been good if it was presented as an option.

In the 1968 Presidential Election, liberal George C. Wallace run on a platform to ship blacks back to Africa.

The people were given that opportunity and rejected it overwhelmingly. Mr. Wallace was rejected by a better than 6 to 1 margin, and his program was never enacted.

Pretty sure he wasn't a liberal.

There is nothing "conservative" about forcing people out of their homes and shipping them against their will someplace else- whether its shipping Israelites out of their homes in Judea and Samaria on the so called "West Bank" or if its shipping African Americans out of their ghetto tenements that they call home.

No one, including Lincoln, ever promoted "forcing" anyone out of their homes and shipping them against their wills somewhere else.

Liberia was a nightmare when it was first colonized. At one point, 80% of the colonists died of malaria or other diseases. African tribes nearby were sometimes hostile; it was almost as miserable as the Pilgrims at Plymouth. Yet during the 1890's, when racism in this country was at its zenith, African Americans did go back. Hopefully by then, living conditions were better.

I met a guy from Liberia in college. Very old school. I sensed a lot of traditional European influence--not sure exactly where that came in.

 

[TNHarley]

Most people are aware our tyrant in chief, Lincoln, considered sending blacks back to africa.
Would that have been a good idea?
For them and everyone else.
How would things be different now?
Less hostility? Less crime? Would Americans get a long better without race engraved in so many minds?
Would there be more enslaved Africans in africa right now? Would Africa be a better continent than the shithole it is now?
Do American blacks on this site wish they were born in africa?

He did. And blacks refused.

Do you anti government whites want to go back to Europe?

They refused? Lol..
Do anti govt whites want to go back to Europe where we left willingly? With bigger govt? What a stupid question.
Do you wish you were in Africa right now?

Do you wish you were in Europe?

In his book The Fiery Trial: Abraham Lincoln and American Slavery, historian Eric Foner writes that by 1862, Lincoln, as well as politically moderate members of Congress, saw colonization as at least a piece of the policy puzzle. "Both the law providing for abolition in the District of Columbia and the Second Confiscation Act included provisions for the colonization of those willing to emigrate. During 1862, Congress appropriated a total of $600,000 to aid in the transportation overseas of African-Americans," Foner wrote. Policy entrepreneurs of varying trustworthiness offered colonization proposals in such far-flung locales as Brazil, Colombia, and the Caribbean island of St. Croix.

But most black Americans weren’t buying. Seeking their support, Lincoln met with a black delegation at the White House on Aug. 14, 1862, and made the case for colonization. It was widely considered a failure. Lincoln offended his visitors, and others who read the after-the-fact newspaper coverage, by saying such things as, "It is better for us both, therefore, to be separated" and that for blacks to refuse to colonize elsewhere would be "extremely selfish."

Did Abraham Lincoln plan to send ex-slaves to Central America after the Civil War?

Abraham Lincoln 'wanted to deport slaves' to new colonies

Here are some words from the republican Abe Lincoln:

“You and we are different races. We have between us a broader difference than exists between almost any other two races. Whether it is right or wrong I need not discuss, but this physical difference is a great disadvantage to us both, as I think your race suffer very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffer from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason at least why we should be separated.”

This is the Abraham Lincoln they didn’t tell you about in school.

As the free black leaders soon discovered, Lincoln’s invitation to discuss policy was a pretext for a one-sided sales pitch.

“I do not propose to discuss this, but to present it as a fact with which we have to deal,” Lincoln continued. “I cannot alter it if I would. It is a fact, about which we all think and feel alike, I and you.”

Lincoln continued to unload on the delegates, even blaming their people for the Civil War at his doorstep: “See our present condition—the country engaged in war!—our white men cutting one another’s throats, none knowing how far it will extend; and then consider what we know to be the truth. But for your race among us there could not be war, although many men engaged on either side do not care for you one way or the other. Nevertheless, I repeat, without the institution of Slavery and the colored race as a basis, the war could not have an existence.”

This brought the president back to colonization, and his purpose for inviting the delegates to the White House in the first place—to get them to accept his trial balloon.

“I suppose one of the principal difficulties in the way of colonization is that the free colored man cannot see that his comfort would be advanced by it,” Lincoln reasoned. “You may believe you can live in Washington or elsewhere in the United States the remainder of your life [as easily], perhaps more so than you can in any foreign country, and hence you may come to the conclusion that you have nothing to do with the idea of going to a foreign country. This is (I speak in no unkind sense) an extremely selfish view of the case.”

Then he pivoted: “But you ought to do something to help those who are not so fortunate as yourselves.”

In Lincoln’s mind, if these free leaders stepped forward to lead the emigration of black people out of the United States, that would make it easier for white slaveholders to free the rest.

He explained: “If you could give a start to white people, you would open a wide door for many to be made free. If we deal with those who are not free at the beginning, and whose intellects are clouded by Slavery, we have very poor materials to start with. If intelligent colored men, such as are before me, would move in this matter, much might be accomplished. It is exceedingly important that we have men at the beginning capable of thinking as white men, and not those who have been systematically oppressed.”

Nothing like flattering some of the race by insulting the rest!

“There is much to encourage you,” Lincoln continued pitching. “For the sake of your race you should sacrifice something of your present comfort for the purpose of being as grand in that respect as the white people.”

https://www.theroot.com/did-lincoln-want-to-ship-black-people-back-to-africa-1790858389

I was born here maggot. I am a motherfucking American. As such, I have the right to air my grievance. And if my grievance is caused by whites, so be it. If you have a problem with my rights as an American, move YOUR ass to another country.

I didn't say you weren't American, or that you should move, you retarded dumbfuck.
Shouldn't Americans know english?

 

[TNHarley]

Wonder how many slaves im2 would have if he was a native african

 

[petro]

And if my grievance is caused by whites, so be it. If you have a problem with my rights as an American, move YOUR ass to another country.

It is also my right to call bullshit on your grievance and mock it.
Don't like my rights as an American move YOUR ass to another country.
Shit works both ways bitch.

 

[Third Party]

Most people are aware our tyrant in chief, Lincoln, considered sending blacks back to africa.
Would that have been a good idea?
For them and everyone else.
How would things be different now?
Less hostility? Less crime? Would Americans get a long better without race engraved in so many minds?
Would there be more enslaved Africans in africa right now? Would Africa be a better continent than the shithole it is now?
Do American blacks on this site wish they were born in africa?

He did. And blacks refused.

Do you anti government whites want to go back to Europe?

They refused? Lol..
Do anti govt whites want to go back to Europe where we left willingly? With bigger govt? What a stupid question.
Do you wish you were in Africa right now?

Do you wish you were in Europe?

In his book The Fiery Trial: Abraham Lincoln and American Slavery, historian Eric Foner writes that by 1862, Lincoln, as well as politically moderate members of Congress, saw colonization as at least a piece of the policy puzzle. "Both the law providing for abolition in the District of Columbia and the Second Confiscation Act included provisions for the colonization of those willing to emigrate. During 1862, Congress appropriated a total of $600,000 to aid in the transportation overseas of African-Americans," Foner wrote. Policy entrepreneurs of varying trustworthiness offered colonization proposals in such far-flung locales as Brazil, Colombia, and the Caribbean island of St. Croix.

But most black Americans weren’t buying. Seeking their support, Lincoln met with a black delegation at the White House on Aug. 14, 1862, and made the case for colonization. It was widely considered a failure. Lincoln offended his visitors, and others who read the after-the-fact newspaper coverage, by saying such things as, "It is better for us both, therefore, to be separated" and that for blacks to refuse to colonize elsewhere would be "extremely selfish."

Did Abraham Lincoln plan to send ex-slaves to Central America after the Civil War?

Abraham Lincoln 'wanted to deport slaves' to new colonies

Here are some words from the republican Abe Lincoln:

“You and we are different races. We have between us a broader difference than exists between almost any other two races. Whether it is right or wrong I need not discuss, but this physical difference is a great disadvantage to us both, as I think your race suffer very greatly, many of them by living among us, while ours suffer from your presence. In a word we suffer on each side. If this is admitted, it affords a reason at least why we should be separated.”

This is the Abraham Lincoln they didn’t tell you about in school.

As the free black leaders soon discovered, Lincoln’s invitation to discuss policy was a pretext for a one-sided sales pitch.

“I do not propose to discuss this, but to present it as a fact with which we have to deal,” Lincoln continued. “I cannot alter it if I would. It is a fact, about which we all think and feel alike, I and you.”

Lincoln continued to unload on the delegates, even blaming their people for the Civil War at his doorstep: “See our present condition—the country engaged in war!—our white men cutting one another’s throats, none knowing how far it will extend; and then consider what we know to be the truth. But for your race among us there could not be war, although many men engaged on either side do not care for you one way or the other. Nevertheless, I repeat, without the institution of Slavery and the colored race as a basis, the war could not have an existence.”

This brought the president back to colonization, and his purpose for inviting the delegates to the White House in the first place—to get them to accept his trial balloon.

“I suppose one of the principal difficulties in the way of colonization is that the free colored man cannot see that his comfort would be advanced by it,” Lincoln reasoned. “You may believe you can live in Washington or elsewhere in the United States the remainder of your life [as easily], perhaps more so than you can in any foreign country, and hence you may come to the conclusion that you have nothing to do with the idea of going to a foreign country. This is (I speak in no unkind sense) an extremely selfish view of the case.”

Then he pivoted: “But you ought to do something to help those who are not so fortunate as yourselves.”

In Lincoln’s mind, if these free leaders stepped forward to lead the emigration of black people out of the United States, that would make it easier for white slaveholders to free the rest.

He explained: “If you could give a start to white people, you would open a wide door for many to be made free. If we deal with those who are not free at the beginning, and whose intellects are clouded by Slavery, we have very poor materials to start with. If intelligent colored men, such as are before me, would move in this matter, much might be accomplished. It is exceedingly important that we have men at the beginning capable of thinking as white men, and not those who have been systematically oppressed.”

Nothing like flattering some of the race by insulting the rest!

“There is much to encourage you,” Lincoln continued pitching. “For the sake of your race you should sacrifice something of your present comfort for the purpose of being as grand in that respect as the white people.”

https://www.theroot.com/did-lincoln-want-to-ship-black-people-back-to-africa-1790858389

I was born here maggot. I am a motherfucking American. As such, I have the right to air my grievance. And if my grievance is caused by whites, so be it. If you have a problem with my rights as an American, move YOUR ass to another country.

I didn't say you weren't American, or that you should move, you retarded dumbfuck.
Shouldn't Americans know english?

It is not a law-though it should be.

 

[Pete7469]

Wonder how many slaves im2 would have if he was a native african

If that imbecile had been a native african 400 years ago he would have wandered away from the village chasing a butterfly, found by some lion cubs who would have played with him for a while, then killed him and ate his guts.

Natural selection would certainly not be hindered in any way, there's no way he would have survived to adolescence.

If it wasn't for child proof lids that imbecile would have died under a sink years ago next to an open bottle of Drano.


.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Lincoln was a moron. He should have laid total waste to the south. Let General Sherman run loose. Snip the bloodlines of all those racists and slavers. Reconstruction was a mistake.

I agree that Lincoln was a moron, but for other reasons. He was also a disgusting, filthy racists. It disgusts me to the core to think that a guy like Lincoln gets all kinds of praise and respect, but a person with much more honor like Robert E. Lee is esteemed as the face of evil (even though he was against the confederacy to being with and held abolitionist views, his only sin [and it was a sin] being his failure to speak out against slavery). The two men are, AT A BARE MINIMUM, equals regarding their character.

I do think the slavers and slave holders got off way too easy.

I also believe that the emblems of the confederacy should have been removed as part of the terms of surrender. Allowing them to persist is what caused 100 years of resistance.

Another thing that caused 100 years of resistance was punishing poor Southerners for the actions of a few rich slave owners (7-8% of the Southern Population). See above, slavers and slave holders allowing non-slave-holding Southerners to share in the burden. Rather than making poor Southerns allies of the Union going forward, the Union punished them along side the slavers and slave holders. They even fucked over Newton Knight (one of my wife's ancestors).

That was a HUGE mistake.

I agree that Reconstruction was a mistake. It should have been a more focused act of complete reparations for freed slaves, directly from slave owners and slavers themselves.

.

 

[Intolerant]

I can't disagree with that.

Then we see pieces of shit like BlackFag on the streets or in prison and we have to wonder if that policy needs to be revisited.

Just sayin'...

Most blacks are just fine people and belong here, pieces of shit like him somehow defy natural selection every day. If they were sent back to africa you know their lifetime expectancy would be a matter of hours.


.

Either the wildlife would kill him or the natives would. They don’t like shucking and Jiving.

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Most people are aware our tyrant in chief, Lincoln, considered sending blacks back to africa.
Would that have been a good idea?
For them and everyone else.
How would things be different now?
Less hostility? Less crime? Would Americans get a long better without race engraved in so many minds?
Would there be more enslaved Africans in africa right now? Would Africa be a better continent than the shithole it is now?
Do American blacks on this site wish they were born in africa?

I understand the frustration. I am working on understanding the other side as well.

But, I am glad black folks didn't go to Africa (they can't really go "back" if they were all born here. See Slave Trade Act of 1807 [thank you, Mr. Jefferson]).

I would challenge anyone to research all the good things we would not have, had black folks been shipped off. You'd be surprised.

.

 

[BlackFlag]

Lincoln was a moron. He should have laid total waste to the south. Let General Sherman run loose. Snip the bloodlines of all those racists and slavers. Reconstruction was a mistake.

I agree that Lincoln was a moron, but for other reasons. He was also a disgusting, filthy racists. It disgusts me to the core to think that a guy like Lincoln gets all kinds of praise and respect, but a person with much more honor like Robert E. Lee is esteemed as the face of evil (even though he was against the confederacy to being with and held abolitionist views, his only sin [and it was a sin] being his failure to speak out against slavery). The two men are, AT A BARE MINIMUM, equals regarding their character.

I do think the slavers and slave holders got off way too easy.

I also believe that the emblems of the confederacy should have been removed as part of the terms of surrender. Allowing them to persist is what caused 100 years of resistance.

Another thing that caused 100 years of resistance was punishing poor Southerners for the actions of a few rich slave owners (7-8% of the Southern Population). See above, slavers and slave holders allowing non-slave-holding Southerners to share in the burden. Rather than making poor Southerns allies of the Union going forward, the Union punished them along side the slavers and slave holders. They even fucked over Newton Knight (one of my wife's ancestors).

That was a HUGE mistake.

I agree that Reconstruction was a mistake. It should have been a more focused act of complete reparations for freed slaves, directly from slave owners and slavers themselves.

.

Lee fought for slavers and slavery. Whatever honor or character he may have had were completely sacrificed when he made that decision.

 

[Likkmee]

Sure they would have been happier

 

[Likkmee]

It's all a lie

 

[Likkmee]

 

[Bootney Lee Farnsworth]

Lee fought for slavers and slavery. Whatever honor or character he may have had were completely sacrificed when he made that decision.

Fair enough. I can't excuse that.

Now, compare the two.

Lincoln didn't give a rat fuck until he needed the issue 2 years in. In fact, he said:

“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races – that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.”

His chief motivation from the beginning was SOLELY to maintain his power base (aka "saving" the Union). He fought the war to keep power over the Southern states--- ONLY!!!

Robert E. Lee said this:

“In this enlightened age, there are few I believe, but what will acknowledge, that slavery as an institution, is a moral & political evil in any Country. It is useless to expatiate on its disadvantages.”

So, again, neither fought to end slavery (until politics got in the way). At least Lee acknowledged that it was evil (without political motivation).

.

 

[Likkmee]

Pass the shackles. Cotton and chicken w/ rice and watermelons aint too bad man....

 

[BlackFlag]

Lee fought for slavers and slavery. Whatever honor or character he may have had were completely sacrificed when he made that decision.

Fair enough. I can't excuse that.

Now, compare the two.

Lincoln didn't give a rat fuck until he needed the issue 2 years in. In fact, he said:

“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races – that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.”

His chief motivation from the beginning was SOLELY to maintain his power base (aka "saving" the Union). He fought the war to keep power over the Southern states--- ONLY!!!

Robert E. Lee said this:

“In this enlightened age, there are few I believe, but what will acknowledge, that slavery as an institution, is a moral & political evil in any Country. It is useless to expatiate on its disadvantages.”

So, again, neither fought to end slavery (until politics got in the way). At least Lee acknowledged that it was evil (without political motivation).

.

Words are words. I care about actions. It’s like how after gay marriage was legalized with Obama’s support and more protections for gay people were enacted than by any other President, conservatives tried to say he was actually anti-gay because of something he said years and years ago. And how under Trump, conservatives say he supports gay people despite siding 100% of the time against them.

 

[OldLady]

Lee fought for slavers and slavery. Whatever honor or character he may have had were completely sacrificed when he made that decision.

Fair enough. I can't excuse that.

Now, compare the two.

Lincoln didn't give a rat fuck until he needed the issue 2 years in. In fact, he said:

“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races – that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.”

His chief motivation from the beginning was SOLELY to maintain his power base (aka "saving" the Union). He fought the war to keep power over the Southern states--- ONLY!!!

Robert E. Lee said this:

“In this enlightened age, there are few I believe, but what will acknowledge, that slavery as an institution, is a moral & political evil in any Country. It is useless to expatiate on its disadvantages.”

So, again, neither fought to end slavery (until politics got in the way). At least Lee acknowledged that it was evil (without political motivation).

.

His chief motivation from the beginning was SOLELY to maintain his power base (aka "saving" the Union)
REALLY? It was his JOB to preserve the union. Do you think it would have been better for everyone if the South had won?