Why havent the terrorists done this?

[eots]

Good For You..sir !

 

[M14 Shooter]

Evidently, they're a tad smarter than you. Gasoline is a flammable liquid, not an explosive. Terrorists like to blow things up. Either you've seen too many hollywood movies, or you failed chemistry class.

What a maroon.

 

[M14 Shooter]

What if it is true? What if the US really isn't being targeted by terrorists? Do you really think that if the US were really a target that something huge wouldn't have happened since 2001?

I guess that depends -- isnt it possible that we've been able to foil their plots?

 

[Paulie]

It's really foolish not to take them at their own word: Death to America. There have been numerous plots since 9/11, but the FBI and CIA are better able to work together now to uncover these plots before they occur. Because of 9/11, it's much harder for the terrorists to work in the U.S. than previously. Ordinary citizens are aware of terrorism now and what the terrorists can do, and they are reporting suspicious actions to authorities, where previously they were not. Because the FBI and CIA have been able to take these plots down, many people have become complacent and think the U.S. is no longer a target.

Please explain how it's 'harder' for terrorists to strike America now. Have you seen how many times people have gotten through various security areas like at Airports, for instance, since 9/11? I mean, what a concept here...we supposedly get attacked via our Airline Industry, but it's no harder to get weapons through security NOW, than it was THEN.

When liquids were supposedly going to be mixed to make bombs aboard an airplane, the new security measure was to have people dump all their liquids into a 'special blue container'. Now what if those mixed together liquids had included someone's bomb-juice? How fucking stupid would the TSA have looked?

There's no more security in this country than before 9/11. We try and outsource our port security to a muslim country for christ's sake. How do we know we can trust them? I mean, they're rag-heads REGARDLESS, right?

And don't even get me started on the border situation. You are PROGRAMMED, dude. Turn that TV off and go outside and EDUCATE yourself.

 

[M14 Shooter]

And don't even get me started on the border situation. You are PROGRAMMED, dude. Turn that TV off and go outside and EDUCATE yourself.

Speaking of programmed... you hit ALL the usual talking points.

According to you, the only reason we havent been attacked again is that they havent tried to attack us.

Do you REALLY believe that?

 

[AllieBaba]

What if it is true? What if the US really isn't being targeted by terrorists?

Do you really think that if the US were really a target that something huge wouldn't have happened since 2001? I mean take the ports. I wouldn't know how many containers go through US ports in a day but I do know that not every single one of them is inspected. Now there's a golden opportunity for terrorists to sneak in a device and activate it. But - thankfully - it hasn't happened.

I need to think about this but it seems to me that if a terrorist group were serious they would have pulled something by now. I mean you only have to look at the IRA, they kept blowing things up in Northern Ireland in the mainland UK, for years. They had an objective and they used terror to try and achieve that objective and they worked assiduously at it.

Do you think the terrorists are lying when they SAY they are targeting us? And are you unaware of the terror cells that have been apprehended and stopped within the boundaries of the US?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Do you think the terrorists are lying when they SAY they are targeting us?

The 'terrorist organizations' that say this are part of the Bush Administration's plot to keep all of us in fear. Duh.

 

[mattskramer]

Speaking of programmed... you hit ALL the usual talking points.

According to you, the only reason we havent been attacked again is that they havent tried to attack us.

Do you REALLY believe that?

Trying to weave through the hype from both sides of the political spectrum, I think that I agree with M14 as I think that the US has thwarted at least a few attempted attacks by terrorists. Check out the lists within these links.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=1599331

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/02/09/whitehouse.plots/index.html

http://www.heritage.org/Research/HomelandDefense/bg2085.cfm

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6682409

You could call 2006 the year of the thwarted terror attack. From the Heathrow airline plot to the Miami men indicted for wanting to blow up the Sears Tower, security officials were busy this year talking about attacks that were averted.

 

[Paulie]

Speaking of programmed... you hit ALL the usual talking points.

That would be the 'liberal' talking points, correct? I'm a liberal because I happen to agree with some of the things they bitch about, right?

I mean, I don't REALLY want less federal government, WAY LESS spending, or ZERO income tax. I'm just a dirty little liberal in disguise, right?

Come on dude. Why does a discussion always have to be turned into partisan bickering? You look stupid when you assume someone leans to a certain side just because they "hit the talking points".

According to you, the only reason we havent been attacked again is that they havent tried to attack us.

Do you REALLY believe that?

That's nothing CLOSE to what I was saying. I was just saying that if we're really trying to stop them from doing so, why is it just as easy to do so NOW, as it was before 9/11?

Just waging war in some other country and secretly detaining supposed terrorists that were "just about to unleash a plot" isn't enough. My point is, you can't fight terrorism abroad if you aren't even fighting it at HOME.

When random security tests prove that it's still very easy to get dangerous items aboard an airplane, why should we feel secure?

When our borders are so porous, that ANYONE could sneak in with something dangerous, why should we feel secure?

When our ports are so porous, that ANYTHING dangerous could be smuggled in, and our government wants to outsource the security to a foreign nation (a muslim one, specifically), why should we feel secure?

I don't believe that every single "foiled plot" was real, nor do I see any reason to. The CIA is very effective at creating illusion, and over the years they've gotten to be very efficient at it. It's a simple tactic called 'counter-intelligence'.

 

[AllieBaba]

The 'terrorist organizations' that say this are part of the Bush Administration's plot to keep all of us in fear. Duh.

Whoops, I forgot. All the bad guys are actually working for us...against us.

Makes perfect (insane) sense.

 

[M14 Shooter]

That would be the 'liberal' talking points, correct? I'm a liberal because I happen to agree with some of the things they bitch about, right?

Your words, not mine.

Come on dude. Why does a discussion always have to be turned into partisan bickering?

Ask the people that are arguing that the entire 'terrorist threat to the US' thing is a plot by the Bush administration to keep us in fear.
Talk about looking stupid...

That's nothing CLOSE to what I was saying.

Do you or do you not believe that the only reason we haven't been attacked is because they havent tried to attack us?

 

[AllieBaba]

I think its because your president did exactly what they wanted him to do. He fell into their trap.

9/11 brought us a lot of sympathy and support from around the world. Bush squandered that, and did exactly what bin laden wanted him to do: invade and occupy an arab country, where we could be pinned down and our treasure bled dry like a stuck pig. Just what they did to the soviets. I don't think, at this point, al qaeda needs to mount any major attacks in the united states. For one thing, it could reignite world sympathy for us again. Bin laden (with bush's help) had marginalized us and alienated us from allies. And Bush has bet the whole farm and pinned us down in iraq, where our solidiers are easy targets, and where our occupation fans the flames of arab resentment and fuels al qaeda recruitment.

Things could change in the future, but right now Bin Laden has manuvered the hapless bush right to where he wants him.

Actually, I think the precise opposite is true. I think B.L. thought the towers would be a call to battle for Muslims around the world, and would result in the US being invaded, overrun and subdued.

We aren't being pinned down in Iraq, Afghanistan or anywhere else. The reason we aren't fighting this war on American soil is because we took it to them, and we are keeping them occupied (and stuck) in the MIddle East. Not the other way around.

 

[Paulie]

Your words, not mine.

Well the only people on this board who I ever see criticize people for 'talking points' are the one's bashing people for being, or supposedly being in THEIR eyes, LIBERAL. And I already know you claim conservative, so how else should I have interpretted your mention of me 'hitting the talking points'?

Ask the people that are arguing that the entire 'terrorist threat to the US' thing is a plot by the Bush administration to keep us in fear.
Talk about looking stupid...

Oh, I don't know if that could be considered 'looking stupid'. Governments have been doing that kind of thing throughout history. Why should we be so arrogant as to think that ours wouldn't? And for the record, I would never give the Bush administration enough credit as to have been solely responsible for anything such as that.

Do you or do you not believe that the only reason we haven't been attacked is because they havent tried to attack us?

As irrelevant to my post as this question is, I see you're still dying for an answer. No. I don't believe that.

I believe that there have probably been some plots that were real, and some that weren't. I also feel that some of the one's that were real, were created by people within the international intelligence community to further an agenda. How easy would it be to trick an unsuspecting wanna-be terrorist into trying to participate in a supposed terrorist operation, and then double-cross them and 'nab' them for the whole world to see?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Well the only people on this board who I ever see criticize people for 'talking points' are the one's bashing people for being, or supposedly being in THEIR eyes, LIBERAL. And I already know you claim conservative, so how else should I have interpretted your mention of me 'hitting the talking points'?

However you want. The point reamins, you DID hit all the talking points.

Oh, I don't know if that could be considered 'looking stupid'. Governments have been doing that kind of thing throughout history. Why should we be so arrogant as to think that ours wouldn't?

So:
Is the entire 'terrorist threat to the US' thing a plot by the Bush administration to keep us in fear, or not?

 

[Paulie]

However you want. The point reamins, you DID hit all the talking points.


So:
Is the entire 'terrorist threat to the US' thing a plot by the Bush administration to keep us in fear, or not?

check my edit.

 

[M14 Shooter]

check my edit.

Aha.

I believe that there have probably been some plots that were real, and some that weren't. I also feel that some of the one's that were real, were created by people within the international intelligence community to further an agenda. How easy would it be to trick an unsuspecting wanna-be terrorist into trying to participate in a supposed terrorist operation, and then double-cross them and 'nab' them for the whole world to see?

So, you dont believe that the ENTIRE 'terrorist threat to the US' it a plot by the Bush administration designed to keep us in fear-- just a large part of it.

 

[maineman]

Perhaps you noted that I said usually? I grant you there were good reasons to target the IRA. I know that it made papers here in the 70's when it was found that the collections in bars and such, were funding such.

I wasn't excusing the IRA, anymore so the ETA, but their overall strategies were very different than what is now coming out of ME/Muslim inspired actions.

to hang the actions of a few extremist muslims on ALL middle eastern muslims is no different that hanging the actions of the IRA on all catholics

 

[Paulie]

Aha.



So, you dont believe that the ENTIRE 'terrorist threat to the US' it a plot by the Bush administration designed to keep us in fear-- just a large part of it.

Check the edit again dude. I would never give the Bush admin enough credit to think they were responsible for something that complex. That kind of thing takes years to establish within the covert intelligence community. Id say it's been going on for decades, probably a bit under the radar of the 3 branches of government, but that's just a guess.

 

[Abelian Sea]

Terrorist attacks aren't foiled by on-site security. They're foiled by espionage: moles, rats, and various other unsavory critters and dirty tricks. The fact that security at airports and such is penetrable does not mean that it's easy for terrorist organizations to strike. They are organizations; they have lines of communication and chains of command; they have plans that take time and multiple people to formulate and prepare for. They naturally tend to work through networks that developed over quite some time, that we've had at least the opportunity to monitor, if not compromise. That's where we're stopping them.

It takes a lot of motivation and, usually, more than a little competence and planning to pull off a good terrorist attack. This takes time to build up, and it's our intelligence community's job to track such build ups, which is easier to do when there's foreign influence involved, like, say, Middle Eastern originating terrorist groups. That's why most plots that make it through are small-scale (at least in terms of people involved) and home-grown, like Tim McVeigh and the various suicide shootings (what we have instead of suicide bombings) that we've endured over the years.

Of course they're likely to get lucky eventually. But how likely? Does the "law of averages" really predict that they'd get lucky every five years, or is it more like every 30 years, or every 100?

The fact that we haven't been "hit" in the last six years is not proof positive that there haven't been genuine efforts to do so, despite imperfect port/airport/border/etc. security.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Check the edit again dude. I would never give the Bush admin enough credit to think they were responsible for something that complex.That kind of thing takes years to establish within the covert intelligence community. Id say it's been going on for decades, probably a bit under the radar of the 3 branches of government, but that's just a guess.

Oh, I see -- a GRAND conspiracy by the intelligence community, domestic as well as international.

Of course, this is your opinion, and you dont have any proof.

Right?