Why does our senators have better healthcare plans than we do ?

[DiamondDave]

It is also the only TRUE form of socialized medicine in this country.
They have government doctors and their hospitals are government controlled. And I also think they have every right to this care, just don't say someone else can't get coverage with the government's help.

Employment benefit is not socialized medicine

We've already debunked this bullshit premise MANY times

How is military health care not socialized medicine?
They work for the government, they recieve medical from the government, the doctors work for the government, and the hospitals are run by the government.

In socialized healthcare, one does not have to contribute at any time to reap the benefits of the system... the health benefits of soldiers (retired, injured in duty, or active duty) is in direct compensation for their services

As a soldier, I received care in a civilian hospital... I also received care in a military facility... it is no different that insurance coverage... it is no different than you receiving total medical coverage in a benefits package from whatever employer you have

If it were a system where non-contributors were reaping the benefits, THEN I would agree that it would be a socialized system

 

[DiamondDave]

And the Iraq war caused the biggest exapnsion of the VA healthcare system in many years.

Just something to keep in perspective when claiming that Obamacare did the same thing.

As an employment benefit... not as the benefit for a non-contributor

 

[DiamondDave]

Most the health care people will be recieving due to this bill will not be free, but hey keep pedaling that crap.

Is it subsidized at the expense of a taxpayer? Will most of those receiving that service be indeed those of the ~50% who do not pay income taxes? It is indeed the non-contributor reaping the benefits at the expense of the contributors....
No different or unfair than if career moneymaker A getting charged $10 for a gallon of milk while career lazy loser B who pays $0.25 for the same product

My friend used to say the same shit, she also follows the tea party movement. Her story changed last year when her husband got laid off from the railroad and she was eight months pregnant with a two year old. Being a mother and needing to feed her family, she sucked it up and applied for WIC. I would never call my friend or her husband lazy or a loser.
Most of you like to people into this "loser" box, but most of the time they don't fit the box.

Whether that happened to your friend or not... the fact that does not change is that it is indeed THEIR responsibility and THEIR personal need, and not someone else's

Now... I am all for the voluntary charities that really help those in situations like that... and I support and call for any voluntary contributions to organizations and charities that help others... I DO NOT support a government forced system

 

[uscitizen]

And the Iraq war caused the biggest exapnsion of the VA healthcare system in many years.

Just something to keep in perspective when claiming that Obamacare did the same thing.

As an employment benefit... not as the benefit for a non-contributor

I have not been "employed" by the govt for over 40 years. Yet I can still get VA healthcare.

 

[DiamondDave]

And the Iraq war caused the biggest exapnsion of the VA healthcare system in many years.

Just something to keep in perspective when claiming that Obamacare did the same thing.

As an employment benefit... not as the benefit for a non-contributor

I have not been "employed" by the govt for over 40 years. Yet I can still get VA healthcare.

Just as retirees from other businesses can still have benefits such as health care that were negotiated for during their employment.....

Jeez are you dense

 

[jillian]

As an employment benefit... not as the benefit for a non-contributor

I have not been "employed" by the govt for over 40 years. Yet I can still get VA healthcare.

Just as retirees from other businesses can still have benefits such as health care that were negotiated for during their employment.....

Jeez are you dense

health insurance is an employee benefit.

medical care provided by the government is socialized medicine. and in the case of the V.A. actually proves that the government does health care pretty well...

not that this bill does that.

 

[uscitizen]

As an employment benefit... not as the benefit for a non-contributor

I have not been "employed" by the govt for over 40 years. Yet I can still get VA healthcare.

Just as retirees from other businesses can still have benefits such as health care that were negotiated for during their employment.....

Jeez are you dense

Most regular employees with healthcare retiree benefits lose the company paid ones when they qualify for medicare.

Regardless, VA benefits are paid for by everyones taxes. And it is govt administrated.

 

[dilloduck]

discuss ( I always wanted to say that)

Are you saying they are exempt from this shit sandwich they're stuffing down our throats?

Newp. On pg. 157, we can opt into theirs.

Head Strong: Health plan levels playing field | Philadelphia Inquirer | 03/21/2010

"For the first time, uninsured individuals, small businesses, they'd have the same kind of choice of private health insurance that members of Congress get for themselves," he said to applause. "Understand that if this reform becomes law, members of Congress, they'll be getting their insurance from the same place that the uninsured get theirs."

Is that true? Yes, according to a former Senate aide who helped draft the bill.

Before stepping down in January, John McDonough was senior adviser to the U.S. Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions. Who better to ask if the plan being fashioned by Congress would apply to its authors as well as the public?

"Yes, and the specific reference to it is Section 1312 of the bill," he told me. "And you can go and look up the bill online, and you can actually see it there in the bill, starting on page 157."

Can we opt in for the same price they get theirs at ? Those long term care bennies are awesome.

 

[boedicca]

It will be very easy for Congress to game the bill via amendments which mandate a specific exchange for Federal Employees. That exchange can then be stuffed with mandated high benefit plans just like they have now. They can also pass legislation to increase pay levels to cover any additional costs.

They are Self-Dealing - to not recognize this is to stick one's head in the sand.

(D) MEMBERS OF CONGRESS IN THE EXCHANGE-

(i) REQUIREMENT- Notwithstanding any other provision of law, after the effective date of this subtitle, the only health plans that the Federal Government may make available to Members of Congress and congressional staff with respect to their service as a Member of Congress or congressional staff shall be health plans that are--

(I) created under this Act (or an amendment made by this Act); or

(II) offered through an Exchange established under this Act (or an amendment made by this Act).

(ii) DEFINITIONS- In this section:

(I) MEMBER OF CONGRESS- The term ‘Member of Congress’ means any member of the House of Representatives or the Senate.

(II) CONGRESSIONAL STAFF- The term ‘congressional staff’ means all full-time and part-time employees employed by the official office of a Member of Congress, whether in Washington, DC or outside of Washington, DC.

Health Care Bill - Text of H.R.3590 as Engrossed Amendment Senate: Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act -... OpenCongress

 

[DiamondDave]

I have not been "employed" by the govt for over 40 years. Yet I can still get VA healthcare.

Just as retirees from other businesses can still have benefits such as health care that were negotiated for during their employment.....

Jeez are you dense

Most regular employees with healthcare retiree benefits lose the company paid ones when they qualify for medicare.

Regardless, VA benefits are paid for by everyones taxes. And it is govt administrated.

Because they are GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES.... and the running of the government is a necessity... it is not even REMOTELY close to the government providing for all for their mere existence

And in relation to losing retirement bennies when medicare kicks in... that is IF that is negotiated into those benefits.. which are AGAIN as a result of employment compensation... not merely because they exist, which is what socialized medicine is

 

[rr1]

With everyone on the board screaming about the new government forced health care fiasco we now have it would seem we have some brand new troofers here over night. Ain't it a bitch! My government conspired against me and wants the IRS to enforce this shit. BUMMER

 

[dilloduck]

Never the less---why does the bill not insure that all Americans have the same health insurance for the same price ? Are some people more equal than others ?

 

[rr1]

That might be the perception Dillo. Maybe these questions will come up because I sure can't answer them for you. I'm so f---ed up in the head right now I don't know my own name. We are off on a brand new thing now. Who the hell knows where it's gonna end up?

 

[dilloduck]

That might be the perception Dillo. Maybe these questions will come up because I sure can't answer them for you. I'm so f---ed up in the head right now I don't know my own name. We are off on a brand new thing now. Who the hell knows where it's gonna end up?

Isn't that the ultimate question ? How is there any morality whatsoever when some people have better health plans than other people ?

 

[rr1]

I could never see why anyone should be held liable for someone else's risk. I've never believed in insurance. That's not to say I haven't been a party to its use. It seems to me that assigning a dollar amount to everything nowadays is old hat. Assigning a dollar amount to a perceived risk is a good way to describe shooting craps.

If my neighbor's house burns down I'd like to think I'd loan him food, water and a blanket. Maybe the others around here would too I don't know. I can't see why a person in L.A. should be forced to pay for somebody's house burning down in New York. Kind of the same thing with health insurance too. I smoke cigarettes and have over indulged in the liquor raised all kinds of hell and have done most everything else I'm not supposed to but I'll be damned if I believe everybody else is accountable and should be billed for the things I chose or choose to do. I just don't get it. Maybe I'm just a dumb ass who ought to be living on a mountain some where.

 

[Skull Pilot]

discuss ( I always wanted to say that)

Are you saying they are exempt from this shit sandwich they're stuffing down our throats?

YOu alreay have healthcare, you are also exempt from this shit sandwich.
Why is so hard for people with health insurance to understand that they get to keep their health insurance and their doctor?

Wrong.

We will be forced to purchase a government approved insurance policy that may very well cost more than the one we currently have.

I have an HSA that does not cover drug and mental health counseling because I am not a substance abuser nor am I a pussy who can't deal with the fact my mommy didn't hug me when I was a kid. But if my policy doesn't cover these things, it will be deemed unacceptable and if I keep it I will be taxed.

 

[dilloduck]

I could never see why anyone should be held liable for someone else's risk. I've never believed in insurance. That's not to say I haven't been a party to its use. It seems to me that assigning a dollar amount to everything nowadays is old hat. Assigning a dollar amount to a perceived risk is a good way to describe shooting craps.

If my neighbor's house burns down I'd like to think I'd loan him food, water and a blanket. Maybe the others around here would too I don't know. I can't see why a person in L.A. should be forced to pay for somebody's house burning down in New York. Kind of the same thing with health insurance too. I smoke cigarettes and have over indulged in the liquor raised all kinds of hell and have done most everything else I'm not supposed to but I'll be damned if I believe everybody else is accountable and should be billed for the things I chose or choose to do. I just don't get it. Maybe I'm just a dumb ass who ought to be living on a mountain some where.

Dibs on the next mountain over----------If I don't get the same insurance for the same price that a senator does, why can't they allow me to refuse health insurance--- I will sign a waiver that if I am dying on the side of the road they can just leave me there.

 

[WillowTree]

discuss ( I always wanted to say that)

because when the Republicans wrote an amendment stating that whatever health care bill the democwats passed they (the congress) should be willing to place themselves and their families on said plan.. The result? The demoncwats voted that amendment down flatter than a fritter.

 

[dilloduck]

discuss ( I always wanted to say that)

because when the Republicans wrote an amendment stating that whatever health care bill the democwats passed they (the congress) should be willing to place themselves and their families on said plan.. The result? The demoncwats voted that amendment down flatter than a fritter.

Did they offer any reason ?

 

[WillowTree]

Never the less---why does the bill not insure that all Americans have the same health insurance for the same price ? Are some people more equal than others ?

no them izzin't