Why didn't House Democrats follow normal protocol to call impeachment witnesses?

[Oldstyle]

They issued a subpoena to Mulvaney, who refused to comply. Clearly, Executive Privilege could be used as the reason. But Trump's attorneys argue that the subpoena was invalid because the underlying reason for issuing it was the "impeachment inquiry", but the problem with that is Nazi Pelousy never held the required vote to implement an impeachment inquiry.

The reason for refusing to comply doesn't matter. Normal protocol when a subpoena is denied is to take it to the courts to get a ruling.

Why didn't Nazi and her House Clowns follow normal protocol? The withdrew the Muclvaney subpeona and did not go to court. Instead, they rushed a vote and are now over at the Senate begging jurors to conduct an investigation that was their responsibility.

Board Dimwingers refuse to acknowledge the responsibility for not having the witnesses they now claim is crucial to their "overwhelming" case is on the House Clowns. Not Trump. Not the Senate.

Once again, don't argue whether or not the reason for challenging the subpoena is valid. That will get nothing done here. That's is now a question for the courts. Dimwingers refused to go to the courts.

So stop trying to blame Trump and the Senate for the failures of your House Clowns to do their job.

Its simple. They didn't follow normal protocol so they could call it Obstruction of Congress.
Democrats are fighting for their lives to get Trump out of office for fear deeper corruption will be uncovered.

Thanks to the Republicans investigations of Obama, the House Committee chairs have subpoena power without a full vote on the House floor to authorize them. Trumpybear started the blanket obstruction of any Congressional Investigation via House Subpoena, before he obstructed the investigation into his Ukraine Shakedown Scheme.

he challenged them, that's allowed. they had to go to court. no obstruction sowwwy chawy

They are in court and the House has won every round. Allowing complete and total obstruction of relevant fact witnesses places the president above the law and accountability, thus abrogating the impeachment power outlined in our Constitution.

Democrats have won each time the case was heard in a court they cherry picked, Boo! So why didn't they take the case to the Supreme Court? I don't think they'll win THERE...and I think they know it!

 

[BlindBoo]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid.

It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.

That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

 

[Siete]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid.

It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.

That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

check into a biden investigation for me, ok ?

 

[Yarddog]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid.

It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.

That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

The context of that phone call was the 2016 election, not the 2020 election which was never mentioned. Again, Schiff accused Trump originally of coming out and saying to Zelensky to DIG UP DIRT and dont get back to me until you have something.

Where are those words in the transcript? They dont exist, so you can see Democrats are spinning Trumps words to mean what they want them to mean. What about when Obama whispered into a Russian's ear and asked him to tell Putin he would have more flexibility after the election?
All these things can be interpreted the way you want it to sound, so in the end you need concrete facts, not partisan interpretations to remove a president. Start with the fact Zelensky said Trump did not pressure him and he didn't know about any quid pro quo. If it was a court of law, that testimony would end the trial because there is no plaintiff.

 

[SAYIT]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid. It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.
That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

This independent voter does not and did not consider lying about a BJ to be corruption or an impeachable offense, and I do not accept as factual your opinion (or that of our Hysterical House Dems) that Trump "coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid." I realize leftards are told that there is no other conclusion to be drawn but that does not make it so ... it just makes them gullible. Just in case:

gul·li·ble
/ˈɡələb(ə)l/ adjective

1. easily persuaded to believe something;

 

[Oldstyle]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid.

It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.

That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

I would view it as "corruption" if Trump had asked the Ukrainian President to make up something bad about Joe Biden that he could then use against him in a political race...you know...like the Democrats actually DID to Trump with the Steele dossiers? Trump didn't do that though...did he? He simply asked the Ukrainian President to investigate what the Biden's had been doing. He also asked the Ukrainian President to look into collusion between the Democrats and Ukrainians in that last Presidential election. Once again...he didn't ask them to make up something...Trump simply asked his Ukrainian counterpart to investigate. That's where the left's narrative of "corruption" simply falls on it's face! Since when is it corrupt to ask for an investigation into apparent corruption?

 

[BlindBoo]

The context of that phone call was the 2016 election, not the 2020 election which was never mentioned.

It was all geared towards the 2020 election. Denigrating our intelligence services, who concluded Russia did it, with the Russian propaganda and putting the Ukrainian president in a box by forcing him to make the announcements including that the Democrat front runner and former Vice President was under investigation.

"I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike ... I guess you have one of your wealthy people... The server, they say Ukraine has.it There- are a lot. of things that went on, the· :whole situation .. I think you 1 re _surrounding yourse·lf with some of the same people. I . would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to ·get to the bottom of it."

"The other thing, There's a lot of. talk about Biden's son,. that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you ·can look into it ... It sounds horrible to me."

https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Unclassified09.2019.pdf

 

[BlindBoo]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid. It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.
That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

This independent voter does not and did not consider lying about a BJ to be corruption or an impeachable offense, and I do not accept as factual your opinion (or that of our Hysterical House Dems) that Trump "coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid." I realize leftards are told that there is no other conclusion to be drawn but that does not make it so ... it just makes them gullible. Just in case:

gul·li·ble
/ˈɡələb(ə)l/ adjective

1. easily persuaded to believe something;

First, Of course he was not successful in his Shakedown scheme to blackmail the head of a foreign state, only because he got caught with his hand in the cookie jar and crumbs all on his face. Second, I never mentioned independent voters. But I suspect that most anyone who tosses around terms like "libtard" in their screed against Democrats is hardly an independent.

 

[BlindBoo]

I would view it as "corruption" if Trump had asked the Ukrainian President to make up something bad about Joe Biden that he could then use against him in a political race. He simply asked the Ukrainian President to investigate what the Biden's had been doing.

Contrary to known reality. Zelenskyy assured him time after time that he would investigate the matter. But that was not good enough for the scheme to work, the demand was a public announcement of the investigations and everyone knows it.

He also asked the Ukrainian President to look into collusion between the Democrats and Ukrainians in that last Presidential election. Once again...he didn't ask them to make up something...Trump simply asked his Ukrainian counterpart to investigate

How many times will this Russian propaganda get play with you guys?

"I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike ... I guess you have one of your wealthy people... The server, they say Ukraine has.it."

 

[SAYIT]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid. It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.
That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

This independent voter does not and did not consider lying about a BJ to be corruption or an impeachable offense, and I do not accept as factual your opinion (or that of our Hysterical House Dems) that Trump "coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid." I realize leftards are told that there is no other conclusion to be drawn but that does not make it so ... it just makes them gullible. Just in case:

gul·li·ble
/ˈɡələb(ə)l/ adjective
easily persuaded to believe something

First, Of course he was not successful in his Shakedown scheme to blackmail the head of a foreign state...

Clearly because there was no "shakedown scheme." Believing that silliness is just irrefutable evidence of your gullibility.

 

[task0778]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid. It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.
That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

This independent voter does not and did not consider lying about a BJ to be corruption or an impeachable offense, and I do not accept as factual your opinion (or that of our Hysterical House Dems) that Trump "coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid." I realize leftards are told that there is no other conclusion to be drawn but that does not make it so ... it just makes them gullible. Just in case:

gul·li·ble
/ˈɡələb(ə)l/ adjective
easily persuaded to believe something

First, Of course he was not successful in his Shakedown scheme to blackmail the head of a foreign state...

Clearly because there was no "shakedown scheme." Believing that silliness is just irrefutable evidence of your gullibility.

To me, the real question should be whether Trump had a reason to suspect wrong-doing on Joe Biden's part. When you see that Hunter Biden was paid somewhere between $50k and $80k/month even though eh knows nothing about the natural gas business, then you kinda suspect that the reason why he got hired and paid that much was because his dad was the VPOTUS. Which by itself isn't a big deal except that then you see the video of Joe Biden bragging (what a dumbass) about getting a Ukrainian prosecutor fired for investigating Burisma (Hunter Biden's company), and you sorta realize why Hunter got his job.

The issue came up about why Trump did nothing about the Bidens until Joe announces his candidacy. I think the answer is that as long as Joe is just another private citizen then it's no big deal; I believe that sort of stuff goes on all the time and on both sides of the isle. But, it's another story if/when somebody runs for president. I can see the idea that Trump went after Biden to try to squash a political opponent as a possibility, but I can also see it as his duty to make it known to the voters if a candidate might have done something corrupt. I really think we should know that stuff, if he's not guilty, fine; then Trump looks like he has been playing dirty politics. It wasn't like Trump told the Ukraine president to find dirt on Biden, he just asked for an investigation and I for one do not see that as necessarily bad. And I do think he had sufficient reason to do so, certainly more than the Dems had when they spied on Carter Page and when they opened the Russian Collusion investigation against Trump.

 

[Yarddog]

The context of that phone call was the 2016 election, not the 2020 election which was never mentioned.

It was all geared towards the 2020 election. Denigrating our intelligence services, who concluded Russia did it, with the Russian propaganda and putting the Ukrainian president in a box by forcing him to make the announcements including that the Democrat front runner and former Vice President was under investigation.

"I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike ... I guess you have one of your wealthy people... The server, they say Ukraine has.it There- are a lot. of things that went on, the· :whole situation .. I think you 1 re _surrounding yourse·lf with some of the same people. I . would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to ·get to the bottom of it."

"The other thing, There's a lot of. talk about Biden's son,. that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you ·can look into it ... It sounds horrible to me."

https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Unclassified09.2019.pdf

So why is Trump asking Zelensky to get to the bottom of something wrong? It's not asking Zelensky to dig up dirt. If there was nothing there, then there was nothing there. At the same time, Trump was the one who had been lied about, and attacked in the 2016 election with lies, he has a right to defend himself as well. You say he should trust the Intel services???? really? the same ones who lied and spied on him? The same ones Schummer said have 5 ways to Sunday to get back at you?
Trump was right to use independent channels as he didnt know who he could trust. The Democrats are play acting right now. They couldn't get him for Russian Collusion, Bribery, extortion, so now they are trying to impeach him for using Exectutive priveledge? Thats not abuse of power. Other presidents have always used E.P. to protect their inner circle of communication and they always will. Its part of the seperation of powers, otherwise your saying the President is answerable to the Congress every time they dissagree with him. If they have Issue then that is what the courts are for. Three branches of government. thats the way its designed and for good reason.

 

[BlindBoo]

To me, the real question should be whether Trump had a reason to suspect wrong-doing on Joe Biden's part.

So why is Trump asking Zelensky to get to the bottom of something wrong?

Nothing wrong with investigations. Let me ask you both, would it have been okay for the FBI to announce it was investigating Trump and possible Russian attempts to help him during the GOP primaries? Would it have been okay for Obama to coerce an ally using foreign aid as leverage,into announcing an investigation into Romney's possible corruption in 2011?

 

[BlindBoo]

What you call "coercion" Boo is what EVERY President does when handing out foreign aid!

Yes they do. However, this is the first time a President tried to coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid. It's corruption. Trumpublicans apparently accept that type of corruption.
That's okay Democrats accept the corruption of lying about getting a blow job so........it's all equal, right?

This independent voter does not and did not consider lying about a BJ to be corruption or an impeachable offense, and I do not accept as factual your opinion (or that of our Hysterical House Dems) that Trump "coerced a foreign nation into announcing investigations into his domestic political rivals with our foreign aid." I realize leftards are told that there is no other conclusion to be drawn but that does not make it so ... it just makes them gullible. Just in case:

gul·li·ble
/ˈɡələb(ə)l/ adjective
easily persuaded to believe something

First, Of course he was not successful in his Shakedown scheme to blackmail the head of a foreign state...

Clearly because there was no "shakedown scheme." Believing that silliness is just irrefutable evidence of your gullibility.

Hahahaha. It was so obvious they should rename Pennsylvania Ave. to Shakedown Street!

 

[Oldstyle]

To me, the real question should be whether Trump had a reason to suspect wrong-doing on Joe Biden's part.

So why is Trump asking Zelensky to get to the bottom of something wrong?

Nothing wrong with investigations. Let me ask you both, would it have been okay for the FBI to announce it was investigating Trump and possible Russian attempts to help him during the GOP primaries? Would it have been okay for Obama to coerce an ally using foreign aid as leverage,into announcing an investigation into Romney's possible corruption in 2011?

You mean like high ranking members of the FBI going to the press to leak the Steele dossiers just prior to the election? That actually happened.

As for alleged "coercion" by Trump? Unlike Barry who gave the Ukraine blankets when they were begging for weapons to defend themselves from Russia...Donald Trump gave the Ukraine military aid so that they COULD defend themselves!

Did Trump ask a favor of the Ukrainian President? Yes he did. He asked his counterpart to look into what the Biden's had been doing in the Ukraine and he asked him to look into the stories that people in the Ukraine colluded with Hillary Clinton's campaign...requests that the Ukrainian President has been quite clear in stating DIDN'T come with a quid pro quo provision!

 

[Oldstyle]

This comes down to one basic premise...the Democrats want you to believe that ANY investigation into a Democratic politician by a Republican President...regardless if the circumstances appear to reek of corruption...is an "abuse of power"...and that ANY attempt to fight back against an attempt to overturn the voter's choices is "obstruction of justice"!

That only works if you put on political blinders and accept the Democrat's definitions. If you don't...then the entire house of cards falls on it's face. Under the Democratic definition of an impeachable offense...every President will now be "impeachable" by the opposition party as soon as they do something they don't agree with politically!

 

[Siete]

To me, the real question should be whether Trump had a reason to suspect wrong-doing on Joe Biden's part.

So why is Trump asking Zelensky to get to the bottom of something wrong?

Nothing wrong with investigations. Let me ask you both, would it have been okay for the FBI to announce it was investigating Trump and possible Russian attempts to help him during the GOP primaries? Would it have been okay for Obama to coerce an ally using foreign aid as leverage,into announcing an investigation into Romney's possible corruption in 2011?

You mean like high ranking members of the FBI going to the press to leak the Steele dossiers just prior to the election? That actually happened.

As for alleged "coercion" by Trump? Unlike Barry who gave the Ukraine blankets when they were begging for weapons to defend themselves from Russia...Donald Trump gave the Ukraine military aid so that they COULD defend themselves!

Did Trump ask a favor of the Ukrainian President? Yes he did. He asked his counterpart to look into what the Biden's had been doing in the Ukraine and he asked him to look into the stories that people in the Ukraine colluded with Hillary Clinton's campaign...requests that the Ukrainian President has been quite clear in stating DIDN'T come with a quid pro quo provision!

asking for help is one thing, holding back aid $$ to get it is the rub.

Shitforhair did both

 

[BlindBoo]

You mean like high ranking members of the FBI going to the press to leak the Steele

No. I mean like going to the podium during an announced press briefing and announcing it publicly.

Unlike Barry who gave the Ukraine blankets

Slanderous lies.

By March 2015, the US had committed more than $120 million in security assistance for Ukraine and had pledged an additional $75 million worth of equipment including UAVs, counter-mortar radars, night vision devices and medical supplies, according to the Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency.
That assistance also included some 230 armored Humvee vehicles.


Trump appears to be echoing a critique leveled at the Obama administration by the late Republican Sen. John McCain. "The Ukrainians are being slaughtered and we're sending blankets and meals," McCain said in 2015. "Blankets don't do well against Russian tanks."
While it never provided lethal aid, many of the items that the Obama administration did provide were seen as critical to Ukraine's military. Part of the $250 million assistance package that the Trump administration announced (then froze and later unfroze) included many of the same items that were provided under Obama, including medical equipment, night vision gear and counter-artillery radar.

Did Trump ask a favor of the Ukrainian President?

Yeah right, like "Don" Corleone was asking Roberto the Slum Lord for a "Favor" too.

 

[Oldstyle]

To me, the real question should be whether Trump had a reason to suspect wrong-doing on Joe Biden's part.

So why is Trump asking Zelensky to get to the bottom of something wrong?

Nothing wrong with investigations. Let me ask you both, would it have been okay for the FBI to announce it was investigating Trump and possible Russian attempts to help him during the GOP primaries? Would it have been okay for Obama to coerce an ally using foreign aid as leverage,into announcing an investigation into Romney's possible corruption in 2011?

You mean like high ranking members of the FBI going to the press to leak the Steele dossiers just prior to the election? That actually happened.

As for alleged "coercion" by Trump? Unlike Barry who gave the Ukraine blankets when they were begging for weapons to defend themselves from Russia...Donald Trump gave the Ukraine military aid so that they COULD defend themselves!

Did Trump ask a favor of the Ukrainian President? Yes he did. He asked his counterpart to look into what the Biden's had been doing in the Ukraine and he asked him to look into the stories that people in the Ukraine colluded with Hillary Clinton's campaign...requests that the Ukrainian President has been quite clear in stating DIDN'T come with a quid pro quo provision!

asking for help is one thing, holding back aid $$ to get it is the rub.

Shitforhair did both

Did you want to then claim that Trump is the first President to hold up aid to someone because they wanted something from them? One of the things that makes our system of justice so great, Siete is that it's based on the premise of "equal justice"! What that means is that everyone gets the same treatment. So is Trump being treated like other Presidents before him? Did you want to make that claim as well?

 

[Oldstyle]

You mean like high ranking members of the FBI going to the press to leak the Steele

No. I mean like going to the podium during an announced press briefing and announcing it publicly.

Unlike Barry who gave the Ukraine blankets

Slanderous lies.

By March 2015, the US had committed more than $120 million in security assistance for Ukraine and had pledged an additional $75 million worth of equipment including UAVs, counter-mortar radars, night vision devices and medical supplies, according to the Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency.
That assistance also included some 230 armored Humvee vehicles.


Trump appears to be echoing a critique leveled at the Obama administration by the late Republican Sen. John McCain. "The Ukrainians are being slaughtered and we're sending blankets and meals," McCain said in 2015. "Blankets don't do well against Russian tanks."
While it never provided lethal aid, many of the items that the Obama administration did provide were seen as critical to Ukraine's military. Part of the $250 million assistance package that the Trump administration announced (then froze and later unfroze) included many of the same items that were provided under Obama, including medical equipment, night vision gear and counter-artillery radar.

Did Trump ask a favor of the Ukrainian President?

Yeah right, like "Don" Corleone was asking Roberto the Slum Lord for a "Favor" too.

Oh, so it's "bad" if you get the Ukrainian's to announce an investigation...but it's not bad when you get the Main Stream Media to announce it through your minions in the FBI?