Where did it all go wrong

[Dr Grump]

I guess most people have missed the point of the OP. It wasn’t so much who said it (a German) but what he said. There was a time when I was growing up (70s) when the US was looked up to and was a place/society others wished to emulate. Don’t get me wrong, there was a naivety there for sure. But there was also optimism about how the world should be. Now the US seems nothing more than a country sliding into mediocrity. And while both the left and right send barbs each other’s way, from the outside looking in, it looks like two toddlers fighting over a candy bar. It’s pathetic. Certainly the neocons on this board seem the worst offenders – not giving a shit about other people and what they think, blaming everybody but themselves for their country’s woes, and ironically, most of all, not taking responsibility for their own actions (including a clown being elected pres). The left can take some of the blame, too. Especially those Sanders supporters who threw their toys out of the cot when their guy didn’t get the Dem nomination.


Wake up USA. Your country is being fucked over. You want somebody to blame? Go look in the mirror first, then head out and starting blaming others.

 

[Doubledareme]

Wake up USA. Your country is being fucked over. You want somebody to blame? Go look in the mirror first, then head out and starting blaming others.

Never happen. It's un-American.

 

[Dr Grump]

Ummm, you brought up the Civil War which last time I checked ended over 150 years ago....just sayin...

That was my point when I brought it up.....

 

[Dr Grump]

maybe we have too many German immigrants here, maybe thats the problem.

Well, the Orange Buffoon is of German stock - well, from his father's side anyway.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

German writer sums up how Germany feels about the US. It's probably how most western countries feel.

"Peter Schneider, the novelist and journalist, expressed the attitude this way: “[The US] has created a model of a savior, and now we find by looking at you that you are not perfect at all—much less, you are actually corrupt, you are terrible businessmen, you have no ideals anymore.” With the Iraq War, Guantánamo, drones, the unmet expectations of the Obama Presidency, and now spying, “you actually have acted against your own promises, and so we feel very deceived.”

NB: This comes from a piece written in The New Yorker which is behind a pay wall so cannot link. Also, for all the Trump haters out there (of which I am one), the piece was written in 2015 when Obama was in office.

One man’s opinion which happened to get published.......in the New Yorker. As I read it, it occurred to me he referenced “we”, as if spoke for others beyond himself. Where are all the other voices he supposedly speaks for?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I guess most people have missed the point of the OP. It wasn’t so much who said it (a German) but what he said. There was a time when I was growing up (70s) when the US was looked up to and was a place/society others wished to emulate. Don’t get me wrong, there was a naivety there for sure. But there was also optimism about how the world should be. Now the US seems nothing more than a country sliding into mediocrity. And while both the left and right send barbs each other’s way, from the outside looking in, it looks like two toddlers fighting over a candy bar. It’s pathetic. Certainly the neocons on this board seem the worst offenders – not giving a shit about other people and what they think, blaming everybody but themselves for their country’s woes, and ironically, most of all, not taking responsibility for their own actions (including a clown being elected pres). The left can take some of the blame, too. Especially those Sanders supporters who threw their toys out of the cot when their guy didn’t get the Dem nomination.


Wake up USA. Your country is being fucked over. You want somebody to blame? Go look in the mirror first, then head out and starting blaming others.

While it's true our country has it's problems, one problem we don't need is getting a European approval. If you don't like our country, then don't pay attention to our country. Guess what? We'll do fine without you or your opinions of us.

When you solve all your problems there, then think about giving us advice. Until then, trial, error and imperfections are commonplace in nearly every nation on this planet.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

German writer sums up how Germany feels about the US. It's probably how most western countries feel.

"Peter Schneider, the novelist and journalist, expressed the attitude this way: “[The US] has created a model of a savior, and now we find by looking at you that you are not perfect at all—much less, you are actually corrupt, you are terrible businessmen, you have no ideals anymore.” With the Iraq War, Guantánamo, drones, the unmet expectations of the Obama Presidency, and now spying, “you actually have acted against your own promises, and so we feel very deceived.”

NB: This comes from a piece written in The New Yorker which is behind a pay wall so cannot link. Also, for all the Trump haters out there (of which I am one), the piece was written in 2015 when Obama was in office.

It's been going wrong for a long time but when the GOP let the American Taliban and Nazis into to party, because that's the only way they could win, that was the end of rational American politics. Now it's winner take nothing (that matters).

The only blessing? The world is better off without America directing the play.

Pack up and go then, I’ll help you pack.

 

[Doubledareme]

German writer sums up how Germany feels about the US. It's probably how most western countries feel.

"Peter Schneider, the novelist and journalist, expressed the attitude this way: “[The US] has created a model of a savior, and now we find by looking at you that you are not perfect at all—much less, you are actually corrupt, you are terrible businessmen, you have no ideals anymore.” With the Iraq War, Guantánamo, drones, the unmet expectations of the Obama Presidency, and now spying, “you actually have acted against your own promises, and so we feel very deceived.”

NB: This comes from a piece written in The New Yorker which is behind a pay wall so cannot link. Also, for all the Trump haters out there (of which I am one), the piece was written in 2015 when Obama was in office.

It's been going wrong for a long time but when the GOP let the American Taliban and Nazis into to party, because that's the only way they could win, that was the end of rational American politics. Now it's winner take nothing (that matters).

The only blessing? The world is better off without America directing the play.

Pack up and go then, I’ll help you pack.

I'm just fine being ignored, rightfully, by the world here. When I care I go there. The world keeps spinning to its doom either way.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

With the exception of the Westwall, all the other replies are just jingoistic crap. Yeah, let's judge Germany on something that happened 70 years ago. I can easily harangue every other state in the world for unlawful killings. Whether it be 6,000 or 6 million. Dead is dead. I'm talking about the here and now.

Well shit man. Didn’t you judge your country over a civil wage faught between 1860-1865? And it was not fought over slaver entirely, it was fought over states rights!

The only States Right was to keep humans as property,

Doubledareme, you have made many lame post here, but this one I can’t let slide. You clearly have not read any history of our civil war, but fear not, I will take pity on your ignorant ass, and educate you.

Slavery was not the cause that started the civil war. Lincoln engaged in the war for one underlying reason- to preserve the Union. He ultimately determined that adjoining slavery to his real cause would allow him the best opportunity to win the war and preserve the Union. In fact, Lincoln would have allowed slavery to continue, if he thought it would allow him to preserve the Union. Read this passage. When you’re done go ahead and read some more civil war history, so you can be more informed about this country than the average German writer.
What is the context of Lincoln saying: "if I could save the union without freeing any slave I would do it"
If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I

 

[Dr Grump]

One man’s opinion which happened to get published.......in the New Yorker. As I read it, it occurred to me he referenced “we”, as if spoke for others beyond himself. Where are all the other voices he supposedly speaks for?

It was a 10,000+ word piece on Angela Merkel...

 

[Dr Grump]

[Q

Doubledareme, you have made many lame post here, but this one I can’t let slide. You clearly have not read any history of our civil war, but fear not, I will take pity on your ignorant ass, and educate you.

Slavery was not the cause that started the civil war. Lincoln engaged in the war for one underlying reason- to preserve the Union. He ultimately determined that adjoining slavery to his real cause would allow him the best opportunity to win the war and preserve the Union. In fact, Lincoln would have allowed slavery to continue, if he thought it would allow him to preserve the Union. Read this passage. When you’re done go ahead and read some more civil war history, so you can be more informed about this country than the average German writer.
What is the context of Lincoln saying: "if I could save the union without freeing any slave I would do it"
If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I

What a load of crap. It was about slavery. If there was no slavery, what would he have been saving the union from?

 

[Dr Grump]

While it's true our country has it's problems, one problem we don't need is getting a European approval. If you don't like our country, then don't pay attention to our country. Guess what? We'll do fine without you or your opinions of us.

When you solve all your problems there, then think about giving us advice. Until then, trial, error and imperfections are commonplace in nearly every nation on this planet.

If only decisions made in Washington didn't have a knock-on/spill over effect to the rest of us. You might have a good point.

 

[Old Rocks]

German writer sums up how Germany feels about the US. It's probably how most western countries feel.

"Peter Schneider, the novelist and journalist, expressed the attitude this way: “[The US] has created a model of a savior, and now we find by looking at you that you are not perfect at all—much less, you are actually corrupt, you are terrible businessmen, you have no ideals anymore.” With the Iraq War, Guantánamo, drones, the unmet expectations of the Obama Presidency, and now spying, “you actually have acted against your own promises, and so we feel very deceived.”

NB: This comes from a piece written in The New Yorker which is behind a pay wall so cannot link. Also, for all the Trump haters out there (of which I am one), the piece was written in 2015 when Obama was in office.

And the ascension to the White House of the treasonous fat senile old orange clown simply verified this opinion piece.

 

[Old Rocks]

What Germany is butt hurt over is the inevitable end to the US gravy train...

Germany is not worried about us at all. They, and many other European nations are looking East toward China for their trading future. Already there is a direct rail link to China. The old Silk Road is back in business again.

 

[westwall]

German writer sums up how Germany feels about the US. It's probably how most western countries feel.

"Peter Schneider, the novelist and journalist, expressed the attitude this way: “[The US] has created a model of a savior, and now we find by looking at you that you are not perfect at all—much less, you are actually corrupt, you are terrible businessmen, you have no ideals anymore.” With the Iraq War, Guantánamo, drones, the unmet expectations of the Obama Presidency, and now spying, “you actually have acted against your own promises, and so we feel very deceived.”

NB: This comes from a piece written in The New Yorker which is behind a pay wall so cannot link. Also, for all the Trump haters out there (of which I am one), the piece was written in 2015 when Obama was in office.

And the ascension to the White House of the treasonous fat senile old orange clown simply verified this opinion piece.

Naaah, he wasn't that old when he sold the country out to the rooskis.

 

[bripat9643]

Wasn't the US the country that killed 100,000s of Iraqi civilians? Didn't they have a civil war over slaves that cost 100,000s of lives?

I could go on...

We already know you hate America. Don't waste our time quoting a German leftist who also hates America.

 

[westwall]

What Germany is butt hurt over is the inevitable end to the US gravy train...

Germany is not worried about us at all. They, and many other European nations are looking East toward China for their trading future. Already there is a direct rail link to China. The old Silk Road is back in business again.

There's been a direct rail link for over 100 years dude. Where the hell have you been?

 

[Old Rocks]

I guess most people have missed the point of the OP. It wasn’t so much who said it (a German) but what he said. There was a time when I was growing up (70s) when the US was looked up to and was a place/society others wished to emulate. Don’t get me wrong, there was a naivety there for sure. But there was also optimism about how the world should be. Now the US seems nothing more than a country sliding into mediocrity. And while both the left and right send barbs each other’s way, from the outside looking in, it looks like two toddlers fighting over a candy bar. It’s pathetic. Certainly the neocons on this board seem the worst offenders – not giving a shit about other people and what they think, blaming everybody but themselves for their country’s woes, and ironically, most of all, not taking responsibility for their own actions (including a clown being elected pres). The left can take some of the blame, too. Especially those Sanders supporters who threw their toys out of the cot when their guy didn’t get the Dem nomination.


Wake up USA. Your country is being fucked over. You want somebody to blame? Go look in the mirror first, then head out and starting blaming others.

We led the world when we dreamed big. Yes, we had faults, but we were the nation where big things were happening and dreams came true. We decided to go to the moon, and did so, 12 years after Sputnik. Today, the rest of the world sees us as a stagnate nation, afraid of everyone around them. An isolated state full of bigots. A place where people prefer superstition over science.

 

[Old Rocks]

With the exception of the Westwall, all the other replies are just jingoistic crap. Yeah, let's judge Germany on something that happened 70 years ago. I can easily harangue every other state in the world for unlawful killings. Whether it be 6,000 or 6 million. Dead is dead. I'm talking about the here and now.

Well shit man. Didn’t you judge your country over a civil wage faught between 1860-1865? And it was not fought over slaver entirely, it was fought over states rights!

The only States Right was to keep humans as property,

Doubledareme, you have made many lame post here, but this one I can’t let slide. You clearly have not read any history of our civil war, but fear not, I will take pity on your ignorant ass, and educate you.

Slavery was not the cause that started the civil war. Lincoln engaged in the war for one underlying reason- to preserve the Union. He ultimately determined that adjoining slavery to his real cause would allow him the best opportunity to win the war and preserve the Union. In fact, Lincoln would have allowed slavery to continue, if he thought it would allow him to preserve the Union. Read this passage. When you’re done go ahead and read some more civil war history, so you can be more informed about this country than the average German writer.
What is the context of Lincoln saying: "if I could save the union without freeing any slave I would do it"
If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union. I

If you read the statements of Jefferson Davis prior to the Civil War, you will find that slavery was indeed the cause of the Civil War. It was inevitable that slavery would end here as it had in every other civilized nation. And the South was going to do everything that it could to prevent that, including Civil War.

 

[westwall]

What a load of bullshit. We still lead the world in technical advancement. Your globalist hero's have been slowly emasculating this country for decades now, that's on you and your hero's, the country would do great if you people would just leave. You like progressive countries, so go move to one.