What would happen to the United States if Conservatives left?

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by bear513, May 22, 2013.

  1. PMZ
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    PMZ BANNED

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    You like to claim "conservatism" as benign, but "Conservatism is all about protecting unalienable rights which never include infringing somebody else's rights" is anything but. To me it says protecting your rights but not mine. Which is even worse than anarchy, it's tyranny. If you are allowed to infringe my rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, things revert quickly back to the guy with the biggest club rules the neighborhood. Sort of like urban gangland.
     
  2. Circe
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    Circe Silver Member

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    You want control, control, control of everyone else, don't you?

    We're not going to let you do that, I hope.


    You don't control us, we don't control you. That's how conservatism should work.
     
  3. JohnL.Burke
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    JohnL.Burke Gold Member Supporting Member

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    You are fine when "the guy with the biggest club" is the government, however. Conservatism in anathema to tyranny. Conservatives want a smaller government so more people have a say in their future and opportunities. This is not to say conservatives want no government. Government has its place. However, conservatives don't believe the government has a place in our private lives, bedrooms, churches and thought process. Tyranny, in the last hundred years, has always derived from a liberal agenda that requires a large government to carry "the biggest club".
    I find it humorous that you compare conservatives to an urban gangland. Urban ganglands are derived from liberal policies implemented in inner cities, inner city schools, and a corrupt and inefficient welfare state.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2013
  4. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    But you see, they cannot articulate a defense for liberalism given the dismal results of it after it has been in operation for awhile. But they are so emotionally invested in it, they have to protect it and the only way they know to do that is to attack conservatives and conservatism however dishonest they have to be to do that. They distort or change our words, put words in our mouths, misrepresent what we do, and demonize us with whatever they have to distort or characterize or make up to do that.

    And don't expect them to actually debate the concept or even repeat it back to us accurately. There is apparently something in the water they drink that prevents them from having the ability to do that.
     
  5. Bfgrn
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    Bfgrn Gold Member

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    "conservatives don't believe the government has a place in our private lives, bedrooms, churches", just as long as a women's uterus is the property of the state, poor people pee in a cup so government can test it, and Christianity and creationism is taught in schools.
     
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  6. JohnL.Burke
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    JohnL.Burke Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Liberalism is a type of religion based on faith as opposed to historical reference and analytical analysis. It is emotion and a knee jerk reaction as opposed to common sense and a protection of rights. Liberalism focuses on rhetoric as opposed to results. So far, all liberalism has accomplished is genocide,poverty and fascistic governments. For liberalism to work, it must create a government big enough to subvert the will of the people by any means necessary.
     
  7. JohnL.Burke
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    JohnL.Burke Gold Member Supporting Member

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    When the government is in charge of "free" contraception then the government is already in charge of women"s uteruses. Liberalism wants to be in charge of everything. Otherwise liberalism would die. Liberalism, by its very nature, despises the will of the people. Obamacare being only one example.
     
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  8. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Conservatives have no interest in a woman's uterus unless they are in an intimate relationship with the woman who owns it or it is their own. They just don't want to be obligated to pay for the consequences of how women use their uteruses. Just leave us out of your business please. And don't bring up the issues of abortion. Conservatives will likely have a personal interest in that but don't assign it to the federal government to decide.

    Conservatives have no interest in the pee of poor people. But those who expect conservatives to support them should have to demonstrate that they are truly needy and are using the benefits to provide necessities to themselves and their children. Conservatives understand and acknowledge that a huge percentage of children being raised in poverty and a huge percentage of children being poorly parented and neglected are being raised by parents stoned or zoned out on illegal substances. Conservatives don't see it as compassion to continue subsidizing that. Do YOU think it is compassionate to subsidize that?

    Conservatives believe in liberty and individual conscience so long as one person does not infringe on the rights of another. So if conservatives don't want creationsm and Christianity taught in the schools, they believe in the right of the community to choose that option. But likewise those communities who do want creationism and Christianity taught in their schools should also have that right. Or Atheism. Or Buddhism. Or Judaism. Or any other philosophy. When the federal government has the power to tell us what we can and cannot teach our children, we have no liberty at all.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2013
  9. Bfgrn
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    Liberalism is trust of the people, tempered by prudence; conservatism, distrust of people, tempered by fear.
    William E. Gladstone

    You couldn't be any further from the truth. There is a plethora of studies on personality types, liberal, and conservative. But what all these modern studies prove was already common knowledge from common sense observation and understanding how emotions manifest in human behavior a century ago. The core of conservatism is the strongest of all human emotion...FEAR. It explains why conservatives cling to guns and Bibles. It is why conservatives fear minorities and create monster like grime reaper images in their minds.

    Conservatives have NEVER given us less government. Even when they controlled both houses of Congress and the White House for almost a decade. The conservative idea of less government, is less regulations on polluters, Wall Street crooks and any of the opulent and CEO's conservatives worship. Conservatives equate wealth with morality.

    Q: What is conservatism?
    A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

    When you understand this and view their words, ask the question; will this lead to some form of an aristocracy?

    The answer is always YES...

    Conservatism is incompatible with democracy, prosperity, and civilization in general. It is a destructive system of inequality and prejudice that is founded on deception and has no place in the modern world.

    These ideas are not new. Indeed they were common sense until recently. Nowadays, though, most of the people who call themselves "conservatives" have little notion of what conservatism even is. They have been deceived by one of the great public relations campaigns of human history. Only by analyzing this deception will it become possible to revive democracy in the United States.

    The Main Arguments of Conservatism


    From the pharaohs of ancient Egypt to the self-regarding thugs of ancient Rome to the glorified warlords of medieval and absolutist Europe, in nearly every urbanized society throughout human history, there have been people who have tried to constitute themselves as an aristocracy. These people and their allies are the conservatives.

    The tactics of conservatism vary widely by place and time. But the most central feature of conservatism is deference: a psychologically internalized attitude on the part of the common people that the aristocracy are better people than they are. Modern-day liberals often theorize that conservatives use "social issues" as a way to mask economic objectives, but this is almost backward: the true goal of conservatism is to establish an aristocracy, which is a social and psychological condition of inequality. Economic inequality and regressive taxation, while certainly welcomed by the aristocracy, are best understood as a means to their actual goal, which is simply to be aristocrats. More generally, it is crucial to conservatism that the people must literally love the order that dominates them. Of course this notion sounds bizarre to modern ears, but it is perfectly overt in the writings of leading conservative theorists such as Burke. Democracy, for them, is not about the mechanisms of voting and office-holding. In fact conservatives hold a wide variety of opinions about such secondary formal matters. For conservatives, rather, democracy is a psychological condition. People who believe that the aristocracy rightfully dominates society because of its intrinsic superiority are conservatives; democrats, by contrast, believe that they are of equal social worth. Conservatism is the antithesis of democracy. This has been true for thousands of years.

    The defenders of aristocracy represent aristocracy as a natural phenomenon, but in reality it is the most artificial thing on earth. Although one of the goals of every aristocracy is to make its preferred social order seem permanent and timeless, in reality conservatism must be reinvented in every generation. This is true for many reasons, including internal conflicts among the aristocrats; institutional shifts due to climate, markets, or warfare; and ideological gains and losses in the perpetual struggle against democracy. In some societies the aristocracy is rigid, closed, and stratified, while in others it is more of an aspiration among various fluid and factionalized groups. The situation in the United States right now is toward the latter end of the spectrum. A main goal in life of all aristocrats, however, is to pass on their positions of privilege to their children, and many of the aspiring aristocrats of the United States are appointing their children to positions in government and in the archipelago of think tanks that promote conservative theories.

    Conservatism in every place and time is founded on deception. The deceptions of conservatism today are especially sophisticated, simply because culture today is sufficiently democratic that the myths of earlier times will no longer suffice.
     
  10. JohnL.Burke
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    JohnL.Burke Gold Member Supporting Member

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    Wow! That was just ridiculous!
     

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