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...as when the liberal debater refuses to answer a simple "yes or no" question, knowing that the true answer will lay the groundwork to defeat their argument.The most infuriating thing to conservatives when arguing with liberals is complexity. Conservatives tend to try to boil everything down to simplicity, the argument always starts when someone says "it's not that simple or clearcut."
Everything, no matter how complex, starts with simple principles. If you understand the principles involved in a discussion, the complexity later on makes more sense. If you disdain the basics, then any argument on complexity becomes little more than special pleading.
i find it interesting that people who post threads like this are surprised when others respond to them accordingly and don't take them seriously.
Actually, Menachem is usually direct and on the level.
But why did s/he decide to post a potentially board burning question is a bit shocking to me.
That is the kind of question I ask to promote partisan bickering! Not Menachem!
i don't know why you'd say that. any thread entitled "what makes arguiong with liberals so frustrating" is a troll thread.
and entertaining that type of nonsense is silly, imo.
and, frankly, his whining that one doesn't "debate" things like this is annoying.
The most infuriating thing to conservatives when arguing with liberals is complexity. Conservatives tend to try to boil everything down to simplicity, the argument always starts when someone says "it's not that simple or clearcut."
...as when the liberal debater refuses to answer a simple "yes or no" question, knowing that the true answer will lay the groundwork to defeat their argument.Everything, no matter how complex, starts with simple principles. If you understand the principles involved in a discussion, the complexity later on makes more sense. If you disdain the basics, then any argument on complexity becomes little more than special pleading.
That's because those simplistic questions are usually some form of "Have you quit beating your wife?" and deserve no answer. Sorry if people don't dutifully fall into two easily identifiable camps for your convenience.
I see this over and over. Conservatives are for limited government. Just because we say we don't want government doing things where government is inept, counterproductive, wasteful or whatever, does not mean that we should shut it down totally.
Yes, we do need roads, bridges, highways, jails, schools, aircraft carriers, GPS satellites, standard weights and measures, courts, etc etc. Saying we don't need subsidies for crummy cars badly built and still with astronomical prices does not mean we don't need highways.
The conservative view is that the government should be a useful servant of the people's needs. However, you give it too much money, power, authority it becomes the worst sort of master.
Actually, Menachem is usually direct and on the level.
But why did s/he decide to post a potentially board burning question is a bit shocking to me.
That is the kind of question I ask to promote partisan bickering! Not Menachem!
i don't know why you'd say that. any thread entitled "what makes arguiong with liberals so frustrating" is a troll thread.
and entertaining that type of nonsense is silly, imo.
and, frankly, his whining that one doesn't "debate" things like this is annoying.
Add what you said to the person who said it, and I find it a bit shocking.
This more along the lines of a hardcore rightwing fanatical bomb-thrower than someone that tends to have a habit of actually weighing what they want to type.
Maybe the Romney campaign hired Menachem to bomb throw a little?
That sucks, I wanted that job!
I see this over and over. Conservatives are for limited government. Just because we say we don't want government doing things where government is inept, counterproductive, wasteful or whatever, does not mean that we should shut it down totally.
Yes, we do need roads, bridges, highways, jails, schools, aircraft carriers, GPS satellites, standard weights and measures, courts, etc etc. Saying we don't need subsidies for crummy cars badly built and still with astronomical prices does not mean we don't need highways.
The conservative view is that the government should be a useful servant of the people's needs. However, you give it too much money, power, authority it becomes the worst sort of master.
I am more amused by liberals than frustrated. I am amused that their inability to logically defend a point so easily morphs into personal attacks, strawman arguments, projection, cries of racism or (my favorite) a response similar or equal to "bullshit!"
Liberalism is (an amusing) mental disorder.
I am still waiting for Republicans to elect one of these mythical Conservatives.
The conservative view is that the government should be a useful servant of the people's needs.
This sounds like a liberal argument based on a subjective definition of "needs".
You mean like the way anyone receiving public assistance is a welfare cheat and all union workers are lazy, overpaid slobs?
This response will be the basis for the thread "what makes liberals annoying #2" But for now, all I can say is this is not a response to the thread and it is typical of the way Liberals try and turn the discussion away from the real issue into a matter of loaded rhetoric that totally ignores the topic at hand. which will be "What makes liberals annoying #3"
I see this over and over. Conservatives are for limited government. Just because we say we don't want government doing things where government is inept, counterproductive, wasteful or whatever, does not mean that we should shut it down totally.
Yes, we do need roads, bridges, highways, jails, schools, aircraft carriers, GPS satellites, standard weights and measures, courts, etc etc. Saying we don't need subsidies for crummy cars badly built and still with astronomical prices does not mean we don't need highways.
The conservative view is that the government should be a useful servant of the people's needs. However, you give it too much money, power, authority it becomes the worst sort of master.
Some functions are better served by you as an individual, some are better served as a society
...as when the liberal debater refuses to answer a simple "yes or no" question, knowing that the true answer will lay the groundwork to defeat their argument.Everything, no matter how complex, starts with simple principles. If you understand the principles involved in a discussion, the complexity later on makes more sense. If you disdain the basics, then any argument on complexity becomes little more than special pleading.
That's because those simplistic questions are usually some form of "Have you quit beating your wife?" and deserve no answer. Sorry if people don't dutifully fall into two easily identifiable camps for your convenience.
...as when the liberal debater refuses to answer a simple "yes or no" question, knowing that the true answer will lay the groundwork to defeat their argument.The most infuriating thing to conservatives when arguing with liberals is complexity. Conservatives tend to try to boil everything down to simplicity, the argument always starts when someone says "it's not that simple or clearcut."
Everything, no matter how complex, starts with simple principles. If you understand the principles involved in a discussion, the complexity later on makes more sense. If you disdain the basics, then any argument on complexity becomes little more than special pleading.
...as when the liberal debater refuses to answer a simple "yes or no" question, knowing that the true answer will lay the groundwork to defeat their argument.
That's because those simplistic questions are usually some form of "Have you quit beating your wife?" and deserve no answer. Sorry if people don't dutifully fall into two easily identifiable camps for your convenience.
Really? None of you have answered my simple question. DO the Democrats control the Senate and have they controlled it since 2007? Not a single Democrat or liberal would actually post an answer to the poll question.
Of course, I speak only for myself and my own frustrations in dealing with various personalities here. In any collection of people, from ant farmers to zoologists, you will find many who are wise, and many who are otherwise.I see this over and over. Conservatives are for limited government. Just because we say we don't want government doing things where government is inept, counterproductive, wasteful or whatever, does not mean that we should shut it down totally.
Yes, we do need roads, bridges, highways, jails, schools, aircraft carriers, GPS satellites, standard weights and measures, courts, etc etc. Saying we don't need subsidies for crummy cars badly built and still with astronomical prices does not mean we don't need highways.
The conservative view is that the government should be a useful servant of the people's needs. However, you give it too much money, power, authority it becomes the worst sort of master.
Were you elected or appointed to speak for all conservatives?
That's because those simplistic questions are usually some form of "Have you quit beating your wife?" and deserve no answer. Sorry if people don't dutifully fall into two easily identifiable camps for your convenience.
Really? None of you have answered my simple question. DO the Democrats control the Senate and have they controlled it since 2007? Not a single Democrat or liberal would actually post an answer to the poll question.
Yes the Demorats control the Senate and they have since 2007.
I am neither Democrat nor a liberal but I find that question based on the obvious fact of history. Why do you need anyone to answer that question?
You get right to the point, don't you. My needs are important your needs are not.
Hypotheticals are the hallmark of liberalism.
"Old people will die if we touch ss or medicare!"
"Children and women will die if we don't fully fund baby killers!"
"If abortion is illegal, women will be forced to bear babies that will kill them!"
