What is the "true" cost of Charter Schools?

[CaféAuLait]

(c) A charter school may contract with a school district or the governing body of a public college or university for the use of a school building and grounds, the operation and maintenance thereof. Any such contract shall provide such services or facilities at cost. - See more at: N.Y. EDN. LAW § 2853 : NY Code - Section 2853: Charter school organization; oversight; facilities

By not following the law. Sue the state comptroller to avoid transparency. Push out kids with disabilities or might be troublesome. Shut down your schools to force march for political purposes. Eva is swell, ain't she?

Someone got it on the first try. When she was asked about the facilities, she said they were free. "Unused government buildings". Only the tax payers are paying, so they aren't "free". It's like Republicans saying, "Cutting taxes pay for themselves". Only they don't. GOP economics is so strange.

Why are you so upset about this when these are the results? And the Mayor just shut down this very school after rescinding agreements.

The Harlem middle school, which opened in 2012, boasts some of the city’s top scores. In 2013, 96% of fifth-graders there passed state math exams, the highest passing rate in the state.

Ousmane Kebe, 11, reading at the Success Academy Harlem Central, one of the schools cut by Mayor de Blasio.

Read more: Eva Moskowitz will keep on fighting Mayor de Blasio over nixed charter schools - NY Daily News


The second post in this thread says she pays cost for her classrooms, she did the same with the NY deal. Perhaps I'm stupid but I don't get why schools with the above results would be a bad thing.

 

[Spiderman]

So I'm watching Morning Joe the other day and they had the CEO of "Success Academy Charter Schools", Eva Moskowitz, on as a guest.

I know right wingers on this site will say "Oh, that's on MSNBC so everything they say is a lie". Just this morning, one of the panelists and regular contributors was Bill Krystal. One of the guests was right wing extremist Jim DeMint. No one interrupted them, edited their comments or tried to make them look foolish. This isn't Fox. Republicans on the USMB don't like MSNBC because they don't like the message. How many times have I posted links here USMB Republicans called "lies" and then later had to eat those words? Examples: Republicans block Obama from investigating the BP oil spill, Military makes super computer from game chips and so one.

So they were talking about how these Charter Schools cost so much less and how people have to go through a lottery to get their children into one. Someone asked the CEO about salary comparison between her teachers and union teachers and she said her teachers get paid, on average, at least 30% more. NOTE: That's the difference between teachers making $40,000 and teachers making $60,000. Times that difference by 10 or 20 and you have a LOT of money going out the door.

AND she said that her teachers are required to spend time going to "classes" so they can learn new techniques in teaching. But the teachers don't pay for those classes, the school does.

So how does a school who limits the number of students, pays the teachers more and pays for further teacher education for the teachers cost less?

I stumbled across the answer this morning.

Anyone?

30% more than 40K is 52K not 60K

If you went to a charter school you might have known that.

so what

If you're going to whine about the cost of something at least get the numbers right.

 

[MeBelle]

So I'm watching Morning Joe the other day and they had the CEO of "Success Academy Charter Schools", Eva Moskowitz, on as a guest.

I know right wingers on this site will say "Oh, that's on MSNBC so everything they say is a lie". Just this morning, one of the panelists and regular contributors was Bill Krystal. One of the guests was right wing extremist Jim DeMint. No one interrupted them, edited their comments or tried to make them look foolish. This isn't Fox. Republicans on the USMB don't like MSNBC because they don't like the message. How many times have I posted links here USMB Republicans called "lies" and then later had to eat those words?

Never.

So they were talking about how these Charter Schools cost so much less and how people have to go through a lottery to get their children into one.

Get off your @ss and change the laws in NY. Simple!!

Someone asked the CEO about salary comparison between her teachers and union teachers and she said her teachers get paid, on average, at least 30% more.

Link? I know darn well your assumption is incorrect.

NOTE: That's the difference between teachers making $40,000 and teachers making $60,000. Times that difference by 10 or 20 and you have a LOT of money going out the door.

1) Teachers who teach in charter schools have a passion for teaching.
2) You failed math.

AND she said that her teachers are required to spend time going to "classes" so they can learn new techniques in teaching. But the teachers don't pay for those classes, the school does.

This is different from regular public schools, how?

So how does a school who limits the number of students, pays the teachers more and pays for further teacher education for the teachers cost less?

All teachers must continue attaining CEUs in order to keep their teaching credentials.
Check NY law (or read the actual link which was posted in this very thread.) You will (should) comprehend your 'issue'.

I stumbled across the answer this morning.

I'm sure you stumbled.

Anyone?

Bueller?

Link for ya' rdean:
Mayor Bloomberg and Joel Klein determined to keep parents seen, not heard - NY Daily News

Read it and learn something.

Why’s there so much hate for a woman who has decided to spend her days starting schools for poor and mostly black children in Harlem? There are now many charter school operators in this city. Why focus on Moskowitz?

Why do you hate children getting a great education?

 

[Disir]

Someone got it on the first try. When she was asked about the facilities, she said they were free. "Unused government buildings". Only the tax payers are paying, so they aren't "free". It's like Republicans saying, "Cutting taxes pay for themselves". Only they don't. GOP economics is so strange.

She's full of it. She "shares space" and is terrified enough to avoid transparency because then she would be caught and she wouldn't be able to steal from the public coffers.

How is she "stealing" anything? A charter school is a public school, idiot.

Why sue to avoid transparency, genius?

 

[editec]

Seems to me that generalizing about "charter schools" based on what happens in one state is a mistake.

We do not have a single educational system in this nation.

We have 50 state educational oversite systems running something like 30,000 local school districts.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Maybe because the charter schools don't have to pay for multiple layers of bureaucracy that is a large chunk of the DOE's budget?

Wonder how many Charter school superintendents are making $635,000?

Wonder how many Charter schools handle a million students?

Charter schools aren't going for World Domination like Public schools. The guy who was making $650K oversaw three public schools. He's was like a CEO, Dean. Where's the Hate?

 

[Kosh]

WOW another far left propaganda thread fail!

 

[bripat9643]

She's full of it. She "shares space" and is terrified enough to avoid transparency because then she would be caught and she wouldn't be able to steal from the public coffers.

How is she "stealing" anything? A charter school is a public school, idiot.

Why sue to avoid transparency, genius?

When did anyone demonstrate that anyone was being sued?

 

[Disir]

How is she "stealing" anything? A charter school is a public school, idiot.

Why sue to avoid transparency, genius?

When did anyone demonstrate that anyone was being sued?

Courthouse News Service

 

[Delta4Embassy]

So I'm watching Morning Joe the other day and they had the CEO of "Success Academy Charter Schools", Eva Moskowitz, on as a guest.

I know right wingers on this site will say "Oh, that's on MSNBC so everything they say is a lie". Just this morning, one of the panelists and regular contributors was Bill Krystal. One of the guests was right wing extremist Jim DeMint. No one interrupted them, edited their comments or tried to make them look foolish. This isn't Fox. Republicans on the USMB don't like MSNBC because they don't like the message. How many times have I posted links here USMB Republicans called "lies" and then later had to eat those words? Examples: Republicans block Obama from investigating the BP oil spill, Military makes super computer from game chips and so one.

So they were talking about how these Charter Schools cost so much less and how people have to go through a lottery to get their children into one. Someone asked the CEO about salary comparison between her teachers and union teachers and she said her teachers get paid, on average, at least 30% more. NOTE: That's the difference between teachers making $40,000 and teachers making $60,000. Times that difference by 10 or 20 and you have a LOT of money going out the door.

AND she said that her teachers are required to spend time going to "classes" so they can learn new techniques in teaching. But the teachers don't pay for those classes, the school does.

So how does a school who limits the number of students, pays the teachers more and pays for further teacher education for the teachers cost less?

I stumbled across the answer this morning.

Anyone?

Actually, it's the difference (at +30%) between $40,000 and $52,000, not $60,000 Might suck at higher maths, but I'm an ace with arithmetic.

I don't have any problem with charter schools. If it reults in a better education that should be the end of it. Do whatever works better.

 

[Boatswain2PA]

Are you limiting the discussion to (some) NY school districts? Or would you like to widen your search for answers?

In my city (about 500,000 people), the USD gets about $13,500 per student.

There are several private schools that charge about $8,000 per student, and they consistently put out a much, much better product (ie: kids that can read) than the USD. However, they usually pay their teachers about 5-10% LESS than the USD teachers. However these teachers don't mind because the work environment is so much better at the private schools.

There is NO, absolutely NONE, sharing of resources between the USD and the private schools (other than the occasional hosting of sports teams).

The problem with education is the lack of choice foisted onto parents with the enormous USD systems. We should get rid of them and give parent's vouchers to send their kids where they want.

 

[JFK_USA]

Charter schools can be an effective tool in increasing educational results in our country. My bigger concern is the narrative of our educational system moving forward.

If we as a country say "Well Charter schools are doing so well, then we should just privatize all education."

So we do that, but now the richer families will say "Well because we pay more in property taxes, our children should have the best teachers and the best resources and not the people who pay less." So then because it's now a private business, they offer the higher level courses, music and art classes or the better prep courses for the SAT to those students and not the poorer students.

This comes to the fundamental philosophy of this country. Are we the "Land of Opportunity" for all or just for the people with the means to afford the opportunities? I went to a public school because I grew up lower middle class. I worked my tail off in school to get good grades and get into AP and honors classes. We sell ourselves as a country that if you work hard, you will make it in this country. Education is a way to do that.

It's easy to determine who works hard and who doesn't. If you are smart and do the work, you'll get a grade based on your work. A, B, C, D, or F. It doesn't recognize your bank account, just how well you master the material and the work you put in to do it. To take that away just seems unamerican. Yes we all know that money talks, but Education shouldn't be affected by how much money you make but how hard you work. I just feel that some pushing this Charter School/School Vouchers agenda is ultimately trying to get to that point where only richer families get the true opportunities and if you aren't born into that, you will have a poor quality of life regardless of how hard you work.

You already see this mentality in some parts of the inner city and this leads to people committing crimes to "get money" because they don't believe that if you truly work hard in this country, you will be successful. All they see is failure around them and people looking down on them. So they don't care about our society and our rules. We have to invest seriously into the philosophy that ALL citizens should have the right to a quality education. I don't think private schools are the solution.

 

[Boatswain2PA]

So we do that, but now the richer families will say "Well because we pay more in property taxes, our children should have the best teachers and the best resources and not the people who pay less." So then because it's now a private business, they offer the higher level courses, music and art classes or the better prep courses for the SAT to those students and not the poorer students.

Richer families are already able to put their kids in good schools. They either do that by moving to the suburbs where the better public schools are, or putting them into private schools. This leaves the poor kids trapped in the urban school districts which, with virtually no exceptions, fail them.

If we simply gave every parent a voucher, and let that parent choose what school to send their child to, then the parents of those kids who are trapped would have an OPTION to send them to a better school. Of course, the rich kids will continue getting into the better private schools who charge above the voucher level, but nothing is going to change that. VOUCHERS HELP THE POOR!

This comes to the fundamental philosophy of this country. Are we the "Land of Opportunity" for all or just for the people with the means to afford the opportunities? I went to a public school because I grew up lower middle class. I worked my tail off in school to get good grades and get into AP and honors classes. We sell ourselves as a country that if you work hard, you will make it in this country. Education is a way to do that.

But unfortunately most of our urban public schools are failing our poor children so badly that they NO LONGER HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY. They graduate, but many can't read, can't do simple math, and certainly can't communicate well enough to get good jobs to lift themselves out of poverty.

Again, VOUCHERS HELP THE POOR!

It's easy to determine who works hard and who doesn't. If you are smart and do the work, you'll get a grade based on your work. A, B, C, D, or F. It doesn't recognize your bank account, just how well you master the material and the work you put in to do it. To take that away just seems unamerican. Yes we all know that money talks, but Education shouldn't be affected by how much money you make but how hard you work. I just feel that some pushing this Charter School/School Vouchers agenda is ultimately trying to get to that point where only richer families get the true opportunities and if you aren't born into that, you will have a poor quality of life regardless of how hard you work.

But if your kid's school looks more like a prison, and your kid can't get the teacher's attention because they are busy dealing with the problem kids, and the money for your kid's textbooks got siphoned into paying for a new assistant vice principal for LGBT discipline...your kid won't be able to perform their best.

Giving parent's choices, by giving them vouchers, is not "taking anything away", and it certainly is not "unAmerican".

You already see this mentality in some parts of the inner city and this leads to people committing crimes to "get money" because they don't believe that if you truly work hard in this country, you will be successful. All they see is failure around them and people looking down on them. So they don't care about our society and our rules. We have to invest seriously into the philosophy that ALL citizens should have the right to a quality education. I don't think private schools are the solution.

So what is your solution, because the public schools are, all too often, utterly failing the students. The mentality you describe above, like you said, is mostly found in the "inner city" where the public schools are typically the worse. If you don't agree with vouchers, then what is your solution?