What is our obligation to the poor?

I agree. People have to hit Rick bottom before they are willing to change. Government removes the bottom so people can continue their bad behavior. A charity isn't going to give a bad person free money indefinitely. There's some accountability when you turn to a charity.

Now if only charities didn't keep 85% of the money they take in maybe we could make a dent
It's probably religions fault, right?
They're just as guilty. Instead of helping the poor my church purchased a new Bell. That Bell will be used to cattle in more sheep to give and maybe that will lead to more good works and less fund raising.

I've been to many different churches/synagogue/mosque/house of prayer and they never talk about helping the poor. I'm sure they do it but that's just a side thing they do. Certainly not a priority.

They'll say,"you aren't supposed to brag" That's Jew for I didn't donate. I translated that from the old testament
Churches are a part of the solution. The order of the solution goes like this: family, friends, churches, communities, state, federal.

How are you categorizing "Churches" that receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Which "Churches" receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Then there is the Jewish United Fund (or the United Jewish Communities-I can't remember) and the Lutheran Social Services. Those three receive 2/3 of their funding from the government.

Like here:
The President and Vice President Speak at the Easter Prayer Breakfast

Initiated under Clinton (PRWORA), expanded under Bush II, expanded again under Obama.
 
It's probably religions fault, right?
They're just as guilty. Instead of helping the poor my church purchased a new Bell. That Bell will be used to cattle in more sheep to give and maybe that will lead to more good works and less fund raising.

I've been to many different churches/synagogue/mosque/house of prayer and they never talk about helping the poor. I'm sure they do it but that's just a side thing they do. Certainly not a priority.

They'll say,"you aren't supposed to brag" That's Jew for I didn't donate. I translated that from the old testament
Churches are a part of the solution. The order of the solution goes like this: family, friends, churches, communities, state, federal.

How are you categorizing "Churches" that receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Which "Churches" receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Then there is the Jewish United Fund (or the United Jewish Communities-I can't remember) and the Lutheran Social Services. Those three receive 2/3 of their funding from the government.

Like here:
The President and Vice President Speak at the Easter Prayer Breakfast

Initiated under Clinton (PRWORA), expanded under Bush II, expanded again under Obama.
Subsidiarity
 
They're just as guilty. Instead of helping the poor my church purchased a new Bell. That Bell will be used to cattle in more sheep to give and maybe that will lead to more good works and less fund raising.

I've been to many different churches/synagogue/mosque/house of prayer and they never talk about helping the poor. I'm sure they do it but that's just a side thing they do. Certainly not a priority.

They'll say,"you aren't supposed to brag" That's Jew for I didn't donate. I translated that from the old testament
Churches are a part of the solution. The order of the solution goes like this: family, friends, churches, communities, state, federal.

How are you categorizing "Churches" that receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Which "Churches" receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Then there is the Jewish United Fund (or the United Jewish Communities-I can't remember) and the Lutheran Social Services. Those three receive 2/3 of their funding from the government.

Like here:
The President and Vice President Speak at the Easter Prayer Breakfast

Initiated under Clinton (PRWORA), expanded under Bush II, expanded again under Obama.
Subsidiarity

They are "charities". The vast majority of religious affiliated "charities" receive funding at the local, state and federal level. That's why there is always an argument of whether to accept that money at all in order to have full control.

For example, church run daycare. There are some that present big problems. One in particular had 15 kids (including infants) to one daycare staff member starting at 6 AM. There were open bottles of bleach in the restroom. There were staff members coming forward and saying this is a dangerous situation. The daycare received over $20,000 in government funds that year but did not want to comply with the standards. The same standards every other daycare has to comply with. The way this played out in the media was that the government was imposing on religious freedom.

Another example is insurance, contraceptives and a religiously affiliated hospital. Now, religiously affiliated hospitals have been given government funds since either 1946 or 1948. I can't remember off the top of my head. The funny part is that they don't pay property taxes based on the amount of "charity" they allegedly do.
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
 
It's probably religions fault, right?
They're just as guilty. Instead of helping the poor my church purchased a new Bell. That Bell will be used to cattle in more sheep to give and maybe that will lead to more good works and less fund raising.

I've been to many different churches/synagogue/mosque/house of prayer and they never talk about helping the poor. I'm sure they do it but that's just a side thing they do. Certainly not a priority.

They'll say,"you aren't supposed to brag" That's Jew for I didn't donate. I translated that from the old testament
Churches are a part of the solution. The order of the solution goes like this: family, friends, churches, communities, state, federal.

How are you categorizing "Churches" that receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Which "Churches" receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Then there is the Jewish United Fund (or the United Jewish Communities-I can't remember) and the Lutheran Social Services. Those three receive 2/3 of their funding from the government.

Like here:
The President and Vice President Speak at the Easter Prayer Breakfast

Initiated under Clinton (PRWORA), expanded under Bush II, expanded again under Obama.
"“A lot of the charity is distributing food, running homeless shelters, most things considered charitable,” said Mr. Lenkowsky. “So what we’re not talking about is federal money being paid for priests and religious activities.”

Fifty-seven government agencies are now contracting with the Catholic Church. If the church were a state, its $1.6 billion in funding would rank it about 43rd out of the 50 states in total federal funding, according to analysis by Adam Andrzejewski, founder of OpenTheBooks.com. The majority of those funds are dedicated to refugee services and rehabilitation."

Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012
 
Credo Crisis: Craftsmanship

We could support the Salvation Army more, that's relatively easy to do and helpful.

We could also teach our kids more about the value of money, and maybe film-makers will make more and more thrillfest films with substantive messages about values.

Comic books, for example, speak to social anxieties about civilization maladies (in civics, social cohesion, domestic values, etc.) with outlandish stories about passionate vigilantes (marketed to youngsters mostly). We could look for films and arts media that address social justice themes to better enhance 'egalitarian education.'

Hey maybe 'loud and eerie' are good for democracy...

====

CAPTAIN AMERICA: Why are you cynical about Burger King?
RED SKULL: Capitalism breeds 'convenience consumerism' and gluttony!
CAPTAIN AMERICA: Do you endorse anti-American terrorism?
RED SKULL: Americans are drunk on complacency and arrogance.
CAPTAIN AMERICA: What about the Salvation Army?
RED SKULL: Patience is for the gullible!
CAPTAIN AMERICA: I defend every man's right to the 'American Dream.'
RED SKULL: There are too many frustrated ethnic minorities in America.
CAPTAIN AMERICA: Terrorism is not the solution to inequality!
RED SKULL: I will raise an army of sentinels to destroy all U.S. banks.

====


cartoon.jpg
 
They're just as guilty. Instead of helping the poor my church purchased a new Bell. That Bell will be used to cattle in more sheep to give and maybe that will lead to more good works and less fund raising.

I've been to many different churches/synagogue/mosque/house of prayer and they never talk about helping the poor. I'm sure they do it but that's just a side thing they do. Certainly not a priority.

They'll say,"you aren't supposed to brag" That's Jew for I didn't donate. I translated that from the old testament
Churches are a part of the solution. The order of the solution goes like this: family, friends, churches, communities, state, federal.

How are you categorizing "Churches" that receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Which "Churches" receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Then there is the Jewish United Fund (or the United Jewish Communities-I can't remember) and the Lutheran Social Services. Those three receive 2/3 of their funding from the government.

Like here:
The President and Vice President Speak at the Easter Prayer Breakfast

Initiated under Clinton (PRWORA), expanded under Bush II, expanded again under Obama.
"“A lot of the charity is distributing food, running homeless shelters, most things considered charitable,” said Mr. Lenkowsky. “So what we’re not talking about is federal money being paid for priests and religious activities.”

Fifty-seven government agencies are now contracting with the Catholic Church. If the church were a state, its $1.6 billion in funding would rank it about 43rd out of the 50 states in total federal funding, according to analysis by Adam Andrzejewski, founder of OpenTheBooks.com. The majority of those funds are dedicated to refugee services and rehabilitation."

Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Yep. And there is a fine line.
 
Churches are a part of the solution. The order of the solution goes like this: family, friends, churches, communities, state, federal.

How are you categorizing "Churches" that receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Which "Churches" receive federal funding for their "charities"?
Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Then there is the Jewish United Fund (or the United Jewish Communities-I can't remember) and the Lutheran Social Services. Those three receive 2/3 of their funding from the government.

Like here:
The President and Vice President Speak at the Easter Prayer Breakfast

Initiated under Clinton (PRWORA), expanded under Bush II, expanded again under Obama.
"“A lot of the charity is distributing food, running homeless shelters, most things considered charitable,” said Mr. Lenkowsky. “So what we’re not talking about is federal money being paid for priests and religious activities.”

Fifty-seven government agencies are now contracting with the Catholic Church. If the church were a state, its $1.6 billion in funding would rank it about 43rd out of the 50 states in total federal funding, according to analysis by Adam Andrzejewski, founder of OpenTheBooks.com. The majority of those funds are dedicated to refugee services and rehabilitation."

Catholic Church collects $1.6 billion in U.S. contracts, grants since 2012

Yep. And there is a fine line.
Agreed. There almost always is.
 
Credo Crisis: Craftsmanship

We could support the Salvation Army more, that's relatively easy to do and helpful.

We could also teach our kids more about the value of money, and maybe film-makers will make more and more thrillfest films with substantive messages about values.

Comic books, for example, speak to social anxieties about civilization maladies (in civics, social cohesion, domestic values, etc.) with outlandish stories about passionate vigilantes (marketed to youngsters mostly). We could look for films and arts media that address social justice themes to better enhance 'egalitarian education.'

Hey maybe 'loud and eerie' are good for democracy...

====

CAPTAIN AMERICA: Why are you cynical about Burger King?
RED SKULL: Capitalism breeds 'convenience consumerism' and gluttony!
CAPTAIN AMERICA: Do you endorse anti-American terrorism?
RED SKULL: Americans are drunk on complacency and arrogance.
CAPTAIN AMERICA: What about the Salvation Army?
RED SKULL: Patience is for the gullible!
CAPTAIN AMERICA: I defend every man's right to the 'American Dream.'
RED SKULL: There are too many frustrated ethnic minorities in America.
CAPTAIN AMERICA: Terrorism is not the solution to inequality!
RED SKULL: I will raise an army of sentinels to destroy all U.S. banks.

====


View attachment 105040
I liked this one. God does love a good conflict and confusion process.
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.

"Forced" obedience is not True Love for Any God, either; and, we have more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God.

So, what is your actual point?
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.

"Forced" obedience is not True Love for Any God, either; and, we have more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God.

So, what is your actual point?
Yes, and forcing someone to be virtuous does not make them virtuous. My point was that your initial comment is something the founder of socialism would have said and that socialism is evil. What is your point about having more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God? Because I don't see God forcing us to follow His "more than Ten religious Commandments," but I do see you suggesting that we should force the rich to be charitable.
 
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.

"Forced" obedience is not True Love for Any God, either; and, we have more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God.

So, what is your actual point?
Yes, and forcing someone to be virtuous does not make them virtuous. My point was that your initial comment is something the founder of socialism would have said and that socialism is evil. What is your point about having more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God? Because I don't see God forcing us to follow His "more than Ten religious Commandments," but I do see you suggesting that we should force the rich to be charitable.
Both terms, promote and provide are in our social Contract and federal Constitution regarding the general welfare. Socialism starts with a social Contract. Are you not glad, our Founding Fathers did such an excellent job.
 
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.

"Forced" obedience is not True Love for Any God, either; and, we have more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God.

So, what is your actual point?
Yes, and forcing someone to be virtuous does not make them virtuous. My point was that your initial comment is something the founder of socialism would have said and that socialism is evil. What is your point about having more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God? Because I don't see God forcing us to follow His "more than Ten religious Commandments," but I do see you suggesting that we should force the rich to be charitable.
Both terms, promote and provide are in our social Contract and federal Constitution regarding the general welfare. Socialism starts with a social Contract. Are you not glad, our Founding Fathers did such an excellent job.
Are you a socialist?
 
I'm the financial clerk for my church.
I handle thousand's of dollars every week
I'm amazed at how much is given to the poor each week.
I'm also responsible for helping church members pay their bills that are seeking help.
My church has a great system.
Myself and other church leaders don't receive a single dime for our services.
 
Ive been thinking about it this morning and I was wondering what our obligation to the poor is. Im not talking about what we should outsource to the government or what the government should do. But what do we as individuals have a responsibility to do?

I keep thinking of the words of a hymn:

"We'll go to the poor like our Captain of old. And visit the weary, the hungry, and cold. We'll cheer up their hearts with the news that he bore and point them to Zion and life evermore."

I believe we as individuals have a duty and privilege to serve the poor. And that when we try to outsource those responsibilities to the government and to others, than we fail to give and recieve the blessings we could otherwise have.

What do you think?

King Benjamin (Mosiah 4, Book of Mormon) would applaud the searchings of your heart but disagree with your "outsourcing" comment. He would tell you that private and public efforts are mandatory, of course. I would think that we would take care of the weary, the infirm, the children and infants, mothers with children, train the non-taxpayer into becoming taxpayers. When we fail to use appropriate outsource opportunities, we deny blessings to those in need but to ourselves as well.
One problem here. You don't have the authority to interpret what king Benjamin said.
 
I think we should solve simple poverty by taxing the rich into Heaven.
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.

"Forced" obedience is not True Love for Any God, either; and, we have more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God.

So, what is your actual point?
Yes, and forcing someone to be virtuous does not make them virtuous.
Actually, it does.
Read Maimonides.
However, our system of taxation is not rational.
 
Karl Marx felt the exact same way.
He must have been influenced by Jesus the Christ and His teachings.

The problem is, socialism requires social morals for free.

We have more than Ten social or religious Commandments.
Forced charity is not charity. Socialism has and will always be a reaction. It dismisses its defeats and ignores its inconcruieties. It is a subversive and deceptive ideology that destroys the spirit of man.

"Forced" obedience is not True Love for Any God, either; and, we have more than Ten religious Commandments, from a God.

So, what is your actual point?
Yes, and forcing someone to be virtuous does not make them virtuous.
Actually, it does.
Read Maimonides.
However, our system of taxation is not rational.
If I say the secret word do I win a hundred dollars?
 

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