What is "debate"? An FYI

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Si modo, Jul 30, 2012.

  1. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Moderate to me doesn't mean strong opinions though. Most people who claim to be moderates tend to be wishy washy and quite 'flexible' (i.e. opportunisiticly dishonest) in the stances they take on things. What you guys (Underhill and Circe) are talking about is holding convictions about things that don't easily fit into the partisan mold. That is a very different thing than being 'moderate' which is too often taking the side that is the most advantageous and not really giving a damn about whether it is the most defensable point of view.

    If you mean you refuse to be identified as partisan, then I too am a moderate. I get equally pissed at either side when I think they're wrong. And I will defend the one who I think makes the most sense or who I think is being accused wrongly regardless of whether he or she has a "D" or "R" or "L" or "I" after his/her name. I am non partisan though. Not moderate. :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2013
  2. Circe
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    Circe Silver Member

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    Okay, I think you are right. I haven't been satisfied with the term "moderate" for some time -- I don't FEEL moderate. :razz: I think I'll switch to non-partisan like you call it.

    The Economist years ago begged Americans to stop saying "liberal" and "conservative" and just say left and right because in England liberal often means the exact opposite of what it means here -- it's a term that has become very confused, for sure. I thought they were correct and have said left and right instead ever since!
     
  3. Underhill
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    Underhill Active Member

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    I think you have that backward.

    The true definition of a moderate is much closer to what I described. But many attempt to portray us as the latter in an attempt to reinforce their party loyalty.

    The definition for the noun in Websters is: A person who holds moderate views, esp. in politics.
     
  4. Billo_Really
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    Billo_Really Litre of the Band

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    Once the person making the claim has met his obligation (to the burden of proof) by providing corroborative citations or evidence, the "burden of proof" now shifts to the "objector" of that claim, to prove their objection has merit and is not frivolous.

    Simply objecting to a claim without any reason to believe it was false, is not a valid rebuttal.
     
  5. PaulS1950
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    PaulS1950 Senior Member

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    I really don't know what to call myself, you decide:

    I am a fiscal conservative. I spend my money carefully and I expect the government to do the same.
    I am a moral liberal (also known as a government interference conservative). I believe that folks ought to be allowed to do what they want as long as it doesn't intrude on the rights and privilages of others or hurt anyone. I believe that people ought to take responsibility for their own lives.
    I agree that having the same rights for GLBT folks as for the vanilla folks (like me) is only right. I don't believe the government should be given the power of life and death - certainly not where the life of an unborn child is concerned.
    I am an "anti-federalist". I believe the central government of America has proven that no body of politicians can be trusted to hold the rights of the governed over their own selfish interests. I also believe that this extends to the state level as well.
    I believe that the constitution is as valid today as it was when it was first written, and that it should be enforced and protected.

    So, what am I?
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2013
  6. Underhill
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    Underhill Active Member

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    A Ron Paul fan? :)
     
  7. Circe
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    Circe Silver Member

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    I think you are a Libertarian, mostly....I'm not sure about the abortion stance, unless you mean exactly what you said, that the government should not be in the business of requiring women to abort, as they too often do in China, one reads. If that is just code for wanting laws against women's right to decide, that would not be Libertarian, obviously. Otherwise it's a fairly consistent Libertarian posture, I would say.
     
  8. PaulS1950
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    PaulS1950 Senior Member

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    My stance on abortion is a major conflict, albeit an internal conflict. I am a minister and have my own belief (faith) of when a human life is formed but I am not limited to thinking that my morality should extend to others. Since the mother, and father in some circumstances, are the only two people who can know all the details of the decision it must be left to her or them.

    I do not exclude the father because sometimes the father wants the child when the mother can't afford it - obviously not in a marrital situation - and the father has to have some say in the decision. I firmly believe however that the mother has the final word in most all abortions.

    A Libertarian, you say.... Ok, I can accept that. I will have to study their platform and get involved if it fits as well as you two seem to think.
     
  9. Circe
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    Circe Silver Member

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    Is this "clean debate" forum actually being moderated, monitored?

    I'm getting neg-repping, insults, name-calling by the usual types --- what's the point of having such a forum if it's as bad as the other forums?
     
  10. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    If you have been neg repped in the CDZ, you should report the neg rep as that is clearly a violation of the rules for this forum. You will see the little red thingee that is the report button in the upper righthand corner of the notice you got of the rep. In the box for reason you're reporting the neg rep, just type in something like you received this in the CDZ.
     
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