Was 9/11 a success?

Just a guy

Member
Feb 6, 2006
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- Throughout this post no one needs to think their or their nations behaviuor is in question -

The enemy.
Not even the definition of a terrorist is crystal clear, but we can assume terrorists are humans with not too low intelligence. They are highly motivated and they don't fear the use of violence. We can also assume that their actions aren't executed for fun. They want something.

His goals
What was the cause the terrorists pursued that day?
What could they possibly win from that action?

I know some people don't care about the reasons. They want revenge. If you are one of them, continue reading anyway.

The not so bright enemy.
If those terrorist where just acting upon hate and their sole purpose was to kill as many American citizens as possible, this whole matter was over in a second. The terrorists died and they probably succeeded (even if they surely hoped for a higher death toll).

A rather clever enemy.
But we know they had an organisation behind them, don't we? That leaves us with terrorist not ready to die but to live and continue their ambition. Deceptive as they are and unclear with their ambition we started a war against what we belive lies within their intrest. Maybe they didn't expect that. Maybe this war is going the right way and the terrorists are actually loosing.

A very intelligent enemy.
Or maybe they were smarter than that. They sure know their enemy better than we know ours. We only see him manifesting himself when he wishes.

What could he have gained by 9/11?
Iraq
Maybe the terrorist like what is happening in Iraq. Maybe they know that in due time they will have a much more controllable country to act within. (I do believe they are muslims and that they can be absorbed much easier in a muslim society).

Tension in the west
Maybe the terrorist like how the west are unable to coordinate and get together over things that are in their mutual intrest? U.S.A., U.N. and Europe cooperates badly. Mistrust spreads. Europe fails to support U.S.A. in Iraq. Some nations actually takes opportunity to act against U.S. interests elsewhere for some short sighted goals. From U.S. point of view there is a feeling of betrayal. Betrayed both by U.N. and Europe. Europe by turn can only watch when the only superpower on earth gets in to action. More fear and uncertainty is poured into this now open wound. Whatever cause these terrorists might have it is probably safe to say that an alienation between Europe and U.S.A. suits them just fine. And the destruction of U.N. too.

Growing feelings of hatred and expressions of voilence might further darken the clouds around what is actually happening. How could the publication of cartoons set half of the mid-east in flames? How could this little thing escalate to an international level? Why did the debate of free spech suddenly start flaming between countries of the west? We share the same ideology but we managed to argue over a minute detail in how we adress those rights, meanwhile the instigators must be laughing. They probably don't accept free speech at all.​

My little worry here - and the reason for posting - is that maybe we all are playing their game the way they want us to. So what would be the least expected move from the west? What would shock the terrorist most and force them out in the open?

Someone with more strategy thinking to him than me might have an idea, - please post.


Was 9/11 a success?
 
911 was not the beginning of the assault on the West. Several attacks and threats were carried out long before 911. It just took a more personal attack on the West to wake up the American people. Radical Islam (The religion of peace :cuckoo: ) has been trying to forcefully submit it will on the world for centuries. It all happen before and it will all happen again. Call it a battle of prevailing cultures or religion or ideology. The results will be the same. At the end of the war, the Crusader shall be victorious. :tank:
 
Just a guy said:
- Throughout this post no one needs to think their or their nations behaviuor is in question -

The enemy.
Not even the definition of a terrorist is crystal clear, but we can assume terrorists are humans with not too low intelligence. They are highly motivated and they don't fear the use of violence. We can also assume that their actions aren't executed for fun. They want something.

His goals
What was the cause the terrorists pursued that day?
What could they possibly win from that action?

I know some people don't care about the reasons. They want revenge. If you are one of them, continue reading anyway.

The not so bright enemy.
If those terrorist where just acting upon hate and their sole purpose was to kill as many American citizens as possible, this whole matter was over in a second. The terrorists died and they probably succeeded (even if they surely hoped for a higher death toll).

A rather clever enemy.
But we know they had an organisation behind them, don't we? That leaves us with terrorist not ready to die but to live and continue their ambition. Deceptive as they are and unclear with their ambition we started a war against what we belive lies within their intrest. Maybe they didn't expect that. Maybe this war is going the right way and the terrorists are actually loosing.

A very intelligent enemy.
Or maybe they were smarter than that. They sure know their enemy better than we know ours. We only see him manifesting himself when he wishes.

What could he have gained by 9/11?
Iraq
Maybe the terrorist like what is happening in Iraq. Maybe they know that in due time they will have a much more controllable country to act within. (I do believe they are muslims and that they can be absorbed much easier in a muslim society).

Tension in the west
Maybe the terrorist like how the west are unable to coordinate and get together over things that are in their mutual intrest? U.S.A., U.N. and Europe cooperates badly. Mistrust spreads. Europe fails to support U.S.A. in Iraq. Some nations actually takes opportunity to act against U.S. interests elsewhere for some short sighted goals. From U.S. point of view there is a feeling of betrayal. Betrayed both by U.N. and Europe. Europe by turn can only watch when the only superpower on earth gets in to action. More fear and uncertainty is poured into this now open wound. Whatever cause these terrorists might have it is probably safe to say that an alienation between Europe and U.S.A. suits them just fine. And the destruction of U.N. too.

Growing feelings of hatred and expressions of voilence might further darken the clouds around what is actually happening. How could the publication of cartoons set half of the mid-east in flames? How could this little thing escalate to an international level? Why did the debate of free spech suddenly start flaming between countries of the west? We share the same ideology but we managed to argue over a minute detail in how we adress those rights, meanwhile the instigators must be laughing. They probably don't accept free speech at all.​

My little worry here - and the reason for posting - is that maybe we all are playing their game the way they want us to. So what would be the least expected move from the west? What would shock the terrorist most and force them out in the open?

Someone with more strategy thinking to him than me might have an idea, - please post.


Was 9/11 a success?

Yes--9/11 was intended to cause fear and financial damage to the US. It worked.
 
shepherdboy said:
911 was not the beginning of the assault on the West. Several attacks and threats were carried out long before 911. It just took a more personal attack on the West to wake up the American people. Radical Islam (The religion of peace :cuckoo: ) has been trying to forcefully submit it will on the world for centuries. It all happen before and it will all happen again. Call it a battle of prevailing cultures or religion or ideology. The results will be the same. At the end of the war, the Crusader shall be victorious. :tank:

How do you assess this enemys intelligence? I mean, did he provoke until he got the desired response from America (thus being within his initial plan), or did he think he could get away with it, somehow?
The enemy is not conducting in an open war, so a direct conflict can't have been a goal.
 
Just a guy said:
How do you assess this enemys intelligence? I mean, did he provoke until he got the desired response from America (thus being within his initial plan), or did he think he could get away with it, somehow?
The enemy is not conducting in an open war, so a direct conflict can't have been a goal.


Why not---induced your enemy into an open attack and fight back with using terror, world opinion, and play on your enemies' fear.
 
dilloduck said:
Why not---induced your enemy into an open attack and fight back with using terror, world opinion, and play on your enemies' fear.
The more intelligent, dillo response would have been?
 
dilloduck said:
Why not---induced your enemy into an open attack and fight back with using terror, world opinion, and play on your enemies' fear.

The light must be switched on globally. I mean as for real humans all we know about them are some names of supposed leaders. But their whole organisation is hidden well beteen the gaps between nations. I wouldn't know if a terrorist lived in my area. I might even be paying for his staying here while he bides his time.
 
Just a guy said:
The light must be switched on globally. I mean as for real humans all we know about them are some names of supposed leaders. But their whole organisation is hidden well beteen the gaps between nations. I wouldn't know if a terrorist lived in my area. I might even be paying for his staying here while he bides his time.

well by all means--turn on the light and watch who you trust.
 
dilloduck said:
well by all means--turn on the light and watch who you trust.

And how to expose them? We see fuirous people storming embassies over cartoons. Are they the masters behind this? Or tid 911 (and the prior events)just lead up to this and made it run by itself? Is ot now Christians against muslims, - period? Is there no head to the snake?
 
Just a guy said:
And how to expose them? We see fuirous people storming embassies over cartoons. Are they the masters behind this? Or tid 911 (and the prior events)just lead up to this and made it run by itself? Is ot now Christians against muslims, - period? Is there no head to the snake?
NO.
 
Objectively yes it was a success. The enemy's goal was to hijak a number of planes and kill alot of people. Went off without a hitch for the most part.
 
Just a guy said:
- Throughout this post no one needs to think their or their nations behaviuor is in question -

The enemy.
Not even the definition of a terrorist is crystal clear, but we can assume terrorists are humans with not too low intelligence. They are highly motivated and they don't fear the use of violence. We can also assume that their actions aren't executed for fun. They want something.

His goals
What was the cause the terrorists pursued that day?
What could they possibly win from that action?

I know some people don't care about the reasons. They want revenge. If you are one of them, continue reading anyway.

The not so bright enemy.
If those terrorist where just acting upon hate and their sole purpose was to kill as many American citizens as possible, this whole matter was over in a second. The terrorists died and they probably succeeded (even if they surely hoped for a higher death toll).

A rather clever enemy.
But we know they had an organisation behind them, don't we? That leaves us with terrorist not ready to die but to live and continue their ambition. Deceptive as they are and unclear with their ambition we started a war against what we belive lies within their intrest. Maybe they didn't expect that. Maybe this war is going the right way and the terrorists are actually loosing.

A very intelligent enemy.
Or maybe they were smarter than that. They sure know their enemy better than we know ours. We only see him manifesting himself when he wishes.

What could he have gained by 9/11?
Iraq
Maybe the terrorist like what is happening in Iraq. Maybe they know that in due time they will have a much more controllable country to act within. (I do believe they are muslims and that they can be absorbed much easier in a muslim society).

Tension in the west
Maybe the terrorist like how the west are unable to coordinate and get together over things that are in their mutual intrest? U.S.A., U.N. and Europe cooperates badly. Mistrust spreads. Europe fails to support U.S.A. in Iraq. Some nations actually takes opportunity to act against U.S. interests elsewhere for some short sighted goals. From U.S. point of view there is a feeling of betrayal. Betrayed both by U.N. and Europe. Europe by turn can only watch when the only superpower on earth gets in to action. More fear and uncertainty is poured into this now open wound. Whatever cause these terrorists might have it is probably safe to say that an alienation between Europe and U.S.A. suits them just fine. And the destruction of U.N. too.

Growing feelings of hatred and expressions of voilence might further darken the clouds around what is actually happening. How could the publication of cartoons set half of the mid-east in flames? How could this little thing escalate to an international level? Why did the debate of free spech suddenly start flaming between countries of the west? We share the same ideology but we managed to argue over a minute detail in how we adress those rights, meanwhile the instigators must be laughing. They probably don't accept free speech at all.​

My little worry here - and the reason for posting - is that maybe we all are playing their game the way they want us to. So what would be the least expected move from the west? What would shock the terrorist most and force them out in the open?

Someone with more strategy thinking to him than me might have an idea, - please post.


Was 9/11 a success?

First, I disagree with the premise that the enemy is intelligent. They are too blinded by religious fanaticism to be intelligent. Intelligent would have been to attack strategically vital targets that would cause the most damage to people and property. Yet what did they attack?

Symbols. Symbols of America's might. WTC -- symbol of US financial strength. Pentagon -- symbol of US military strength. Allegedly the plane that went down in PA was heading for the White House -- symbol of the most powerful man on Earth.

Strategic value -- minimal.

Sure, 9/11 scared people. I think it pissed off more than it scared. Then there are those among us who achieved some form of satisfaction because while availing themselves of the freedoms and privileges of our society, they hate it too.

The most unexpected thing we could do to the terrorists is fight them on THEIR terms and knock of this "Holier than thou, we're above all that" bullshit facade.

Hunt them down like dogs and execute where found. That would be the most effective message we could send. Instead, we're playing by rules they have no intention of observing, and laugh at us for doing so.
 
GunnyL said:
First, I disagree with the premise that the enemy is intelligent. They are too blinded by religious fanaticism to be intelligent. Intelligent would have been to attack strategically vital targets that would cause the most damage to people and property. Yet what did they attack?

Symbols. Symbols of America's might. WTC -- symbol of US financial strength. Pentagon -- symbol of US military strength. Allegedly the plane that went down in PA was heading for the White House -- symbol of the most powerful man on Earth.

Strategic value -- minimal.

Sure, 9/11 scared people. I think it pissed off more than it scared. Then there are those among us who achieved some form of satisfaction because while availing themselves of the freedoms and privileges of our society, they hate it too.

The most unexpected thing we could do to the terrorists is fight them on THEIR terms and knock of this "Holier than thou, we're above all that" bullshit facade.

Hunt them down like dogs and execute where found. That would be the most effective message we could send. Instead, we're playing by rules they have no intention of observing, and laugh at us for doing so.

Yes, I've changed my mind a bit. The enemy wasn't smart, he was merley hating. I think I've overestimated the enemy in the long run, the war is probably going quite well acctually, terrorist are hunted.
 
Just a guy said:
Yes, I've changed my mind a bit. The enemy wasn't smart, he was merley hating. I think I've overestimated the enemy in the long run, the war is probably going quite well acctually, terrorist are hunted.

If this was sincere, not sarcastice, perhaps I've underestimated you. :beer:
 
Tactically 9/11 was huge success. The team accomplished it's mission, with the exception of the plane that crashed in Pennsylvania. Overall though, three out of four is considered to be successful.

Strategically, 9/11 was a disaster for Al Qaeda. As a result, they lost their best training base as well as numerous fighters who were killed in the US invasion. They have also had the problem of trying to top the 9/11 success, as they always have to increase the mayhem with their next attack.
 
Doc Holiday said:
Tactically 9/11 was huge success. The team accomplished it's mission, with the exception of the plane that crashed in Pennsylvania. Overall though, three out of four is considered to be successful.

Strategically, 9/11 was a disaster for Al Qaeda. As a result, they lost their best training base as well as numerous fighters who were killed in the US invasion. They have also had the problem of trying to top the 9/11 success, as they always have to increase the mayhem with their next attack.

Only thing 9/11 may have failed at was driving a wedge between Saudi Arabia and the US. Bin Laden hand picked Saudis' for the mission.
 

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