Vermont governor abandons single-payer health care plan

[Where_r_my_Keys]

"Calling it the biggest disappointment of his career, Gov. Peter Shumlin said Wednesday he was abandoning plans to make Vermont the first state in the country with a universal, publicly funded health care system.

Going forward with a project four years in the making would require tax increases too big for the state to absorb, Shumlin said. The measure had been the centerpiece of the Democratic governor's agenda and was watched and rooted for by single-payer health care supporters around the country."

Politics Vermont s liberal governor abandons single-payer plan because state couldn t handle the taxes Best of Cain

 

[g5000]

That has GOT to hurt.

It would require a sudden massive increase in taxes, instead of the usual incrementalism which has been more successfully employed by our politicians.

 

[Where_r_my_Keys]

That has GOT to hurt.

It would require a sudden massive increase in taxes, instead of the usual incrementalism which has been more successfully employed by our politicians.

What is more amazing than anything else, is that a leftist FINALLY figured out that their idea SUCKED ... BEFORE they made it public policy... .

To the best of my knowledge, it is the first time in human history that it's ever happened.

 

[Pogo]

There are at least two threads on this already.

Guess the corporate bootlickers are just going with the one-a-day routine.

 

[Listening]

Yup, Listening, you got your ass kicked in yet another of your own threads (not even bigreb, PC, or caligirl had as good a records as you) so you try to deflect with Omaha. Not to worry, he got it even worse than you have here.

We were talking about Vermont, and you got beat down.

Then you got beat down on health care cost.

You are going to get beat down on ACA next here.

You will have a negative Trifecta here.

Way to go, girl.

Sorry Jakey (Absent From Omaha.....),

Nobody cares what you say.

Including me.

You don't have the balls to stand behind anything you say.

You won't meet me in the bullring.

You've had your ass handed to you so many times I've lost count.

My guess is that you enjoy being called one of the top three disrespected posters on the board.

It's good to know that even a coward like you can get some sleep at night.

 

[JakeStarkey]

No one ever has much support for you.

Why? The Ls of course: you are a loser and laughable.

 

[Listening]

No one ever has much support for you.

Why? The Ls of course: you are a loser and laughable.

I started this thread and there was some good information being shared.

My point in posting was made clear in the OP.

You show up and argue against vapor (i.e. you make stuff up).

Once you show up in a thread, I notice people quit posting to it.

You are much like a rather disgusting fart.

You drive people away.

I'll bet you're proud of that.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

I said four years ago when they passed this shit it would never get implemented. If Vermont can't afford it how the hell are we supposed to do it nationwide?

It fails in Massachusetts as well since it was implemented in 2006, with reports of half of family practices not accepting new patients. It doesn't end there as bogged down wait times are an increasing problem.

Boston has a much higher ratio of physicals to population over any other metropolitan area in that state, yet patients had to wait 66 days to see a family physician. The system hasn't been able to bring down costs of health care premiums, and hasn't saved the state's budget on health care costs as they hoped it would. Yes there may only still be 3% uninsured in the state, but that's if you can get the quality of care you need in time, and in a lot of cases you don't get to keep the doctor you originally wanted. Quality of care is simply not there anymore, and it hasn't solved the major problems it was promised to perform.

Massachusetts shows where Obamacare is headed - Opinion - The Boston Globe

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

I know facts are not your thing, Listening, but since your arguments never work, you might try them.

Oh the irony behind that post is just too much.

 

[MaxGrit]

No one ever has much support for you.

Why? The Ls of course: you are a loser and laughable.

I started this thread and there was some good information being shared.

My point in posting was made clear in the OP.

You show up and argue against vapor (i.e. you make stuff up).

Once you show up in a thread, I notice people quit posting to it.

You are much like a rather disgusting fart.

You drive people away.

I'll bet you're proud of that.

Libtards are nasty.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

This may help your lack of knowledge, Listening.

US Health Care Inflation Rate - YCharts
US Health Care Inflation Rate
...

Personally, I say go through with it. Implement the additional taxes Shumlin has cited and let Vermonters get exactly what they asked for and maybe they'll finally come to an understanding of how badly the far left wants to ruin their lives. They're one of the most Democratic states in the country so why shield them from their poor voting decisions.

Seems like a heavily biased argument, donut?

Has Canada ruined its citizens' lives? Or for that matter has most of the rest of the world?

Kinda speaks volumes when one's reaction to a new idea boils down to "will never work". Sorry, I think I prefer construction and tweaking to destruction and gainsaying.

What does the overall cost for Canada's health care system mean for it's citizens?

A typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for public health care insurance.

The average family of two parents with one child that bill would be $10,989

For the average family of two adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381

As a result of lower average incomes and differences in taxation, the bills are smaller for the average unattached individual ($3,780)

For the average one-parent-one-child family ($3,905)

and the average one-parent two-child family ($3,387). But no matter the family type, the bill is not small.

This is the overall cost burden just to HAVE health care coverage in Canada. Yet this is what a successful health care alternative looks like among the left.



Source:
Free Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It s Worth Nadeem Esmail

 

[JakeStarkey]

No one ever has much support for you.

Why? The Ls of course: you are a loser and laughable.

I started this thread and there was some good information being shared. My point in posting was made clear in the OP. You show up and argue against vapor (i.e. you make stuff up). Once you show up in a thread, I notice people quit posting to it. You are much like a rather disgusting fart. You drive people away. I'll bet you're proud of that.

You made stuff up, L: the governor delayed not abandoned the program, as your OP says.

Tell the truth, you have no trouble from me.

If people who want to lie feel they have to leave because they called out on lies, tough.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Oh the irony behind that post is just too much.

This from Shakles Factless.

 

[Listening]

I know facts are not your thing, Listening, but since your arguments never work, you might try them.

Oh the irony behind that post is just too much.

It took me five minutes to stop laughing.

 

[Listening]

I said four years ago when they passed this shit it would never get implemented. If Vermont can't afford it how the hell are we supposed to do it nationwide?

It fails in Massachusetts as well since it was implemented in 2006, with reports of half of family practices not accepting new patients. It doesn't end there as bogged down wait times are an increasing problem.

Boston has a much higher ratio of physicals to population over any other metropolitan area in that state, yet patients had to wait 66 days to see a family physician. The system hasn't been able to bring down costs of health care premiums, and hasn't saved the state's budget on health care costs as they hoped it would. Yes there may only still be 3% uninsured in the state, but that's if you can get the quality of care you need in time, and in a lot of cases you don't get to keep the doctor you originally wanted. Quality of care is simply not there anymore, and it hasn't solved the major problems it was promised to perform.

Massachusetts shows where Obamacare is headed - Opinion - The Boston Globe

Once again, we have a system in the works.

As I mentioned....Tenncare underwent some pretty radical changes in it's evolution. In the end, they wound up trimming a lot of people off the roles.

But my point is that we should be able to get numbers. We should be able to analyze things like costs, total spending, all that. It almost seems like NOBODY really wants the data because of what it says.

One big problem is when you start collecting data AFTER you make a change. You have no baseline and what the data tells you is up for political grabs.

 

[JakeStarkey]

And from Shakles link above:

And from the same link, find below that universal national health care works very well. But the worst part is that things don't have to be this way. While Canadians are getting a raw deal for their health care dollars, patients in Belgium, France, Germany, Japan, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, and Switzerland receive universal access to health care without lengthy queues. Patients in Australia, Japan, Sweden, Switzerland, and France enjoy better outcomes from the health care process than Canadians from their universal access health care systems. And vitally, payers in these countries all
face a smaller bill for health care than Canadians.

That combination of superior performance for less cost comes from more pragmatic approaches to health care policy. Each of these nations' universal access health care systems every one of them has a larger role for the private sector in financing and delivery than Canada with cost sharing, private competition in the delivery of health care services, and private parallel health care and health care insurance.

Shakles and Listening, why was the above not pointed out, that the system works very well in most of the free world?

 

[Listening]

And from Shakles link above:

And from the same link, find below that universal national health care works very well. But the worst part is that things don't have to be this way. While Canadians are getting a raw deal for their health care dollars, patients in Belgium, France, Germany, Japan, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, and Switzerland receive universal access to health care without lengthy queues. Patients in Australia, Japan, Sweden, Switzerland, and France enjoy better outcomes from the health care process than Canadians from their universal access health care systems. And vitally, payers in these countries all
face a smaller bill for health care than Canadians.

That combination of superior performance for less cost comes from more pragmatic approaches to health care policy. Each of these nations' universal access health care systems every one of them has a larger role for the private sector in financing and delivery than Canada with cost sharing, private competition in the delivery of health care services, and private parallel health care and health care insurance.

Shakles and Listening, why was the above not pointed out, that the system works very well in most of the free world?

Uhhh...because he was responding to a question specific to Canada.

This thread is not about Universal Health Care.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Shakles made it so, and he failed to put matters into context, as you also fail to do.

 

[Listening]

This may help your lack of knowledge, Listening.

US Health Care Inflation Rate - YCharts
US Health Care Inflation Rate
...

Personally, I say go through with it. Implement the additional taxes Shumlin has cited and let Vermonters get exactly what they asked for and maybe they'll finally come to an understanding of how badly the far left wants to ruin their lives. They're one of the most Democratic states in the country so why shield them from their poor voting decisions.

Seems like a heavily biased argument, donut?

Has Canada ruined its citizens' lives? Or for that matter has most of the rest of the world?

Kinda speaks volumes when one's reaction to a new idea boils down to "will never work". Sorry, I think I prefer construction and tweaking to destruction and gainsaying.

What does the overall cost for Canada's health care system mean for it's citizens?

A typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for public health care insurance.

The average family of two parents with one child that bill would be $10,989

For the average family of two adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381

As a result of lower average incomes and differences in taxation, the bills are smaller for the average unattached individual ($3,780)

For the average one-parent-one-child family ($3,905)

and the average one-parent two-child family ($3,387). But no matter the family type, the bill is not small.

This is the overall cost burden just to HAVE health care coverage in Canada. Yet this is what a successful health care alternative looks like among the left.



Source:
Free Health Care in Canada Costs More Than It s Worth Nadeem Esmail

From your link.

Canadians pay a substantial amount of money for their universal health care system each year through the tax system but get a fairly poor deal in return. Reforming Canadian health care based on lessons from other, more successful, universal access health care systems is the key to solving that problem.

*******************************

Which, as I read the article (thanks for posting) brings up the basic question....what are his metrics for comparison ? That is what has always been lacking in the Obamacare debacle.

Obama would not have promised people they could keep their plans if he thought they were only GOP.

It was because about 80% of the country liked their plans (if they had them....big if).

It is easier to move the goal posts if you never plant them.

 

[ShaklesOfBigGov]

Shakles made it so, and he failed to put matters into context, as you also fail to do.

The reply was in response to the subject" of that discussion which was the Canadian health care "system. Why is it that you are the only one that had trouble following the subject at hand that you feel the need to drift off in a tangent all by yourself?