The Immigration Dilemma

[leftwinger]

Flopper, that report had a summary at the end explaining how they calculated totals. In great detail.

If you have an Anchor baby (millions do) they are not dying on the streets. They are eating, living, driving around. Henceforth, benefits are give to the Anchor baby. Funneled through the parents. Do you think they are going to let Anchor babies die on the streets because Mom and Dad can't pay $2K/mo rent in LA? come on. PLEASE! Do you think if Senior Gomez needs an operation.......with an Anchor baby. come on people. Quit drinking the kool-aid so easily.

I'm not sure what report you are referring to since you're not replying to a posting.

The one you called an "opinion piece"............I just get so tired of it.

The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on United States Taxpayers (2013)

 

[Flopper]

Flopper, that report had a summary at the end explaining how they calculated totals. In great detail.

If you have an Anchor baby (millions do) they are not dying on the streets. They are eating, living, driving around. Henceforth, benefits are give to the Anchor baby. Funneled through the parents. Do you think they are going to let Anchor babies die on the streets because Mom and Dad can't pay $2K/mo rent in LA? come on. PLEASE! Do you think if Senior Gomez needs an operation.......with an Anchor baby. come on people. Quit drinking the kool-aid so easily.

I'm not sure what report you are referring to since you're not replying to a posting.

The one you called an "opinion piece"............I just get so tired of it.

The Fiscal Burden of Illegal Immigration on United States Taxpayers (2013)


View attachment 115270

The CATO Institute, a Washington based conservative think tank found the report by FAIR anything but fair.
The FAIR report counts the costs without considering benefits. They failed to account for how much undocumented workers contribute to the economy by using the money they earn to purchase goods and services, which generate tax revenue. They are numerous other problems in the report such as using statistics that include both legal and illegal immigrants but there intention was clearly not to produced an unbiased study but rather to support their contention that all immigration is bad for America.
Fact-checking Trump’s claim that illegal immigration costs US taxpayers $113 billion annually

 

[American_Jihad]

ILLEGAL ALIEN BEHEADS MOTHER, ILLEGAL ALIEN DEPORTED 5 TIMES KILLS WOMAN
March 8, 2017

Daniel Greenfield

Are we "sanctuaried" out yet?

...

If only there were some sort of way to keep the illegals we deported from coming back... like a wall.

...

We mustn't discourage the DREAMERs by actually deporting illegal aliens. They're beheading the people Americans won't behead.


Illegal Alien Beheads Mother, Illegal Alien Deported 5 Times Kills Woman

 

[rhodescholar]

As I recall this character was led out of the courtroom disgraced and under arrest.

But what he said was absolutely true.

 

[rhodescholar]

The CATO Institute, a Washington based conservative think tank found the report by FAIR anything but fair. The FAIR report counts the costs without considering benefits. They failed to account for how much undocumented workers contribute to the economy by using the money they earn to purchase goods and services, which generate tax revenue. They are numerous other problems in the report such as using statistics that include both legal and illegal immigrants but there intention was clearly not to produced an unbiased study but rather to support their contention that all immigration is bad for America.
Fact-checking Trump’s claim that illegal immigration costs US taxpayers $113 billion annually

I'm sorry but not buying it as the CATO institute is in the pockets of corporate america who have a vested interest in keeping the floodgates open.

There is no way on this earth that a family of four that illegally enters the country, with the parents working for $25K or less each per year, possibly off the books in one or both cases, can be paying ANYWHERE near the amount of taxes in a year to cover their costs of healthcare, public schooling for their kids, etc., and that's counting a family that actually has working parents.

The math simply does NOT work, except for the bastard companies hiring them - for everyone else who has to pay higher taxes to cover for them, its a massive cost. That the NYT today has a cover article on how dozens of corporations paid zero taxes over the past several years is just a disgrace - it is now the shrinking, over-burdened and under-employed middle class that is paying higher taxes to support these people.

 

[rhodescholar]

You do realize that this report? is an opinion piece by an extremist organization that ignores the contribution to the economy of undocumented immigrants and the fact that they are not eligible for welfare, food stamps, or medicaid. What they present as facts are assumptions based on estimates that can be off by over 100%.

Almost half the cost they quote is for education of children of illegal immigrants. What they don't mention is that these children are US citizens and many if not most were born to legal US residents that are now illegal due visa expiration. They also omit the millions paid in social security and medicare taxes that they will never be able to use. They omit the fact that undocumented immigrants own businesses that create jobs, and they all pay sales taxes and many pay property which finance schools.

"Extremist" organization? Who do you work for, the NY Times? Do you label everyone who wants to reduce legal immigration and terminate/deport illegal aliens as extremists, simply because they are following the law?

#1-that the kids were granted citizenship is a mis-reading of the 14th amendment, and does not exist in any other Western democracy that is successful, for obvious reasons

#2-many illegals work off the books, so remind me again how they are paying SS/FICA taxes, etc?

#3-the sales taxes they pay do not even come close to covering their costs, that is laughable. A single public school student in NYC getting free breakfasts and lunches plus ESL adjunct classes costs about $30K PER YEAR, that is more than the average entire annual salary for the vast majority of illegals, many of whom have multiple kids. And that does not include the tens of thousands of dollars used by the uninsured illegals every time they walk into a hospital for basic care/treatment.

The FAIR report is VERY accurate, and it is no accident that the major leftist news media has never made a proper, good faith effort to do this type of calculation - it would cause a massive uprising. It is also why the ludicrous "11 mm illegals" nonsense is repeated so frequently by the media as if they were fucking parrots; the actual number which is closer to 35 MM would initiate another civil war if widely known.

There is a reason why no other country on earth accepts illegals the way the US does; their cost burden and theft of jobs which destroys the working/middle class wage base would create a civil war in another country. Only in the US with the corporate owned media - which liberals seem to despise on every other subject - does the propaganda flow like a river to try and forestall these facts from becoming broadly known. As in the daily sob story crap published by the NYT about some illegal family crossing the border, its is transparent propaganda/tripe.

 

[rhodescholar]

However, with that said, I don't think most American really want strict immigration laws and the inevitable human tragedies that would entail.

Sit down with 25 random americans, show them the massive costs of illegals, and the vast numbers of homeless and homeless vets, the decaying infrastructure, etc and I can guarantee you "most americans" would want the illegals deported immediately.

Its incredible how hypocritical you liberals are; you once stood up for the poor and the homeles, just goes to show how the left dissects the electorate based upon identity politics and which group it considers the greatest "victim" fr which it will defend/support - which in this case is the illegals. I'd have to guess that the only "greater" victim to the liberals these days is muslims, they are the World Champion of liberal victims.

 

[ricechickie]

Could you give me the source for this?

 

[longknife]

Could you give me the source for this?

No. It was posted on Google+ and I just posted the image location. You want to refute the claims? Let's see you do it.

 

[ricechickie]

Could you give me the source for this?

No. It was posted on Google+ and I just posted the image location. You want to refute the claims? Let's see you do it.

How irresponsible of you to post a laundry list of claims without some evidence that they're true. And to label them as "FACTS!".

 

[longknife]

Could you give me the source for this?

No. It was posted on Google+ and I just posted the image location. You want to refute the claims? Let's see you do it.

How irresponsible of you to post a laundry list of claims without some evidence that they're true. And to label them as "FACTS!".

As I posted before, if you believe they're false, REFUTE THEM!

 

[Flopper]

The CATO Institute, a Washington based conservative think tank found the report by FAIR anything but fair. The FAIR report counts the costs without considering benefits. They failed to account for how much undocumented workers contribute to the economy by using the money they earn to purchase goods and services, which generate tax revenue. They are numerous other problems in the report such as using statistics that include both legal and illegal immigrants but there intention was clearly not to produced an unbiased study but rather to support their contention that all immigration is bad for America.
Fact-checking Trump’s claim that illegal immigration costs US taxpayers $113 billion annually

I'm sorry but not buying it as the CATO institute is in the pockets of corporate america who have a vested interest in keeping the floodgates open.

There is no way on this earth that a family of four that illegally enters the country, with the parents working for $25K or less each per year, possibly off the books in one or both cases, can be paying ANYWHERE near the amount of taxes in a year to cover their costs of healthcare, public schooling for their kids, etc., and that's counting a family that actually has working parents.

The math simply does NOT work, except for the bastard companies hiring them - for everyone else who has to pay higher taxes to cover for them, its a massive cost. That the NYT today has a cover article on how dozens of corporations paid zero taxes over the past several years is just a disgrace - it is now the shrinking, over-burdened and under-employed middle class that is paying higher taxes to support these people.

Assuming the average illegal immigrant family makes less than $25K is not reasonable because at that rate, there would little if any increase in their standard of living over living in Mexico and thus there would be little reason for them to come here.

By law it is illegal for the states to spend any federal dollars on illegal immigrants. Only children born in the US are eligible.

The Social Security Administration collects billions of dollars in taxes each year from illegal immigrants that will never be paid back in benefits. Since 1937, Social Security has a mass 1.3 trillion dollars from tax payers without valid social security numbers. The agency estimates that most of that money comes from wages illegal immigrants.

The Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy estimates that illegal immigrants pay 7 billion in sales taxes and 3.6 billion in property taxes.

Adding Up the Billions in Tax Dollars Paid by Undocumented Immigrants

 

[longknife]

 

[longknife]

 

[SeaGal]

Two most often used justifications by advocates for those who enter, or stay, in this country illegally...

1. 'they' contribute to the economy
2. closed borders are selfish/inhumane

To #1 -
a. we need to erase the phrase 'illegal immigrants do the jobs Americans won't do' from the American psyche. Until every able-bodied and/or mentally fit American is gainfully employed, no American should be able to
choose not to work, while demanding his employed neighbor provide for his needs. Working Americans will also contribute to the economy through taxes.
b. stop issuing temporary visas if we cannot keep track of them
c. in this respect - advocating for immigration is big business

To #2 -
a. we can have open borders or a welfare state - not both
b. many entering the country illegally are fleeing from nations where the rule of law is corrupt - corrupting the rule of law in this country is not the answer...for we risk becoming what they have fled.
c. most of us lock our doors at night, not because we hate our neighbors, but because we love our family.

We are a unique country, and we do offer opportunity not seen in many other places in the world - that is why so many want to come here...and not those 'other places'. The immigration issue is muddied by the fact that too many of the decision makers in high places, both in business and politics, have their own self-interests at heart...and have successfully separated us into squabbling groups...while they amass power and/or wealth.

It is no more selfish to expect laws to be enforced than it is humanitarian to demand they not be. Forcing one to pay for another is not emulating Robin Hood - it is theft.

In the Carboniferous Epoch we were promised abundance for all,
By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul;

The circumstances that Kipling did not foresee in the above, The Gods of the Copybook Headings - we are no longer robbing selected Peter, we are robbing his grandchildren - taking out loans in their name - we have no money.
Then again, maybe he did foresee -
And that after this is accomplished, and the brave new world begins
When all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins,
As surely as Water will wet us, as surely as Fire will burn,
The Gods of the Copybook Headings with terror and slaughter return!

 

[longknife]

 

[longknife]

 

[longknife]

 

[Winston]

Arrests are up but deportations are DOWN. And the entire increase in arrests, and then some, can be attributed to the fact that Trump is arresting non-criminal immigrants. In other words, his policies are CHICKEN SHIT. He sends the INS out to round up mothers, fathers, and students to jack up his numbers and clog up the system while the rapists and gang leaders continue to roam the streets. Like most everything else, Trump is all talk and little action.

ICE: More immigrants arrested, fewer deported under Trump

 

[longknife]

Arrests are up but deportations are DOWN. And the entire increase in arrests, and then some, can be attributed to the fact that Trump is arresting non-criminal immigrants. In other words, his policies are CHICKEN SHIT. He sends the INS out to round up mothers, fathers, and students to jack up his numbers and clog up the system while the rapists and gang leaders continue to roam the streets. Like most everything else, Trump is all talk and little action.

ICE: More immigrants arrested, fewer deported under Trump

Nowhere does your link point out WHY deportations are down and what the administration is doing to force many nations to take them back.

It also makes no difference whether or not they been convicted of crimes other than being here illegally. THEY ARE HERE ILLEGALLY. Send 'em back when you discover them. Period