The Birth Tax

[Care4all]

but that's just it...how could the wealth not be taxed once already...? it is!!! that money is taxed when it is earned in the first place...then when you save it and it earns interest, that interest is taxed as well...if you invest it in any way whatsoever, it is taxed again...also when you spend it, you pay sales tax...do not be fooled into believing that taxation equals caring about your fellow man...that is a suckers bet.

No it isn't GloriB....

Here is how...

1. the house he owns could have been bought for 100k....that money was taxed, but 50 years later, the estate is now worth 10 million...which means 9.9 million GAIN, which was not taxed...

2. the stocks he owns in what was his own company until he sold it to the public....many cases they keep 49% or close to it and sell the rest, this 49% is put in to his share of stocks in the company worth and let's say it was $10 dollars a share for 100,000 shares as his portion....he holds on to this stock for 30-50 years and when he dies the shares are now worth $100 bucks a share, the $1 million he initially invested is now $10,000,000....of which he never had to pay any capital gains tax, because he held on to them and did not sell them....so this means that $9 million of this was never taxed for the 30-50 years....

There are many situations similar to this in which taxes are not paid until the person dies and his estate is passed over....

The average joe does not ever get this kind of tax break, where their money earned and money GAINED are not taxed....

Things like the above examples are just some of the examples in which taxes are avoided by the very wealthy for decades, until death....and please note, they are just examples off the top of my head....

Giving the first $2 million of any estate as a deduction covers the things in which taxes were already paid.

This is how i understand it to be....

Care

 

[CA95380]

Limbaugh is nothing more than a blowhard...
But what right does the government have taking away 45% of someone's lifetime worth of savings?

I guess I had nothing to say about it. So I will say "No comment!"

 

[jreeves]

The government (that's us by the way) is empowered by the Constitution to "lay taxes".

Any other questions?

The people who btw are getting taxed excessively have the right to change said laws......

45% of a person's lifetime savings....

 

[CA95380]

Really? I've always been under the impression that most of Rush's listeners are those on the left, looking for something to get pissed about!

Yeah! That too!

 

[Glori.B]

No it isn't GloriB....

Here is how...

1. the house he owns could have been bought for 100k....that money was taxed, but 50 years later, the estate is now worth 10 million...which means 9.9 million GAIN, which was not taxed...

you lost me right there

 

[Care4all]

The people who btw are getting taxed excessively have the right to change said laws......

45% of a person's lifetime savings....

UTTER NONSENSE

READ PLEASE!

http://www.ctj.org/pdf/est0406.pdf

 

[jreeves]

No it isn't GloriB....

Here is how...

1. the house he owns could have been bought for 100k....that money was taxed, but 50 years later, the estate is now worth 10 million...which means 9.9 million GAIN, which was not taxed...
2. the stocks he owns in what was his own company until he sold it to the public....many cases they keep 49% or close to it and sell the rest, this 49% is put in to his share of stocks in the company worth and let's say it was $10 dollars a share for 100,000 shares as his portion....he holds on to this stock for 30-50 years and when he dies the shares are now worth $100 bucks a share, the $1 million he initially invested is now $10,000,000....of which he never had to pay any capital gains tax, because he held on to them and did not sell them....so this means that $9 million of this was never taxed for the 30-50 years....

There are many situations similar to this in which taxes are not paid until the person dies and his estate is passed over....

The average joe does not ever get this kind of tax break, where their money earned and money GAINED are not taxed....

Things like the above examples are just some of the examples in which taxes are avoided by the very wealthy for decades, until death....and please note, they are just examples off the top of my head....

Giving the first $2 million of any estate as a deduction covers the things in which taxes were already paid.

This is how i understand it to be....

Care

Maybe it has happened but I would like to see an example of a real estate investment of 100k turning into 10 million dollars?

 

[jreeves]

UTTER NONSENSE

READ PLEASE!

http://www.ctj.org/pdf/est0406.pdf

Care,
The tax rate is 45% that's someone's lifetime savings, it doesn't belong to the feds. Sorry I disagree with you...

 

[wihosa]

Regardless of whether the righties are correct that millionaires are not wealthy, we are still left holding the bag for the TEN TRILLION DOLLAR debt wrung up under Neo-Con rule. That debt will be paid with taxes which fall more and more on working people.

Every child born in America 'Inherits' a liftime debt.

Welcome to America and don't forget to pay your Birth Tax.

 

[jreeves]

Regardless of whether the righties are correct that millionaires are not wealthy, we are still left holding the bag for the TEN TRILLION DOLLAR debt wrung up under Neo-Con rule. That debt will be paid with taxes which fall more and more on working people.

Every child born in America 'Inherits' a liftime debt.

Welcome to America and don't forget to pay your Birth Tax.

For one the national debt isn't 10 trillion its 9.4 trillion. Secondly if you think that the conservatives are solely to blame for the national deficit you are clueless. It is entitlements that threaten our country's fiscal security, which were created by lefties....

 

[Glori.B]

2. the stocks he owns in what was his own company until he sold it to the public....many cases they keep 49% or close to it and sell the rest, this 49% is put in to his share of stocks in the company worth and let's say it was $10 dollars a share for 100,000 shares as his portion....he holds on to this stock for 30-50 years and when he dies the shares are now worth $100 bucks a share, the $1 million he initially invested is now $10,000,000....of which he never had to pay any capital gains tax, because he held on to them and did not sell them....so this means that $9 million of this was never taxed for the 30-50 years....

you do not pay tax on a capital gain unless and until that gain is realized...if you realize a 9 million dollar gain, then you pay capital gains tax on that gain. if that gain has never been realized until the person dies, then the tax is payed at that time, just like any other capital gain prior to their death.

what if you already paid that capital gain tax prior to your death and squared away your assests into a trust in order to provide for your grandchildren's college education...should your estate then be taxed again upon your death?

 

[Moon]

For one the national debt isn't 10 trillion its 9.4 trillion. Secondly if you think that the conservatives are solely to blame for the national deficit you are clueless. It is entitlements that threaten our country's fiscal security, which were created by lefties....

Yep. Wait until the bills for Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid come due. Yikes!

 

[Care4all]

Care,
The tax rate is 45% that's someone's lifetime savings, it doesn't belong to the feds. Sorry I disagree with you...

This is what the taxes come out to, for both state and federal....the deductions and other loopholes bring their taxes to what the chart shows below...this was on 2004 deaths associated with the death tax....the fed tax collected for all of them was 11.5% of their total estate, and state taxes came out to 3.4% of the total estate....

NOT THE 45% RATE FOR ALL....that they own or earned....or profited from...

Shares of where the money goes
Taxes

Size of estate .. Fed Govt .. States
$1 – 2.5 million.. 5.5% .. 2.1%
$2.5 – 5 million .. 12.9% .. 2.8%
$5 – $10 million .. 17.0% .. 3.9%
$10 – 20 million .. 18.3% .. 5.2%
$20 million or more 14.0% ... 5.0%
TOTAL ....11.5% ... 3.4%

 

[CA95380]

Welcome to America and don't forget to pay your Birth Tax.

This must not be the sign that you see when leaving Mexico. I think it is more like .....

Welcome to America and don't forget to sign up for Welfare.

 

[editec]

it's only for the wealthy, you are truly stupid or you are very uninformed.

Yes, by all means let's look at the inherent injustice of the estate tax, shall we? We wouldn't DREAM of being misinformed, Jeeves...

source

Although the above tax table looks like a system of progressive tax rates, there is a unified credit against the tentative tax which effectively eliminates any tax on the first $2,000,000 of the estate (or the first $2,000,000 on a combination of taxable gifts during lifetime and a taxable estate at death), so the federal estate tax is effectively a flat tax of 45% once the unified credit exclusion amount has been exhausted.

Excuse me, but how many people do you think die leaving estates over $2,000,000. exactly?

Well, I can tell you what percentage of all estates left behind paid ANY estate taxes whatever in 2004, if you'd like to know...

0.8%​

But wait, there's more..

For a person dying during 2006, 2007, or 2008, the "applicable exclusion amount" is $2,000,000, so if the sum of the taxable estate plus the "adjusted taxable gifts" made during lifetime equals $2,000,000 or less, there is no federal estate tax to pay. According to the Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001, the applicable exclusion will increase to $3,500,000 in 2009, the estate tax is repealed in 2010, but then the act "sunsets" in 2011 and the estate tax reappears with an applicable exclusion amount of only $1,000,000 (unless Congress acts before then).

Now remember, these estates don't actually start paying ANY taxes on the first $2,000,000 they'll be leaving behind, amigo.

Do you know what the average SALARY is in the USA, sport?

It's $21, 000= BEFORE TAXES , per year.

That means that the scions start out with a TOTAL equal to 95 YEARS average American salary that is NOT TAXED...unlike the $21,000 salaries which are taxed at least 14% every paycheck for SSI and medicare.

Not a fair comparison, you say?...that average salary is misleading, editec?

Okay...lets look..

The MEDIAN FAMILY income BEFORE TAXES is, we're informed...

In 2006, the median annual household income was $48,201.00

So that means these poor put upon scions will only START our with 41 YEARS, six months MEDIAN FAMILY incomes, which they will not pay ANY taxes on, unlike the median families in the USA who will be paying some part of the meidan slaries every year, but at least 14%, I will remind you again.

You want to appeal to our sense of justice and fair play given those numbers?

Good luck with, pal.

The system is already SO rigged to the benefit of CAPITAL, against LABOR, that some folks can leave the children 41 years average salary before their estates are taxed.

It's damned hard to feel much sympathy for those poor richs kids, amigo.

Damned hard.

 

[jreeves]

This is what the taxes come out to, for both state and federal....the deductions and other loopholes bring their taxes to what the chart shows below...this was on 2004 deaths associated with the death tax....the fed tax collected for all of them was 11.5% of their total estate, and state taxes came out to 3.4% of the total estate....

NOT THE 45% RATE FOR ALL....that they own or earned....or profited from...

Shares of where the money goes
Taxes

Size of estate .. Fed Govt .. States
$1 – 2.5 million.. 5.5% .. 2.1%
$2.5 – 5 million .. 12.9% .. 2.8%
$5 – $10 million .. 17.0% .. 3.9%
$10 – 20 million .. 18.3% .. 5.2%
$20 million or more 14.0% ... 5.0%
TOTAL ....11.5% ... 3.4%

The tentative tax base is the sum of the taxable estate and the "adjusted taxable gifts" (i.e., taxable gifts made after 1976) and the tentative tax is then calculated by applying the following tax rates:

For amounts not greater than $10,000, the tax liability is 18% of the amount.

For amounts over $10,000 but not over $20,000, the tentative tax is $1,800 plus 20% of the excess over $10,000.

For amounts over $20,000 but not over $40,000, the tentative tax is $3,800 plus 22% of the excess over $20,000.

For amounts over $40,000 but not over $60,000, the tentative tax is $8,200 plus 24% of the excess over $40,000.

For amounts over $60,000 but not over $80,000, the tentative tax is $13,000 plus 26% of the excess over $60,000.

For amounts over $80,000 but not over $100,000, the tentative tax is $18,200 plus 28% of the excess over $80,000.

For amounts over $100,000 but not over $150,000, the tentative tax is $23,800 plus 30% of the excess over $100,000.

For amounts over $150,000 but not over $250,000, the tentative tax is $38,800 plus 32% of the excess over $150,000.

For amounts over $250,000 but not over $500,000, the tentative tax is $70,800 plus 34% of the excess over $250,000.

For amounts over $500,000 but not over $750,000, the tentative tax is $155,800 plus 37% of the excess over $500,000.

For amounts over $750,000 but not over $1,000,000, the tentative tax is $248,300 plus 39% of the excess over $750,000.

For amounts over $1,000,000 but not over $1,250,000, the tentative tax is $345,800 plus 41% of the excess over $1,000,000.

For amounts over $1,250,000 but not over $1,500,000, the tentative tax is $448,300 plus 43% of the excess over $1,250,000.

For amounts over $1,500,000, the tentative tax is $555,800 plus 45% of the excess over $1,500,000.

For years before 2007, additional tax brackets applied for amounts over $2,000,000 with marginal rates of up to 55%.

The tentative tax is reduced by gift tax that would have been paid on the adjusted taxable gifts, based on the rates in effect on the date of death (which means that the reduction is not necessarily equal to the gift tax actually paid on those gifts).

Although the above tax table looks like a system of progressive tax rates, there is a unified credit against the tentative tax which effectively eliminates any tax on the first $2,000,000 of the estate (or the first $2,000,000 on a combination of taxable gifts during lifetime and a taxable estate at death), so the federal estate tax is effectively a flat tax of 45% once the unified credit exclusion amount has been exhausted.

Estate tax in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[wihosa]

It will be ten trillion by the time Bush is gone.

Ah, entitlements, how dare any tax money be spent on "The People".

In case you hadn't noticed almost all the debt was accumulated under twenty years of Republican rule, the "Borrow and Spend Republicans".

 

[jreeves]

Yes, by all means let's look at the inherent injustice of the estate tax, shall we? We wouldn't DREAM of being misinformed, Jeeves...

source



Excuse me, but how many people do you think die leaving estates over $2,000,000. exactly?

Well, I can tell you what percentage of all estates left behind paid ANY estate taxes whatever in 2004, if you'd like to know...

0.8%​

But wait, there's more..



Now remember, these estates don't actually start paying ANY taxes on the first $2,000,000 they'll be leaving behind, amigo.

Do you know what the average SALARY is in the USA, sport?

It's $21, 000= BEFORE TAXES , per year.

That means that the scions start out with a TOTAL equal to 95 YEARS average American salary that is NOT TAXED...unlike the $21,000 salaries which are taxed at least 14% every paycheck for SSI and medicare.

Not a fair comparison, you say?...that average salary is misleading, editec?

Okay...lets look..

The MEDIAN FAMILY income BEFORE TAXES is, we're informed...

In 2006, the median annual household income was $48,201.00

So that means these poor put upon scions will only START our with 41 YEARS, six months MEDIAN FAMILY incomes, which they will not pay ANY taxes on, unlike the median families in the USA who will be paying some part of the meidan slaries every year, but at least 14%, I will remind you again.

You want to appeal to our sense of justice and fair play given those numbers?

Good luck with, pal.

The system is already SO rigged to the benefit of CAPITAL, against LABOR, that some folks can leave the children 41 years average salary before their estates are taxed.

It's damned hard to feel much sympathy for those poor richs kids, amigo.

Damned hard.

In other words you support taking someone's lifetime savings and imposing a 45% tax rate on their already taxed savings.

 

[jreeves]

It will be ten trillion by the time Bush is gone.

Ah, entitlements, how dare any tax money be spent on "The People".

In case you hadn't noticed almost all the debt was accumulated under twenty years of Republican rule, the "Borrow and Spend Republicans".

Automatic triggers in entitlement spending is greatly to blame just ask the CBO....

 

[Red Dawn]

Yes, by all means let's look at the inherent injustice of the estate tax, shall we? We wouldn't DREAM of being misinformed, Jeeves...

source



Excuse me, but how many people do you think die leaving estates over $2,000,000. exactly?

Well, I can tell you what percentage of all estates left behind paid ANY estate taxes whatever in 2004, if you'd like to know...

0.8%​

But wait, there's more..



Now remember, these estates don't actually start paying ANY taxes on the first $2,000,000 they'll be leaving behind, amigo.

Do you know what the average SALARY is in the USA, sport?

It's $21, 000= BEFORE TAXES , per year.

That means that the scions start out with a TOTAL equal to 95 YEARS average American salary that is NOT TAXED...unlike the $21,000 salaries which are taxed at least 14% every paycheck for SSI and medicare.

Not a fair comparison, you say?...that average salary is misleading, editec?

Okay...lets look..

The MEDIAN FAMILY income BEFORE TAXES is, we're informed...

In 2006, the median annual household income was $48,201.00

So that means these poor put upon scions will only START our with 41 YEARS, six months MEDIAN FAMILY incomes, which they will not pay ANY taxes on, unlike the median families in the USA who will be paying some part of the meidan slaries every year, but at least 14%, I will remind you again.

You want to appeal to our sense of justice and fair play given those numbers?

Good luck with, pal.

The system is already SO rigged to the benefit of CAPITAL, against LABOR, that some folks can leave the children 41 years average salary before their estates are taxed.

It's damned hard to feel much sympathy for those poor richs kids, amigo.

Damned hard.

Damn, its been ages since I've seen anyone owned this badly.

JReeves started out saying that EVERY one, every property owner, had to pay the inheritance tax.

From his OWN link, and your stats, less than 1% of families - the affluent and the wealthy - have to pay any inheritance tax because of the large tax exemption on the first several million dollars of estate.