The biggest threat to gun rights: The US military

[bucs90]

Well, this is gonna be an uncomfortable discussion. So, lets get to is. The biggest threat to gun rights in this country is, without doubt, the US military. Hear me out.

Lets say a tyrannical government wanted to take your guns. Yep. Bubba next door has been saying for years "Da gubermint is gurrna comes, and dey gurrna tries to takes mee guns away, over mah cold dead hands!!!" Well, lets say it actually happens, and they try to do it.

HOW?

The police. Well, the cops are the enforcement wing of government. They'd be tasked with it. Most wouldnt do it. Most agree with the 2nd amendment. So, any law without cops willing to enforce it....is no more harmful than plain ink on paper, like ink on a Sports Illustrated magazine. Harmless. BUT, the cops are only 800,000 strong nationwide. Even if they all jumped on board, thats 800,000 vs 300,000,000. And most cops aren't on board. So that isn't a rational fear.

Thus, only martial law could take your guns.

The military, in martial law if the cops refused to do it, are under directed orders enforceable by court martial and jail. Cops can say "Fuck you, Im not doing that" and nothing happens except maybe they get fired, but probably not even that. Military cant. They can go to jail for refusing to obey orders. They have tanks, jets, attack helicopters, etc, etc, etc, that the cops dont. They are much larger and more powerful than domestic cops. They might be able to accomplish a disarming of the public. Would they? Who knows. Most military folks think the same way most cops do. They likely would be opposed to a gun confiscation also. BUT, they have that consequence of jail for disobeying, plus, they have the power and tools to do it.


SO....consider right wingers this: The only true, legit way that a tyrannical government would be able to take your guns is through military martial law. And yet, the ONLY thing in government funding you truly, passionately and blindly support is military.

You guys support the growth, funding and equipping of the very institute that poses the only legit threat to your own guns being taken

Now, I gave up on right wing intelligence a year ago. But I cant help but notice this contrast in thinking. You guys blindly and emotionally support anything and everything military, and passionately oppose any cuts to military spending. But that happens to be the only reasonable threat to your gun rights. You are creating, funding, and supporting the only thing that could bring your biggest fear to reality.

WHY?

 

[Mad Scientist]

Before anyone says "There's no Military on the Streets!" just Google "Military Assists Law Enforcement" then come back here.

 

[Katzndogz]

The obvious answer is, we should not trust the military nor should we trust the government. This is truly a place where everyone is on their own.

 

[bucs90]

Before anyone says "There's no Military on the Streets!" just Google "Military Assists Law Enforcement" then come back here.

I strongly support our military. Let me say that first.

But yes, the military and police have very slowly started working together more, cooperating more, and very frequently now go to some training classes together- mostly private sector training, at places like Blackwater. Our police are becoming more like military, and our military more like police (world police).

It is fascinating, in a sociological way, to see how the right wing has such an emotional and passionate love, support and faith in the military, while also holding such a strong distrust in the government's potential for tyranny.

But, the only true threat of tyranny would be from the military in a martial law situation, and the right wing supports funding the very institution that could inflict tyranny on them. ONLY a strong, funded military could confiscate US firearms nationwide....but, the right wing passionately opposes any cuts to the funding of that very same military.

It is a fascinating look into the mind of the far right.

 

[Katzndogz]

That's assuming that the military itself would continue to follow orders from obama and there would be no military revolt.

 

[Erand7899]

Before anyone says "There's no Military on the Streets!" just Google "Military Assists Law Enforcement" then come back here.

I strongly support our military. Let me say that first.

But yes, the military and police have very slowly started working together more, cooperating more, and very frequently now go to some training classes together- mostly private sector training, at places like Blackwater. Our police are becoming more like military, and our military more like police (world police).

It is fascinating, in a sociological way, to see how the right wing has such an emotional and passionate love, support and faith in the military, while also holding such a strong distrust in the government's potential for tyranny.

But, the only true threat of tyranny would be from the military in a martial law situation, and the right wing supports funding the very institution that could inflict tyranny on them. ONLY a strong, funded military could confiscate US firearms nationwide....but, the right wing passionately opposes any cuts to the funding of that very same military.

It is a fascinating look into the mind of the far right.

You should spend more time looking into the mind of the person who writes such drivel. A self evaluation of your own common sense is definitely in order. First, and foremost, is your ignorance of the requirement for military personnel to obey orders. They are only required to obey lawful orders of those appointed over them. That applies from the top generals to the privates.

Secondly, in order for the police, and/or the military to confiscate all firearms, they would need to know who have the guns. That means that a comprehensive registration system would have to be put in place before confiscation could begin.

Finally, once all guns are registered, confiscation would not be necessary. Firearms could then be taxed out of the hands of all but the rich, the well connected, and the crooks. The reasons for taxation always sound reasonable. To pay for the background checks, and to pay for maintenance of the registration system, and eventually to pay for those injured by firearms, scared by firearms, or just need some form of medical treatment.

Once taxation becomes excessive, people will voluntarily turn in their guns to cease paying the taxes on them. This will start with the poorest and most vulnerable segment of the population, and slowly move up the food chain as the taxes increase.

 

[HereWeGoAgain]

I dont want a law on the books that can be used against me when someone just decides to enforce it when it suites them.
That has abuse written all over it. No thanks.

 

[Borillar]

Before anyone says "There's no Military on the Streets!" just Google "Military Assists Law Enforcement" then come back here.

I strongly support our military. Let me say that first.

But yes, the military and police have very slowly started working together more, cooperating more, and very frequently now go to some training classes together- mostly private sector training, at places like Blackwater. Our police are becoming more like military, and our military more like police (world police).

It is fascinating, in a sociological way, to see how the right wing has such an emotional and passionate love, support and faith in the military, while also holding such a strong distrust in the government's potential for tyranny.

But, the only true threat of tyranny would be from the military in a martial law situation, and the right wing supports funding the very institution that could inflict tyranny on them. ONLY a strong, funded military could confiscate US firearms nationwide....but, the right wing passionately opposes any cuts to the funding of that very same military.

It is a fascinating look into the mind of the far right.

They ( the right) only have a strong distrust of the government and its potential for tyranny when a democrat is president. They were all for creating big government police state agencies like the TSA and DHS and giving them all kinds of powers with the Patriot Act when Bush was president.

You are correct in that the police around the country are becoming more and more like a paramilitary force, both in arms and in tactics. When I was growing up in the 60's and 70's, police were typically armed with a revolver and maybe carried a shotgun in their cars. Now, they carry semiautomatic pistols and AR-15 rifles in their cars.

For those hopeful that the military or police wouldn't carry out their orders, remember Kent State, Bull Conner, the "Bonus Army", and countless other examples of rebellions being forcefully put down.

 

[bucs90]

Before anyone says "There's no Military on the Streets!" just Google "Military Assists Law Enforcement" then come back here.

I strongly support our military. Let me say that first.

But yes, the military and police have very slowly started working together more, cooperating more, and very frequently now go to some training classes together- mostly private sector training, at places like Blackwater. Our police are becoming more like military, and our military more like police (world police).

It is fascinating, in a sociological way, to see how the right wing has such an emotional and passionate love, support and faith in the military, while also holding such a strong distrust in the government's potential for tyranny.

But, the only true threat of tyranny would be from the military in a martial law situation, and the right wing supports funding the very institution that could inflict tyranny on them. ONLY a strong, funded military could confiscate US firearms nationwide....but, the right wing passionately opposes any cuts to the funding of that very same military.

It is a fascinating look into the mind of the far right.

You should spend more time looking into the mind of the person who writes such drivel. A self evaluation of your own common sense is definitely in order. First, and foremost, is your ignorance of the requirement for military personnel to obey orders. They are only required to obey lawful orders of those appointed over them. That applies from the top generals to the privates.

Secondly, in order for the police, and/or the military to confiscate all firearms, they would need to know who have the guns. That means that a comprehensive registration system would have to be put in place before confiscation could begin.

Finally, once all guns are registered, confiscation would not be necessary. Firearms could then be taxed out of the hands of all but the rich, the well connected, and the crooks. The reasons for taxation always sound reasonable. To pay for the background checks, and to pay for maintenance of the registration system, and eventually to pay for those injured by firearms, scared by firearms, or just need some form of medical treatment.

Once taxation becomes excessive, people will voluntarily turn in their guns to cease paying the taxes on them. This will start with the poorest and most vulnerable segment of the population, and slowly move up the food chain as the taxes increase.

If a gun law is passed to confiscate or ban........then an order to round 'em up would be a "lawful order". If the law is passed, and Obama says go through with it, then his military has no choice but obey the Commander in Chief, or, a revolt. The cops, on the other hand, can say "Go fuck yourselves", and the worst that can happen is they get fired, and even if they did, the WONT be fired, because the Feds have no power. Police authority is hugely segmented among cities, counties, states. So if a mayor/city council/police chief are OK with the cops saying "go fuck yourselves", then the cops keep their jobs.


Second, if a tax is levied, and people refuse to pay that gun tax, WHO goes to lock them up? The cops. Again....."go fuck yourselves".

The only way you'll lose your guns is through the military. And right wingers keep pushing for unlimited funding at any cost for military.