The abortion debate

[Ralph]

Complaining about the father's right is just another pathetically feeble attempt by men to control women. I'm glad some men are bent out of shape over that. Now they know how it feels to be a woman in their religion, no say.

No one demonstrates equality by preaching a message of superiority. Men are men and women are women, they are physically distinct, this does not make one inferior to the other, each simply have their place in the scheme of life.

 

[JBeukema]

Women follow religions, and it's amazing that they don't care that they follow a man's religion that put them "in their place".

or they could be smart and just tell the religions morons to take their delusions elsewhere

I think the point he was trying to make was that men should just try the woman's role in religion to see whether they'd like it in a black sheet. maybe then they wouldn't make them wear it.

You're an idiot

JB says: be smart and just toss the whole damn thing aside

 

[DamnYankee]

I'd be most interested in your interpretation of the distinction, since the 6th Commandment states "Thou shalt not kill."

My interpretation makes abslutely no difference in a legal sense. I was simply pointing to the dichotomy in our laws. This is the result of the pragamatism that has given such gems as Dred Scott, Plessy and Roe.

However, the difference to me is that killing is something that ends a life. Murder is something that ends a human life. If I cause my lawn to die, I killed it. If I cause my neighbor to die, I murdered him. Is that an accurate understanding? I'm no lawyer, it's just what I think.

Under our law, if we stop the developement of a fetus and the Mother to be disagrees with that goal, we have murdered her baby to be.

If she does agree with it, we have ended the developement. Is that killing it? A whole new can of worms.

Not quite. Murder is not a moral term. It is a legal term. Murder is the ILLEGAL taking of a human life. That is why a woman killing the man trying to rape her, for example, is not murder. So if you killed your neighbor while he was trimming the hedges, you've committed murder. If you kill your neighbor while he's attacking you with the hedge trimmers, you've only killed him.

Homicide is still homicide, whether or not the jury considers it "justifiable".

 

[Cecilie1200]

[/COLOR]

My interpretation makes abslutely no difference in a legal sense. I was simply pointing to the dichotomy in our laws. This is the result of the pragamatism that has given such gems as Dred Scott, Plessy and Roe.

However, the difference to me is that killing is something that ends a life. Murder is something that ends a human life. If I cause my lawn to die, I killed it. If I cause my neighbor to die, I murdered him. Is that an accurate understanding? I'm no lawyer, it's just what I think.

Under our law, if we stop the developement of a fetus and the Mother to be disagrees with that goal, we have murdered her baby to be.

If she does agree with it, we have ended the developement. Is that killing it? A whole new can of worms.

Not quite. Murder is not a moral term. It is a legal term. Murder is the ILLEGAL taking of a human life. That is why a woman killing the man trying to rape her, for example, is not murder. So if you killed your neighbor while he was trimming the hedges, you've committed murder. If you kill your neighbor while he's attacking you with the hedge trimmers, you've only killed him.

Homicide is still homicide, whether or not the jury considers it "justifiable".

I didn't say "homicide". Note that that word never appeared in my post. I said "murder". They aren't the same thing, which is why the law talks of "first degree murder" and "justifiable homicide".

 

[JBeukema]

[/COLOR]

My interpretation makes abslutely no difference in a legal sense. I was simply pointing to the dichotomy in our laws. This is the result of the pragamatism that has given such gems as Dred Scott, Plessy and Roe.

However, the difference to me is that killing is something that ends a life. Murder is something that ends a human life. If I cause my lawn to die, I killed it. If I cause my neighbor to die, I murdered him. Is that an accurate understanding? I'm no lawyer, it's just what I think.

Under our law, if we stop the developement of a fetus and the Mother to be disagrees with that goal, we have murdered her baby to be.

If she does agree with it, we have ended the developement. Is that killing it? A whole new can of worms.

Not quite. Murder is not a moral term. It is a legal term. Murder is the ILLEGAL taking of a human life. That is why a woman killing the man trying to rape her, for example, is not murder. So if you killed your neighbor while he was trimming the hedges, you've committed murder. If you kill your neighbor while he's attacking you with the hedge trimmers, you've only killed him.

Homicide is still homicide, whether or not the jury considers it "justifiable".

homicide =/= murder


dumbass

 

[DamnYankee]

Not quite. Murder is not a moral term. It is a legal term. Murder is the ILLEGAL taking of a human life. That is why a woman killing the man trying to rape her, for example, is not murder. So if you killed your neighbor while he was trimming the hedges, you've committed murder. If you kill your neighbor while he's attacking you with the hedge trimmers, you've only killed him.

Homicide is still homicide, whether or not the jury considers it "justifiable".

I didn't say "homicide". Note that that word never appeared in my post. I said "murder". They aren't the same thing, which is why the law talks of "first degree murder" and "justifiable homicide".

Maybe it would be good if you learned the terminology before attempting to make an argument.

Homicide (Latin homicidium, homo human being + caedere to cut, kill) refers to the act of killing another human being.[1] It can also describe a person who has committed such an act, though this use is rare in modern English. Homicide is not always an illegal act.

Criminal homicide, a malum in se crime, occurs when a person purposely, knowingly, recklessly, or negligently causes the death of another. Murder and manslaughter are both examples of criminal homicide. Every legal system contains some form of prohibition or regulation of criminal homicide.

Homicide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[JBeukema]

{homicide} can also describe a person who has committed such an act, though this use is rare in modern English.

Now that I did not know

 

[DamnYankee]

{homicide} can also describe a person who has committed such an act, though this use is rare in modern English.

Now that I did not kniow

See there? I'm not just another pretty ........ Never mind ......

 

[Al Gunn]

When you call abortion murder, the only thing you're murdering is common sense.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Homicide is still homicide, whether or not the jury considers it "justifiable".

I didn't say "homicide". Note that that word never appeared in my post. I said "murder". They aren't the same thing, which is why the law talks of "first degree murder" and "justifiable homicide".

Maybe it would be good if you learned the terminology before attempting to make an argument.

Homicide (Latin homicidium, homo human being + caedere to cut, kill) refers to the act of killing another human being.[1] It can also describe a person who has committed such an act, though this use is rare in modern English. Homicide is not always an illegal act.

Criminal homicide, a malum in se crime, occurs when a person purposely, knowingly, recklessly, or negligently causes the death of another. Murder and manslaughter are both examples of criminal homicide. Every legal system contains some form of prohibition or regulation of criminal homicide.

Homicide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Congratulations. You just superciliously corrected me . . . by saying the exact same thing I did. Thank you SO MUCH for "teaching me the terminology" by giving me definitions I already had and helpfully telling me that homicide doesn't mean killing, it means KILLING. I really needed you to come along and clarify things . . . by repeating me.

 

[Father Time]

When you call abortion murder, the only thing you're murdering is common sense.

No you're just manipulating a term to suit your needs.

 

[code1211]

I'd be most interested in your interpretation of the distinction, since the 6th Commandment states "Thou shalt not kill."

My interpretation makes abslutely no difference in a legal sense. I was simply pointing to the dichotomy in our laws. This is the result of the pragamatism that has given such gems as Dred Scott, Plessy and Roe.

However, the difference to me is that killing is something that ends a life. Murder is something that ends a human life. If I cause my lawn to die, I killed it. If I cause my neighbor to die, I murdered him. Is that an accurate understanding? I'm no lawyer, it's just what I think.

Under our law, if we stop the developement of a fetus and the Mother to be disagrees with that goal, we have murdered her baby to be.

If she does agree with it, we have ended the developement. Is that killing it? A whole new can of worms.

Not quite. Murder is not a moral term. It is a legal term. Murder is the ILLEGAL taking of a human life. That is why a woman killing the man trying to rape her, for example, is not murder. So if you killed your neighbor while he was trimming the hedges, you've committed murder. If you kill your neighbor while he's attacking you with the hedge trimmers, you've only killed him.

That is the crux of this whole discussion, though, isn't it? Is an unborn baby a human life or not? Under our law, apparently, it is not. Unless the mother to be wants the baby. Then it is a human life.

 

[DamnYankee]

I didn't say "homicide". Note that that word never appeared in my post. I said "murder". They aren't the same thing, which is why the law talks of "first degree murder" and "justifiable homicide".

Maybe it would be good if you learned the terminology before attempting to make an argument.

Homicide (Latin homicidium, homo human being + caedere to cut, kill) refers to the act of killing another human being.[1] It can also describe a person who has committed such an act, though this use is rare in modern English. Homicide is not always an illegal act.

Criminal homicide, a malum in se crime, occurs when a person purposely, knowingly, recklessly, or negligently causes the death of another. Murder and manslaughter are both examples of criminal homicide. Every legal system contains some form of prohibition or regulation of criminal homicide.

Homicide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Congratulations. You just superciliously corrected me . . . by saying the exact same thing I did. Thank you SO MUCH for "teaching me the terminology" by giving me definitions I already had and helpfully telling me that homicide doesn't mean killing, it means KILLING. I really needed you to come along and clarify things . . . by repeating me.

You superciliously corrected me on the difference between "murder" and "killing", and "murder" and "homocide" -- or attempted to. You'll note however, that homocide is defined as killing, and is also defined as murder; therefore, they are one and the same. Hence, I did NOT repeat you, but, most emphatically, did correct you.

Next.

 

[JBeukema]

You'll note however, that homocide is defined as killing, and is also defined as murder; therefore, they are one and the same. /QUOTE]

*facepalm*

murder = illegal homicide*

homicide =/= murder

* not all illegal homicides are murder. See also Manslaughter**


**There may be other legal classifications for illegal homicides as well, but manslaughter and murder are the most familiar

 

[DamnYankee]

You'll note however, that homocide is defined as killing, and is also defined as murder; therefore, they are one and the same.

*facepalm*

murder = illegal homicide*

homicide =/= murder

* not all illegal homicides are murder. See also Manslaughter**


**There may be other legal classifications for illegal homicides as well, but manslaughter and murder are the most familiar

You might want to back it up a tad to the part about "justifiable"