So...who is getting a flu shot?

[koshergrl]

My guess is, if you don't understand it, it must be directly attributable either to magic and/or some conspiracy by the government to develop (at great cost) and jab people for no good reason cuz its fun!

Sometimes the strain that mutates and takes hold is not the one for which the immunization is developed. Sometimes, people are resistant because they have been previously exposed to a different version of the virus (or the same version) which is the best immunization in the world. Sometimes...brace yourself....there is more than ONE influenza bug making the rounds, and the result is that previously immunized people can catch it and get sick.

The immunizations are geared to what is predicted to be the most virulent and deadly.

Or maybe your sick family members didn't even have the flu. Unless blood was drawn when they were sick, or a swab done (maybe0 there's no way to know. A lot of time various illnesses get blamed on flu (which is one reason people think it' not so bad) and really, it's not flu at all but just a minor cold or mild case of ecoli or some other bug picked up.

Also, what people don't realize is that for an innoculation to be most effective...you need TWO of them. Most people only get one.

See how easy that was?

 

[MisterBeale]

People are so amazingly stupid. They've grown complacent and ignorant, living in a country that has up till now, had the best health practices and medical care in the world.

That is changing as we speak.

I have been in emergency meetings with CDC workers during the H1N1 pandemic when a local children's camp was hit so hard they had a hundred kids in cots outside because there was no room for them in the infirmary. Those people were terrified, and they were not faking it or shills for the government. They were on the ground, working with very sick kids, and eye witnesses to the rapidity with which it spread, and the potential for death.

I don't give a crap if middle aged, out of work conspiracy theorists drop dead. But kids need the innoculations.

You've been in emergency meetings with the CDC huh? What, you work for the pharmaceutical companies?


Again, post those studies that PROVE their efficacy, and MAYBE somebody here will believe your rants. I have posted real articles from legitimate publications, referring to legitimate scientific peer reviewed studies showing that the flu vaccine does nothing.

Not only does it do nothing, I have showed how it does possible harm to the neurological functioning of the neural pathways in children and adults. Some in the medical community suspect it may cause dementia, autism, and possibly be a co-cause along with gluten in the rise in rates of Alzheimers. Others have posted articles which explain how the flu vaccine supposedly only "protects" for two of the many many strains that are out there every year. They describe how right after you get the shot, your immune system is compromised for a few weeks after, so you are essentially weakened to a point where you are bound to get sick if you are exposed to any cold or flu, including the one you were vaccinated against.

You post so little evidence for your supposition, and what you do post has so very little to do with what your claims are and with people's real world experience, why should any one take you seriously?

You call "people" stupid for educating themselves on this issue, when it seems that you are the one who refuses to do any research that contradicts the establishment, or that might threaten the pharmaceutical industry's bottom line. When one doesn't know all the facts, that is the definition of ignorant, (i.e. stupid.)

You have shoved your fingers in your ear and just called me names. That has been your method of argumentation. Why should anyone take you seriously?

 

[KissMy]

My guess is, if you don't understand it, it must be directly attributable either to magic and/or some conspiracy by the government to develop (at great cost) and jab people for no good reason cuz its fun!

Sometimes the strain that mutates and takes hold is not the one for which the immunization is developed. Sometimes, people are resistant because they have been previously exposed to a different version of the virus (or the same version) which is the best immunization in the world. Sometimes...brace yourself....there is more than ONE influenza bug making the rounds, and the result is that previously immunized people can catch it and get sick.

The immunizations are geared to what is predicted to be the most virulent and deadly.

Or maybe your sick family members didn't even have the flu. Unless blood was drawn when they were sick, or a swab done (maybe0 there's no way to know. A lot of time various illnesses get blamed on flu (which is one reason people think it' not so bad) and really, it's not flu at all but just a minor cold or mild case of ecoli or some other bug picked up.

Also, what people don't realize is that for an innoculation to be most effective...you need TWO of them. Most people only get one.

See how easy that was?

Your entire post was bullshit. I stated in my first post in this thread "They went & got tested which proved they had the same strains of Flu as the vaccine contained."

Yes their blood was tested. Yes they got the "Flu Shot" more than the required time to become immune prior to coming down with the Flu. Every (member 5 out of about a hundred) who got the shot, came down with both strains of the Flu that the shot contained. It was the topic of discussion at family reunions. Yes there are doctors & nurses in my family who could not explain it.

 

[KissMy]

The other thing that is fucked about our healthcare system here in the USA is the excessive prescription drug enforcement.

For TamiFlu to work you must take it A.S.A.P when you come down with the Flu. But by the time you get in to see a doctor to get a prescription & then find someone to fill your prescription, it is too late for it to work.

With antibiotics you get in to take time off work losing pay, pay see a doctor to get a prescription & then pay someone to fill your prescription while you are sick. They think this will prevent super-bugs. 80 percent of all antibiotics used in the United States are fed to farm animals without prescription. That is where the breeding of super-bugs happens.

In order to get effective medical care in-spite of the FDA you have to fake the Flu to get prescriptions to have on hand illegally in case you get sick. Or you have to go to a pet store & get antibiotics for animals.

 

[MisterBeale]

The other thing that is fucked about our healthcare system here in the USA is the excessive prescription drug enforcement.

For TamiFlu to work you must take it A.S.A.P when you come down with the Flu. But by the time you get in to see a doctor to get a prescription & then find someone to fill your prescription, it is too late for it to work.

With antibiotics you get in to take time off work losing pay, pay see a doctor to get a prescription & then pay someone to fill your prescription while you are sick. They think this will prevent super-bugs. 80 percent of all antibiotics used in the United States are fed to farm animals without prescription. That is where the breeding of super-bugs happens.

In order to get effective medical care in-spite of the FDA you have to fake the Flu to get prescriptions to have on hand illegally in case you get sick. Or you have to go to a pet store & get antibiotics for animals.

All the studies I've seen, Sambucol works better than TamiFlu, and you can get that at most health food stores, possibly even at big box stores.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11399518

Abstract

Sambucus nigra L. products - Sambucol - are based on a standardized black elderberry extract. They are natural remedies with antiviral properties, especially against different strains of influenza virus. Sambucol was shown to be effective in vitro against 10 strains of influenza virus. In a double-blind, placebo-controlled, randomized study, Sambucol reduced the duration of flu symptoms to 3-4 days. Convalescent phase serum showed a higher antibody level to influenza virus in the Sambucol group, than in the control group. The present study aimed to assess the effect of Sambucol products on the healthy immune system - namely, its effect on cytokine production. The production of inflammatory cytokines was tested using blood - derived monocytes from 12 healthy human donors. Adherent monocytes were separated from PBL and incubated with different Sambucol preparations i.e., Sambucol Elderberry Extract, Sambucol Black Elderberry Syrup, Sambucol Immune System and Sambucol for Kids. Production of inflammatory cytokines (IL-1 beta, TNF-alpha, IL-6, IL-8) was significantly increased, mostly by the Sambucol Black Elderberry Extract (2-45 fold), as compared to LPS, a known monocyte activator (3.6-10.7 fold). The most striking increase was noted in TNF-alpha production (44.9 fold). We conclude from this study that, in addition to its antiviral properties, Sambucol Elderberry Extract and its formulations activate the healthy immune system by increasing inflammatory cytokine production. Sambucol might therefore be beneficial to the immune system activation and in the inflammatory process in healthy individuals or in patients with various diseases. Sambucol could also have an immunoprotective or immunostimulatory effect when administered to cancer or AIDS patients, in conjunction with chemotherapeutic or other treatments. In view of the increasing popularity of botanical supplements, such studies and investigations in vitro, in vivo and in clinical trials need to be developed.

Our ancestors knew about Elderberries, if it ain't broke, why mess with it. At the first signs of real cold or flu symptoms, of really feeling crappy, this will serve you a lot better then trying to get to a doctor and get into the system.

 

[Gracie]

Now, a SHINGLE shot, I would like to have. I had it a few months ago. It was a mild case but still not very pleasant. I damn sure don't want it again.

 

[Sunshine]

I got a flu shot at the drug store. I try to avoid clinics where there are sick people because my next cold or flu could be my last. The pharmacist gave the worst shot I have ever had. Never again will someone other than a nurse give me a shot. I'm guessing he thinks shots are beneath him so he botches them to keep you from coming back. I have a friend who says the same thing happened to him.

 

[Gracie]

The problem I see with a flu shot is...the shot itself is GUESSWORK on which flu will be predicted by doctors who THINK they know which ones will be prevaliant (sp?). So..you get a shot for a flu that is not around THIS YEAR...and SOOPRISE! A new strain makes its ugly appearance and by then, there are no preventative shots to take. Ya gotta wait another year for them to make one. Then in the next seasons flu shot time, it's more guesswork.

How many people have taken certain drugs for certain things only to find out that particular drug is unsafe and we get to watch those stupid commercials "if you or a loved one died, you may be compensated for taking the drug Blah Blah. Call NOW!"

I call bullshit. I just decided, too. No flu shot for me. I'll take my chances. And if I get the flu and it kills me...shrug. We all gotta die sometime. Fucking cancer didn't get me (yet). Let the fucking flu give it a shot. Pun intended.

 

[koshergrl]

People are so amazingly stupid. They've grown complacent and ignorant, living in a country that has up till now, had the best health practices and medical care in the world.

That is changing as we speak.

I have been in emergency meetings with CDC workers during the H1N1 pandemic when a local children's camp was hit so hard they had a hundred kids in cots outside because there was no room for them in the infirmary. Those people were terrified, and they were not faking it or shills for the government. They were on the ground, working with very sick kids, and eye witnesses to the rapidity with which it spread, and the potential for death.

I don't give a crap if middle aged, out of work conspiracy theorists drop dead. But kids need the innoculations.

You've been in emergency meetings with the CDC huh? What, you work for the pharmaceutical companies? Ad hominem, adds nothing to the convo. Ask a real question and maybe you'll get a real answer.


Again, post those studies that PROVE their efficacy, and MAYBE somebody here will believe your rants. I have posted real articles from legitimate publications, referring to legitimate scientific peer reviewed studies showing that the flu vaccine does nothing. I don't need to, because the study you provided was rejected by the medical community, and was not published in respected publications that publish peer-reviewed studies. Because they agreed the study was crap. So you failed to prove you had anything of value to add to the conversation, and you failed to support your argument with anything even remotely like reputable information.

Not only does it do nothing, I have showed how it does possible harm to the neurological functioning of the neural pathways in children and adults. Some in the medical community suspect it may cause dementia, autism, and possibly be a co-cause along with gluten in the rise in rates of Alzheimers. Others have posted articles which explain how the flu vaccine supposedly only "protects" for two of the many many strains that are out there every year. They describe how right after you get the shot, your immune system is compromised for a few weeks after, so you are essentially weakened to a point where you are bound to get sick if you are exposed to any cold or flu, including the one you were vaccinated against. No, you posted a bunch of garbage that made illogical and nonsensical leaps from one point to another, with no supporting evidence to prove that any of it was true.

Your own link states: "Jackson’s findings showed that outside of flu season, the baseline risk of death among people who did not get vaccinated was approximately 60 percent higher than among those who did." Really, after that, there's nothing more to be said. But don't let that stop you!


You post so little evidence for your supposition, and what you do post has so very little to do with what your claims are and with people's real world experience, why should any one take you seriously? Exactly what IS my supposition? Do you know? YOu said there had only been one flu pandemic...I proved that was an idiotic statement. You said there's no evidence that flu vaccines actually save people...your own link put the lie to that retardo comment. So what claim have I made that I haven't been able to support?

You call "people" stupid for educating themselves on this issue, when it seems that you are the one who refuses to do any research that contradicts the establishment, or that might threaten the pharmaceutical industry's bottom line. When one doesn't know all the facts, that is the definition of ignorant, (i.e. stupid.) Oh, you mean because I reject your whack-a-doodle conspiracy theories (which have been rejected by the entire reputable medical community WORLD WIDE)... my research isn't complete. Got it.

You have shoved your fingers in your ear and just called me names. That has been your method of argumentation. Why should anyone take you seriously?

People take me seriously because I do my research, because I back up my statements, and because I have a gift for exposing nuts. You're welcome.

 

[CMike]

I have never had one. I don't think I want to start, either. They scare me. The flu does too, but I think I would rather take my chances without the shot.

That is foolish.

 

[koshergrl]

Now, a SHINGLE shot, I would like to have. I had it a few months ago. It was a mild case but still not very pleasant. I damn sure don't want it again.

Too late, it's from chickenpox in your past, you can't prevent varicilla-voster after it gets in.

Which is why chickenpox vaccinations are a good thing for kids these days.

 

[Gracie]

Never mind. Pandora's box is full of stingy buggy critters. Best keep it closed.

 

[koshergrl]

What the hell are you yammering about, stalker? Are you saying you don't care if kids die?

That's great! Like everybody didn't already think you were nuts!

 

[Gracie]

I have never had one. I don't think I want to start, either. They scare me. The flu does too, but I think I would rather take my chances without the shot.

That is foolish.

In your opinion. Seems to be quite a few foolish people thinking the same thing I'm thinking.

Hubby went to the doc last year for some kind of bloodwork checkup. Nurse came in carrying a needle. He asked what it was for. She said "doctor said to give you a flu shot". Hubby said "I don't want one". She said "Doctor said". Hubby said "I SAID I don't want one. Now go away" to which she huffed off.

 

[koshergrl]

Good for you!

So who are these "a lot of people" who agree with you?

mr b?
Liewinger?
CC?
joe b?

Pretty much the board nutwads who claim regularly that they would like to see the population annihilated? Good on ya, you've found some friends! Albeit, according to your own comment, they're foolish, just like you.

 

[Sunshine]

Now, a SHINGLE shot, I would like to have. I had it a few months ago. It was a mild case but still not very pleasant. I damn sure don't want it again.

Too late, it's from chickenpox in your past, you can't prevent varicilla-voster after it gets in.

Which is why chickenpox vaccinations are a good thing for kids these days.

The shot helps if a person had a mild case. In those instances, they are more likely to get shingles. My doctor tried to sell me one, but I had such a high titer when I started nursing school, I don't really think I need one. I remember it. I had a whopping case of em.

 

[Gracie]

I am thankful mine was mild. But it still hurt. Not bad, but enough to be uncomfortable. And they showed up on the upper part of my right knee on the inside. I can imagine if it was on my stomach or back or neck. Shudder.

I just hope I don't get them again. I want hubby to get a shot for them. I damn sure dont want him getting them.