Same-Gender Marriage

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Bullypulpit, Nov 6, 2004.

  1. Bullypulpit
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    Bullypulpit Senior Member

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    Thus far, the arguments for prohibiting the marriage of same-gender couples have all lacked a fundamental premise...Demonstrable harm to the indivduals involved or to society. By failing to prove demostrable harm, the opponents of same-gender marriage have no reason to prohibit such unions beyond their own prejudices.

    Also, the arguments against same-gender marriage are rooted in the same fallacious arguments used to perpetuate the anti-miscegenation laws of the Jim Crowe era. Such arguments are no more valid now than they were then.

    Of course, you have those who argue that gays do have the right to marry...someone of the opposite gender. Outside of those cultures which encourage arranged marriages, we do not force individuals to marry someone not of their choosing. But some would prefer the hypocrisy of a sham marriage to open, honest and loving relationships between same-gender couples.

    My wife and I voted against Issue 1 in Ohio because it is unjust, it is discriminatory and it does adversely impact the lives of so many others.
    It was a piece of legislation motivated, not by concern for the society as a whole, but by the fear and bigotry of a few.
     
  2. dilloduck
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    dilloduck Diamond Member

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    Gays simply want America to recognize them with equal access to everything to make up for their unwillingness to accept resposibilty for their life style. They already can live in a loving realtionship. Why do they have to call it marriage? I can even support them having some of the rights that marriage includes (partner benefits, insurance coverage etc.) but why can't the guys simply claim that they are married. Is it becuase of the depression that results from being unable to produce offspring? Being legally married won't change that.
     
  3. Joan
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    Joan Mommy Dearest

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    I have no problem in offering benefits to long term relationship couples, be they married or not (i.e., medical coverage, death benefits etc), but when it comes to marriage - I am against it. You can always make vows to each other without the benefit of a wedding. I have known a few men in long term relationships with other men, and I do know that they are allowed to cover their "significant other" on their medical benefits. Where would it stop, a step-father wanting to marry his 15 year old daughter - I can only imagine what would come next. I also see no reason the gays cannot adopt children, I knew one gay woman who has adopted two, and a more devoted mother you would never find. Just because someone has different sexual preferences does not necessarily make them an automatic child molester!
     
  4. eric
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    Personally, I think you are missing the point. This issue has nothing to do with harm to others, and everthing to do with tradition, which is currently under attack in this country. All one needs to do is to look at the lawsuits filled all over this nation; to take the words under God out of the pledge and off of our money, to take prayer (or a moment of silence) out of our schools and references to God out of our courts. To take away a parents fundamental right to decide what his or her children will be taught in school, to even go as far as suing a school because a student was punished for telling his teacher to go Fu** off, that somehow his freedom of speech was violated. The list goes on and on.

    It is our traditions that are under attack, and marriage is an important one to most Americans. What we are seeing is more a defense of the tradition of marriage, rather than bigotry or hatred toward same sex couples. For if it were hate, then most Americans would not want to allow civil unions, which most polls show Americans are not adverse too.

    You want equal rights, you can have them, just leave the institution of marriage a tradition as it has always been !
     
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  5. Mr. P
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    Mr. P Senior Member

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    I disagree Bully....There's nothing wrong with discrimination in the context of right or wrong, positive or negative benefit. I bet you discriminate everyday. I'm sure there are places in town you won't go for fear of possible crime, positive discrimination for you. Maybe merchants you won't visit due to price, quality or service, another positive discrimination for you. I'm sure there are many more discriminations you practice everyday. Why would you think society should be any different?

    Is societies anti-same sex marriage movement discriminatory? Yes. But is it a positive or negative? Is the sentence for Armed robbery different than just plain ole robbery? Yes. Discriminatory? Yes. Positive? Yes.
    All for the benefit of society? Yes.

    Does the anti-same sex marriage ban adversely impact the lives of others? No. Since it's not a ban on a current legal practice it has no negative effect. Would allowing same sex marriage effect many others? You bet you ass it would. The next group up is who, pedafiles that want to marry 8 year olds? Then the folks that want more than one wife. Then the ones that want one wife to be same sex and one to be the opposite sex. Or how about the Moron that wants to marry a sheep? What a wonderful positive to society that would be.

    The question must be this, is same sex marriage a discrimination that is positive for the Country, for society as a whole? I think the answer is YES! The fiber of our societies morals, family values, have been greatly damaged and diluted over the past 30 years, it's time to stand up an say ENOUGH. Which is what happened on Nov.2nd.

    So Bully...where do "You" stop? What line do you draw? I hope it's not the "if it feels good do it" line, that line of thinking is partly responsible for where we are today.

    My wife and I voted for the amendment in my state.
     
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  6. OCA
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    OCA Senior Member

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    Bully see the results from the 11 states that had anti-queer marriage measures? OVERWHELMINGLY NO MARRIAGE! Valid points have been made hundreds of times you simply refuse to acknowledge them, its your side who is wrong, your time for your views have long past.

    I hope you relish being an antiquated dinosaur.
     
  7. 5stringJeff
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    5stringJeff Senior Member

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    Bully, the problem with gay marriage is that it legitimatizes a practice (homosexuality) that most Americans do not want to be legitimatized. Being an evangelical Christian, I base many of my arguments against gay marriage on my faith; however, there is plenty of empirical evidence out there that shows that children raised by gay parents are more likely to have mental disorders, more likely to commit crimes, and more likely to practice homosexuality themselves. (Source: Marriage Under Fire by James Dobson) So to say that gay marriage causes nobody harm is, in fact, false.

    I will also say, though, that almost nobody besides Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson wants to outlaw homosexuality, though many Americans see it as immoral.
     
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  8. Merlin1047
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    Merlin1047 Senior Member

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    Well Bully, since you're such a huge proponent of same-sex marriage, why don't you quit talking about it and get a bit more personally involved? Find yourself a nice lad and marry him.

    Let me know when the nuptials are scheduled. I'll send you a case of vaseline - or 50 weight motor oil - your preference.
     
  9. 007
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    007 Charter Member Supporting Member

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    My God... here we go again. Another liberal dumping another stinking bucket of "why we should all accept fags" over our heads.

    What you fail to realize pulit, and all your homosexual agenda pumping idiot cohorts as well, is that the more you sling this perverted stench at us, the more we dislike it, and with that, the more we'll oppose it.

    Shutting up about it would be your best discourse. But I guess you haven't the brains to figure that out.
     
  10. Bullypulpit
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    Bullypulpit Senior Member

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    Simply because a thing is traditional does not mean that it is good.

    Same gender couples who wish to marry are expressing their willingness to take up the responsibilities that marriage entails. The desire is not for special rights, but the same rights as traditional couples enjoy.

    Again, if you cannot demonstrate real harm to either the individuals or to society, your argument regardless of its reliance on tradtion, is without merit.
     

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