RUSSIA CLEARLY WANTS WAR with the USA!

[GLASNOST]

He wrote the book on Propaganda....literally. Or check out the very enlightening documentary, Century of the Self, done in 4, hour long segments. It is very telling, how our consumerist society developed, and how government saw usefulness and employed the same techniques to sway the population.

I've just read a very badly written intro by Naom Chomsky . Anyway it's a start.
Propaganda by Edward Bernays (1928)

 

[Sbiker]

Man, read the wiki first!

The Georgia Train and Equip Program (GTEP) training was conducted using U.S. Special Operations Forces and U.S. Marine Corps forces from May 2002 to May 2004
Georgian Armed Forces - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Rapid Trident | U.S. Army in Europe

View attachment 93133

It's your argument. You're the one who has to present evidence.

Then again I read your evidence, which you clearly didn't.

"The Georgia Train and Equip Program (GTEP) was an American-sponsored 18-month, $64-million program aimed at increasing the capabilities of the Georgian armed forces by training and equipping four 600-man battalions with light weapons, vehicles and communications. The program enabled the US to expedite funding for the Georgian military for Operation Enduring Freedom."

See the last part. Operation Enduring Freedom? That would be Afghanistan.

200 troops were sent in 2002. The Russo-Georgia War was in 2008. There's a timeline difference of 6 years here.

So, what do you have? The US training and sending money to a country that just happens to border Russia. The country then goes to war 6 years later, but it was started by Russia.

Yes, offcourse, artful Russian forces close to afternoon of 8.8.08 suddenly attacked Georgian forces which peacefully murdered civilians in Tskhinvali since evening of 7.8.08...
Official independent EU commitee, apparently, lies:

EU blames Georgia for starting war with Russia

Now you believe the EU?

Well, the EU blamed all sides in this. How did Russia attack so quickly? You can't have a military just suddenly go from barracks in Moscow and be battle ready in 24 hours in South Ossetia. The Georgians would have know the Russians were there and ready to go.

But again, this isn't black and white, this is black and black and Putin made the most of it.

From MOSCOW? Russia - is not only Moscow, btw, we have MORE millionaire cities than US And we have military bases at all territory of Russia. This battle were perfiormed by 58 army, based in Vladikavkaz, capital of North Ossetia. From Vladikavkaz to Tshinval directly is less than 100km.

You're ready to believe in any stupid idea, if it casts by your media, instead of switching on the mind. "Georgians knew... were ready..." They started a day before!

Yes, I'm quite aware of that. I was merely spicing up the language a little, rather than suggesting all troops are in Moscow. The point still remains the same. How the hell does an army march into another country with only 24 hours notice, if they're not already prepared?

1. But it's Russian army. By the way, last manoeuvers showed, army has mobile group about 200.000 people and can deploy it in any west direction for a day...

2. 58 army don't need any preparing because a). North Caucas is not a silent region, b). 58 army - active formation, which took part at all Chechen wars and permanently helping to hunting terrorists, c). 100km - it's not a distance, it's about two hours of any truck on a dirt road.

No, I'm not ready to believe any stupid ideas, you're just jumping on something you thought you might be able to score points with. Sorry, but I don't do those sorts of games.

Maybe it would be better not to believe in opinions, but in facts?

 

[charwin95]

Russia doesn't want war with USA.


But if that witch Clinton is elected, she is the one who is going to start a war with Russia!

Russia don't want a war? Maybe tell your president Putin thug stop supporting Syria and Iran.
That is why they want to elect Trump a weak pussy will just hand Syria to Russia. Look at his position in Syria compared to his VP? Crap.
Your buddies here making a stupid assessment that Hillary is weak will not do damn thing....... The same time you are saying that Hillary will start a war.

Russia is destroying ISIS in Syria...... haven't you heard?

As opposed to Rotten Clinton and Obama's position of arming ISIS terrorists and protecting them.

Wake up!

So why is it that ISIS in Syria still capable of producing oil by the millions of gallons and sell them to Syria? Putin is very busy killing civilians they should charge him with war crimes.
Last 5 days Putin your president has been killing civilians in Aleppo. Congratulations.
And what evidence do you have that Obama is arming ISIS?
In reality Putin thug has been selling arms to Iran and Syria which sponsored terrorism with the support of you r president Putin.

The Nation

 

[GLASNOST]

And what evidence do you have that Obama is arming ISIS?

I've already sent you a mound of evidence. I guess you chose not to read it.

 

[charwin95]

Russia doesn't want war with USA.


But if that witch Clinton is elected, she is the one who is going to start a war with Russia!

Russia don't want a war? Maybe tell your president Putin thug stop supporting Syria and Iran.
That is why they want to elect Trump a weak pussy will just hand Syria to Russia. Look at his position in Syria compared to his VP? Crap.
Your buddies here making a stupid assessment that Hillary is weak will not do damn thing....... The same time you are saying that Hillary will start a war.

Russia is destroying ISIS in Syria...... haven't you heard?

As opposed to Rotten Clinton and Obama's position of arming ISIS terrorists and protecting them.

Wake up!

Wake up?
What is that supposed to mean? Start supporting foreign leaders like you and Trump? Then trash my country. That is not going to happen.

 

[frigidweirdo]

It's your argument. You're the one who has to present evidence.

Then again I read your evidence, which you clearly didn't.

"The Georgia Train and Equip Program (GTEP) was an American-sponsored 18-month, $64-million program aimed at increasing the capabilities of the Georgian armed forces by training and equipping four 600-man battalions with light weapons, vehicles and communications. The program enabled the US to expedite funding for the Georgian military for Operation Enduring Freedom."

See the last part. Operation Enduring Freedom? That would be Afghanistan.

200 troops were sent in 2002. The Russo-Georgia War was in 2008. There's a timeline difference of 6 years here.

So, what do you have? The US training and sending money to a country that just happens to border Russia. The country then goes to war 6 years later, but it was started by Russia.

Yes, offcourse, artful Russian forces close to afternoon of 8.8.08 suddenly attacked Georgian forces which peacefully murdered civilians in Tskhinvali since evening of 7.8.08...
Official independent EU commitee, apparently, lies:

EU blames Georgia for starting war with Russia

Now you believe the EU?

Well, the EU blamed all sides in this. How did Russia attack so quickly? You can't have a military just suddenly go from barracks in Moscow and be battle ready in 24 hours in South Ossetia. The Georgians would have know the Russians were there and ready to go.

But again, this isn't black and white, this is black and black and Putin made the most of it.

From MOSCOW? Russia - is not only Moscow, btw, we have MORE millionaire cities than US And we have military bases at all territory of Russia. This battle were perfiormed by 58 army, based in Vladikavkaz, capital of North Ossetia. From Vladikavkaz to Tshinval directly is less than 100km.

You're ready to believe in any stupid idea, if it casts by your media, instead of switching on the mind. "Georgians knew... were ready..." They started a day before!

Yes, I'm quite aware of that. I was merely spicing up the language a little, rather than suggesting all troops are in Moscow. The point still remains the same. How the hell does an army march into another country with only 24 hours notice, if they're not already prepared?

1. But it's Russian army. By the way, last manoeuvers showed, army has mobile group about 200.000 people and can deploy it in any west direction for a day...

2. 58 army don't need any preparing because a). North Caucas is not a silent region, b). 58 army - active formation, which took part at all Chechen wars and permanently helping to hunting terrorists, c). 100km - it's not a distance, it's about two hours of any truck on a dirt road.

No, I'm not ready to believe any stupid ideas, you're just jumping on something you thought you might be able to score points with. Sorry, but I don't do those sorts of games.

Maybe it would be better not to believe in opinions, but in facts?

But there's a difference between being deployed in 24 hours, and being ready to invade another country in 24 hours.

So, basically the Russian Army was ready to invade Georgia, that's what you're saying? It's what I'm saying. You need a plan, you need troops ready, you need preparation.

 

[charwin95]

And what evidence do you have that Obama is arming ISIS?

I've already sent you a mound of evidence. I guess you chose not to read it.

Post me something that I don't know. Is Obama supplying ISIS arms right this minute?
Like Putin thug killing civilians right this minute.

Since you took over my post to Skye .............. why don't you answer the rest of my post?

 

[GLASNOST]

.............. why don't you answer the rest of my post?

Because I don't believe in kicking a man when I've already knocked him down. If you catch your breath and manage to stand up again, I will resume.

 

[Sbiker]

Yes, offcourse, artful Russian forces close to afternoon of 8.8.08 suddenly attacked Georgian forces which peacefully murdered civilians in Tskhinvali since evening of 7.8.08...
Official independent EU commitee, apparently, lies:

EU blames Georgia for starting war with Russia

Now you believe the EU?

Well, the EU blamed all sides in this. How did Russia attack so quickly? You can't have a military just suddenly go from barracks in Moscow and be battle ready in 24 hours in South Ossetia. The Georgians would have know the Russians were there and ready to go.

But again, this isn't black and white, this is black and black and Putin made the most of it.

From MOSCOW? Russia - is not only Moscow, btw, we have MORE millionaire cities than US And we have military bases at all territory of Russia. This battle were perfiormed by 58 army, based in Vladikavkaz, capital of North Ossetia. From Vladikavkaz to Tshinval directly is less than 100km.

You're ready to believe in any stupid idea, if it casts by your media, instead of switching on the mind. "Georgians knew... were ready..." They started a day before!

Yes, I'm quite aware of that. I was merely spicing up the language a little, rather than suggesting all troops are in Moscow. The point still remains the same. How the hell does an army march into another country with only 24 hours notice, if they're not already prepared?

1. But it's Russian army. By the way, last manoeuvers showed, army has mobile group about 200.000 people and can deploy it in any west direction for a day...

2. 58 army don't need any preparing because a). North Caucas is not a silent region, b). 58 army - active formation, which took part at all Chechen wars and permanently helping to hunting terrorists, c). 100km - it's not a distance, it's about two hours of any truck on a dirt road.

No, I'm not ready to believe any stupid ideas, you're just jumping on something you thought you might be able to score points with. Sorry, but I don't do those sorts of games.

Maybe it would be better not to believe in opinions, but in facts?

But there's a difference between being deployed in 24 hours, and being ready to invade another country in 24 hours.

Great! So, it really wasn't any invasion to Georgia till 11th of August. 11th of August Russian forces took border town Zugdidi, found Georgian army mostly fleed - and 12th of August peace was established.

I heared, some units of GRU rode up to suburban of Tbilisi - but only to buy some bottles of vintage wine...)) Do you know - Georgian wine is really good and respectable... [/QUOTE]

So, basically the Russian Army was ready to invade Georgia, that's what you're saying? It's what I'm saying. You need a plan, you need troops ready, you need preparation.

And what? Every Army need to be prepared to any situation. Your NATO has a lot of plans to invade Russia, or striking Russia, or any kinds of war with Russia. If you saying, having plans is criminal - what can you say, for example, about this:

Operation Dropshot - Wikipedia
Plan Totality - Wikipedia
Operation Unthinkable - Wikipedia

And so on - just click on links...

BUT behind this discussion we have to see one - but most important thing -

You don't believe, 58th Army were able to deploy forces by one day. Instead of this reality... But it's not a problem.
Your General Staff, producing scenarios of Russian invasion of Baltic countries (what the hell we forget there after building Luga-seaport?) - they think about 50.000 of russian "invade forces" and cannot believe, Russia able to deploy 200.000 only in one day and about 200.000 else not so fast. It could be a problem for NATO plans, if this invasion becomes reality.
But some people in your goverment and candidates to be president also cannot trust in nuclear weapon in Russia, listening a lot of own propaganda about "broken russian economics" and so on. Instead of reality - it's not a problem to make any nukes for country, having outstanding rocket and nuclear technologies (even US don't have any fast neutron reactors and buying rocket engines here). And this problem could become the problem of whole world, if new US president could want to check real presence of nukes in Russia.

 

[charwin95]

.............. why don't you answer the rest of my post?

Because I don't believe in kicking a man when I've already knocked him down. If you catch your breath and manage to stand up again, I will resume.

You didn't post anything credible that tickled me.
And you never answer ANY of my questions.

So basically you are giving up because you don't know what you are talking about. Nice deflection. But let me know when you have something credible to say.

 

[GLASNOST]

I heared, some units of GRU rode up to suburban of Tbilisi - but only to buy some bottles of vintage wine...)) Do you know - Georgian wine is really good and respectable...

During Sovjet times, Georgian wine was the only wine worth drinking. Today, however, the Republic of Moldova makes some of the best wine in the world. I drink only red wine. But when I was in Chisinau I accidently bought a bottle of white wine because the bouteille was dark glass. I was disappointed when I opened it back home but when I tasted it I was shocked .... it was the best wine I've ever tasted in my life!

 

[GLASNOST]

You didn't post anything credible that tickled me..

I seldom post anything that supports your view, is what you mean to say.

And you never answer ANY of my questions.

I have, and I do. It's just that my comments go way over your head so you skip whole sentences and paragraphs. Just look at your query about American support of ISIS. I sent you a link that explains everything you need to know. You ignored it. You are not doing very well in this debate about Russia's aggression/non-aggression towards the US. I think you bit off more than you can chew.

 

[Sbiker]

I heared, some units of GRU rode up to suburban of Tbilisi - but only to buy some bottles of vintage wine...)) Do you know - Georgian wine is really good and respectable...

During Sovjet times, Georgian wine was the only wine worth drinking. Today, however, the Republic of Moldova makes some of the best wine in the world. I drink only red wine. But when I was in Chisinau I accidently bought a bottle of white wine because the bouteille was dark glass. I was disappointed when I opened it back home but when I tasted it I was shocked .... it was the best wine I've ever tasted in my life!

Yeah, and Georgian wine is very tasty too...

Some news on topic of this thread (unfortunately on russian): «Гроза авианосцев» встанет на службу Отечеству: реанимация проекта «Лунь»

Russia now really don't have a tools for attack US, only to defend. In fact, US could start seriously afraid of Russian invasion, when the project "Loon" would be reanimated to mass-production of transport variants, not early... How could else Russian forces can cross the Pacific ocean to invade?

 

[frigidweirdo]

Now you believe the EU?

Well, the EU blamed all sides in this. How did Russia attack so quickly? You can't have a military just suddenly go from barracks in Moscow and be battle ready in 24 hours in South Ossetia. The Georgians would have know the Russians were there and ready to go.

But again, this isn't black and white, this is black and black and Putin made the most of it.

From MOSCOW? Russia - is not only Moscow, btw, we have MORE millionaire cities than US And we have military bases at all territory of Russia. This battle were perfiormed by 58 army, based in Vladikavkaz, capital of North Ossetia. From Vladikavkaz to Tshinval directly is less than 100km.

You're ready to believe in any stupid idea, if it casts by your media, instead of switching on the mind. "Georgians knew... were ready..." They started a day before!

Yes, I'm quite aware of that. I was merely spicing up the language a little, rather than suggesting all troops are in Moscow. The point still remains the same. How the hell does an army march into another country with only 24 hours notice, if they're not already prepared?

1. But it's Russian army. By the way, last manoeuvers showed, army has mobile group about 200.000 people and can deploy it in any west direction for a day...

2. 58 army don't need any preparing because a). North Caucas is not a silent region, b). 58 army - active formation, which took part at all Chechen wars and permanently helping to hunting terrorists, c). 100km - it's not a distance, it's about two hours of any truck on a dirt road.

No, I'm not ready to believe any stupid ideas, you're just jumping on something you thought you might be able to score points with. Sorry, but I don't do those sorts of games.

Maybe it would be better not to believe in opinions, but in facts?

But there's a difference between being deployed in 24 hours, and being ready to invade another country in 24 hours.

Great! So, it really wasn't any invasion to Georgia till 11th of August. 11th of August Russian forces took border town Zugdidi, found Georgian army mostly fleed - and 12th of August peace was established.

I heared, some units of GRU rode up to suburban of Tbilisi - but only to buy some bottles of vintage wine...)) Do you know - Georgian wine is really good and respectable...

So, basically the Russian Army was ready to invade Georgia, that's what you're saying? It's what I'm saying. You need a plan, you need troops ready, you need preparation.

And what? Every Army need to be prepared to any situation. Your NATO has a lot of plans to invade Russia, or striking Russia, or any kinds of war with Russia. If you saying, having plans is criminal - what can you say, for example, about this:

Operation Dropshot - Wikipedia
Plan Totality - Wikipedia
Operation Unthinkable - Wikipedia

And so on - just click on links...

BUT behind this discussion we have to see one - but most important thing -

You don't believe, 58th Army were able to deploy forces by one day. Instead of this reality... But it's not a problem.
Your General Staff, producing scenarios of Russian invasion of Baltic countries (what the hell we forget there after building Luga-seaport?) - they think about 50.000 of russian "invade forces" and cannot believe, Russia able to deploy 200.000 only in one day and about 200.000 else not so fast. It could be a problem for NATO plans, if this invasion becomes reality.
But some people in your goverment and candidates to be president also cannot trust in nuclear weapon in Russia, listening a lot of own propaganda about "broken russian economics" and so on. Instead of reality - it's not a problem to make any nukes for country, having outstanding rocket and nuclear technologies (even US don't have any fast neutron reactors and buying rocket engines here). And this problem could become the problem of whole world, if new US president could want to check real presence of nukes in Russia.[/QUOTE]

Yes, NATO would have plans in place. However they wouldn't be able to invade tomorrow.

As for it not being a problem to invade in one day, maybe not for you. For the Russian Army almost certainly.

My govt? What govt would that be?

 

[charwin95]

You didn't post anything credible that tickled me..

I seldom post anything that supports your view, is what you mean to say.

And you never answer ANY of my questions.

I have, and I do. It's just that my comments go way over your head so you skip whole sentences and paragraphs. Just look at your query about American support of ISIS. I sent you a link that explains everything you need to know. You ignored it. You are not doing very well in this debate about Russia's aggression/non-aggression towards the US. I think you bit off more than you can chew.

Let me repeat what I said......... You post a link like it's tucked in somewhere in Gulag. And you make it sound that you are the only one that has access. I'm very familiar with all those links. So tell me something I don't know.......
No comrade you have not answer my questions. Answer my question start with post #263. Do not give me a conspiracy answer or a lie............ like Hillary gave the 2300 humvees to ISIS as a gift. That's not true.
You ask me question about conspiracy.... And I answered your question. Then you are trying to duck or deflect.

 

[GLASNOST]

... you are trying to duck or deflect.

Yes, that's right. I am 'ducking' .... right in your face .... and also deflecting or batting .... batting your excuses, disinformation & misinformation right into the rubbish bin.

 

[Sbiker]

You didn't post anything credible that tickled me..

I seldom post anything that supports your view, is what you mean to say.

And you never answer ANY of my questions.

I have, and I do. It's just that my comments go way over your head so you skip whole sentences and paragraphs. Just look at your query about American support of ISIS. I sent you a link that explains everything you need to know. You ignored it. You are not doing very well in this debate about Russia's aggression/non-aggression towards the US. I think you bit off more than you can chew.

Let me repeat what I said......... You post a link like it's tucked in somewhere in Gulag. And you make it sound that you are the only one that has access. I'm very familiar with all those links. So tell me something I don't know.......
No comrade you have not answer my questions. Answer my question start with post #263. Do not give me a conspiracy answer or a lie............ like Hillary gave the 2300 humvees to ISIS as a gift. That's not true.
You ask me question about conspiracy.... And I answered your question. Then you are trying to duck or deflect.

She didn't gave them Humvees as a gift. It happens out of her control...

Do you think, who cannot control even 2300 Humvees - can be a good president?

 

[charwin95]

... you are trying to duck or deflect.

Yes, that's right. I am 'ducking' .... right in your face .... and also deflecting or batting .... batting your excuses, disinformation & misinformation right into the rubbish bin.

So you clearly admitted that you are deflecting and ducking because you don't know anything. Next time try to deal with reality not about lies and conspiracy theory. Lightweight.

 

[charwin95]

You didn't post anything credible that tickled me..

I seldom post anything that supports your view, is what you mean to say.

And you never answer ANY of my questions.

I have, and I do. It's just that my comments go way over your head so you skip whole sentences and paragraphs. Just look at your query about American support of ISIS. I sent you a link that explains everything you need to know. You ignored it. You are not doing very well in this debate about Russia's aggression/non-aggression towards the US. I think you bit off more than you can chew.

Let me repeat what I said......... You post a link like it's tucked in somewhere in Gulag. And you make it sound that you are the only one that has access. I'm very familiar with all those links. So tell me something I don't know.......
No comrade you have not answer my questions. Answer my question start with post #263. Do not give me a conspiracy answer or a lie............ like Hillary gave the 2300 humvees to ISIS as a gift. That's not true.
You ask me question about conspiracy.... And I answered your question. Then you are trying to duck or deflect.

She didn't gave them Humvees as a gift. It happens out of her control...

Do you think, who cannot control even 2300 Humvees - can be a good president?

Another lie. How in the world you can post something so stupid like this?

The coward Iraqi army run for their life when ISIS took over the military installation in Mosul. The Iraqi army just simply ran.

Since when is Secretary of State job to stand and guard or responsible for these humvees? Is it her job to tell the Iraqi army to run or fight? Is it her job to make sure these army is capable of fighting? Is it her job to spoon fed these army? Im sure you and your buddy here can't answer any of this question.

 

[Wyatt earp]

I heared, some units of GRU rode up to suburban of Tbilisi - but only to buy some bottles of vintage wine...)) Do you know - Georgian wine is really good and respectable...

During Sovjet times, Georgian wine was the only wine worth drinking. Today, however, the Republic of Moldova makes some of the best wine in the world. I drink only red wine. But when I was in Chisinau I accidently bought a bottle of white wine because the bouteille was dark glass. I was disappointed when I opened it back home but when I tasted it I was shocked .... it was the best wine I've ever tasted in my life!

Yeah, and Georgian wine is very tasty too...

Some news on topic of this thread (unfortunately on russian): «Гроза авианосцев» встанет на службу Отечеству: реанимация проекта «Лунь»

Russia now really don't have a tools for attack US, only to defend. In fact, US could start seriously afraid of Russian invasion, when the project "Loon" would be reanimated to mass-production of transport variants, not early... How could else Russian forces can cross the Pacific ocean to invade?

What? Russia could be in Spain with in a week and the U.S. couldn't do a damn thing to stop it with the few heavy divisions they have in Germany,