Rick Santorum Is Insane

[jillian]

Replace GOP with DEMS and you have moveon.org.

Prove it. What rights has moveon tried to take away from you?

 

[dilloduck]

Prove it. What rights has moveon tried to take away from you?

The right to be free from seeing Cindy Sheehan on TV.

 

[jillian]

The right to be free from seeing Cindy Sheehan on TV.

I'll trade you for getting Annie Coulter out of circulation

 

[dilloduck]

I'll trade you for getting Annie Coulter out of circulation

No deal--Cindy has taken herself out but being just plain stupid.

 

[jillian]

No deal--Cindy has taken herself out but being just plain stupid.

You know I'm no fan of Cindy's either, right?

 

[dilloduck]

You know I'm no fan of Cindy's either, right?

Now I do----lets face it---a lot of politicians are crazy.

 

[MissileMan]

I think it would be only fair for the father of the baby to have some legal say in NOT letting the baby be aborted (Not that the father should be allowed to force a woman to HAVE an abortion).

And when some dirt bag can't find a woman to marry him, he can rape one and force her to carry his child to term?

It seems to me your fair scale is out of balance.

 

[jillian]

And when some dirt bag can't find a woman to marry him, he can rape one and force her to carry his child to term?

It seems to me your fair scale is out of balance.

Nah...she just thinks women are subservient so men should be the deciders.

 

[Nienna]

And when some dirt bag can't find a woman to marry him, he can rape one and force her to carry his child to term?

It seems to me your fair scale is out of balance.

I don't hear of too many rapists desiring to marry their rape victims. Nor is pregnancy a common result of rape. And I never said the woman should be forced to marry the man. The VAST majority of abortions are elective procedures. Just think it's only fair to acknowledge that it is also the man's child. He should also have a choice about whether or not it is allowed to live and grow.

And, Jillian... I don't know you, personally, at all, and you don't know me. Please stop speaking in my name. You don't know my mind or my heart. I do not presume to do that to you.

 

[MissileMan]

I don't hear of too many rapists desiring to marry their rape victims. Nor is pregnancy a common result of rape. And I never said the woman should be forced to marry the man. The VAST majority of abortions are elective procedures. Just think it's only fair to acknowledge that it is also the man's child. He should also have a choice about whether or not it is allowed to live and grow.

I said nothing about a rapist marrying his victim, only insisting his victim carry his child to term if he gets her pregnant. Marriage has nothing to do with it. In reality, a rapist could, once he's forced his victim to give birth to his child, sue for custody, especially if the woman wanted nothing to do with the fruit of her assault. As to giving the man a say in the decision, I notice you think that he should have a say, but only if he is in agreement with YOUR position on abortion. That was why I said your scale is out of balance.

 

[dilloduck]

I said nothing about a rapist marrying his victim, only insisting his victim carry his child to term if he gets her pregnant. Marriage has nothing to do with it. In reality, a rapist could, once he's forced his victim to give birth to his child, sue for custody, especially if the woman wanted nothing to do with the fruit of her assault. As to giving the man a say in the decision, I notice you think that he should have a say, but only if he is in agreement with YOUR position on abortion. That was why I said your scale is out of balance.

Moot point---women would NEVER assent to giving a man the right to choose to abort his own. It's a power trip.

 

[Gem]

MissileMan,

I don't think that you are being in anyway fair to Nienna in this discussion. She has stated only that men should have some say, not the only say, not the more important say. You and jillian have put words into her mouth - quite harshly implying that she thinks rapists should be able to tell their victims what to do and that women should be subservient to men. This is not productive, nor is it fair.

I do not think it should be a shocking, controversial statement to say that perhaps men should have some rights when it comes to the child that they helped to create. They obviously are expected to pay for the raising of children that women decide to carry - even if the man does not want to woman to carry the child to term - so we, as a society, acknowledge that a man has RESPONSIBILITY for his children. Why then, is it so outrageous to state that maybe a man should have some rights regarding that child before it is born?

I do not think that this needs to mean that his say is automatically taken over the woman's...nor that it automatically has to mean that a woman feels men are superior or rapists should be able to make their victims have their babies.

Considering that our nation is now looking at several lawsuits from men who are suing for their right to have no obligation to the women they have gotten pregant what-so-ever...we may want to stop and reconsider what cutting men out of the loop altogether will mean for our society?


Lets keep it rational and fair...please.

 

[MissileMan]

Moot point---women would NEVER assent to giving a man the right to choose to abort his own. It's a power trip.

And I'm not suggesting that men get any say in the matter.

 

[MissileMan]

MissileMan,

I don't think that you are being in anyway fair to Nienna in this discussion. She has stated only that men should have some say, not the only say, not the more important say. You and jillian have put words into her mouth - quite harshly implying that she thinks rapists should be able to tell their victims what to do and that women should be subservient to men. This is not productive, nor is it fair.

I do not think it should be a shocking, controversial statement to say that perhaps men should have some rights when it comes to the child that they helped to create. They obviously are expected to pay for the raising of children that women decide to carry - even if the man does not want to woman to carry the child to term - so we, as a society, acknowledge that a man has RESPONSIBILITY for his children. Why then, is it so outrageous to state that maybe a man should have some rights regarding that child before it is born?

I do not think that this needs to mean that his say is automatically taken over the woman's...nor that it automatically has to mean that a woman feels men are superior or rapists should be able to make their victims have their babies.

Considering that our nation is now looking at several lawsuits from men who are suing for their right to have no obligation to the women they have gotten pregant what-so-ever...we may want to stop and reconsider what cutting men out of the loop altogether will mean for our society?


Lets keep it rational and fair...please.

I haven't placed any words in Nienna's mouth. She advocates giving the biological father an input into whether a child is carried to term. A rapist who impregnates his victim would fall into the category of biological father. Are you going to make an exclusion for rapists? If that exclusion is added to any legislation, how long before a woman claims rape to circumvent the wishes of the father?

And let's not kid ourselves, if Nienna had her way, a biological father could veto an abortion with no recourse for the woman.

 

[dilloduck]

And I'm not suggesting that men get any say in the matter.

Neither are the feminazis----they don't want men involved in making any reproductive decision other than castration. They want control--they dont care if it's a person or not. It's just a great strawman that has kept the discussion limited to the unknowable. Slick move.

 

[MissileMan]

Neither are the feminazis----they don't want men involved in making any reproductive decision other than castration. They want control--they dont care if it's a person or not. It's just a great strawman that has kept the discussion limited to the unknowable. Slick move.

Does the tone of your post reflect that you believe men should have veto power over an abortion of an egg that they've fertilized?

 

[dilloduck]

Does the tone of your post reflect that you believe men should have veto power over an abortion of an egg that they've fertilized?

If women have it, men should have it.

 

[MissileMan]

If women have it, men should have it.

Women have ovaries...have you scheduled your implantation surgery yet?

 

[dilloduck]

Women have ovaries...have you scheduled your implantation surgery yet?

Men have wallets--since when do women have the right to steal them?

 

[MissileMan]

Men have wallets--since when do women have the right to steal them?

So now your argument is if men have them, women shouldn't also? You're all over the place. Think on it a while and provide a post with an explanation of your position on a father's reproductive rights.