Resurrection

[Bill O'Olberman]

Yet have you proof that the all powerful and vengeful flying Flying Spaghetti Monster or the Invisible Pink Unicorn do not exists.

We do? Did we ever make the claim that either of them dont exist? In fact, have you ever made the claim they do? If you have reason to believe in such things then believe in them.

Find me twelve witnesses who will sincerely testify with power to what they have seen and maybe people will believe them as well. What I can tell you is that I know God is real. Ive felt His power, His glory, His love and recognize Him. I am a witness. Ive seen miracles. Ive been healed by the power of God. Ive taught with it. Ive been taught by it. Ive seen God change lives, particularly my own. After having all these witnesses, why should I deny Him?

Has the Spaghetti monster changed your life? Has it healed you? Has it given you power to heal and to teach? How about the Invisible Pink Unicorn?

If your god would send people who have lived a moral, just, and deligent life to "hell" simply because they didnt embrace Jesus Christ then fuck em i would rather go to hell. What about peoples who have never been exposed to Christianity? Are they just destined to go to hell as well?

No one. but one, has lived a just and moral life. If they had, the atonement would be irrelevant. They wouldnt need God to pay the requirements of justice. They wouldnt need mercy.

Only one person has lived a just and moral life, and He chose to go to hell to free the captives. He descended below all things to lift us above them all. He purchased our souls in blood and suffered so we wouldn't have to.

You don't even know what hell is. You dont understand the nature of man, nor His potential. You could know if you studied and sought the Truth. But you believe you already know, and so you will never know until you are humbled to a point where you need to find it.

I can promise you that in the day you need it, the Lord will extend His mercy to you. He will welcome you in open arms. He is always welcoming us with open arms. There are just alot of us who are too stubborn to look for Him.

Well my first point was rhetorical and was meant to point out the logical fallacy in your statement "yet you have no proof that it isn't true." The burden of proof in such a situtation rests on you, the one asserting than something exists.

I have talked to people who legitimately believe they have seen UFOs... So maybe Jesus is like a UFO... hmmm.

My opinion of a just and moral life then must differ from yours.

And actually I dont know "the truth." In fact if "the truth" can be articulated to man through a little book written by man then "the truth" to me would be a big disappointment. I kinda hope that what god has planned for man is much greater and more magical than we as humans can understand. Attempting to understand an entity that has to be much more complex than we are would have to be like an ant trying to explain the behavior of a human. So my objection to any religion and religious text rests upon the assumptions than god is perfect and man is inherently flawed. Therefore, any religious text not printed by god itself is going to be corrupted by man since we are inherently flawed. So I believe every religious text is bullshit since it is not the word of god... which would have to be perfect. I have faith in god just not faith in man, mans collection of stories, and religious institutions run by man.

And I reject the whole concept of prayer... why pray? God already knows whats gonna happen. It just seems like an utter waste of time. Is god so narcissistic that he desires 6 billion people every day to talk to him or does he require you to talk to him in order for some seemingly right thing to happen... like Joe for church having his cancer go into remission?

 

[trueblue]

Regardless, it was only written about way after the facts, 200 to 500 years later depending on the part of the bible, so that even if it's written that lots of people saw the resurrection, that's certainly not proof that 200 years later someone wrote that down. The whole book is total crap, not an eyewitness account.

You're accusing, yet you have no proof that it isn't true. But, boy, are you in a load of crap if it is, aren't you? That's okay. You've got plenty of company.

Yes I can prove that it isn't true: do you really think that if god existed and the bible and all its miracles were true that we'd not be able to find any proof of anything?
Also, you're believing just in case? Not only is that totally lame, but how do you know that you've chosen the right religion to believe in just in case, since you have no proof of anything, there's no way to know if you picked the right one.

No proof of anything?!! No proof?!! I'm afraid that if anyone is left out in the cold on this one it is you, friend. The long list of scientific evidences range from chariot wheel-shaped corals in the Red Sea to archeology finds in the Arabian deserts to millions of people willing to testify that they have had prayers answered or experience divine intervention. There exists more than enough evidence to win any court trial. No, proof isn't the problem. Nor do I believe "just in case." I know I have picked the right one because I have tested its claims and each one has held up. I know I have picked the right one because it works, because it enriches my life, because I have experienced it. I'm not a big fan of blind belief, see.

 

[JBeukema]

There are some mysteries that won't be revealed until our Savior comes again.

like the Thunder Judgments...

\
Regardless, it was only written about way after the facts, 200 to 500 years later depending on the part of the bible, so that even if it's written that lots of people saw the resurrection, that's certainly not proof that 200 years later someone wrote that down. The whole book is total crap, not an eyewitness account.

Actually, some parts are believed to have been written within within 50 years of the events, according to the latest criticisms I've read

Which many churches tried to get banned from public libraries because it was so "anti-christian".

I never understood that...

Although Aslan can be read as an original character, there are parallels with the character and story of Christ. In particular, Aslan's sacrifice and subsequent resurrection parallel Christ's crucifixion and resurrection. Aslan also has God-like powers; he created Narnia with a song (The Magician’s Nephew). The Emperor-Over-the-Sea then refers to God the Father, and Aslan’s country (The Voyage of the Dawn Treader) to heaven. In The Last Battle a new Narnia is made and also a new Earth, as in the Book of Revelation. Furthermore, there are biblical references of Christ being called a lion, as in Revelation 5:5 "And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof." (KJV)
According to the author, Aslan is not an allegorical portrayal of Christ, but rather a different, hypothetical, incarnation of Christ himself:

If Aslan represented the immaterial Deity, he would be an allegorical figure. In reality however, he is an invention giving an imaginary answer to the question, 'What might Christ become like if there really were a world like Narnia and He chose to be incarnate and die and rise again in that world as He actually has done in ours?' This is not allegory at all.

​

This interpretation is related to J. R. R. Tolkien's concept of "secondary creation" expounded in his 1947 essay "On Fairy-Stories," reflecting discussions Lewis and Tolkien had in the Inklings group.

(Wikipedia) (emphasis added)

We do? Did we ever make the claim that either of them dont exist?

So you acknowledge the existence of Hid Noodliness?

 

[Al Gunn]

You're accusing, yet you have no proof that it isn't true. But, boy, are you in a load of crap if it is, aren't you? That's okay. You've got plenty of company.

Yes I can prove that it isn't true: do you really think that if god existed and the bible and all its miracles were true that we'd not be able to find any proof of anything?
Also, you're believing just in case? Not only is that totally lame, but how do you know that you've chosen the right religion to believe in just in case, since you have no proof of anything, there's no way to know if you picked the right one.

No proof of anything?!! No proof?!! I'm afraid that if anyone is left out in the cold on this one it is you, friend. The long list of scientific evidences range from chariot wheel-shaped corals in the Red Sea to archeology finds in the Arabian deserts to millions of people willing to testify that they have had prayers answered or experience divine intervention. There exists more than enough evidence to win any court trial. No, proof isn't the problem. Nor do I believe "just in case." I know I have picked the right one because I have tested its claims and each one has held up. I know I have picked the right one because it works, because it enriches my life, because I have experienced it. I'm not a big fan of blind belief, see.

Chariot shaped corals? LOL! man you're dumb. You sure it wasn't jesus' face burned into a grilled cheese sandwich?
Archeological finds? Like what, rocks shaped in the form of Jesus' butt?
Millions of people who prayed and got what they wanted? Geez, if you pray every day for a job, eventually you'll find one. Is that divine intervention? Dunno...
So out of all the religions, you're sure you've picked the right one because... you're such a genius?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Yes I can prove that it isn't true: do you really think that if god existed and the bible and all its miracles were true that we'd not be able to find any proof of anything?
Also, you're believing just in case? Not only is that totally lame, but how do you know that you've chosen the right religion to believe in just in case, since you have no proof of anything, there's no way to know if you picked the right one.

No proof of anything?!! No proof?!! I'm afraid that if anyone is left out in the cold on this one it is you, friend. The long list of scientific evidences range from chariot wheel-shaped corals in the Red Sea to archeology finds in the Arabian deserts to millions of people willing to testify that they have had prayers answered or experience divine intervention. There exists more than enough evidence to win any court trial. No, proof isn't the problem. Nor do I believe "just in case." I know I have picked the right one because I have tested its claims and each one has held up. I know I have picked the right one because it works, because it enriches my life, because I have experienced it. I'm not a big fan of blind belief, see.

Chariot shaped corals? LOL! man you're dumb. You sure it wasn't jesus' face burned into a grilled cheese sandwich?
Archeological finds? Like what, rocks shaped in the form of Jesus' butt?
Millions of people who prayed and got what they wanted? Geez, if you pray every day for a job, eventually you'll find one. Is that divine intervention? Dunno...
So out of all the religions, you're sure you've picked the right one because... you're such a genius?

Another Nonbeliever so insecure in his non belief he feels the need to attack believers. I bet you get pissed when somebody wants to talk to you about God, don't ya? But here you are doing what they do but from the point of view that God does not exist. Are you PROUD of yourself, hypocrite?

 

[Al Gunn]

Yo RetardedGaySausarge, seriously, chariot wheel shaped corrals? wtf do corrals have to do with anything at all? I don't get it. Please explain it to me.
I'm just tired of believers saying that there's so much proof, yet never provide anything real.
Just show me the proof please or stfu.

Now go yell at your kids like a good sausarge.

 

[Avatar4321]

Yo RetardedGaySausarge, seriously, chariot wheel shaped corrals? wtf do corrals have to do with anything at all? I don't get it. Please explain it to me.
I'm just tired of believers saying that there's so much proof, yet never provide anything real.
Just show me the proof please or stfu.

Now go yell at your kids like a good sausarge.

Your disbelief in the credibility of the evidence does not at all create a lack of evidence. It would be nice if people acknowledged the difference between these.

 

[Avatar4321]

We do? Did we ever make the claim that either of them dont exist?

So you acknowledge the existence of Hid Noodliness?

I neither acknowledge or deny the existance. Quite frankly, I couldnt care less about the topic.

My point was, we werent making claims either way. So its dishonest to say we claim he doesnt exist when we arent addressing such a topic.

 

[k2skier]

I was killed 2 days ago and god brought me back to life today! Do you believe me?

The only proof that god exists is in the bible, WRITTEN BY MAN, gee what a convenient coincidence...

 

[JBeukema]

I was killed 2 days ago and god brought me back to life today! Do you believe me?

The only proof that god exists is in the bible, WRITTEN BY MAN, gee what a convenient coincidence...

liar. The universe only created ten minutes ago....

 

[k2skier]

I was killed 2 days ago and god brought me back to life today! Do you believe me?

The only proof that god exists is in the bible, WRITTEN BY MAN, gee what a convenient coincidence...

liar. The universe only created ten minutes ago....

I can remember 11 minutes ago, I AM GOD! Believe me now, fear me later.

 

[JBeukema]

I was killed 2 days ago and god brought me back to life today! Do you believe me?

The only proof that god exists is in the bible, WRITTEN BY MAN, gee what a convenient coincidence...

liar. The universe only created ten minutes ago....

I can remember 11 minutes ago, I AM GOD! Believe me now, fear me later.

Blasphemy!

When i created the world 10 minutes ago, I put false memories in your head, fossils in the grounds, and the light from the stars en route to earth to test your faith...

 

["b0xcar*girl*]

I believe that basing anything on the bible is crap. You might as well base your belief system on a Harry Potter novel, it's about as realistic as the bible. If Jesus had resurected, do you really think that only the apostles would have seen him and that he wouldn't show himself to everyone to prove his god?

I see what you are saying. However, think of it this way. Have you ever been into outer space to actually see that the earth is round????? Have you ever seen your stomach to know that it is really there????? Ever seen the wind.......not the effects, but the actual wind????? Lots of things we believe because someone told us. Perhaps religion is one of those.

One also might consider the historical evidence of any other well documented event in history. They might not have had video cameras, but everyone renders them as fact. Those were documented by men!!!!! Maybe they were as inaccurate in their recording as the Bible writers were. I guess that conclusion is up to the reader.

Check out 1 Corinthians 15:3-8. You might want to clarify disciples and apostles, and then just the general public.

 

[plt42]

I know there are many different viewpoints on resurrection.
What do y'all believe?

As I've stated before, I think the bible to be a work of historical fiction. Though not a religious belief, I think that accounts of the crucifiction of Jesus of Nazareth and his subsequent "resurection" could have some physiological and scientific validity.

It's fact that death by crucifiction is one of suffocation as fluids build up in the abdominal cavity, restricting the movement of the diaphragm and the appearance of no breathing. Curcifiction was usually accomplished over days but the bible reports Jesus was on the cross a matter of hours. As reported in the bible, a Roman soldier speared Jesus in the side which may have caused a release of the fluid build up of blood and water (acites) allowing the diaphragm to resume functioning. ... A request to remove him from the cross before sundown in accordance with Jewish burial custom was honored. Likely suffering from hypovolemic shock, he may have appeard dead. If, as recorded, he was placed in a cold rock tomb, his biological oxygen demand would have dropped and his own body would have restored circulating fluid volume and he could have regained consciousness.

Other factors surrounding the crucification foster more probabilities of this scenario.

For me, it's not a belief in what may or may not have happened. It's more of a thought process. But, one believes what one believes and I don't discount anyone's faith.

Just don't jump all over me. You asked!

 

[k2skier]

I believe that basing anything on the bible is crap. You might as well base your belief system on a Harry Potter novel, it's about as realistic as the bible. If Jesus had resurected, do you really think that only the apostles would have seen him and that he wouldn't show himself to everyone to prove his god?

I see what you are saying. However, think of it this way. Have you ever been into outer space to actually see that the earth is round????? Have you ever seen your stomach to know that it is really there????? Ever seen the wind.......not the effects, but the actual wind????? Lots of things we believe because someone told us. Perhaps religion is one of those.

One also might consider the historical evidence of any other well documented event in history. They might not have had video cameras, but everyone renders them as fact. Those were documented by men!!!!! Maybe they were as inaccurate in their recording as the Bible writers were. I guess that conclusion is up to the reader.

Check out 1 Corinthians 15:3-8. You might want to clarify disciples and apostles, and then just the general public.

So you believe the earth is flat and the sun revolves around the earth. Galileo was denounced by the church because of his findings, the church said the sun revolves around the earth and it was a fact the church believed in, Galileo's findings contradicted the bible...

 

[Avatar4321]

I was killed 2 days ago and god brought me back to life today! Do you believe me?

The only proof that god exists is in the bible, WRITTEN BY MAN, gee what a convenient coincidence...

The only proof that God exists in the Bible? That's news to me. I see proof everywhere. Particularly in prayer.

But since you've said its only in the Bible, I must be wrong. Now I know.

 

["b0xcar*girl*]

I believe that basing anything on the bible is crap. You might as well base your belief system on a Harry Potter novel, it's about as realistic as the bible. If Jesus had resurected, do you really think that only the apostles would have seen him and that he wouldn't show himself to everyone to prove his god?

I see what you are saying. However, think of it this way. Have you ever been into outer space to actually see that the earth is round????? Have you ever seen your stomach to know that it is really there????? Ever seen the wind.......not the effects, but the actual wind????? Lots of things we believe because someone told us. Perhaps religion is one of those.

One also might consider the historical evidence of any other well documented event in history. They might not have had video cameras, but everyone renders them as fact. Those were documented by men!!!!! Maybe they were as inaccurate in their recording as the Bible writers were. I guess that conclusion is up to the reader.

Check out 1 Corinthians 15:3-8. You might want to clarify disciples and apostles, and then just the general public.

So you believe the earth is flat and the sun revolves around the earth. Galileo was denounced by the church because of his findings, the church said the sun revolves around the earth and it was a fact the church believed in, Galileo's findings contradicted the bible...

Excellent observation!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Take note........you believe the church contradicted Galileo. Who documented that?????

No, I firmly believe the earth is round, and the earth revolves around the sun. how many Christians in the year 2009 do you know that swear the earth is flat??????? However, that it not the point.

The point is folks don't like the Bible (in this case, a discussion on the resurrection) because it causes them to think about themselves and their choices in life. So, the simplest and easiest thing to do which requires the least amount of self-examination is to say, "Well, that's too touchy, so I'll just say they were nuts."

Assuming in this conversation the resurrection is true (from my point of view), this might cause a person to stop and think about why Jesus died upon the cross. That might lead to an understanding and cinviction of sin, and that might just lead to repentance.

 

[JBeukema]

The only proof that God exists in the Bible? That's news to me. I see proof everywhere. Particularly in prayer.
.

Really? So all the controlled studies involving prayer-where god could show himself- that show that prayer has absolutely no positive effect and patients who were told they were being prayed for actually did worse (and, surprise! were less cooperative in their treatment)...

that's evidence for god?

 

[Al Gunn]

I see what you are saying. However, think of it this way. Have you ever been into outer space to actually see that the earth is round????? Have you ever seen your stomach to know that it is really there????? Ever seen the wind.......not the effects, but the actual wind????? Lots of things we believe because someone told us. Perhaps religion is one of those.

One also might consider the historical evidence of any other well documented event in history. They might not have had video cameras, but everyone renders them as fact. Those were documented by men!!!!! Maybe they were as inaccurate in their recording as the Bible writers were. I guess that conclusion is up to the reader.

Check out 1 Corinthians 15:3-8. You might want to clarify disciples and apostles, and then just the general public.

So you believe the earth is flat and the sun revolves around the earth. Galileo was denounced by the church because of his findings, the church said the sun revolves around the earth and it was a fact the church believed in, Galileo's findings contradicted the bible...

Excellent observation!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Take note........you believe the church contradicted Galileo. Who documented that?????

No, I firmly believe the earth is round, and the earth revolves around the sun. how many Christians in the year 2009 do you know that swear the earth is flat??????? However, that it not the point.

The point is folks don't like the Bible (in this case, a discussion on the resurrection) because it causes them to think about themselves and their choices in life. So, the simplest and easiest thing to do which requires the least amount of self-examination is to say, "Well, that's too touchy, so I'll just say they were nuts."

Assuming in this conversation the resurrection is true (from my point of view), this might cause a person to stop and think about why Jesus died upon the cross. That might lead to an understanding and cinviction of sin, and that might just lead to repentance.

Religion is more like a philosophy, not something that will likely ever be proven , like your earth story. The main delusion of religionites is that they equate scientific discoveries with religion by thinking that religion is just in the stage before we discover god, so therefore god must exist. Nobody's saying that scientists know everything, but at least they're still looking with an open mind. Religionites have long ago given up the search for the truth about our existance. You're soooo stuck in the past when humans needed stuff like religion to explain the world and the universe, which shows that our brain is still pretty close to a primitive state still.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I believe that basing anything on the bible is crap. You might as well base your belief system on a Harry Potter novel, it's about as realistic as the bible. If Jesus had resurected, do you really think that only the apostles would have seen him and that he wouldn't show himself to everyone to prove his god?

I see what you are saying. However, think of it this way. Have you ever been into outer space to actually see that the earth is round????? Have you ever seen your stomach to know that it is really there????? Ever seen the wind.......not the effects, but the actual wind????? Lots of things we believe because someone told us. Perhaps religion is one of those.

One also might consider the historical evidence of any other well documented event in history. They might not have had video cameras, but everyone renders them as fact. Those were documented by men!!!!! Maybe they were as inaccurate in their recording as the Bible writers were. I guess that conclusion is up to the reader.

Check out 1 Corinthians 15:3-8. You might want to clarify disciples and apostles, and then just the general public.

So you believe the earth is flat and the sun revolves around the earth. Galileo was denounced by the church because of his findings, the church said the sun revolves around the earth and it was a fact the church believed in, Galileo's findings contradicted the bible...

Now provide a passage in the Bible that says the Sun revolves around the Earth. You have made a claim, back it up.