CDZ Question!

[DandyDonovan]

The realization that leeching and blood letting weren't sound medical procedures?

Kinda like we now realize there are much better ways to secure the border than a medieval wall.

Okay.....explain them, okay?

Lots of ways. First step is to get more personnel to deal with the recent increase in asylum seekers so they don't have to wait months at normal points of entry. Other things include drones, more border patrol, sensors, etc.

It still wouldn't be enough personnel for the 1,000's of asylum seekers. Most just want in and then disperse before their day in court.
drones and sensors would only relay the breech, but not stop it.
Even hiring more border patrol wouldn't help in a porous border that we have.

If someone wants across a fence, they will get across a fence.

And yet in the areas where we have the fence, people aren't crossing. That's weird.

 

[BULLDOG]

A few leaches, or a good blood letting were prescribed for a sick person in the middle ages too. what's changed?

I kind of wished you would have debated what I stated. Walls work as well now as they did centuries ago.
Leeches and blood letting not so much.

No they don't.

Yes, they do

Walls can be gone over, under and through. Without electronic monitoring, or border patrol already there to see the breach the wall is useless to stop anybody. With electronic monitoring and more border patrol, the wall is not needed.

Yet, where we have good fences, there is little breaching over the walls, and only a trickle go by tunnel.
I have no idea just how many more border agents you want to hire and electronics only go so far as to monitor and not stop a breach.
The people on the ground at the borders say they want more walls.
I believe them and not some skirt and a clown on the hill. Steny Hoyer even says he wants a wall.

Why didn't they spend more than 10% of the 1.3 trillion allotted last year?

 

[Meister]

I kind of wished you would have debated what I stated. Walls work as well now as they did centuries ago.
Leeches and blood letting not so much.

No they don't.

Yes, they do

Walls can be gone over, under and through. Without electronic monitoring, or border patrol already there to see the breach the wall is useless to stop anybody. With electronic monitoring and more border patrol, the wall is not needed.

Yet, where we have good fences, there is little breaching over the walls, and only a trickle go by tunnel.
I have no idea just how many more border agents you want to hire and electronics only go so far as to monitor and not stop a breach.
The people on the ground at the borders say they want more walls.
I believe them and not some skirt and a clown on the hill. Steny Hoyer even says he wants a wall.

Why didn't they spend more than 10% of the 1.3 trillion allotted last year?

Makes me want to look at the details of that and not take some left wing talking point.

 

[DandyDonovan]

No they don't.

Yes, they do

Walls can be gone over, under and through. Without electronic monitoring, or border patrol already there to see the breach the wall is useless to stop anybody. With electronic monitoring and more border patrol, the wall is not needed.

Yet, where we have good fences, there is little breaching over the walls, and only a trickle go by tunnel.
I have no idea just how many more border agents you want to hire and electronics only go so far as to monitor and not stop a breach.
The people on the ground at the borders say they want more walls.
I believe them and not some skirt and a clown on the hill. Steny Hoyer even says he wants a wall.

Why didn't they spend more than 10% of the 1.3 trillion allotted last year?

Makes me want to look at the details of that and not take some left wing talking point.

He won't EVER provide a link because the numbers are completely made up.

 

[Meister]

JACOBSON: That is not accurate. So there was $1.6 billion which was earmarked for border security in the March 2018 omnibus spending bill.

KELLY: So to put that in plain English, that means Congress gave the Trump administration $1.6 billion this March for border funding.

JACOBSON: Correct.

KELLY: OK.

JACOBSON: However, it's supposed to be spent for existing projects. It's not supposed to be for a newly constructed wall along the lines of what the president has been advocating for.

KELLY: So how does he get the other half? How did he bump it up to 3.2 billion?

JACOBSON: We think what he was doing was he was adding in a $1.6 billion amount that was in a Senate spending bill proposal which was not actually passed and signed into law. He sort of jumped the gun and said that we've already got this money. Well, that version of the bill is several versions too old. And we still haven't gotten any additional 1.6 billion.
How Much Has Been Spent On A Border Wall So Far?


Always should do your own research

 

[DandyDonovan]

JACOBSON: That is not accurate. So there was $1.6 billion which was earmarked for border security in the March 2018 omnibus spending bill.

KELLY: So to put that in plain English, that means Congress gave the Trump administration $1.6 billion this March for border funding.

JACOBSON: Correct.

KELLY: OK.

JACOBSON: However, it's supposed to be spent for existing projects. It's not supposed to be for a newly constructed wall along the lines of what the president has been advocating for.

KELLY: So how does he get the other half? How did he bump it up to 3.2 billion?

JACOBSON: We think what he was doing was he was adding in a $1.6 billion amount that was in a Senate spending bill proposal which was not actually passed and signed into law. He sort of jumped the gun and said that we've already got this money. Well, that version of the bill is several versions too old. And we still haven't gotten any additional 1.6 billion.
How Much Has Been Spent On A Border Wall So Far?


Always should do your own research

Please, you assume he didn't know he made those numbers up. Just like he's completely avoiding the point that just 5 years ago Democrats voted FOR a steel barrier. And also in 2009 they voted for the fence.

What's changed since 2013?

 

[BULLDOG]

Kinda like we now realize there are much better ways to secure the border than a medieval wall.

Okay.....explain them, okay?

Lots of ways. First step is to get more personnel to deal with the recent increase in asylum seekers so they don't have to wait months at normal points of entry. Other things include drones, more border patrol, sensors, etc.

If those things would all do more than a fence, why did Democrats and Republicans vote for a fence in 2013?
In fact the last Democratic nominee for President stridently supported a fence in 2009.

There was 1.3 trillion allocated last year, but less than 10% of that has been spent. If Trump cared about border security instead of just building a stupid wall, he could have done lots with that money. He didn't

You wanna provide some proof of that?

I was mistaken. Working off of memory instead of looking at the actual figures. I apologize. The real number was 1.6 billion. in the omnibus spending package of which less than 10% has been spent.
https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

 

[DandyDonovan]

Okay.....explain them, okay?

Lots of ways. First step is to get more personnel to deal with the recent increase in asylum seekers so they don't have to wait months at normal points of entry. Other things include drones, more border patrol, sensors, etc.

If those things would all do more than a fence, why did Democrats and Republicans vote for a fence in 2013?
In fact the last Democratic nominee for President stridently supported a fence in 2009.

There was 1.3 trillion allocated last year, but less than 10% of that has been spent. If Trump cared about border security instead of just building a stupid wall, he could have done lots with that money. He didn't

You wanna provide some proof of that?

I was mistaken. Working off of memory instead of looking at the actual figures. I apologize. The real number was 1.6 billion. in the omnibus spending package of which less than 10% has been spent.
https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

But that is just the regular budget, there is no money for new construction and by law it can't be used for new construction, even if not spent.

 

[BULLDOG]

Kinda like we now realize there are much better ways to secure the border than a medieval wall.

Okay.....explain them, okay?

Lots of ways. First step is to get more personnel to deal with the recent increase in asylum seekers so they don't have to wait months at normal points of entry. Other things include drones, more border patrol, sensors, etc.

It still wouldn't be enough personnel for the 1,000's of asylum seekers. Most just want in and then disperse before their day in court.
drones and sensors would only relay the breech, but not stop it.
Even hiring more border patrol wouldn't help in a porous border that we have.

If someone wants across a fence, they will get across a fence.

And yet in the areas where we have the fence, people aren't crossing. That's weird.

Sure they are. You didn't see those pictures a few days ago when all those people dug under and lined up on the US side to wait on Border patrol to turn themselves in?

 

[WillowTree]

Nancy has a wall in California!

 

[BULLDOG]

No they don't.

Yes, they do

Walls can be gone over, under and through. Without electronic monitoring, or border patrol already there to see the breach the wall is useless to stop anybody. With electronic monitoring and more border patrol, the wall is not needed.

Yet, where we have good fences, there is little breaching over the walls, and only a trickle go by tunnel.
I have no idea just how many more border agents you want to hire and electronics only go so far as to monitor and not stop a breach.
The people on the ground at the borders say they want more walls.
I believe them and not some skirt and a clown on the hill. Steny Hoyer even says he wants a wall.

Why didn't they spend more than 10% of the 1.3 trillion allotted last year?

Makes me want to look at the details of that and not take some left wing talking point.

I already admitted my mistake. the real number was 1.6 billion in the Omnibus Spending Bill March 2018.

 

[BULLDOG]

Yes, they do

Walls can be gone over, under and through. Without electronic monitoring, or border patrol already there to see the breach the wall is useless to stop anybody. With electronic monitoring and more border patrol, the wall is not needed.

Yet, where we have good fences, there is little breaching over the walls, and only a trickle go by tunnel.
I have no idea just how many more border agents you want to hire and electronics only go so far as to monitor and not stop a breach.
The people on the ground at the borders say they want more walls.
I believe them and not some skirt and a clown on the hill. Steny Hoyer even says he wants a wall.

Why didn't they spend more than 10% of the 1.3 trillion allotted last year?

Makes me want to look at the details of that and not take some left wing talking point.

He won't EVER provide a link because the numbers are completely made up.

https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

 

[BULLDOG]

Lots of ways. First step is to get more personnel to deal with the recent increase in asylum seekers so they don't have to wait months at normal points of entry. Other things include drones, more border patrol, sensors, etc.

If those things would all do more than a fence, why did Democrats and Republicans vote for a fence in 2013?
In fact the last Democratic nominee for President stridently supported a fence in 2009.

There was 1.3 trillion allocated last year, but less than 10% of that has been spent. If Trump cared about border security instead of just building a stupid wall, he could have done lots with that money. He didn't

You wanna provide some proof of that?

I was mistaken. Working off of memory instead of looking at the actual figures. I apologize. The real number was 1.6 billion. in the omnibus spending package of which less than 10% has been spent.
https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

But that is just the regular budget, there is no money for new construction and by law it can't be used for new construction, even if not spent.

That's kinda my point. If he cared about security instead of just building a wall, the money would have been spent

 

[BULLDOG]

Nancy has a wall in California!

What a silly irrelevant remark.

 

[WillowTree]

If those things would all do more than a fence, why did Democrats and Republicans vote for a fence in 2013?
In fact the last Democratic nominee for President stridently supported a fence in 2009.

There was 1.3 trillion allocated last year, but less than 10% of that has been spent. If Trump cared about border security instead of just building a stupid wall, he could have done lots with that money. He didn't

You wanna provide some proof of that?

I was mistaken. Working off of memory instead of looking at the actual figures. I apologize. The real number was 1.6 billion. in the omnibus spending package of which less than 10% has been spent.
https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

But that is just the regular budget, there is no money for new construction and by law it can't be used for new construction, even if not spent.

That's kinda my point. If he cared about security instead of just building a wall, the money would have been spent

So why was this left? Why is this now Trump’s problem? Why don’t the democrats favor Americans over illegals?

 

[DandyDonovan]

Walls can be gone over, under and through. Without electronic monitoring, or border patrol already there to see the breach the wall is useless to stop anybody. With electronic monitoring and more border patrol, the wall is not needed.

Yet, where we have good fences, there is little breaching over the walls, and only a trickle go by tunnel.
I have no idea just how many more border agents you want to hire and electronics only go so far as to monitor and not stop a breach.
The people on the ground at the borders say they want more walls.
I believe them and not some skirt and a clown on the hill. Steny Hoyer even says he wants a wall.

Why didn't they spend more than 10% of the 1.3 trillion allotted last year?

Makes me want to look at the details of that and not take some left wing talking point.

He won't EVER provide a link because the numbers are completely made up.

https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

Point out what you found relevant in that document.

 

[WillowTree]

Nancy has a wall in California!

What a silly irrelevant remark.

No! Not irrelevant.

 

[Meister]

Okay.....explain them, okay?

Lots of ways. First step is to get more personnel to deal with the recent increase in asylum seekers so they don't have to wait months at normal points of entry. Other things include drones, more border patrol, sensors, etc.

If those things would all do more than a fence, why did Democrats and Republicans vote for a fence in 2013?
In fact the last Democratic nominee for President stridently supported a fence in 2009.

There was 1.3 trillion allocated last year, but less than 10% of that has been spent. If Trump cared about border security instead of just building a stupid wall, he could have done lots with that money. He didn't

You wanna provide some proof of that?

I was mistaken. Working off of memory instead of looking at the actual figures. I apologize. The real number was 1.6 billion. in the omnibus spending package of which less than 10% has been spent.
https://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/20180319/BILLS-115SAHR1625-RCP115-66.pdf

But, that money was not earmarked for a wall, Bulldog.
From my previous post, this: However, it's supposed to be spent for existing projects. It's not supposed to be for a newly constructed wall along the lines of what the president has been advocating for.

 

[Markle]

Because we have had a border with Mexico for 150 years

There are no absolutes. There are many other issues that affect border security .......Walls are a medieval solution to a modern problem

Why then is this happening? Why too does it work?

A World of Walls
Donald Trump’s proposal for the U.S.-Mexico border isn’t outdated. It’s a sign of the times.

URI FRIEDMANMAY 19, 2016

It's Not Just Donald Trump: Walls Are Going Up Around the World - The Atlantic

###

Why the world is building walls

TIM MARSHALL
CONTRIBUTED TO THE GLOBE AND MAIL
PUBLISHED AUGUST 3, 2018
[...]
The border wall between Israel and the West Bank is among the most forbidding and hostile in the world. Viewed from up close, whichever side you find yourself on, it rears up from the ground, overwhelming and dominating you. Faced by this blank expanse of steel and concrete, you are dwarfed not only by its size but by what it represents. You are on one side; “they” are on the other.
[...]
We are seeing walls being built along borders everywhere. Despite globalization and advances in technology, we seem to be feeling more divided than ever. Thousands of miles of walls and fences have gone up around the world in the 21st century. At least 65 countries, more than a third of the world’s nation-states, have built barriers along their borders; half of those erected since the Second World War sprang up between 2000 and now. Within a few years, the European nations could have more miles of walls, fences and barriers on their borders than there were at the height of the Cold War. They began by separating Greece and Macedonia, Macedonia and Serbia, and Serbia and Hungary, and as we became less shocked by each stretch of barbed wire, others followed suit – Slovenia began building on the Croatian border, the Austrians fenced off Slovenia, and Sweden put up barriers to prevent illegal immigrants crossing from Denmark, while Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania have all started on defensive fortifications on their borders with Russia.
[...]
Why the world is building walls

 

[Markle]

As true today as it was 1000 years ago
Ask the French how their investment in a wall paid off

South America is coming with tanks, heavy artillery, air bombings and hundreds of thousands of armed men? Who knew?

Nice try but, in real life, the Maginot Line proves walls work! Where did the Nazi's attack?

Due to economic reasons, France was never able to complete the wall, plus Adolph Hitler had already invaded and taken Belgium. Had it been completed, it would have slowed by not stopped Hitler due to the fact that France's military was far inferior to the Nazi's.

Had Great Britain and France, actually gone to war, in a major way, when they declared war on Germany in 1939, there never would have been a World War with Germany.

In the places shown on the map as being weak defenses, the defenses were virtually non-existent.

By Goran tek-en, CC BY-SA 3.0, File:Maginot Line ln-en svg.svg - Wikimedia Commons