I.P.Freely
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- May 8, 2014
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Bacon proves there is only one god,
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"God", "YHWH", and "Allah" all describe the same being.Not as a Christian, or as a Jew, a Muslim, or a Catholic... but as a monolatristic, perhaps even henotheistic, Pagan, do I worship YHWH.
Even though Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all have different culture, rituals, and ways of worshipping and understanding YHWH... these religions have a great deal of things in common, because they all worship the same deity.
In their own ways, they all worship YHWH.
In my own way, I worship YHWH.
Ash, If you worship YHWH does that mean you believe what He says?
Satan and Christ had things in common too. They quoted the same scripture. Does that make them the same?
God has a Son. Allah takes pride in not having a son. How are they the same deity?
"God", "YHWH", and "Allah" all describe the same being.Not as a Christian, or as a Jew, a Muslim, or a Catholic... but as a monolatristic, perhaps even henotheistic, Pagan, do I worship YHWH.
Even though Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all have different culture, rituals, and ways of worshipping and understanding YHWH... these religions have a great deal of things in common, because they all worship the same deity.
In their own ways, they all worship YHWH.
In my own way, I worship YHWH.
Ash, If you worship YHWH does that mean you believe what He says?
Satan and Christ had things in common too. They quoted the same scripture. Does that make them the same?
God has a Son. Allah takes pride in not having a son. How are they the same deity?
The mysteries of YHWH are only partially revealed through Christianity which can only attempt to understand that which is beyond comprehension.
The mysteries of YHWH are partially revealed through Islam. The mysteries of YHWH are partially revealed through Judaism. The mysteries of YHWH are partially revealed through other religions.
The mysteries of YHWH are partially revealed through other entities such as Angels, Demons, Djinn...
The mysteries of YHWH are partially revealed through praying directly to YHWH.
No one Holy Book can reveal all the mysteries of YHWH.
No one religion can reveal all the mysteries of YHWH.
And no mere human can learn all the mysteries of YHWH.
Bacon proves there is only one god,
That would seem to conflict with biblical tales and fables regarding the alleged apostles.You're suggesting that the gods actually wrote the bibles?
You have an s problem. God wrote the Bible.
I don't hit women or children, only cowards do that.So why would a woman want to be in a religion that allows men to beat them?
.....
a devout muslim woman will be obedient to her husband and a devout muslim man should be merciful with his obedient wife and not to hit or mistreat her.
if your objection is on that a wife should be obedient to her husband, so why you accept that the same woman got to work and be obedient to her boss / manager?
if your objection on the exceptionally allowed hitting action, so why you may be accepting parents hit their children?
we are subjected to many constraints in this life, you should study and be educated to have a good career. you should work to have money... you will be an old weak man or die sooner or later, we all have no choice of this and wise people adopt to these conditions.
worshiping the God and praying and putting you front to land and prostrate to the God is one of these constraints imposed on you. Those who refuse to do so, will be destinated to the hell.
so it is wise to accept that as you accept other forms of constraints.
God wrote the bible, but then men edited it many times. Apparently, god's not all that.That would seem to conflict with biblical tales and fables regarding the alleged apostles.You're suggesting that the gods actually wrote the bibles?
You have an s problem. God wrote the Bible.
It seems you have chosen to re-write both biblical tales and fables as well as the bibles.
Yes, the gods pounded out their bibles on a typewriter and those sheets of blue carbon paper. A huge hand appeared from the clouds and the bibles were magically delivered to humanity. Their admin skills being a bit wanting for efficiency, (smeared with all that whiteout), mankind was left to cobble together the first of the bibles as an attempt to resolve the errors and omissions.God wrote the bible, but then men edited it many times. Apparently, god's not all that.That would seem to conflict with biblical tales and fables regarding the alleged apostles.You're suggesting that the gods actually wrote the bibles?
You have an s problem. God wrote the Bible.
It seems you have chosen to re-write both biblical tales and fables as well as the bibles.
I find this thread a bit funny......
1) Your #1 has some problems to what we have observed at the Quantum mechanical level for physical systems. The physical laws are not as Iron clad here, but present us with a model in which we could use to guess at some of the possible results of a physical system.
In other words, determinism breaks down at the microscopic level.
#2) Alan Turing has presented numerous works on how two distinct systems can interact and create complex systems that seems highly efficient(but, at times, can be highly unstable!!).
In short, his work can be used as a counter-example to the idea that "complexity" and/or seemingly 'well designed" structures is proof for intelligence. It is possible that those "structures" can arise due to unintended interactions to different systems.
(A shorter version of what I am saying: Complexity and/or Order are not proof of intentions by an intelligent being and hence cannot be used as proof for a God)
#3) Your 3rd statement is not an accurate description of the global ecosystem.
A better(though not much more accurate, however) description is that the Earth's ecosystem is in a state of flux. In some cases, simple events has caused drastic and rapid effects, while in other cases, the effects are so slow and gradual that it may take 100s of millennia to notice even a small change.
Some of these "complicated" systems that you claim to work (or sustained?not sure of meaning here? to work) may seem to now when in fact it, may have suffered irreparable damage whose effects are too gradual for you to notice.
The fact that there is God and that he is only one is obvious and simply proved, it is independent of any religion.
we should first consider three points:
1) The universe is constrained by fixed laws, all beings dead or alive are constrained by these law.
2) The world is very complicated and well designed system, it should be designed by alive and capable entity.
3) The complicated systems in this world sustain to work, even with the many sources of degradation and randomness.
these three points leads directly to the conclusion that the world is created, supervised and constrained by an alive entity which shouldn't be constrained by any physical laws (otherwise it is part of the world not the creator of it).
why this entity should be unique?
assume it is not unique, and there is many entities that are unconstrained by any physical laws.
it is either one of them is more (stronger) than the others that means those others have constraints put on them by the stronger entity..... but this means they are not really unconstrained entities, they are like any other living being that are constrained.
or no one of them is more stronger than the others so every one of them is constrained by the others, but this means none of them are unconstrained.
in the two cases (or any other cases you can think of) there is a contradiction with the assumption that they are unconstrained.
so there is only one entity....... The God ..... Allah.
Allah is not constrained by any physical law, he is the creator, supervisor of all world including earth, skies, galaxies and every thing. The laws that govern this world is imposed by God.
I find this thread a bit funny......
1) Your #1 has some problems to what we have observed at the Quantum mechanical level for physical systems. The physical laws are not as Iron clad here, but present us with a model in which we could use to guess at some of the possible results of a physical system.
In other words, determinism breaks down at the microscopic level.
#2) Alan Turing has presented numerous works on how two distinct systems can interact and create complex systems that seems highly efficient(but, at times, can be highly unstable!!).
In short, his work can be used as a counter-example to the idea that "complexity" and/or seemingly 'well designed" structures is proof for intelligence. It is possible that those "structures" can arise due to unintended interactions to different systems.
(A shorter version of what I am saying: Complexity and/or Order are not proof of intentions by an intelligent being and hence cannot be used as proof for a God)
#3) Your 3rd statement is not an accurate description of the global ecosystem.
A better(though not much more accurate, however) description is that the Earth's ecosystem is in a state of flux. In some cases, simple events has caused drastic and rapid effects, while in other cases, the effects are so slow and gradual that it may take 100s of millennia to notice even a small change.
Some of these "complicated" systems that you claim to work (or sustained?not sure of meaning here? to work) may seem to now when in fact it, may have suffered irreparable damage whose effects are too gradual for you to notice.
1) i am already aware of quantum mechanics. I didn't claim this universe is deterministic.
the idea of determinism was - as to my knowledge- rooted to atheist and communist to deny the concept of responsibility of people to their actions. if it is all determined, all of our actions is rooted to some chemical reactions inside our brains. so the break of the idea of determinism was against them.
I believe that (there is choices) in this world, and we are responsible for our actions.
you try to give the impression that it is all probable not governed by physical lows. but this is simply not correct, micro particles are affected by these laws and beside that it seems like it also have (its own will).
the movement of electrons in an electric field is similar to a crowd of people that walks steep down-hill. they tend to move faster than normal conditions, but still have their own will to determine the velocity they walk by.
so your argument is no meaning to me.
2) i know a bout turing machine that it is used as a model for a basic computer. if you have more info about it give me links about it.
any way i am sure of what i said, i can't put some sand into a box, shake them many times, then expect an intel-core i7 processor to be manufactured by luck. if you can believe that, i have no help for you.
3) your argument is based on that (there is deterioration but it is slow). so my question:
if it degrades all the time, even if very slowly, when it evolved?
I find this thread a bit funny......
1) Your #1 has some problems to what we have observed at the Quantum mechanical level for physical systems. The physical laws are not as Iron clad here, but present us with a model in which we could use to guess at some of the possible results of a physical system.
In other words, determinism breaks down at the microscopic level.
#2) Alan Turing has presented numerous works on how two distinct systems can interact and create complex systems that seems highly efficient(but, at times, can be highly unstable!!).
In short, his work can be used as a counter-example to the idea that "complexity" and/or seemingly 'well designed" structures is proof for intelligence. It is possible that those "structures" can arise due to unintended interactions to different systems.
(A shorter version of what I am saying: Complexity and/or Order are not proof of intentions by an intelligent being and hence cannot be used as proof for a God)
#3) Your 3rd statement is not an accurate description of the global ecosystem.
A better(though not much more accurate, however) description is that the Earth's ecosystem is in a state of flux. In some cases, simple events has caused drastic and rapid effects, while in other cases, the effects are so slow and gradual that it may take 100s of millennia to notice even a small change.
Some of these "complicated" systems that you claim to work (or sustained?not sure of meaning here? to work) may seem to now when in fact it, may have suffered irreparable damage whose effects are too gradual for you to notice.
1) i am already aware of quantum mechanics. I didn't claim this universe is deterministic.
the idea of determinism was - as to my knowledge- rooted to atheist and communist to deny the concept of responsibility of people to their actions. if it is all determined, all of our actions is rooted to some chemical reactions inside our brains. so the break of the idea of determinism was against them.
I believe that (there is choices) in this world, and we are responsible for our actions.
you try to give the impression that it is all probable not governed by physical lows. but this is simply not correct, micro particles are affected by these laws and beside that it seems like it also have (its own will).
the movement of electrons in an electric field is similar to a crowd of people that walks steep down-hill. they tend to move faster than normal conditions, but still have their own will to determine the velocity they walk by.
so your argument is no meaning to me.
2) i know a bout turing machine that it is used as a model for a basic computer. if you have more info about it give me links about it.
any way i am sure of what i said, i can't put some sand into a box, shake them many times, then expect an intel-core i7 processor to be manufactured by luck. if you can believe that, i have no help for you.
3) your argument is based on that (there is deterioration but it is slow). so my question:
if it degrades all the time, even if very slowly, when it evolved?
1) The concept of determinism is rooted in the early theological development of the Catholic Church. It is very much related to the concept of the "Elect" and "Reprobates" and how some people are doomed to Damnation because it is their fate.
The philosophical basis for Free will comes a few centuaries later...
The philosophy and politics of Communism comes a millennium after Free Will and by this time, Christian theologians and philosophers had "debunked" determinism!!
Also, to add a little interesting tad bit about Communist philosophy and determinism--The communist philosophers did not argue for "determinism"!! they are argued that social structures and organizations had too great of an influence on individuals in society and dictated/restricted their potential roles choices in the society. Without these social structures, mans roles and choices will be dictated by his own Free Will.
An Aside: Note how the actual communist actually over-built the role of societal structure versus how the philosophical communist argued against it!
Even so, your decidedly turn to "politics". Also, your argument of an electron in an electric field as determined by the theory of Classical electric dynamics fails to explain why an electron cannot remain at rest on the absence of an Electric field and its motions and direction is not
1) The Philosophical argument of "Determinism" was a metaphysical arguement created by the Catholic Church to describe people as either "Reprobates" or the "Elect". Here, it was argued that some of us are doomed because that is our fate.
Free Will came centuaries later
Communism came a millenium later and by this time Christian philosophers and theologians, especially those of the Cathlic Church, had debunked Determinism as a philosophical concept. Also, the communist philosophers did not argue for "Determinism". I could tell you more about what they did argue about and the distinct differences between the philosophers and their politicians/activists but that is off topic.
Now, Determinism as a scientific concept(not the metaphysical one!!) is a Classical motion that suggests that all physical systems can be model accurately by the physical laws of the universe.
This is what you are arguing!!
That concept was disproved by the Quantum Mechanics!! Here, you think that your argument for motion of an electron in an electric field is definitive proof that all motion, despite conditions, can explained all things "deterministically".
However, what law governs the electron at rest in the absence of an external electric field--an even simpler physical system than the one you described? How is such a motion even "determined" beforehand?
First of all, the electron can not stay at rest in such a case!! Even worst, the velocity the electron takes is highly probable. It can go in any direction at any speed up to the speed of light from rest!!
By the way, Einstein had problems with Quantum Mechanics and the results--thus his statement "God does not play dice!!", so you are in good company!!
However, Einstein was wrong when it came to QM!
2. Alan Turing worked on many things, as well as Non-linear PDE's. I am not talking about the Turing machine, but coupled PDE's, the field I am referring to is Analytical Mathematics, not Theoretical Computer Science.
3. If you understood Turing's work on PDE's, you would not have asked that question.
However, If you understood the Heisenburg Uncertainty principle, then asking "How does a cannonball, shot point blank at a glass window, can land on the other side without shattering the glass?" would have been a nice retort!!
I don't hit women or children, only cowards do that.
You're equating being married to having a job? Even your boss isn't going to take your children from you and sell them. Your boss also didn't buy you, and you can quit anytime with no hard feelings. And if your boss mistreats you, you can get HIM fired.
The teachers aren't allowed to hit students, only cowards do that. Both my children did fine at school without being beaten. We live in a civilized society, you know, like with toilet paper and toothbrushes.I don't hit women or children, only cowards do that.
You're equating being married to having a job? Even your boss isn't going to take your children from you and sell them. Your boss also didn't buy you, and you can quit anytime with no hard feelings. And if your boss mistreats you, you can get HIM fired.
what about your children's teachers? does they hit them? if they don't, then i will wonder if they do their homework regularly.
you need to know more about islam instead of relying on black propaganda against islam.
The teachers aren't allowed to hit students, only cowards do that. Both my children did fine at school without being beaten. We live in a civilized society, you know, like with toilet paper and toothbrushes.
1) The concept of determinism is rooted in the early theological development of the Catholic Church. It is very much related to the concept of the "Elect" and "Reprobates" and how some people are doomed to Damnation because it is their fate.
The philosophical basis for Free will comes a few centuaries later...
The philosophy and politics of Communism comes a millennium after Free Will and by this time, Christian theologians and philosophers had "debunked" determinism!!
Also, to add a little interesting tad bit about Communist philosophy and determinism--The communist philosophers did not argue for "determinism"!! they are argued that social structures and organizations had too great of an influence on individuals in society and dictated/restricted their potential roles choices in the society. Without these social structures, mans roles and choices will be dictated by his own Free Will.
An Aside: Note how the actual communist actually over-built the role of societal structure versus how the philosophical communist argued against it!
Even so, your decidedly turn to "politics". Also, your argument of an electron in an electric field as determined by the theory of Classical electric dynamics fails to explain why an electron cannot remain at rest on the absence of an Electric field and its motions and direction is not
1) The Philosophical argument of "Determinism" was a metaphysical arguement created by the Catholic Church to describe people as either "Reprobates" or the "Elect". Here, it was argued that some of us are doomed because that is our fate.
Free Will came centuaries later
Communism came a millenium later and by this time Christian philosophers and theologians, especially those of the Cathlic Church, had debunked Determinism as a philosophical concept. Also, the communist philosophers did not argue for "Determinism". I could tell you more about what they did argue about and the distinct differences between the philosophers and their politicians/activists but that is off topic.
Now, Determinism as a scientific concept(not the metaphysical one!!) is a Classical motion that suggests that all physical systems can be model accurately by the physical laws of the universe.
This is what you are arguing!!
That concept was disproved by the Quantum Mechanics!! Here, you think that your argument for motion of an electron in an electric field is definitive proof that all motion, despite conditions, can explained all things "deterministically".
However, what law governs the electron at rest in the absence of an external electric field--an even simpler physical system than the one you described? How is such a motion even "determined" beforehand?
First of all, the electron can not stay at rest in such a case!! Even worst, the velocity the electron takes is highly probable. It can go in any direction at any speed up to the speed of light from rest!!
By the way, Einstein had problems with Quantum Mechanics and the results--thus his statement "God does not play dice!!", so you are in good company!!
However, Einstein was wrong when it came to QM!
2. Alan Turing worked on many things, as well as Non-linear PDE's. I am not talking about the Turing machine, but coupled PDE's, the field I am referring to is Analytical Mathematics, not Theoretical Computer Science.
3. If you understood Turing's work on PDE's, you would not have asked that question.
However, If you understood the Heisenburg Uncertainty principle, then asking "How does a cannonball, shot point blank at a glass window, can land on the other side without shattering the glass?" would have been a nice retort!!
1) i didn't support determinism. i was saying it is wrong idea!!!!!!!
2) PDE--> partial differential equations is this what you mean?
ok, i have good background on the subject. what is your argument? or where is the link that discuss what you mean?
anyway i'm still sure that an intel core i7 processor can't be obtained by shaking a box containing sand many times.
3)give me a link to what you mean. this is not an argument?!!!
I don't hit women or children, only cowards do that.
You're equating being married to having a job? Even your boss isn't going to take your children from you and sell them. Your boss also didn't buy you, and you can quit anytime with no hard feelings. And if your boss mistreats you, you can get HIM fired.
what about your children's teachers? does they hit them? if they don't, then i will wonder if they do their homework regularly.
you need to know more about islam instead of relying on black propaganda against islam.