Physics and why LWIR can not warm oceans... Info for a Clueless Senator Markey and alarmists..

[CrusaderFrank]

Record El Nino. Record weather disasters worldwide. Warming has now surpassed 1 degree C. But still the Frankie Boys of the world claim nothing at all is happening. They get their news directly from the aliens in the hollow moon.

Do'h! No rise!

Doh! DOH!!

 

[Crick]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Frank, I am going to report this post. I have used the term "excess heat". It has as much meaning as any two words, it simply has no specific meaning in the context of global warming. I have explained this to you repeatedly but you are simply too stupid to understand. Well, let's see if management can understand.

 

[Crick]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Making Progress on Crick? He wont even admit that he has no empirical evidence to support his religion.. He must be sick..

Making progress on your claim to have a degree in atmospheric physics?

Did you get albedo all figured out?

Did you actually read Cook et al's abstract?

Were you aware that greater than 97% of publishing climate scientists accept that the primary cause of the global warming witnessed over the last century is human activity: GHG emissions and deforestation?

Did you realize that your only explanation for that warming is to claim that it hasn't actually taken place? Did you realize how well that fits with the meme of an ostrich sticking its head in the sand?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Frank, I am going to report this post. I have used the term "excess heat". It has as much meaning as any two words, it simply has no specific meaning in the context of global warming. I have explained this to you repeatedly but you are simply too stupid to understand. Well, let's see if management can understand.

So you're reporting that excess heat is a meaningless concept or are you looking to have a mod help your squid ink retreat

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Frank, I am going to report this post. I have used the term "excess heat". It has as much meaning as any two words, it simply has no specific meaning in the context of global warming. I have explained this to you repeatedly but you are simply too stupid to understand. Well, let's see if management can understand.

"Excess heat is a phrase. It has no official scientific definition in the world of physics or thermodynamics or climate science" --Crick

 

[Coyote]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Do you have a quote from Crick for that?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Do you have a quote from Crick for that?

"Excess heat is a phrase. It has no official scientific definition in the world of physics or thermodynamics or climate science" --Crick

Did you check the post above?

Are you on Crick Defense Detail?

 

[Coyote]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Do you have a quote from Crick for that?

"Excess heat is a phrase. It has no official scientific definition in the world of physics or thermodynamics or climate science" --Crick

Did you check the post above?

Are you on Crick Defense Detail?

That is not saying it's "fiction"

 

[rdean]

Increased evaporation means water is getting cooler?

Put a pan of water on your stove and turn on the heat. When evaporation is really pouring out of the water, stick your hand into the water and see how cool it is.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Do you have a quote from Crick for that?

Notice, I didn't directly quote your pal Crick

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Do you have a quote from Crick for that?

"Excess heat is a phrase. It has no official scientific definition in the world of physics or thermodynamics or climate science" --Crick

Did you check the post above?

Are you on Crick Defense Detail?

That is not saying it's "fiction"

I didn't directly quote him, I paraphrased his rejection of "excess heat"

 

[SSDD]

LOL. Now SSDD is claiming that photons carry no energy. LOL. He failed third grade physics for sure.

All lies all the time with you...isn't it. But feel free to provide a quote by me stating that photons carry no energy if you care to prove that you aren't a bald faced liar...

 

[mamooth]

Physics tells us that CO2 emitted LWIR (Long Wave Infrared Radiation) CANNOT influence anything but INCREASED evaporation rates which, actually cools the body of water.

That's absurd and contrary to the evidence. This stuff has been measured, you know. Scientists have actually put very sensitive instruments at the skin layer and shown that backradiation does not significantly increase evaporation. Backradiation simply does not raise the temperature of the skin enough to cause significantly more evaporation. Instead, it slows heat loss out of the ocean, which heats the oceans by increasing the heat that remains in the oceans,

Time for my lesson again concerning how backradiation heats the ocean. This diagram show how the ocean works during the daytime. Note that the vertical axis is a sort of log scale.

Most of the solar energy, contained in the visible and UV spectrum, penetrates deeply and warms the water. Convection causes warmer water to rise, so the oceans get warmer as they get shallower.

However, that trend reverses at the skin layer. The atmosphere is usually colder than the ocean below, so the ocean at the surface loses heat to the cooler atmosphere, which lowers the temperature of the skin layer by about 1C.

The amount of heat flowing out the oceans depends on the delta-T across that skin layer. Heat conducts from hot to cold, linearly proportionally to the temperature difference. With more of a temperature gradient, more heat flows out of the oceans. Less of a gradient, less outflow.

Enter the IR radiation. It heats the skin layer, decreasing the delta-T across the skin layer, so less heat flows out of the oceans. The IR doesn't heat the deeper ocean directly. It reduces the heat flow out of the deeper ocean, so more heat stays in the deeper ocean, so the IR indirectly warms the deeper ocean.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

LOL. Now SSDD is claiming that photons carry no energy. LOL. He failed third grade physics for sure.

All lies all the time with you...isn't it. But feel free to provide a quote by me stating that photons carry no energy if you care to prove that you aren't a bald faced liar...

Coyote is hanging around, ask him/her to look into this

 

[Crick]

Long wave radiation is less efficient at heating the oceans than is short wave radiation, but the claim that it doesn't heat it at all or that it cools it, is simple ignorance.

A molecule of water released from the liquid state has more energy than one in the liquid state. It is there, after all, because it absorbed sufficient energy to to break the bonds that were holding it in the liquid state. You CAN cool water by forcing evaporation via pressure change. You cannot cool it with evaporation forced by heating. That evaporation REQUIRES the temperature first rise.

The energy which goes in to evaporation can come from any of several sources: mixing with water from below, conducted and/or convected from air above or from any form of impinging EM radiation. The idea that LW energy ONLY goes into evaporation is simply stupid.

 

[Crick]

Well he made the comment without realizing that AR5 bases its "the oceans ate my warming" conclusion on the concept of "Excess heat" So as soon as I pointed out to him that excess heat is important to AR5, he started dialing back his ridicule of the concept.

I read AR5, Crick --not so much

Let's see some AR5 Frank. Let's see where AR5 or I use the phrase "the oceans ate my warming" as your text here strenuously implies. Let's see where AR5 bases deep ocean warming on some specific definition of "excess heat".

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Making Progress on Crick? He wont even admit that he has no empirical evidence to support his religion.. He must be sick..

Well he made the comment without realizing that AR5 bases its "the oceans ate my warming" conclusion on the concept of "Excess heat" So as soon as I pointed out to him that excess heat is important to AR5, he started dialing back his ridicule of the concept.

I read AR5, Crick --not so much

Let's see some AR5 Frank.

"About 93% of the excess heat energy stored by the Earth over the last 50 years is found in the ocean..." p 260

"The Earth is absorbing more heat than it is emitting back into space, and nearly all this excess heat is entering the oceans and being stored there...." p 266

"Excess heat or cold entering at the ocean surface (top curvy red arrows) also mixes slowly downward (sub-surface wavy red arrows)." -- p 267

http://www.ipcc.ch/pdf/assessment-report/ar5/wg1/WG1AR5_Chapter03_FINAL.pdf

Need more? Fairly obvious to everyone now that you never read AR5, isn't it?

 

[SSDD]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Making Progress on Crick? He wont even admit that he has no empirical evidence to support his religion.. He must be sick..

Well he made the comment without realizing that AR5 bases its "the oceans ate my warming" conclusion on the concept of "Excess heat" So as soon as I pointed out to him that excess heat is important to AR5, he started dialing back his ridicule of the concept.

I read AR5, Crick --not so much

Let's see some AR5 Frank.

Its clear that you have A) either never looked at the paper or B)looked at it but found it all way over your head...Here are the first two instances I came across...took about a minute to find them.

section 12.4.3.1

Arctic ampli cation (de ned as the 67.5 N° to 90°N warming compared to the global average warming for 2081–2100 versus 1986–2005) peaks in early winter (November to December) with a CMIP5 RCP4.5 multi-model mean warming for 67.5°N to 90°N exceeding the global average by a factor of more than 4. The warming is smallest in summer when excess heat at the Arctic surface goes into melting ice or is absorbed by the ocean, which has a relatively large thermal inertia.

Section 12.5.2

Loss of excess heat from the ocean will lead to a positive surface air temperature anomaly for decades to centuries

 

[SSDD]

And yet.....he can provide data to support his claims....where is that empirical data that proves the most basic claim of the AGW hypothesis?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Even Crick admitted that "Excess heat" was a fiction and didn't make any sense

Making Progress on Crick? He wont even admit that he has no empirical evidence to support his religion.. He must be sick..

Well he made the comment without realizing that AR5 bases its "the oceans ate my warming" conclusion on the concept of "Excess heat" So as soon as I pointed out to him that excess heat is important to AR5, he started dialing back his ridicule of the concept.

I read AR5, Crick --not so much

Let's see some AR5 Frank.

"About 93% of the excess heat energy stored by the Earth over the last 50 years is found in the ocean..." p 260

"The Earth is absorbing more heat than it is emitting back into space, and nearly all this excess heat is entering the oceans and being stored there...." p 266

"Excess heat or cold entering at the ocean surface (top curvy red arrows) also mixes slowly downward (sub-surface wavy red arrows)." -- p 267

http://www.ipcc.ch/pdf/assessment-report/ar5/wg1/WG1AR5_Chapter03_FINAL.pdf

Need more? Fairly obvious to everyone now that you never read AR5, isn't it?

No. But it's fairly obvious to everyone here that you haven't the brains god give a rubber duck.

Right, Crick. But I read AR5, why didn't you?