Palestinians Massing At The Israeli Border

[Billo_Really]

Now, what exactly was in those homes that Israel had to fire against them?

Hidden rockets? Military base?

Are you discounting all the mosques, schools, hospitals, homes where Hamas and Islamic Jihad hide and keep weapons, rockets, etc and actually hide in?

All of the above does become a military target according to the laws of Combat.


Of course I do not know the answer, but......

would it not be much better for both military groups to simply stay away from civilian centers and create a defense where homes, mosques, hospitals, schools, would not have to end up being targeted because both groups are using civilian areas in order to fire rockets into Israel from?

None of those houses in the photo had to be targeted.
If only Hamas and Islamic Jihad had not used those homes as military bases.


Actions have consequences .

The fact that you don't know what was in those homes, means you cannot target them.

When is Israel going to give up all of its weapons?

 

[dannyboys]

Westsplaining.

The demonstrators are not demanding an end to the blockade. They are demanding to flood Israel with six million Arabs, many of whom actively desire to murder Jews, by their own words.

Also I'm not entirely sure how you would suggest to Israel that they check ID with a sniper rifle. Although, Hamas could certainly prevent children from engaging in the protest and are, according to international law, absolutely obligated to do so.

A 14 year old kid was just looking for work and you shot him!

Last month, a 14-year-old Palestinian from Gaza, Hasan Shalabi, was fatally shot in the chest by an Israeli sniper. He had been looking for work and food for his family when he became one of dozens of children killed by the Israeli army during the Great March of Return protests.​

You shot another Palestinian in the back of the head when he was just smoking a cigarette. You shot a first responder in the chest while giving care to the wounded. And you shot a reporter wearing a large yellow vest indicating he was a member of the media. You and your country are sick people. You make up these bullshit lies just so you can murder innocent, peaceful, unarmed Palestinian's protesting the brutal occupation you are forcing them to live under.

These people just want to go home, not kill Jews.

One man, Hassan Hijazi from Jaffa, made it hundreds of kilometres to the coastal city before handing himself in to Israeli authorities.
​

If he wanted to kill Jews, he wouldn't have voluntarily turned himself in to Israeli authorities.

What are all those things that explode when they land called? Who is launching them. Aimed at who? Intended to do what?
The Arabs put in with the Germans in both world wars with the express purpose to help exterminate every Jew on the planet!
The LON after the second war decided to teach the Arabs a lesson they will NEVER forget.

 

[Hollie]

One year on, the Great March of Return protests have become a manifestation of ultimate despair. The effects of the siege and occupation have left more than half of Palestinians in Gaza living in abject poverty, many with serious mental and physical health conditions.​

Oh the despair, the poverty

 

[Billo_Really]

Not one Israeli in Gaza to make it a "brutal occupation" or an occupation of Any Kind.

But.....Palestinians protest Hamas, and this is what happens.

Imagine, all the money Hamas gets from Iran and still......they want more from the Gaza population. Cruel, simply cruel.

In Gaza, Hamas Cracks Down On Palestinians Protesting Newly Imposed Taxes

Hamas Crackdown on Gaza Protests Instills Fear

You do not have to have a standing army in the territory to satisfy the definition of an occupation. If you maintain "effective control" over the area, then that is an occupation.

 

[Sixties Fan]

You are just avoiding my question. What do you think would happen if Gaza stopped attacking Israel completely?

You would just move the goal posts and make up another excuse to maintain the siege, because the bottom line is, you do not want peace.

This aggression that Israel started that you keep mentioning...Do you mean the blockade?

Don't give me this "deer-in-the-headlights" bullshit, you know what I am referring to.

One year on, the Great March of Return protests have become a manifestation of ultimate despair. The effects of the siege and occupation have left more than half of Palestinians in Gaza living in abject poverty, many with serious mental and physical health conditions.​

[ let us see you read the whole thing and answer each point ]

Do you realize that it is a "March of Return", not a march about our conditions are deplorable (that is something they did against Hamas ) ?
Do you realize that Gaza is their home?
Do you realize that what they are talking about is ALL of Israel for ALL of them to return to?
Do you realize that the population which comes to the border do so because they are being offered money to do so, and more if they are injured or killed?
Do you realize that since 1920 the Arabs have refused to allow the Jews to achieve self determination via many riots, expulsions and then war, in 1948, 1967, 1973 and on.

Do you realize what the Palestinian map of Palestine means?

PA Education Minister presents child poet with plaque with map of “Palestine” replacing Israel - "Palestine" replaces Israel | PMW


Do you realize which area the Palestinians are referring to as being "Occupied"?

Is Hamas complaining about "conditions and occupation" in Gaza?

Or is Hamas and the population in Gaza complaining about Jews "occupying" what has been Israel since 1948/1967?

In other words, the people of Gaza are not being taught to make peace with Israel, to live alongside with Israel, they are being taught that Israel is THEIR home, regardless of how many actually were told to leave by their leaders, or expelled from their aggression against Israel because of the 1948 war.


That is what they are rioting about, that is what they are marching for.

RETURN ......to Israel.....where they will take over and turn Israel into another Arab/Muslim majority State....unless they have given up on the Caliphate.

The conditions in Gaza are brought up by what Hamas forces on the population, especially the poor one which has no power and are also against the continues attacks on Israel in their name.

As I put it before, we are not going to see Hamas or Islamic Jihad hide in their own mansions, at the malls, by the olympic pool, or any other very expensive places which are far away from the border with Israel.

They will hide, mostly, around the poor civilians, and hide rockets amongst the poor civilians, as they have always done, and there is plenty of video and photos on it, and international reporters who more than witness the Hamas behavior during the 2014 war.

The abject living condition on the poor is FORCED on them by Hamas, and nobody else.

You do not really believe that Israel is responsible for it. You are simply crying fire on a crowded theatre and hoping that it will scare Israel, the US, or any Israel supporter to stop supporting Israel's right to defend itself from a people who are intent on destroying the country and kill all or most of its Jewish population.

They say so all the time, but you will not hear it.

 

[Billo_Really]

Now, are you referring to the war of 1967 or what happened after Israel pulled out of Gaza in 2005?

Be specific as to which one you are referring to, and be clear when the first aggression started, why and by whom.

Let's just say the current aggression started with Israel holding on to territories it seized during the '67 war and the Gaza blockade started during the mid-90's and was ratcheted up in 2007 after Hamas won the election in 2006.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Not one Israeli in Gaza to make it a "brutal occupation" or an occupation of Any Kind.

But.....Palestinians protest Hamas, and this is what happens.

Imagine, all the money Hamas gets from Iran and still......they want more from the Gaza population. Cruel, simply cruel.

In Gaza, Hamas Cracks Down On Palestinians Protesting Newly Imposed Taxes

Hamas Crackdown on Gaza Protests Instills Fear

You do not have to have a standing army in the territory to satisfy the definition of an occupation. If you maintain "effective control" over the area, then that is an occupation.

Then Egypt is also occupying Gaza, because they effectively control what comes and goes and who comes and goes.

Let us end Egypt's occupation of Gaza.

 

[Billo_Really]

RE: Palestinians Massing At The Israeli Border
⁜→ Billo_Really, Sixties Fan, et al,

To understand this, you have to understand that International Human Rights Law is (nearly always) at odds with International Armed Conflict (IAC), as well as, Non-International Armed Conflict (NIAC). BUT! There is no one single international policy pertain to entities like HAMAS and associates.

Like it or not, HAMAS is a "terrorist organization;" with associate Jihadists, Insurgents, Radicalized Islamic Troublemakers, Adherents, Guerrillas and Asymmetric Fighter. This should include indeterminate combat support that trains and equips foreign Islamic groups Islamic Resistance Movement (AKA HAMAS).

Which shows how much you do know about blockades and International law.

But keep repeating that, since in your ears it sounds SO good.

No, you explain why Israel has jurisdiction in international waters, you fucking bitch!

(REFERENCES)

1997 • International Convention for the Suppression of Terrorist Bombings •
Creates a regime of universal jurisdiction over the unlawful and intentional use of explosives and other lethal devices in, into, or against various defined public places with intent to kill or cause serious bodily injury, or with intent to cause extensive destruction of the public place.

Article 14 • Arms Trade Treaty •
EnforcementEach State Party shall take appropriate measures to enforce national laws and regulations that implement the provisions of this Treaty.
Article 15
States Parties shall cooperate with each other, consistent with their 4.States Parties are encouraged to cooperate, pursuant to their national laws, in order to assist national implementation of the provisions of this Treaty, including through sharing information regarding illicit activities and actors and in order to prevent and eradicate diversion of conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1)...

Measures to prevent and combat terrorism - Section II - Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy in the form of a resolution and an annexed Plan of Action (A/RES/60/288) •
To in order to prevent and detect the movement of terrorists and to prevent and detect the illicit traffic in, inter alia, small arms and light weapons, conventional ammunition and explosives, nuclear, chemical, biological or radiological weapons and materials, while recognizing that States may require assistance to that effect.

(COMMENT)

Israel is endeavoring to intensify cooperation, as appropriate, in exchanging timely and accurate information concerning the prevention and combating of terrorism.

Israel's actions are focused on the apprehension and prosecution or extradition of perpetrators of terrorist acts, in accordance with the United Nations Global Counter-Terrorism Strategy and Action Plan.

Israel is stepping-up national efforts and bilateral, sub-regional, regional and international co-operation, as appropriate, to improve border and customs controls, in accordance with United Nations Global
Counter-Terrorism Strategy and Action Plan.

You can't look at the issue from just one angle and the Hostile Arab Palestinian perspective. You have to expand your view. You have to look at it from all sides.

AND we have not yet talked about the Israeli EEZ (Exclusive Economic Zone) (200 NM) → a national concern.

Most Respectfully,
R

By the same token, Israel is a terrorist organization. The Likud Party has its roots in Irgun. And Irgun was a Zionist terrorist group.

 

[Billo_Really]

The Jordanians did, and wanted to annex it to the other 78% they got illegally from the British, just because the British liked Jews less than they did Arabs. And they wanted something for giving the Hashemites such a huge present after the Hashemites got kicked out of their ancient Arabian land AT GUN POINT by the Saudi Clan.

Jerusalem IS the Capital of Israel and will continue to be, ALL of it.
It has been for 3000 years.

What else do you have?

Conquer by conquest was outlawed at the end of WWII. Saying it is okay for Israel to annex East Jerusalem, is like saying it was okay for Germany to annex Poland.

 

[Billo_Really]

Lots of countries get US aid. We have strategic alliances with Israel. Not so much with Islamic terrorists.

As usual, you’re befuddled by the context. Hamas is an islamic terrorist syndicate, one of several, that is alleged to be a government. They are the beneficiaries of a UN sponsored welfare scam that generates incredible wealth for an islsmic terrorist franchise.

That's the big lie you're being paid to get people to believe.

 

[Billo_Really]

Your profound confusion,

So you're not going to answer the question?

 

[Hollie]

Now, are you referring to the war of 1967 or what happened after Israel pulled out of Gaza in 2005?

Be specific as to which one you are referring to, and be clear when the first aggression started, why and by whom.

Let's just say the current aggression started with Israel holding on to territories it seized during the '67 war and the Gaza blockade started during the mid-90's and was ratcheted up in 2007 after Hamas won the election in 2006.

Let’s say that Islamic terrorist attacks also increased dramatically around the timeframe you describe.

 

[Billo_Really]

The money which the US lends to Israel does not end up in the Government's pocket. It is for many other things, which also help the US.
You and many others have a very wrong idea of the US "giving" money to Israel for nothing.
--------------------
The U.S.-Israeli alliance has paved the way for the countries to cooperate on far more than just traditional security issues. In part because of the long-standing political and security relationship between the United States and Israel, most Israelis know the United States and harbor positive feelings toward it. Israeli companies looking for a global market for their products have often viewed their American counterparts as partners of choice. So today, Israeli civilian technological innovations are helping the United States maintain its economic competitiveness, promote sustainable development, and address a range of non-military security challenges.

Dozens of leading U.S. companies have set up technology incubators in Israel to take advantage of the country's penchant for new ideas, which is why Bill Gates observed in 2006 that the "innovation going on in Israel is critical to the future of the technology business." Likewise, Israeli high-tech firms often turn to U.S. companies as partners for joint production and marketing opportunities in the United States and elsewhere, creating tens of thousands of American jobs. And although Israelis make up just three percent of the population of the Middle East, in 2011 Israel was the destination of 25 percent of all U.S. exports to the region, having recently eclipsed Saudi Arabia as the top market there for American products.

U.S. companies' substantial cooperation with Israel on information technology has been crucial to Silicon Valley's success. At Intel's research and development centers in Israel, engineers have designed many of the company's most successful microprocessors, accounting for some 40 percent of the firm's revenues last year. If you've made a secure financial transaction on the Internet, sent an instant message, or bought something using PayPal, you can thank Israeli IT researchers.

Friends with Benefits: Why the U.S.-Israeli Alliance Is Good for America
------------

The U.S.-Israel alliance is expansive. Pro-Israel advocates understand that the alliance contributes to America’s security and its position as a moral, democratic leader in the world. Decades of polling show Americans outside the foreign policy establishment support Israel because of the democratic, liberal values shared by our two nations. But the alliance is much deeper than that. As of December 2015, according to the World Bank, Israel is the 37th largest economy in the world by gross domestic product (GDP), an extraordinary accomplishment for such a young and perpetually beleaguered nation. But last year Israel was also America’s 23rd largest trade partner. From Israel, America receives unusually high amounts of investment; helpful and profitable technologies and services; and advancements in science, agriculture, the environment, and healthcare that improve the quality of and, in some cases, quite literally save our lives. Our exports to Israel create jobs in America. Through Israeli innovations and collaboration, our scientists and medical professionals become smarter and more effective at their jobs, and our agriculture and environmental sectors become more efficient and productive. The impact of the alliance is as wide as it is deep.

Israel Gives Much More to the U.S. Economy Than You Imagined - The Tower

The money from the US is used to commit war crimes.

 

[Hollie]

Your profound confusion,

So you're not going to answer the question?

So, you’re not going to defend your claim?

 

[Hollie]

Lots of countries get US aid. We have strategic alliances with Israel. Not so much with Islamic terrorists.

As usual, you’re befuddled by the context. Hamas is an islamic terrorist syndicate, one of several, that is alleged to be a government. They are the beneficiaries of a UN sponsored welfare scam that generates incredible wealth for an islsmic terrorist franchise.

That's the big lie you're being paid to get people to believe.

Your conspiracy theories aren’t helpful.

 

[Hollie]

The Jordanians did, and wanted to annex it to the other 78% they got illegally from the British, just because the British liked Jews less than they did Arabs. And they wanted something for giving the Hashemites such a huge present after the Hashemites got kicked out of their ancient Arabian land AT GUN POINT by the Saudi Clan.

Jerusalem IS the Capital of Israel and will continue to be, ALL of it.
It has been for 3000 years.

What else do you have?

Conquer by conquest was outlawed at the end of WWII. Saying it is okay for Israel to annex East Jerusalem, is like saying it was okay for Germany to annex Poland.

So, what’s this Hamas charter thing all about then?

 

[Sixties Fan]

Now, are you referring to the war of 1967 or what happened after Israel pulled out of Gaza in 2005?

Be specific as to which one you are referring to, and be clear when the first aggression started, why and by whom.

Let's just say the current aggression started with Israel holding on to territories it seized during the '67 war and the Gaza blockade started during the mid-90's and was ratcheted up in 2007 after Hamas won the election in 2006.

Let us just say that the territory Israel seized in 1967 had been totally occupied by the Hashemites/Jordan, since May of 1948. And since Jordan wanted more territory to add to it, it joined the other Arab countries when they thought they were ready to attack Israel, as they did in 1948, to put an end to Israel as a country.

You are aware that territory conquered in a defense war, and Israel had actually asked Jordan to not enter in that war with Egypt and Syria. Actions have consequences .

Gamal Abdel Nasser ramped up rhetoric against Israel and mobilized Egyptian forces in preparation for war. The war began on June 5, 1967, when Israel launched a preemptive assault against the Egyptian and Syrian air forces.

Six-Day War | Causes & Summary
---------------
Mexico's or Canada's military mobilize their forces to the US border, after many disputes and threats. That is a declaration of war. The US strikes first and wins some Mexican and Canadian territory because of it.

Tell me that the US would have to give the land back......for nothing with Mexico or Canada continuing to threaten and sending rockets over the border.
-------------------
Israel built the Israel and Egypt–Gaza Strip barrier between 1994 and 2005, as a security measure to stop the infiltration of terrorists, including suicide bombers, into Israel. The construction of a border fence was envisaged in the Oslo Accords, as was the control by Israel of all borders of the Palestinian territories. There are four border crossings through the barrier: the Kerem Shalom, Karni, Erez, and Sufa crossings. All goods bound for Gaza through Israel must pass through one of these crossings, and undergo security inspection before being permitted into Gaza.

Additionally, the Egypt-Gaza barrier was built underground by Egypt starting in 2009. The stated aim was to block smuggling tunnels. The Egyptian Border Police maintain a presence along the Egypt-Gaza border. The Rafah Border Crossing is the only lawful crossing point between Egypt and Gaza, and was manned by Palestinian Authority security forces and the European Union Border Assistance Mission Rafah.[21] All humanitarian supplies are transferred through Israel or Egypt via the land crossings after security inspection.

One year after the 2005 disengagement from the Gaza Strip by Israel, Hamas won the Palestinian legislative elections in January 2006, winning control of the Palestinian Legislative Council. Israel and the Quartet on the Middle East had stated that their continued aid to the PA under a Hamas government was conditional on Hamas' recognition of Israel, the disavowal of violent actions, and acceptance of previous agreements between Israel and the PA, including the Oslo Accords. When Hamas formed a government in March 2006 led by Ismail Haniya, refusing to accept these conditions, Israel and the Quartet stopped having any dialogue with the Palestinian Authority and especially any member of the Hamas government, ceased providing aid to the PA and imposed sanctions against the PA.[3]

In March 2007, Hamas and Fatah formed a PA unity government, also headed by Haniya. Shortly after, in June, Hamas took control of the Gaza Strip during the Battle of Gaza,[1] seizing government institutions and replacing Fatah and other government officials with Hamas members.[2] Following the takeover, besides other measures, Israel and Egypt closed the border crossings with Gaza, marking the start of the blockade of the Gaza Strip. At the same time, international relations and aid to the Fatah-led government in the West Bank resumed and the economic sanctions lifted.


Blockade of the Gaza Strip - Wikipedia
-----------
Looks like the reasons for Israel and Egypt deciding on the blockade are very clear.
Not the population's fault, but Hamas. How are we going to make Hamas change its policies?

For some strange reason, Fatah ought to be in power in Gaza, but since Hamas won the election, and there has not been any other .....they remain as the government in Gaza, not allowing Abbas to take over.

The best thing is to let Hamas have Gaza, and Abbas just have areas A and B, and let them both govern their territories, without taking it out on Israel, without demanding any right of return, which does not exist anywhere in the world.

 

[Billo_Really]

Dr. Einat Wilf speaking about Westsplaining.

You can't have it both ways. You can't point to the UN in regards to Israeli sovereignty, while at the same time saying UN resolutions do not give the right of return to Palestinians. These people are descendents of the Palestinian's who were driven out of the area by Zionist terrorist groups like Irgun in 1948. They have the right to return to their homeland.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Not really a wise thing to do. Trouble by Sunday, perhaps?

Hamas to Swarm Israel's Border, Sparking Fear of New 'Passover War'

Break out the gunships and hellfires.

 

[Billo_Really]

You are so full of shit. If Palestinians wanted peace they would stop floating fire balloons. They would stop trying to sneak into Israel to go on a murder spree. Just stop.

If Israel wanted peace, they would end the occupation and stop breaking all the ceasefires.