Okay, I give up...

Discussion in 'Healthcare/Insurance/Govt Healthcare' started by MaggieMae, Jun 23, 2009.

  1. MaggieMae
    Offline

    MaggieMae Reality bits

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    24,043
    Thanks Received:
    1,599
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Ratings:
    +1,601
    Health care reform is just too expensive to "do" this year, no matter how the numbers are manipulated. (But I still want to hear what Obama has to say at today's press conference.) My preference would be that because he is losing political capital on the health issue, he would be wise to turn his full attention to the other two priorities: education and energy, both of which are much more flexible issues among the American public.

    HOWEVER, that said, here's my problem with the Republican politicians who have consistently just said NO to any health care reform other than their own well-worn proposals. The major talking heads this past weekend (McCain, Graham, and the others parroting each other) have been once more been beating the drum for getting us into another conflict over Iran by demanding that Obama "denounce" the Iranian leadership and ally himself with the moderates . What they have been saying sounds eerily familiar to the subtle justifications for invading Iraq, which ultimately happened.

    Do they not think that an incursion into Iran would not be just as costly as Iraq? If the Republicans are so all-fired concerned about out of control deficit spending, just how do they propose to do another war? I'm reading this debate like this:

    Potential cost of health care reform = kill the beast.
    Potential cost of another trillion dollar war = bring it on.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  2. MaggieMae
    Offline

    MaggieMae Reality bits

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    24,043
    Thanks Received:
    1,599
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Ratings:
    +1,601
    Okay, monitors--why is this thread tagged "OLD" when it was posted less than an hour ago? If you don't like the slot, then move it, but it's hardly OLD!
     
  3. Immanuel
    Offline

    Immanuel Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2007
    Messages:
    16,823
    Thanks Received:
    2,210
    Trophy Points:
    183
    Ratings:
    +2,224
    I'd like to hear what his ideas are as well.

    I will say that I am opposed to anything that puts the government in sole control of either our health care or our health insurance, but hearing his ideas can't hurt. Somebody needs to come up with an idea because we are in a health care crisis. Personally, I think if both sides were to sit down and discuss the issue then something could be done, but they are only interested in beating each other up as in every other issue and nothing will ever get done.

    Immie
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  4. Political Junky
    Offline

    Political Junky Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2009
    Messages:
    19,563
    Thanks Received:
    2,948
    Trophy Points:
    260
    Ratings:
    +5,541
    I won't give up on a public plan this year. The President was very strong today in his support of a public plan.
    He said, "Why would it drive private insurance out of business?" he asked rhetorically, pointing out that the industry repeatedly argues that private insurance is the best and the government can't run anything.
    He said the administration's position is a "public plan makes sense."
     
  5. Said1
    Offline

    Said1 VIP Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2004
    Messages:
    12,087
    Thanks Received:
    937
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    Somewhere in Ontario
    Ratings:
    +937
    Going for the 'common sense', angle. Worked with NAFTA. :lol:
     
  6. Navy1960
    Offline

    Navy1960 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2008
    Messages:
    5,821
    Thanks Received:
    1,188
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Arizona
    Ratings:
    +1,189
    I've made a ton of suggestions on healthcare on here, and well it's no secret where my political feelings lay. I am not supporter of a "public option" as it applies to the Federal Govt. . As it will be too costly, will lead to lower quality of care, and won't cover everyone. I do recognize a desperate need to lower the costs associated with healthcare and healthcare insurance and by doing so making it easier for those who want it and need to be able to access it. One of the best ways to do this, to allow for privately funded healthcare insurance co-ops that allow individuals, small business, and many others to come together to purchase group coverage. Other ways are promoting competetion through federal grants to those companies wishing to provide healthcare to low income individuals and familes. Still even more ways to do so would be to allow for Federal funding through state run Universal Health care programs that are voted on from state to state. There are many ways to do this without a federal govt. that regulates the same people they would be competing with. This is a complete and utter falacy if people think this will lower the costs of healthcare insurance, it will lead to a bloated system where the FICA deduction is much higher to pay for this "public option" as well as year end tax on those who have employee sponsored healthcare plans. I don't believe anyone denies the need to reform healthcare. I do think though that the ways to go about it are what is at issue.
     
  7. Immanuel
    Offline

    Immanuel Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2007
    Messages:
    16,823
    Thanks Received:
    2,210
    Trophy Points:
    183
    Ratings:
    +2,224
    I have not yet heard what the President had to say. As to why would it drive private insurance out of business, the preliminary reports I read on this said that his plan would not allow any private insurance companies to offer any policies that offered the same services that the public plan offered meaning that if the public plan covered MRIs then no private insurance would be allowed to cover MRIs. That is utterly ridiculous.

    Now, as I said, that was the preliminary reports about his health care plan from several months ago. Whether that part as stuck or not, I have no idea, but if it does stick then it would drive private insurance out of the market simply because they would be prevented by law from offering health coverage.

    Immie
     
  8. Political Junky
    Offline

    Political Junky Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2009
    Messages:
    19,563
    Thanks Received:
    2,948
    Trophy Points:
    260
    Ratings:
    +5,541
    What you heard was republican, health insurance, and pharmaceutical talking points ... in other words, Bullshit.
     
  9. Annie
    Offline

    Annie Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2003
    Messages:
    50,847
    Thanks Received:
    4,644
    Trophy Points:
    1,790
    Ratings:
    +4,770
    I've not heard anything of the kind regarding treatments/tests. I've heard that there will be oversight on what test would be allowed under which conditions, but that is nothing new. If I want an MRI it's the Dr, not me that can get that ordered.

    No, from what I can see, the question of the 'plan' and 'promise of not losing your preferred provider' has to do with costs, pure and simple. The gov't plan, just like Medicare/Medicaid will determine how much they'll pay. The private insurers don't have that ability. Thus the cost of gov't plan will be lower. Why would an employer pay higher premium? However, once most have jumped onto the bandwagon, the gov't can choose who will get care and who won't. 85 year old need an artificial limb due to diabetes? Not so much.
     
  10. MaggieMae
    Offline

    MaggieMae Reality bits

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    24,043
    Thanks Received:
    1,599
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Ratings:
    +1,601
    Two of your choices involve federal money. Once again, "universal" health care WILL NOT pass, so you need to stop thinking in that direction. The latest compendium of proposals are described here, none of which has majority support.

    Democrats to Begin Scaling Back Costly Health Care Proposals - Political News - FOXNews.com
     

Share This Page