Obamacare vs. Economic Principles

Discussion in 'Politics' started by BlackFlag10, May 20, 2013.

  1. BlackFlag10
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    BlackFlag10 College Conservative

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    Originally meant to expand coverage, Obamacare will do exactly the opposite. Consumers act rationally under economic principles. Here is what will happen:


    Read the full article at Cameron Harris: Obamacare vs. Economic Principles ---The Young Won't Buy Healthcare
     
  2. OohPooPahDoo
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    OohPooPahDoo Senior Member

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    It is a good point but in practical reality under the Massachusetts law which has similar penalties, only 3.4% were uncovered in 2011.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  3. Claudette
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    Claudette Gold Member

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    The ACA is going to be anything but affordable.

    Hope those who put jackass back in the WH will be oh so happy with their higher hc costs. Its just to bad the rest of us are in the same boat.

    All except for those that can't pay. We will be paying for the're hc as well as our own.


    Way to go all you idiots who voted the jackass back into office.
     
  4. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    The costs of ObamaCare are going to be astronomical. However, Holtz-Eakin makes claims which are supplemental to this fact, and it is those which I challenge.

    It must first be recognized that Holtz-Eakin and his American Action Forum are a right wing organization formed for the express purpose of achieving a GOP majority in Congress. So it is fair to say they have a very biased agenda. Therefore, their claims must be viewed in this light.

    As OohPooPahDoo points out, Massachusetts has a similar mandate, with similar penalties for avoiding the mandate, and yet we do not see young people avoiding it in large numbers.

    So we have a biased political organization's claims of what WILL happen, and we have the real world example of what HAS happened.

    Which one do YOU believe?

     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  5. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  6. bear513
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    bear513 Senior Member

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    We dont live in retarded massachusetts.
     
  7. BlackFlag10
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    BlackFlag10 College Conservative

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    Mass is one state. We are talking about a country of 300 million people. False equivalence
     
  8. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    That's all you got? That's your best shot?

    ObamaCare is modeled after RomneyCare.


    We really should look at the American Action Forum's polling data before drinking their piss. Did they inform the young people they polled that ObamaCare subsidizes their health insurance if they earn up to 400% above the poverty level?

    Since younger people earn the smallest incomes, most of them are going to have their insurance premiums subsidized considerably.
     
  9. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    Young Adults? Insurance Decisions Dependent on Cost | American Action Forum

    Notice the gigantic assumptions American Action Forum made:
    The article is completely silent about the fact that people whose incomes are up to 400% above poverty level will see their insurance premiums subsidized by the federal government. Many of these young people will get insurance for FREE!

    Let's see THAT polling chart! "How likely will you be to get health insurance if it is free?" "How likely will you be to keep your health insurance if your out of pocket costs DROP by 30 percent?"
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  10. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    ObamaCare gives away the store. This is why it is going to bankrupt the federal AND state governments.

    But as long as organizations like the American Action Forum make completely bogus claims, the Right will never get its footing.

    Stop the lies. Liberals only succeed because the Right lies its fucking ass off every goddam day.

    The truth would slay the Left in its tracks. When will the fucking maniacs who have hijacked the GOP ever figure this out?

    :confused::confused::confused:
     
  11. BlackFlag10
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    BlackFlag10 College Conservative

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    The right has tried to make the argument that Obamacare will bankrupt everyone from businesses to the state and federal governments. No one seems to be listening to that claim, so it is reasonable to pursue others until something gains footing that makes people realize, "Hey, maybe this wasn't such a good idea."

    I am not agreeing that these claims are bogus. I am just saying that Repubs are now having to think outside of the box for ways to teach Americans what is going to happen.
     
  12. Claudette
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    Claudette Gold Member

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    Don't worry. All Americans are going to find that out soon enough.

    The ACA is going to be anything but affordable.
     
  13. healthmyths
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    healthmyths Gold Member Supporting Member

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    I have posted this frequently as an example of if Obama can't believe his own Census, and he had to GIVE a false impression to have Obamacare pass by ONLY six votes.. It is pure ignorance!

    Premise:The following statement is a BALD FACE LIE:
    Obama said: "We are not a nation that accepts nearly 46 million uninsured men, women and children,"
    46 Million Uninsured: A Look Behind The Number : NPR

    THE following FACTS show there are 4 million truly uninsured that WANT insurance! NOT 46 million!

    FACT STATISTICS:
    GIVEN: The Census bureau says 10 million of the 46 million "uninsured' are not citizens…
    Subtract 10 million from 46 million leaves 36 million… NOT 46 million!
    Source: Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau
    10 million are not citizens!

    GIVEN: 14 million are eligible for Medicaid..but they are counted as "uninsured"….
    but Obama totally ignored this FACT and subtracting 14 million from 36 million that leaves 22 million…

    Source: http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf
    Blue Cross and Blue Shield Association contracted with the Actuarial Research Corporation (ARC) to provide a detailed analysis of the uninsured identified by the Census Bureau, which found:
    - Of the 44.7 million non-elderly uninsured individuals identified in the 2004 Census Current Population Survey (CPS) data,
    nearly one-third — almost 14 million — were reachable through existing government
    health programs such as Medicaid and the State Children’s Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) under current rules.

    REACHABLE meaning all these people had to do was enroll! NO money. NO risks! Just enroll! 14 million already eligible only need to register with MEDICAID!

    So far we've reduced the 46 million by 10 million NON-Citizens, 14 million that simply had to enroll as they were covered by Medicaid!

    That leaves 22 million!

    The last time I checked as an American I had the right NOT to buy health insurance!

    18 million people declaring that right!

    They are under age 34. They make over $50,000 a year. They decide it is cheaper just to pay out of pocket the average of $1,000 per year for their health needs then take up their employers' health plan.
    Their credit rating depends on their paying their bills . They pay their own way! They are NOT FREE-LOADERS as Pelosi calls them!
    Source: CRISIS OF THE UNINSURED: 2009

    So 10 million not citizens, 14 million COVERED by Medicaid and 18 million that don't want: equals 42 million!
    That leaves 4 million that want and need insurance... NOT 46 million which Obamacare was passed on ignorantly!

    I've asked so many times but NO ONE HAS proven differently! Why are we counting illegal aliens as uninsured when they are NOT eligible!
    Why are we counting 14 million that only need to register with Medicaid. No money. No tests. Register!

    Finally WHY are we forcing 18 million people to buy a service that is NOT NEEDED by them? It is totally wrong and totally stupid to think as these idiots do that
    this will increase the "POOL"! Idiots!
     
  14. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    They were never in the box. Because they are too retarded to comprehend ObamaCare, they decided to just make shit up about it.

    And that is why we have ObamaCare today.
     
  15. g5000
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    g5000 Gold Member

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    Massachusetts is a real world example of the real choices people make, not the false choices offered by the partisan hacks at American Action Forum. Massachussets has the same health insurance mandate, and the same lax penalties for not participating. And we see the choices the people made are nothing like the AAF is attempting to predict. And that is because they totally fudged their data and their scenario into a completely bogus hypothetical.

    So go right ahead and continue to deceive yourself the AAF knows what it is talking about. Live in that fantasy world. The rest of us live in the real one.



    As I have pointed out in further posts, the AAF completely ignored the real results of ObamaCare that are already happening which completely refute their fantasy world fake poll choices.

    The number of uninsured young adults has already dropped significantly. This is a simple fact that no amount of piss and bullshit by the AAF can conceal. So stop consuming it and fight the Left with real facts and the truth.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  16. BlackFlag10
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    BlackFlag10 College Conservative

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    You are absolutely delusional. I can't tell whether you are defending ObamaCare or attacking it. The legislators who PASSED Obamacare don't even comprehend it.

    Remember Pelosi? "We have to pass it to see what's in it."
     
  17. healthmyths
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    healthmyths Gold Member Supporting Member

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    So EVERY single person in the USA is JUST like every person in Massachusetts?
    The concept maybe working fine in a state with HOMOGENOUS population. A state with 2% of USA population IS NOT a good test!

    AND I wouldn't even trust people that CAN'T even figure out there are LESS THE 4 million truly uninsured AFTER you subtract 10 million illegals, 14 million already covered by Medicaid and 18 million that don't want health insurance!!! Can afford it!! But don't need to buy !

    SO if idiots can't figure out there are less then 4 million... how in the hell they gonna run a $2.5 trillion system???
    These are the facts...
     
  18. bear513
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    bear513 Senior Member

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    And what was wrong with that statement? was a work, somtimes you dont have to post a novel...For the milliionth time Romney care was bipartisan, Obama care was partisian. Which gave rise to the tea party and resulted in nothing gets done in D.C. anymore except bigger exposure to Obama's shenanigans. Good job stupid Democrats.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  19. Greenbeard
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    Greenbeard Gold Member

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    Scenario 2:

    Premiums drop, coverage expands in Washington's exchanger
    Regardless, young people have options to buy catastrophic "young invincibles" policies if they don't want the more generous policies that most others in the exchange will buy (if they're not under 26 and instead exercising the option to remain on a family plan, that is).

    I.e.:
    The Affordable Care Act: Implications for Adolescents and Young Adults
    Under 30 health insurance through the reform - Apr. 28, 2010
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013
  20. bear513
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    bear513 Senior Member

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    post a link please..... All I can google is premiums could rise by 400%.....

    prewww.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/14/health-premiums-could-hike-400-percent-under-obama/


    Is this what your talking about?
    www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2013/01/1...ocket-premium-costs-despite-lavish-subsidies/

     
    Last edited: May 20, 2013

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