Obama gets taxpayers to fund campaign drive

[RDD_1210]

People without insurance do get chemo.

How? Where? You have no clue do you? One day you'll learn. I'm not much older than you but I know you have a lot to learn about this topic still. Your vague answers tell enough.

The same people pay now as would under Obamacare. The "haves" would still be paying for the "have nots."

And please address the rest of what I said in my previous post. Very disingenuous to cut out the stuff that exposes bad things about Obamacare.

Disingenuous? You think your answer of "People without insurance do get chemo." is a good one? Are you being stubborn now or just too much pride to admit that perhaps you don't know enough about this topic to admit you don't have all the answers.

C'mon now, you're trying to change the topic to something I already said I agreed with. I know Obamacare is far from perfect and does little to address the cost, but you refuse to acknowledge how it does benefit people and what you would do if you were faced with a life threatening illness.

Ok more people would have insurance, hooray. Would it improve healthcare? No. Would it lower costs? No, the opposite. Would it lower medical bankruptcies? No.

So in the end, all it would be doing is giving more cash money to big insurance companies. Yay?

Right, I told you I agree with all that. So what's your solution? Like I said before, when you come up with a better idea I'm all ears. I wanted a public option to help bring costs down, that didn't happen. I would rather see insurance cut out of the equation all together but that didnt happen. But keeping things the way they were wasn't better than what we have now. Complaining about this without offering a viable solution to the problem doesn't do us much good.

All I'm doing is acknowledging the good aspects of this legislation while recognizing that it falls way short. You want to sit on the sidelines and point out everything that is still wrong while offering no solutions. Hooray for you!

How Do Cancer Patients Without Health Insurance Get Treatment ? | eHow.com

The above link deals with treatment for those without insurance. "One day you'll learn. I'm not much older than you but I know you have a lot to learn about this topic still. Your vague answers tell enough."

LOL, I was right. You are too stubborn.

Your "solution" for those people being denied due to preexisting conditions or too poor to afford insurance are government sponsored and supported programs? Remind me again how you're all about smaller government.

Just try and remember this conversation on the day you or someone close to you gets hit with a major illness. You'll then realize it's not such a simple issue and that "I'll just pay for my medical care out of my pocket" is not going to work...not in this country.

 

[Dr.Drock]

How? Where? You have no clue do you? One day you'll learn. I'm not much older than you but I know you have a lot to learn about this topic still. Your vague answers tell enough.



Disingenuous? You think your answer of "People without insurance do get chemo." is a good one? Are you being stubborn now or just too much pride to admit that perhaps you don't know enough about this topic to admit you don't have all the answers.

C'mon now, you're trying to change the topic to something I already said I agreed with. I know Obamacare is far from perfect and does little to address the cost, but you refuse to acknowledge how it does benefit people and what you would do if you were faced with a life threatening illness.

Ok more people would have insurance, hooray. Would it improve healthcare? No. Would it lower costs? No, the opposite. Would it lower medical bankruptcies? No.

So in the end, all it would be doing is giving more cash money to big insurance companies. Yay?

Right, I told you I agree with all that. So what's your solution? Like I said before, when you come up with a better idea I'm all ears. I wanted a public option to help bring costs down, that didn't happen. I would rather see insurance cut out of the equation all together but that didnt happen. But keeping things the way they were wasn't better than what we have now. Complaining about this without offering a viable solution to the problem doesn't do us much good.

All I'm doing is acknowledging the good aspects of this legislation while recognizing that it falls way short. You want to sit on the sidelines and point out everything that is still wrong while offering no solutions. Hooray for you!

How Do Cancer Patients Without Health Insurance Get Treatment ? | eHow.com

The above link deals with treatment for those without insurance. "One day you'll learn. I'm not much older than you but I know you have a lot to learn about this topic still. Your vague answers tell enough."

LOL, I was right. You are too stubborn.

Your "solution" for those people being denied due to preexisting conditions or too poor to afford insurance are government sponsored and supported programs? Remind me again how you're all about smaller government.

Just try and remember this conversation on the day you or someone close to you gets hit with a major illness. You'll then realize it's not such a simple issue and that "I'll just pay for my medical care out of my pocket" is not going to work...not in this country.

It doesn't benefit people other than those at the big drug/insurance companies who own washington, already provided links to show it.

I didn't say those were options I approve of, I said there's options. You said ppl without insurance don't get chemo, I said they do, I provided proof to back my words, that's all.

My solution is get gov't out of healthcare in general, the more gov't involvement in healthcare the worse things get for citizens. More than 50% of all healthcare dollars are spent by gov't, that's the problem. Make health expenses tax deductible and get gov't out of the industry.

 

[RDD_1210]

Ok more people would have insurance, hooray. Would it improve healthcare? No. Would it lower costs? No, the opposite. Would it lower medical bankruptcies? No.

So in the end, all it would be doing is giving more cash money to big insurance companies. Yay?

Right, I told you I agree with all that. So what's your solution? Like I said before, when you come up with a better idea I'm all ears. I wanted a public option to help bring costs down, that didn't happen. I would rather see insurance cut out of the equation all together but that didnt happen. But keeping things the way they were wasn't better than what we have now. Complaining about this without offering a viable solution to the problem doesn't do us much good.

All I'm doing is acknowledging the good aspects of this legislation while recognizing that it falls way short. You want to sit on the sidelines and point out everything that is still wrong while offering no solutions. Hooray for you!

How Do Cancer Patients Without Health Insurance Get Treatment ? | eHow.com

The above link deals with treatment for those without insurance. "One day you'll learn. I'm not much older than you but I know you have a lot to learn about this topic still. Your vague answers tell enough."

LOL, I was right. You are too stubborn.

Your "solution" for those people being denied due to preexisting conditions or too poor to afford insurance are government sponsored and supported programs? Remind me again how you're all about smaller government.

Just try and remember this conversation on the day you or someone close to you gets hit with a major illness. You'll then realize it's not such a simple issue and that "I'll just pay for my medical care out of my pocket" is not going to work...not in this country.

It doesn't benefit people other than those at the big drug/insurance companies who own washington, already provided links to show it.

I didn't say those were options I approve of, I said there's options. You said ppl without insurance don't get chemo, I said they do, I provided proof to back my words, that's all.

My solution is get gov't out of healthcare in general, the more gov't involvement in healthcare the worse things get for citizens. More than 50% of all healthcare dollars are spent by gov't, that's the problem. Make health expenses tax deductible and get gov't out of the industry.

So you should love the ACA since it's handing more customers to private insurance. If private is the way to go, you should love it. No?

You don't have an actual solution, you just know government = bad, and you also know that the ACA sucks because.....wait for it....big business profits from it. Again, I ask you for a solution and all you can do is tell me what we shouldn't be doing. You have no answers. It's always easier to criticize than it is to come up with tangible ideas.

The disconnect here is amazing, only trumped by the fact that you can't see it.

You're so confused, it's sad. One day you'll have some real world experience to speak from, until then you'll just have to base your narrow opinion on your limited world view of this topic gained from TV and the internet. You're a smart guy at least, so I have hope for you unlike some of the others on this site.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Right, I told you I agree with all that. So what's your solution? Like I said before, when you come up with a better idea I'm all ears. I wanted a public option to help bring costs down, that didn't happen. I would rather see insurance cut out of the equation all together but that didnt happen. But keeping things the way they were wasn't better than what we have now. Complaining about this without offering a viable solution to the problem doesn't do us much good.

All I'm doing is acknowledging the good aspects of this legislation while recognizing that it falls way short. You want to sit on the sidelines and point out everything that is still wrong while offering no solutions. Hooray for you!



LOL, I was right. You are too stubborn.

Your "solution" for those people being denied due to preexisting conditions or too poor to afford insurance are government sponsored and supported programs? Remind me again how you're all about smaller government.

Just try and remember this conversation on the day you or someone close to you gets hit with a major illness. You'll then realize it's not such a simple issue and that "I'll just pay for my medical care out of my pocket" is not going to work...not in this country.

It doesn't benefit people other than those at the big drug/insurance companies who own washington, already provided links to show it.

I didn't say those were options I approve of, I said there's options. You said ppl without insurance don't get chemo, I said they do, I provided proof to back my words, that's all.

My solution is get gov't out of healthcare in general, the more gov't involvement in healthcare the worse things get for citizens. More than 50% of all healthcare dollars are spent by gov't, that's the problem. Make health expenses tax deductible and get gov't out of the industry.

So you should love the ACA since it's handing more customers to private insurance. If private is the way to go, you should love it. No?

You don't have an actual solution, you just know government = bad, and you also know that the ACA sucks because.....wait for it....big business profits from it. Again, I ask you for a solution and all you can do is tell me what we shouldn't be doing. You have no answers. It's always easier to criticize than it is to come up with tangible ideas.

The disconnect here is amazing, only trumped by the fact that you can't see it.

You're so confused, it's sad. One day you'll have some real world experience to speak from, until then you'll just have to base your narrow opinion on your limited world view of this topic gained from TV and the internet. You're a smart guy at least, so I have hope for you unlike some of the others on this site.

I gave a solution, you just didn't like it because my solution was get gov't out of it. Your only solution is more more more gov't, which is the exact problem.

I provided proof in links you didn't like, so you cut them out and just repeated yourself despite new information. You have an emotional attachment to support Obamacare because you have an emotional attachment to support Obama, you voted for him so you feel he reflects on you, thus you have to support Obamacare.

You're smart as well, you're just partially blinded by partisanship. But you aren't nearly as blinded as more partisans, even we agree on some fundamental aspects of Obamacare. Doesn't lower costs+helps those who have bought off Washington. You didn't address my point with links to back it up that it doesn't help people in terms of medical bankrupcies, so I dunno if you agree with me there or not.

 

[uscitizen]

Well to me getting treated is more important than having insurance, poor people already get treated at the expense of those who pay their medical bills.

Oh and I'm just speaking hypothetically, I do have insurance.

Speaking hypothetically? Tough guy you are. Put your money where your mouth is. Basically, what you are saying is IF I didn't have insurance...I'd just suck it up. Easy to say when you're safe...don't you think?

"Let them eat cake....the conservative philosophy.

Not everyone needs or wants health care. The Fed forcing everyone to have it isn't cool. That is all.

Absolutely imagine them forcing us to have an apendectomy instead of dying in lingering agony which is our right!

 

[Dr.Drock]

Speaking hypothetically? Tough guy you are. Put your money where your mouth is. Basically, what you are saying is IF I didn't have insurance...I'd just suck it up. Easy to say when you're safe...don't you think?

"Let them eat cake....the conservative philosophy.

Not everyone needs or wants health care. The Fed forcing everyone to have it isn't cool. That is all.

Absolutely imagine them forcing us to have an apendectomy instead of dying in lingering agony which is our right!

Strawman, apendectomies are done on ppl without insurance.

 

[RDD_1210]

It doesn't benefit people other than those at the big drug/insurance companies who own washington, already provided links to show it.

I didn't say those were options I approve of, I said there's options. You said ppl without insurance don't get chemo, I said they do, I provided proof to back my words, that's all.

My solution is get gov't out of healthcare in general, the more gov't involvement in healthcare the worse things get for citizens. More than 50% of all healthcare dollars are spent by gov't, that's the problem. Make health expenses tax deductible and get gov't out of the industry.

So you should love the ACA since it's handing more customers to private insurance. If private is the way to go, you should love it. No?

You don't have an actual solution, you just know government = bad, and you also know that the ACA sucks because.....wait for it....big business profits from it. Again, I ask you for a solution and all you can do is tell me what we shouldn't be doing. You have no answers. It's always easier to criticize than it is to come up with tangible ideas.

The disconnect here is amazing, only trumped by the fact that you can't see it.

You're so confused, it's sad. One day you'll have some real world experience to speak from, until then you'll just have to base your narrow opinion on your limited world view of this topic gained from TV and the internet. You're a smart guy at least, so I have hope for you unlike some of the others on this site.

I gave a solution, you just didn't like it because my solution was get gov't out of it. Your only solution is more more more gov't, which is the exact problem.

No, you outlined a problem. You didn't provide a solution. Getting government out of healthcare is a talking point not a solution. Whats the solution? More privatization?

I provided proof in links you didn't like, so you cut them out and just repeated yourself despite new information. You have an emotional attachment to support Obamacare because you have an emotional attachment to support Obama, you voted for him so you feel he reflects on you, thus you have to support Obamacare.

It's not that I didn't like your link, it's that your link only provided government options as solution. Government options that you want to do away with and I agree that don't work. So do millions of Americans. If those are such good options why doesn't everyone use them?

I have said numerous times what I'd like to see as a solution. You just didn't respond to what I said. You've just complained about the ACA without offering a solution.

And for the record I didn't vote for Obama, but go ahead and think that if thats the only way you can make your case. He does represent more of what I believe in though, that is however different than what he actually delivers.

You're smart as well, you're just partially blinded by partisanship. But you aren't nearly as blinded as more partisans, even we agree on some fundamental aspects of Obamacare. Doesn't lower costs+helps those who have bought off Washington. You didn't address my point with links to back it up that it doesn't help people in terms of medical bankrupcies, so I dunno if you agree with me there or not.

I don't know if it helps with medical bankruptcies or not. You certainly could be right about that. I am certainly liberal but from from partisan. Let's remember who here is against it simply because it's the "evil government" and who here said it has good portions and bad portions. Something that you refuse to recognize. Who is being partisan?

 

[Dr.Drock]

So you should love the ACA since it's handing more customers to private insurance. If private is the way to go, you should love it. No?

You don't have an actual solution, you just know government = bad, and you also know that the ACA sucks because.....wait for it....big business profits from it. Again, I ask you for a solution and all you can do is tell me what we shouldn't be doing. You have no answers. It's always easier to criticize than it is to come up with tangible ideas.

The disconnect here is amazing, only trumped by the fact that you can't see it.

You're so confused, it's sad. One day you'll have some real world experience to speak from, until then you'll just have to base your narrow opinion on your limited world view of this topic gained from TV and the internet. You're a smart guy at least, so I have hope for you unlike some of the others on this site.

I gave a solution, you just didn't like it because my solution was get gov't out of it. Your only solution is more more more gov't, which is the exact problem.

No, you outlined a problem. You didn't provide a solution. Getting government out of healthcare is a talking point not a solution. Whats the solution? More privatization?

I provided proof in links you didn't like, so you cut them out and just repeated yourself despite new information. You have an emotional attachment to support Obamacare because you have an emotional attachment to support Obama, you voted for him so you feel he reflects on you, thus you have to support Obamacare.

It's not that I didn't like your link, it's that your link only provided government options as solution. Government options that you want to do away with and I agree that don't work. So do millions of Americans. If those are such good options why doesn't everyone use them?

I have said numerous times what I'd like to see as a solution. You just didn't respond to what I said. You've just complained about the ACA without offering a solution.

And for the record I didn't vote for Obama, but go ahead and think that if thats the only way you can make your case. He does represent more of what I believe in though, that is however different than what he actually delivers.

You're smart as well, you're just partially blinded by partisanship. But you aren't nearly as blinded as more partisans, even we agree on some fundamental aspects of Obamacare. Doesn't lower costs+helps those who have bought off Washington. You didn't address my point with links to back it up that it doesn't help people in terms of medical bankrupcies, so I dunno if you agree with me there or not.

I don't know if it helps with medical bankruptcies or not. You certainly could be right about that. I am certainly liberal but from from partisan. Let's remember who here is against it simply because it's the "evil government" and who here said it has good portions and bad portions. Something that you refuse to recognize. Who is being partisan?

Government is bought off by a select handful of drug companies, big pharma companies and big insurance. Would it or would it not be pure insanity to trust a completely bribed entity to do what's best for americans in the healthcare industry?

Health Care

As you know I'm a Ron Paul supporter, he has the best ideas in terms of gov't and healthcare. That link should help with the solution you're looking for.

 

[RDD_1210]

I gave a solution, you just didn't like it because my solution was get gov't out of it. Your only solution is more more more gov't, which is the exact problem.

No, you outlined a problem. You didn't provide a solution. Getting government out of healthcare is a talking point not a solution. Whats the solution? More privatization?


It's not that I didn't like your link, it's that your link only provided government options as solution. Government options that you want to do away with and I agree that don't work. So do millions of Americans. If those are such good options why doesn't everyone use them?

I have said numerous times what I'd like to see as a solution. You just didn't respond to what I said. You've just complained about the ACA without offering a solution.

And for the record I didn't vote for Obama, but go ahead and think that if thats the only way you can make your case. He does represent more of what I believe in though, that is however different than what he actually delivers.

You're smart as well, you're just partially blinded by partisanship. But you aren't nearly as blinded as more partisans, even we agree on some fundamental aspects of Obamacare. Doesn't lower costs+helps those who have bought off Washington. You didn't address my point with links to back it up that it doesn't help people in terms of medical bankrupcies, so I dunno if you agree with me there or not.

I don't know if it helps with medical bankruptcies or not. You certainly could be right about that. I am certainly liberal but from from partisan. Let's remember who here is against it simply because it's the "evil government" and who here said it has good portions and bad portions. Something that you refuse to recognize. Who is being partisan?

Government is bought off by a select handful of drug companies, big pharma companies and big insurance. Would it or would it not be pure insanity to trust a completely bribed entity to do what's best for americans in the healthcare industry?

You're totally right, so why do you want to give even more power to those who are doing the bribing? Why not eliminate that need for bribing by eliminating insurance all together? Or why not introduce a competitor who is not driven by a need to turn a profit and increase their stock value?

Health Care

As you know I'm a Ron Paul supporter, he has the best ideas in terms of gov't and healthcare. That link should help with the solution you're looking for.

Thanks for the link. It makes sense now. You don't have a plan because your man Paul really has very little semblance of a plan.

Let's check the facts....he knows the current system is broken, you know the current system is broken.

He knows that Obamacare isn't the answer, you know that Obamacare isn't the answer.

His "Solution" - making health care more affordable and that only true free market competition will put pressure on the providers and force them to lower their costs to remain in business.

Additionally, Ron Paul wants to change the tax code to allow individual Americans to fully deduct all health care costs from their taxes.

That explains why you have no solution either. Ron Pauls solution is to "make it affordable", "use the free market" and "change the tax code". Lots of fluffy talk with the only real actionable item being change the tax code...but even that is vague.

I guess I can't blame you for not having a solution when your hero doesn't have one either. His campaign like any other politician was built on pointing out what the other guy is doing wrong, while offering little in concrete alternate plans. Same as what you're doing here. You "know" the ACA sucks even though your reasoning why and your solution contradict each other.

One day, you'll learn.

 

[Dr.Drock]

No, you outlined a problem. You didn't provide a solution. Getting government out of healthcare is a talking point not a solution. Whats the solution? More privatization?


It's not that I didn't like your link, it's that your link only provided government options as solution. Government options that you want to do away with and I agree that don't work. So do millions of Americans. If those are such good options why doesn't everyone use them?

I have said numerous times what I'd like to see as a solution. You just didn't respond to what I said. You've just complained about the ACA without offering a solution.

And for the record I didn't vote for Obama, but go ahead and think that if thats the only way you can make your case. He does represent more of what I believe in though, that is however different than what he actually delivers.



I don't know if it helps with medical bankruptcies or not. You certainly could be right about that. I am certainly liberal but from from partisan. Let's remember who here is against it simply because it's the "evil government" and who here said it has good portions and bad portions. Something that you refuse to recognize. Who is being partisan?

Government is bought off by a select handful of drug companies, big pharma companies and big insurance. Would it or would it not be pure insanity to trust a completely bribed entity to do what's best for americans in the healthcare industry?

You're totally right, so why do you want to give even more power to those who are doing the bribing? Why not eliminate that need for bribing by eliminating insurance all together? Or why not introduce a competitor who is not driven by a need to turn a profit and increase their stock value?

Health Care

As you know I'm a Ron Paul supporter, he has the best ideas in terms of gov't and healthcare. That link should help with the solution you're looking for.

Thanks for the link. It makes sense now. You don't have a plan because your man Paul really has very little semblance of a plan.

Let's check the facts....he knows the current system is broken, you know the current system is broken.

He knows that Obamacare isn't the answer, you know that Obamacare isn't the answer.

His "Solution" - making health care more affordable and that only true free market competition will put pressure on the providers and force them to lower their costs to remain in business.

Additionally, Ron Paul wants to change the tax code to allow individual Americans to fully deduct all health care costs from their taxes.

That explains why you have no solution either. Ron Pauls solution is to "make it affordable", "use the free market" and "change the tax code". Lots of fluffy talk with the only real actionable item being change the tax code...but even that is vague.

I guess I can't blame you for not having a solution when your hero doesn't have one either. His campaign like any other politician was built on pointing out what the other guy is doing wrong, while offering little in concrete alternate plans. Same as what you're doing here. You "know" the ACA sucks even though your reasoning why and your solution contradict each other.

One day, you'll learn.

I don't have a problem with insurance companies in general, my problem is with putting faith in gov't who's bought off by insurance companies.

Well I'm sorry you don't like how the solution is being presented to you. We'll have to agree to disagree.

I'm a libertarian, I assure you I'll never learn to trust a bribed gov't and give said bribed gov't more power and more money in such a critical industry. Hopefully some day you'll learn, rather than just simply buy into propoganda.

 

[RDD_1210]

Government is bought off by a select handful of drug companies, big pharma companies and big insurance. Would it or would it not be pure insanity to trust a completely bribed entity to do what's best for americans in the healthcare industry?

You're totally right, so why do you want to give even more power to those who are doing the bribing? Why not eliminate that need for bribing by eliminating insurance all together? Or why not introduce a competitor who is not driven by a need to turn a profit and increase their stock value?

Health Care

As you know I'm a Ron Paul supporter, he has the best ideas in terms of gov't and healthcare. That link should help with the solution you're looking for.

Thanks for the link. It makes sense now. You don't have a plan because your man Paul really has very little semblance of a plan.

Let's check the facts....he knows the current system is broken, you know the current system is broken.

He knows that Obamacare isn't the answer, you know that Obamacare isn't the answer.

His "Solution" - making health care more affordable and that only true free market competition will put pressure on the providers and force them to lower their costs to remain in business.

Additionally, Ron Paul wants to change the tax code to allow individual Americans to fully deduct all health care costs from their taxes.

That explains why you have no solution either. Ron Pauls solution is to "make it affordable", "use the free market" and "change the tax code". Lots of fluffy talk with the only real actionable item being change the tax code...but even that is vague.

I guess I can't blame you for not having a solution when your hero doesn't have one either. His campaign like any other politician was built on pointing out what the other guy is doing wrong, while offering little in concrete alternate plans. Same as what you're doing here. You "know" the ACA sucks even though your reasoning why and your solution contradict each other.

One day, you'll learn.

I don't have a problem with insurance companies in general, my problem is with putting faith in gov't who's bought off by insurance companies.

Well I'm sorry you don't like how the solution is being presented to you. We'll have to agree to disagree.

I'm a libertarian, I assure you I'll never learn to trust a bribed gov't and give said bribed gov't more power and more money in such a critical industry. Hopefully some day you'll learn, rather than just simply buy into propoganda.

Again what solution? Show me a solution with an actionable plan and I'd be happy to discuss it. We haven't disagreed on a plan yet because you have yet to produce one. I'd love to discuss a plan. I've talked about what I'd like to see and you don't seem to want to talk about that. Why is that?

Until then you're just buying in to the propaganda that is Ron Paul. All he has provided is big talking points and little substance, and you fell in love.

I think you love the idea that you can be "the outsider" who doesn't fit in to one of the two big parties and you've latched on to your leader who really hasn't offered much different in terms of a plan yet you can't see it. You're more concerned with not aligning yourself with one of the two big parties than you are with actually thinking about does the guy I have latched on to have any better ideas about this mess. In the case of health care...he clearly doesn't.

 

[Dr.Drock]

You're totally right, so why do you want to give even more power to those who are doing the bribing? Why not eliminate that need for bribing by eliminating insurance all together? Or why not introduce a competitor who is not driven by a need to turn a profit and increase their stock value?



Thanks for the link. It makes sense now. You don't have a plan because your man Paul really has very little semblance of a plan.

Let's check the facts....he knows the current system is broken, you know the current system is broken.

He knows that Obamacare isn't the answer, you know that Obamacare isn't the answer.

His "Solution" - making health care more affordable and that only true free market competition will put pressure on the providers and force them to lower their costs to remain in business.

Additionally, Ron Paul wants to change the tax code to allow individual Americans to fully deduct all health care costs from their taxes.

That explains why you have no solution either. Ron Pauls solution is to "make it affordable", "use the free market" and "change the tax code". Lots of fluffy talk with the only real actionable item being change the tax code...but even that is vague.

I guess I can't blame you for not having a solution when your hero doesn't have one either. His campaign like any other politician was built on pointing out what the other guy is doing wrong, while offering little in concrete alternate plans. Same as what you're doing here. You "know" the ACA sucks even though your reasoning why and your solution contradict each other.

One day, you'll learn.

I don't have a problem with insurance companies in general, my problem is with putting faith in gov't who's bought off by insurance companies.

Well I'm sorry you don't like how the solution is being presented to you. We'll have to agree to disagree.

I'm a libertarian, I assure you I'll never learn to trust a bribed gov't and give said bribed gov't more power and more money in such a critical industry. Hopefully some day you'll learn, rather than just simply buy into propoganda.

Again what solution? Show me a solution with an actionable plan and I'd be happy to discuss it. We haven't disagreed on a plan yet because you have yet to produce one. I'd love to discuss a plan. I've talked about what I'd like to see and you don't seem to want to talk about that. Why is that?

Until then you're just buying in to the propaganda that is Ron Paul. All he has provided is big talking points and little substance, and you fell in love.

I think you love the idea that you can be "the outsider" who doesn't fit in to one of the two big parties and you've latched on to your leader who really hasn't offered much different in terms of a plan yet you can't see it. You're more concerned with not aligning yourself with one of the two big parties than you are with actually thinking about does the guy I have latched on to have any better ideas about this mess. In the case of health care...he clearly doesn't.

There's plenty of stuff I disagee with Paul on, do I think he's a great man? Yes. To work in an area so corrupt with every politician completely bought off, to be the lone exception is amazing. Healthcare I agree with him though. Get rid of medicaid, get rid of hmo's, get rid of the FDA, tax deductible-medical expenses. I'm not sure what else you want to hear.

 

[RDD_1210]

I don't have a problem with insurance companies in general, my problem is with putting faith in gov't who's bought off by insurance companies.

Well I'm sorry you don't like how the solution is being presented to you. We'll have to agree to disagree.

I'm a libertarian, I assure you I'll never learn to trust a bribed gov't and give said bribed gov't more power and more money in such a critical industry. Hopefully some day you'll learn, rather than just simply buy into propoganda.

Again what solution? Show me a solution with an actionable plan and I'd be happy to discuss it. We haven't disagreed on a plan yet because you have yet to produce one. I'd love to discuss a plan. I've talked about what I'd like to see and you don't seem to want to talk about that. Why is that?

Until then you're just buying in to the propaganda that is Ron Paul. All he has provided is big talking points and little substance, and you fell in love.

I think you love the idea that you can be "the outsider" who doesn't fit in to one of the two big parties and you've latched on to your leader who really hasn't offered much different in terms of a plan yet you can't see it. You're more concerned with not aligning yourself with one of the two big parties than you are with actually thinking about does the guy I have latched on to have any better ideas about this mess. In the case of health care...he clearly doesn't.

There's plenty of stuff I disagee with Paul on, do I think he's a great man? Yes. To work in an area so corrupt with every politician completely bought off, to be the lone exception is amazing. Healthcare I agree with him though. Get rid of medicaid, get rid of hmo's, get rid of the FDA, tax deductible-medical expenses. I'm not sure what else you want to hear.

LOL. Details....

For instance, you say "Get rid of Medicaid". So how do you propose the poor receive healthcare? Put it on their credit card? Dip in to their 401k? Sell off their summer home? You have these great talking points but it seems you haven't actually thought them all the way through.

And what does "tax deductible medical expenses" really mean? If you are diagnosed with Leukemia and have $500,000 in medical bills or more. How are you going to pay for that? Where is that money coming from? How much should you be allowed to write off? Is there a limit?

Sue me for wanting to see the full picture plan, I'm crazy like that.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Again what solution? Show me a solution with an actionable plan and I'd be happy to discuss it. We haven't disagreed on a plan yet because you have yet to produce one. I'd love to discuss a plan. I've talked about what I'd like to see and you don't seem to want to talk about that. Why is that?

Until then you're just buying in to the propaganda that is Ron Paul. All he has provided is big talking points and little substance, and you fell in love.

I think you love the idea that you can be "the outsider" who doesn't fit in to one of the two big parties and you've latched on to your leader who really hasn't offered much different in terms of a plan yet you can't see it. You're more concerned with not aligning yourself with one of the two big parties than you are with actually thinking about does the guy I have latched on to have any better ideas about this mess. In the case of health care...he clearly doesn't.

There's plenty of stuff I disagee with Paul on, do I think he's a great man? Yes. To work in an area so corrupt with every politician completely bought off, to be the lone exception is amazing. Healthcare I agree with him though. Get rid of medicaid, get rid of hmo's, get rid of the FDA, tax deductible-medical expenses. I'm not sure what else you want to hear.

LOL. Details....

For instance, you say "Get rid of Medicaid". So how do you propose the poor receive healthcare? Put it on their credit card? Dip in to their 401k? Sell off their summer home? You have these great talking points but it seems you haven't actually thought them all the way through.

And what does "tax deductible medical expenses" really mean? If you are diagnosed with Leukemia and have $500,000 in medical bills or more. How are you going to pay for that? Where is that money coming from? How much should you be allowed to write off? Is there a limit?

Sue me for wanting to see the full picture plan, I'm crazy like that.

I wish you'd read the links I provided, the answer to your questions have already been provided. There's already answers for those who can't afford their care.

List of legislation sponsored by Ron Paul - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And on that link is a list of the many specific tax credits that are involved in healthcare.

 

[RDD_1210]

There's plenty of stuff I disagee with Paul on, do I think he's a great man? Yes. To work in an area so corrupt with every politician completely bought off, to be the lone exception is amazing. Healthcare I agree with him though. Get rid of medicaid, get rid of hmo's, get rid of the FDA, tax deductible-medical expenses. I'm not sure what else you want to hear.

LOL. Details....

For instance, you say "Get rid of Medicaid". So how do you propose the poor receive healthcare? Put it on their credit card? Dip in to their 401k? Sell off their summer home? You have these great talking points but it seems you haven't actually thought them all the way through.

And what does "tax deductible medical expenses" really mean? If you are diagnosed with Leukemia and have $500,000 in medical bills or more. How are you going to pay for that? Where is that money coming from? How much should you be allowed to write off? Is there a limit?

Sue me for wanting to see the full picture plan, I'm crazy like that.

I wish you'd read the links I provided, the answer to your questions have already been provided. There's already answers for those who can't afford their care.

List of legislation sponsored by Ron Paul - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And on that link is a list of the many specific tax credits that are involved in healthcare.

I have been reading the links you've sent me. That's why I am asking for more details. Where on Ron pauls page did it have details? It doesn't.

I get the feeling now that you don't know the answers (actually I know you don't) but rather than just say I don't know, you link me to some wiki page and hope I find something on there that meets what I'm looking for (it doesn't).

So I looked at the Wiki page and what you linked to doesn't come close to providing answers to how to fix our healthcare system.

"Creates tax credit for the cost of insurance against negative outcomes from surgery, such as against malpractice of a physician." -

"Assists those suffering from cancer and other life-threatening illnesses by waiving the employee portion of Social Security taxes." - Yeah most people with cancer do pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in SS taxes each year. That should fix everything.

Why don't you tell me in your own words the answers to my questions. I mean, if you support the man and his policies you must understand the issue and how you imagine it would work under a Paul presidency.

*I know you can't and won't do that, but I want you to be honest for once and say you don't know the answer. I'd rather you be honest then continue to ignore me or pretend like you answered me and give me some lame link that you know full well doesn't answer the questions I am asking.

 

[Dr.Drock]

LOL. Details....

For instance, you say "Get rid of Medicaid". So how do you propose the poor receive healthcare? Put it on their credit card? Dip in to their 401k? Sell off their summer home? You have these great talking points but it seems you haven't actually thought them all the way through.

And what does "tax deductible medical expenses" really mean? If you are diagnosed with Leukemia and have $500,000 in medical bills or more. How are you going to pay for that? Where is that money coming from? How much should you be allowed to write off? Is there a limit?

Sue me for wanting to see the full picture plan, I'm crazy like that.

I wish you'd read the links I provided, the answer to your questions have already been provided. There's already answers for those who can't afford their care.

List of legislation sponsored by Ron Paul - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And on that link is a list of the many specific tax credits that are involved in healthcare.

I have been reading the links you've sent me. That's why I am asking for more details. Where on Ron pauls page did it have details? It doesn't.

I get the feeling now that you don't know the answers (actually I know you don't) but rather than just say I don't know, you link me to some wiki page and hope I find something on there that meets what I'm looking for (it doesn't).

So I looked at the Wiki page and what you linked to doesn't come close to providing answers to how to fix our healthcare system.

"Creates tax credit for the cost of insurance against negative outcomes from surgery, such as against malpractice of a physician." -

"Assists those suffering from cancer and other life-threatening illnesses by waiving the employee portion of Social Security taxes." - Yeah most people with cancer do pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in SS taxes each year. That should fix everything.

Why don't you tell me in your own words the answers to my questions. I mean, if you support the man and his policies you must understand the issue and how you imagine it would work under a Paul presidency.

*I know you can't and won't do that, but I want you to be honest for once and say you don't know the answer. I'd rather you be honest then continue to ignore me or pretend like you answered me and give me some lame link that you know full well doesn't answer the questions I am asking.

You're getting really sensitive, first you praise me for being smart, now you say I'm a liar who's never honest. I think you're a smart, honest person, who's just completely wrong on Obamacare, sad you're taking this so personally.

Big picture, getting rid of the fed and getting rid of income taxes will greatly help people's ability to afford healthcare. Smaller picture, I'll provide the answer below.

Here's the answer to your question, again from the link already provided.

As for the poor and the severely ill who can neither obtain insurance nor pay for the medical care they need, Ron Paul offers the following solution in his book “The Revolution: A Manifesto“:

In the days before Medicare and Medicaid, the poor and elderly were admitted to hospitals at the same rate they are now, and received good care. Before those programs came into existence, every physician understood that he or she had a responsibility towards the less fortunate and free medical care was the norm. Hardly anyone is aware of this today, since it doesn’t fit into the typical, by the script story of government rescuing us from a predatory private sector.

Illegal aliens already receive de-facto free health care. Why can’t poor Americans have the same… not as a right, but as a charitable benefit provided by doctors who feel a personal responsibility for their fellow citizens?

 

[uscitizen]

Not everyone needs or wants health care. The Fed forcing everyone to have it isn't cool. That is all.

Absolutely imagine them forcing us to have an apendectomy instead of dying in lingering agony which is our right!

Strawman, apendectomies are done on ppl without insurance.

but you have to pay for it. Unless you are a socialist.
No pay no operation.

 

[Dr.Drock]

Absolutely imagine them forcing us to have an apendectomy instead of dying in lingering agony which is our right!

Strawman, apendectomies are done on ppl without insurance.

but you have to pay for it. Unless you are a socialist.
No pay no operation.

False, socialist healthcare brought extinction for charitable hospitals.

 

[RDD_1210]

I wish you'd read the links I provided, the answer to your questions have already been provided. There's already answers for those who can't afford their care.

List of legislation sponsored by Ron Paul - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And on that link is a list of the many specific tax credits that are involved in healthcare.

I have been reading the links you've sent me. That's why I am asking for more details. Where on Ron pauls page did it have details? It doesn't.

I get the feeling now that you don't know the answers (actually I know you don't) but rather than just say I don't know, you link me to some wiki page and hope I find something on there that meets what I'm looking for (it doesn't).

So I looked at the Wiki page and what you linked to doesn't come close to providing answers to how to fix our healthcare system.

"Creates tax credit for the cost of insurance against negative outcomes from surgery, such as against malpractice of a physician." -

"Assists those suffering from cancer and other life-threatening illnesses by waiving the employee portion of Social Security taxes." - Yeah most people with cancer do pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in SS taxes each year. That should fix everything.

Why don't you tell me in your own words the answers to my questions. I mean, if you support the man and his policies you must understand the issue and how you imagine it would work under a Paul presidency.

*I know you can't and won't do that, but I want you to be honest for once and say you don't know the answer. I'd rather you be honest then continue to ignore me or pretend like you answered me and give me some lame link that you know full well doesn't answer the questions I am asking.

You're getting really sensitive, first you praise me for being smart, now you say I'm a liar who's never honest. I think you're a smart, honest person, who's just completely wrong on Obamacare, sad you're taking this so personally.

Sensitive? Hardly. But this is an issue I am passionate about and unfortunately have deep first hand knowledge of. Which is why its frustrating when someone who obviously has no real world experience is spouting off an opinion that has no basis in reality and doesn't seem to want to have an open mind.

I never said you were a liar, just stubborn and letting pride getting in the way of admitting when you don't know something.

Big picture, getting rid of the fed and getting rid of income taxes will greatly help people's ability to afford healthcare. Smaller picture, I'll provide the answer below.

Here's the answer to your question, again from the link already provided.

As for the poor and the severely ill who can neither obtain insurance nor pay for the medical care they need, Ron Paul offers the following solution in his book “The Revolution: A Manifesto“:

In the days before Medicare and Medicaid, the poor and elderly were admitted to hospitals at the same rate they are now, and received good care. Before those programs came into existence, every physician understood that he or she had a responsibility towards the less fortunate and free medical care was the norm. Hardly anyone is aware of this today, since it doesn’t fit into the typical, by the script story of government rescuing us from a predatory private sector.

Illegal aliens already receive de-facto free health care. Why can’t poor Americans have the same… not as a right, but as a charitable benefit provided by doctors who feel a personal responsibility for their fellow citizens?

And again I did read your link, the first time you posted it. So his great plan is to let doctors work for free out of the responsibility to do what is right for their fellow man but you don't think people should have to buy their own health insurance to do the same thing? To help out their fellow man. Seriously? You don't see the real world application problems with this? Or the blatant hypocrisy this sort of suggestion this is?

You're obviously too full of pride or just plain stubborn to admit you don't know what you're talking about so I'll leave you alone. I think you've taken enough of a beating for one day.

If and when you're ready to answer my questions and not with cherry picked snippets from someone else that still doesn't even answer what I asked, you let me know.

Have a good one.

 

[Dr.Drock]

I have been reading the links you've sent me. That's why I am asking for more details. Where on Ron pauls page did it have details? It doesn't.

I get the feeling now that you don't know the answers (actually I know you don't) but rather than just say I don't know, you link me to some wiki page and hope I find something on there that meets what I'm looking for (it doesn't).

So I looked at the Wiki page and what you linked to doesn't come close to providing answers to how to fix our healthcare system.

"Creates tax credit for the cost of insurance against negative outcomes from surgery, such as against malpractice of a physician." -

"Assists those suffering from cancer and other life-threatening illnesses by waiving the employee portion of Social Security taxes." - Yeah most people with cancer do pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in SS taxes each year. That should fix everything.

Why don't you tell me in your own words the answers to my questions. I mean, if you support the man and his policies you must understand the issue and how you imagine it would work under a Paul presidency.

*I know you can't and won't do that, but I want you to be honest for once and say you don't know the answer. I'd rather you be honest then continue to ignore me or pretend like you answered me and give me some lame link that you know full well doesn't answer the questions I am asking.

You're getting really sensitive, first you praise me for being smart, now you say I'm a liar who's never honest. I think you're a smart, honest person, who's just completely wrong on Obamacare, sad you're taking this so personally.

Sensitive? Hardly. But this is an issue I am passionate about and unfortunately have deep first hand knowledge of. Which is why its frustrating when someone who obviously has no real world experience is spouting off an opinion that has no basis in reality and doesn't seem to want to have an open mind.

I never said you were a liar, just stubborn and letting pride getting in the way of admitting when you don't know something.

Big picture, getting rid of the fed and getting rid of income taxes will greatly help people's ability to afford healthcare. Smaller picture, I'll provide the answer below.

Here's the answer to your question, again from the link already provided.

As for the poor and the severely ill who can neither obtain insurance nor pay for the medical care they need, Ron Paul offers the following solution in his book “The Revolution: A Manifesto“:

In the days before Medicare and Medicaid, the poor and elderly were admitted to hospitals at the same rate they are now, and received good care. Before those programs came into existence, every physician understood that he or she had a responsibility towards the less fortunate and free medical care was the norm. Hardly anyone is aware of this today, since it doesn’t fit into the typical, by the script story of government rescuing us from a predatory private sector.

Illegal aliens already receive de-facto free health care. Why can’t poor Americans have the same… not as a right, but as a charitable benefit provided by doctors who feel a personal responsibility for their fellow citizens?

And again I did read your link, the first time you posted it. So his great plan is to let doctors work for free out of the responsibility to do what is right for their fellow man but you don't think people should have to buy their own health insurance to do the same thing? To help out their fellow man. Seriously? You don't see the real world application problems with this? Or the blatant hypocrisy this sort of suggestion this is?

You're obviously too full of pride or just plain stubborn to admit you don't know what you're talking about so I'll leave you alone. I think you've taken enough of a beating for one day.

If and when you're ready to answer my questions and not with cherry picked snippets from someone else that still doesn't even answer what I asked, you let me know.

Have a good one.

Atta boy, declare yourself more knowledgible and the winner, the good thing about doing that is it never reaks of insecurity.

Not stubborn in the least, you even admit it doesn't fix any of the major problems. You're calling me ignorant for wanting us to return a currently broken system to a system that was already proven to have worked. It's not crazy to ask some doctors to work cheaply, that already happened and with Paul specifically.

Like I've stated and provided links to already show, Obamacare doesn't "help my fellow man." It helps a select handful of big billionaire companies that have bought off Washington.

I'll leave now and I win!!! Lol