Obama 95% illusion

[BlackAsCoal]

FWIW I don't mind paying taxes, more taxes than I do now even - but then I was raised to believe it is important to contribute to the community.

I am raising my kids to believe that contributing to a common cause is good, too.

Good for you.

The right forgets that taxes are a necessary function of government.

 

[DiamondDave]

Good for you.

The right forgets that taxes are a necessary function of government.

Yes... for government to run takes takes and tarrifs...

But it is not the function of government to play mommy or Robin Hood....

 

[KMAN]

And Cons believe the world revolves around them, yet they do talk in complete circles though

No... Conservatives believe that they can donate their money to causes better than the government... Because, conservatives believe in personal responsibility... That's the main difference between libs and cons, cons believe in the individual and libs believe in the government...which is quite astounding being that the government has a 10% approval rating right now...

 

[BlackAsCoal]

Yes... for government to run takes takes and tarrifs...

But it is not the function of government to play mommy or Robin Hood....

Mommy and Robin Hood analogies aside .. government functions to provide for its citizens .. that requires money/taxes to do so.

Conservatives .. who often think themselves the only true "patriots" .. are always whining about taxes .. and people .. while also branding themselves as "God-fearing"

Incredible stuff

 

[BlackAsCoal]

No... Conservatives believe that they can donate their money to causes better than the government... Because, conservatives believe in personal responsibility... That's the main difference between libs and cons, cons believe in the individual and libs believe in the government...which is quite astounding being that the government has a 10% approval rating right now...

No .. the main difference is that the left sees life as dynamic while the right sees life as static. Conservatives have their feet firmly planted hundreds of years in the past.

Your song about cons being more fiscally responsible flies in the face of damn near everything around you and absolutely everything about the last 8 years.

Donating money to your favorite cause is a far ass cry from addressing the needs of the government and the basic needs of its citizens. That "we donate money" crap is a copout.

 

[Andrew2382]

Yes, The left obviously believes that 95% of americans that will pay lower taxes is a valid statement when 1/3 of americans don't pay any fucking taxes!!

The person on welfare not paying any taxes is just going to get a bigger welfare check. I have no problem for welfare, I do think that if you want a welfare check you have to pass a drug test.

Seems fair

 

[Andrew2382]

have you ever worked for a large corporation, I have worked for a few and they are outsourcing like crazy and thats just the financial side, the industrial side is packing up and moving or laying people off left and right. Things are not moving the right direction as they stand now, bottom line.

have you ever worked for a large company?

I do. I work for Aon, largest broker in the world.

Guess what, this is how it works. All offices have something called a budget.

Now they set their budget before the new eyar, for example my office is getting ready to finish theirs for 2009 in the next 5 weeks or so.

Then they see how much revenue they have.

guess what? if it has been slow or more money ahs gone out because of higher corporate taxes and such, the revenue is going to be down. Well, in order to match the budget, the company will then start slashing things.

Guess what is the first thing to go. Employees...I have seen it, I saw 7 of my friends get laid off int he past 7 months due to budget reasons.

If the corporation is going to get taxed even more, they are going to find th emoney for it somewhere. Most likely, your salary

 

[Truthmatters]

No .. the main difference is that the left sees life as dynamic while the right sees life as static. Conservatives have their feet firmly planted hundreds of years in the past.

Your song about cons being more fiscally responsible flies in the face of damn near everything around you and absolutely everything about the last 8 years.

Donating money to your favorite cause is a far ass cry from addressing the needs of the government and the basic needs of its citizens. That "we donate money" crap is a copout.

Not just the last 8 years but much further.

go look at the last 30 years, Dems are better for the stock market and give us less debt.

 

[Andrew2382]

yeah jimmy carter did wonders for the stock market

 

[Andrew2382]

Market trends - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The United States was described as being in a secular (long term) bull market from about 1983 to late 2007

Reagen, bush, clinton, bush

 

[jschuck12001]

have you ever worked for a large company?

I do. I work for Aon, largest broker in the world.

Guess what, this is how it works. All offices have something called a budget.

Now they set their budget before the new eyar, for example my office is getting ready to finish theirs for 2009 in the next 5 weeks or so.

Then they see how much revenue they have.

guess what? if it has been slow or more money ahs gone out because of higher corporate taxes and such, the revenue is going to be down. Well, in order to match the budget, the company will then start slashing things.

Guess what is the first thing to go. Employees...I have seen it, I saw 7 of my friends get laid off int he past 7 months due to budget reasons.

If the corporation is going to get taxed even more, they are going to find th emoney for it somewhere. Most likely, your salary

I dont need your input on how corporations work, your company has 36,000 employees worldwide, the last 2 companies I have worked for have 1 1/2 times that and its all domestic. I also had to go thru 3 stages of layoffs with my previous company so I know very well how terrible it can be to tell someone they no longer have a job. You keep repeating the same bullshit that everyone else says but the bottom line is we are losing jobs to outsourcing and layoffs regardless of the tax rates. My main thing is get rid of the offshore accounting practices and keep those dollars in the US, find another way to reward these companies for staying in the US and get rid of those tax loopholes. Your in the financial side so if your laying people off I would watch your back, first its 7 people, then Corporate calls and you need to close down 3 branches and the next thing you know the whole region is closing. By the way I work for B of A now and before that I was a branch manager for Countrywide Financial so you dont need to tell me about layoffs, takeovers, liquidity issues or anything else.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

have you ever worked for a large company?

I do. I work for Aon, largest broker in the world.

Guess what, this is how it works. All offices have something called a budget.

Now they set their budget before the new eyar, for example my office is getting ready to finish theirs for 2009 in the next 5 weeks or so.

Then they see how much revenue they have.

guess what? if it has been slow or more money ahs gone out because of higher corporate taxes and such, the revenue is going to be down. Well, in order to match the budget, the company will then start slashing things.

Guess what is the first thing to go. Employees...I have seen it, I saw 7 of my friends get laid off int he past 7 months due to budget reasons.

If the corporation is going to get taxed even more, they are going to find th emoney for it somewhere. Most likely, your salary

So you think taxes are what's causing corporations to lay off people and ship jobs overseas?

YIKES

I've worked for several major corporations, including Oracle. I bet over half of Oracle's employeees are from India and have green crads .. because they work for much less .. which fits into the only thing that matters to Larry Ellison .. the bottom line.

Any idea how much Ellsion makes?

History has a clear and demonstrable lesson for your thoughts on this .. it's called the Robber Barons .. check it out.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

Yes, The left obviously believes that 95% of americans that will pay lower taxes is a valid statement when 1/3 of americans don't pay any fucking taxes!!

The person on welfare not paying any taxes is just going to get a bigger welfare check. I have no problem for welfare, I do think that if you want a welfare check you have to pass a drug test.

Seems fair

Should recipients of the massive amount of corporate welfare also have to take a drug test?

Seems fair .. if one believes as you do.

 

[jschuck12001]

So you think taxes are what's causing corporations to lay off people and ship jobs overseas?

YIKES

I've worked for several major corporations, including Oracle. I bet over half of Oracle's employeees are from India and have green crads .. because they work for much less .. which fits into the only thing that matters to Larry Ellison .. the bottom line.

Any idea how much Ellsion makes?

History has a clear and demonstrable lesson for your thoughts on this .. it's called the Robber Barons .. check it out.

Exactly, It bugs the shit out of me to see the outsourcing. Thats my main issue.

 

[jillian]

So you think taxes are what's causing corporations to lay off people and ship jobs overseas?

YIKES

I've worked for several major corporations, including Oracle. I bet over half of Oracle's employeees are from India and have green crads .. because they work for much less .. which fits into the only thing that matters to Larry Ellison .. the bottom line.

Any idea how much Ellsion makes?

History has a clear and demonstrable lesson for your thoughts on this .. it's called the Robber Barons .. check it out.

True. And, frankly, I, for one, am really bored of the voodoo economics crowd whining about taxes on corporate PROFITS. If the money is used to pay employees, it is deducted and ISN'T taxed. I am also really bored of hearing about how unions ruin business when even the most failed of CEO's is walking away with golden parachutes that suck the profitability out of business and ransack corporate coffers which can be better used to fund workers benefit packages.

So I guess it just depends on the kind of responsibility one expects from the corporatists to be accountable for the results of their actions.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

True. And, frankly, I, for one, am really bored of the voodoo economics crowd whining about taxes on corporate PROFITS. If the money is used to pay employees, it is deducted and ISN'T taxed. I am also really bored of hearing about how unions ruin business when even the most failed of CEO's is walking away with golden parachutes that suck the profitability out of business and ransack corporate coffers which can be better used to fund workers benefit packages.

So I guess it just depends on the kind of responsibility one expects from the corporatists to be accountable for the results of their actions.

I absolutely agree with you and you can add all the tired crap about the "free market" to your list of disgusting copouts.

The problem is that America IS a plutocracy and our government and military have been reduced to being mere extensions of American business.

No matter who wins in November, the corporate will will continue to dominate and dictate American domestic and foreign policy.

 

[Andrew2382]

Obama will fix all the corporate problems in this country don't worry.

Yet, noone can refute the fact that his 95% of taxpayers will pay lower taxes is bullshit.

 

[jschuck12001]

Obama will fix all the corporate problems in this country don't worry.

Yet, noone can refute the fact that his 95% of taxpayers will pay lower taxes is bullshit.

I'm not worried and saying he will fix all of the corporate problems in this country is obviously sarcasm because you cant be that ignorant. I have posted the links to the fact check websites about his plan and its proven that about 90% of working Americans will see a tax reduction. This plan was obviously written before the bailout so wee will see how that affects it.

 

[Andrew2382]

J,

90% of Americans can not see a tax reduction if a third of americans don't pay taxes...it's simple math.

What he does is twist the words, basically peopl ealready getting free money are going to get more free money when they aren't putting anything in. he calls that a tax reduction, it's not. It is a bigger welfare check.

Unfortunately, what I think is going to happen is neither canidate will do what they promise.

In Jan 09 we are going to get

"wow, things are much more fucked up then I thought, sorry i can't do shit that I said before"

 

[jschuck12001]

J,

90% of Americans can not see a tax reduction if a third of americans don't pay taxes...it's simple math.

What he does is twist the words, basically peopl ealready getting free money are going to get more free money when they aren't putting anything in. he calls that a tax reduction, it's not. It is a bigger welfare check.

Unfortunately, what I think is going to happen is neither canidate will do what they promise.

In Jan 09 we are going to get

"wow, things are much more fucked up then I thought, sorry i can't do shit that I said before"

Read the article, 90% of "working Americans" not just Americans. Why the hell would we need to cut taxes for people who dont pay taxes. This is something that has been over hyped on this board because he did say for " all Americans" early on but he changed to working Americans which he probably thought people were smart enough to figure out on their own since old folks dont have issues with getting taxed to death unless they own substantial assets. "Working Americans", is what is in his plan.