N.J. Supreme Court rules schools can search cars of students

[Bill O'Olberman]

My son is 11, and has a couple of bullies in his class. He is in 5th grade, and we have already discussed getting him a can of pepper spray to carry with him. He gets kicked for tapping his pencil in class, or singing little songs in line. The bully that kicks him, kicks HARD, and it hurts my son, even puts bruises on his legs sometimes. I am shocked that I have been forced into considering sending him to a "safe place" with a can of mace.. His bully's brother used to kick him, but when he got kicked out of the after school program (different organization) for it, he stopped.
We have other choices we could make, like pressing charges on the abusive child, as it does happen almost every day, or filing for an injunction, which I doubt would do much good, really.

I do not know for sure, but would carrying pepper spray get your kid suspended? You might wanna check the code of conduct. Also, having your son use pepper spray on another 11 year old kid, assuming the kids the same age/grade, isnt the best course of action anyways. Yeah, the kids a bully but hes 11 years old, come on. Addressing the issue with the school, the bully's parents, or your kid actually growing a pair of balls (hes 11 but still needs to learn to stand up for himself) and confronting the bullies are better solutions.

As far as I am concerned schools are not private property one gives up the assumption of protection when one goes to the school in a car. One gives up the presumption of private property when one consents to use a school locker or carries anything to school on their person.

But the Constitution protects the rights of people not places. Just because a phone booth is public doesnt mean that the government is able to monitor every phone call coming from that phone booth. I kinda disagree with your reasoning here.

As its been pointed out, school officials are not held to as strict a scrutiny as the police and can search the lockers, cars, etc. However, I believe that police cannot unless there is reasonable suspicion that they must articulate in court. Which is why I believe when school officials are searching the lockers and cars there is usually a police officer present but not actually conducting the search.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I suggest you reread what is and is not allowed. And yes a school can search a student if they feel a need for it. They do not even need a search warrant to do THAT.

Doesn't make it right.

It should be illegal unless the school has the permission of the parents. And as a parent I would never give permission for some government employee to search my kid.

Then you are part of the problem.

What problem?

The problem people who believe in liberty are to those who don't?

 

[Modbert]

Laws like these don't make much sense. What exactly would this law had prevented in the first place if it was enacted sooner?

It wouldn't of stopped any school shooting, nor columbine.

Never mind the whole liberty argument.

 

[Care4all]

i think it is unconstitutional

 

[Father Time]

modern version of searching their lockers, no?

No. Lockers are the school's property loaned to students. Cars are private property. The NJ court seriously fucked up.

 

[Father Time]

Not a big fan of the ACLU simply because I disagree with a lot of their frivolous cases and their support for pedophiles.

Such as?

 

[Father Time]

Further in grade and High School children are not adults and have not the same rights as adults.

Where exactly in the Constitution does it say kids have less 4th amendment rights than adults?

 

[Mr Natural]

Raise the minimum driving age to 19.

Problem solved.

 

[chanel]

Not going to debate that one here but if you are interested in the topic just google "aclu sex offenders" and you will get all the info you want.

Parents forfeit rights as soon as they put their kid on the bus. In exchange the schools promise to keep the kids safe. If a parent does not want to surrender their rights for six hours they should sign a waiver saying the school is not responsible for their safety. You can't have it both ways.

 

[Paulie]

EGG HARBOR TOWNSHIP -- School officials can search students’ cars on school property if they suspect them of illegal activity, the state Supreme Court unanimously ruled today in a decision that further broadens administrators’ investigatory rights.

Expanding the standard of "reasonable suspicion" to students’ vehicles, the court said that "represents the best way to vindicate each student’s right to be free from unreasonable searches and to receive a thorough and efficient education."

"Obviously the education process is hampered when drugs and other illegal activities are present," Justice John E. Wallace Jr., wrote for the court. "Indeed, the need for school officials to maintain safety, order, and discipline is necessary whether school officials are addressing concerns inside the school building or outside on the school parking lot."

"The administrators at schools have a lot more authority to conduct searches of their (students’) belongings than would be normally allowed by police," he said.

N.J. Supreme Court rules schools can search cars of students | - NJ.com

Good law?

If the car is on school property, then the school has a leg to stand on.

If it's parked on public property, sorry, no deal.

 

[chanel]

Yes and as I said many kids park on the street anyway. I doubt if it is applied very often anyway. They'd have to get keys, etc. It seems that the kid that brought the suit was a major drug dealer and was given a slap on the wrist. I'm just glad he lost.

 

[JD_2B]

Ugh- I don't like the argument of "Don't think it's constitutional- don't bother going to ________ public place."

It is a little hard to avoid public places, especially schools.

 

[JD_2B]

My son is 11, and has a couple of bullies in his class. He is in 5th grade, and we have already discussed getting him a can of pepper spray to carry with him. He gets kicked for tapping his pencil in class, or singing little songs in line. The bully that kicks him, kicks HARD, and it hurts my son, even puts bruises on his legs sometimes. I am shocked that I have been forced into considering sending him to a "safe place" with a can of mace.. His bully's brother used to kick him, but when he got kicked out of the after school program (different organization) for it, he stopped.
We have other choices we could make, like pressing charges on the abusive child, as it does happen almost every day, or filing for an injunction, which I doubt would do much good, really.

I do not know for sure, but would carrying pepper spray get your kid suspended? You might wanna check the code of conduct. Also, having your son use pepper spray on another 11 year old kid, assuming the kids the same age/grade, isnt the best course of action anyways. Yeah, the kids a bully but hes 11 years old, come on. Addressing the issue with the school, the bully's parents, or your kid actually growing a pair of balls (hes 11 but still needs to learn to stand up for himself) and confronting the bullies are better solutions.

Gee thanks, but I believe I already covered all that. My son beat up his last bully. Sorry the post was too long for you to bother reading entirely.

I have discussed it personally with the parents, AND the kid's brother was fucking kicked out of the after school program, not at the school, for physically bullying my child. The parents don't do SHIT besides fight and teach their kids to fight. This neighborhood sucks, and I can't wait to move this summer!

And I could care less about the code of fucking conduct, when the school is allowing a kid to kick my child on an almost daily basis, and not kicking that little punk's ass out. The code is that violence is only allowed if the child being hit is cornered or in some other position that he can not simply run away or retreat in some other way.

If the school is not going to honor the code of conduct with the bullies, then I am personally in a position of having to give my child non violent means of protection. Pepper spray solves that problem. I will happily take it to court, complete with tort liability well, if they decided to even TRY to suspend him for using a spray in self defense.

By the way, fighting and throwing punches to prove who can beat the other up the worst, is NOT how one grows a pair of balls. MY 11 year old son obviously is already a bigger man than you are, by knowing this and using patience and words to solve his problems rather than sticks and stones!! Telling an eleven year old boy to grow a pair, to fight like a man, etc.. GOOD GRIEF. Jackass.

 

[Bill O'Olberman]

I wish my son would just teach this other boy a lesson, too.

Okay, okay, okay. you're right. I must be a jackass for advocating that he confront the bully as a means of resolution.

Am I the only one who finds in morally questionable to spray an 11 year old kid with pepper spray here? Why not arm your son with a taser or a gun with rubber bullets because, yeah, that will teach the little shit not to be a bully anymore.

I agree the school has fail your child by not providing a safe environment and the parents of the other kid are seemingly giant wastes of life.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

My son is 11, and has a couple of bullies in his class. He is in 5th grade, and we have already discussed getting him a can of pepper spray to carry with him. He gets kicked for tapping his pencil in class, or singing little songs in line. The bully that kicks him, kicks HARD, and it hurts my son, even puts bruises on his legs sometimes. I am shocked that I have been forced into considering sending him to a "safe place" with a can of mace.. His bully's brother used to kick him, but when he got kicked out of the after school program (different organization) for it, he stopped.
We have other choices we could make, like pressing charges on the abusive child, as it does happen almost every day, or filing for an injunction, which I doubt would do much good, really.

I do not know for sure, but would carrying pepper spray get your kid suspended? You might wanna check the code of conduct. Also, having your son use pepper spray on another 11 year old kid, assuming the kids the same age/grade, isnt the best course of action anyways. Yeah, the kids a bully but hes 11 years old, come on. Addressing the issue with the school, the bully's parents, or your kid actually growing a pair of balls (hes 11 but still needs to learn to stand up for himself) and confronting the bullies are better solutions.

Gee thanks, but I believe I already covered all that. My son beat up his last bully. Sorry the post was too long for you to bother reading entirely.

I have discussed it personally with the parents, AND the kid's brother was fucking kicked out of the after school program, not at the school, for physically bullying my child. The parents don't do SHIT besides fight and teach their kids to fight. This neighborhood sucks, and I can't wait to move this summer!

And I could care less about the code of fucking conduct, when the school is allowing a kid to kick my child on an almost daily basis, and not kicking that little punk's ass out. The code is that violence is only allowed if the child being hit is cornered or in some other position that he can not simply run away or retreat in some other way.

If the school is not going to honor the code of conduct with the bullies, then I am personally in a position of having to give my child non violent means of protection. Pepper spray solves that problem. I will happily take it to court, complete with tort liability well, if they decided to even TRY to suspend him for using a spray in self defense.

By the way, fighting and throwing punches to prove who can beat the other up the worst, is NOT how one grows a pair of balls. MY 11 year old son obviously is already a bigger man than you are, by knowing this and using patience and words to solve his problems rather than sticks and stones!! Telling an eleven year old boy to grow a pair, to fight like a man, etc.. GOOD GRIEF. Jackass.

If he fights back he gets suspended for fighting. One can not win in the zero tolerance category we have sunk to in our schools. Report the abuse to the school. DO it every day and record it. In fact make the school sign a form that you have reported it. After several weeks they will either stop it or they deserve the law suit you bring on them for failing to enforce safety and security in the school.