Missiles over Tel Aviv 'Iron Dome'

[wavingrl]

from Drudge>>>
Iron Dome intercepts 2 Fajr-5 missiles aimed a... JPost - Defense

I tried to read it.

Can anyone provide a brief summary.

Time to head to a secure, underground location?



eta: somewhat easier to understand/CNN.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/17/world/meast/gaza-israel-strike/?hpt=hp_t1


'A White House spokesman, saying "the precipitating factor for the conflict was the rocket fire coming out of Gaza" into civilian areas, stressed that "Israel has a right to defend itself. He also underscored the importance of Israel avoiding civilian casualties.

"Israel is going to make choices about its own military operations," said Ben Rhodes, White House deputy national security adviser for strategic communications. "I think there's a broad preference for de-escalation if it could be achieved in a way that ends that threat to Israeli citizens."

Conclusion--US is sticking to its guns--leading from behind. What may be 'in the works'--behind the scenes--isn't clear to me. If it is 'necessary'---when it is necessary--to defend the US --we are well prepared to do what is needed. If I had to guess.

Confident that our POTUS is clear about that and can be inflexible about any form of manipulation. He proved that to me. Difficult job. I have read a bit about Harry Truman and what it is like to 'get the call'. It seems the decision made after Hiroshima was 'be prudent and patient'. I agree.

 

[waltky]

The United States has allocated a total of $275 million for Iron Dome...

Iron Dome: Missile defense system a game changer, Israelis say
Sat November 17, 2012 - Israel's missile system targets rockets fired from Gaza; In 2011, Israeli military said Iron Dome had 70% success rate, IHS Jane's says; The system is highly mobile and can be set up in hours

Israel's Iron Dome missile defense system is figuring prominently in the unfolding aerial conflict with Hamas' military wing in Gaza. Iron Dome is being credited with protecting Tel Aviv and other Israeli cities by blocking some of the rockets fired from Gaza. Over the past three days, 737 rockets from Gaza were fired upon Israel: 492 landed, but 245 were intercepted by the system, Israel Defense Forces said Saturday.

What is it?

The name Iron Dome evokes an image of a protective bubble over a city. In practice, Iron Dome is a defense against short-range rockets and mortar shells: the system targets incoming rockets and fires an interceptor missile to destroy them midair. Each battery has a firing-control radar to identify targets and a portable missile launcher. The system is easily transportable, with just a few hours needed to relocate and set up. The missile is highly maneuverable. It is three meters, or almost 10 feet, long; has a diameter of about six inches; and weighs 90 kilograms, or 198 pounds, according to the security analysis group IHS Jane's. The warhead is believed to carry 11 kilograms, or 24 pounds, of high explosives, IHS Jane's said. Its range is from 4 kilometers to 70 kilometers -- or 2.5 miles to 43 miles.

What are the origins of Iron Dome?

Israel began developing the ground-based system in 2007. After a series of test flights in 2008 and 2009, the first deployment of a battery occurred in southern Israel in 2011, according to IHS Jane's and the IDF. The Israel Air Force reported an interception success rate of 70% in 2011, IHS Jane's said. Israel credits "breakthrough technology" and the system's radar. Iron Dome confronts multiple threats simultaneously, in all weather conditions, the Israeli military said. "The radar detects a rocket launch and passes information regarding its path to the control center, which calculates the predicted point of impact," the IDF said. "If this location justifies an interception, a missile is fired to intercept the rocket. The payload of the interceptor missile explodes near the rocket, in a place that is not expected to cause injuries." Each Iron Dome battery costs $50 million, IHS Jane's said. A missile costs at least $62,000, Israeli officials said.

Is the United States involved in Iron Dome?

Yes. The initial development was solely by Israel's defense technology company Rafael, but the system has since been heavily sponsored by the United States. In May 2010, the U.S. House approved a plan to allocate $205 million for Iron Dome. In July, President Barack Obama announced $70 million in U.S. funding. "This is a program that has been critical in terms of providing security and safety for Israeli families," Obama said of the system. "It is a program that has been tested and has prevented missile strikes inside of Israel."

How important is Iron Dome?

See also:

Israel bombards Gaza Strip, shoots down rocket
17 Nov.`12 — Israel destroyed the headquarters of Hamas' prime minister and blasted a sprawling network of smuggling tunnels in the southern Gaza Strip on Saturday, broadening a blistering four-day-old offensive against the Islamic militant group even as diplomatic efforts to broker a cease-fire appeared to be gaining steam.

In neighboring Egypt, President Mohammed Morsi hosted leaders from Hamas and two key allies, Qatar and Turkey, to seek a way to end the fighting. "There are discussions about the ways to bring a cease-fire soon, but there are no guarantees until now," Morsi said at a news conference. He said he was working with Turkey, Arab countries, the U.S., Russia and western European countries to halt the fighting. Israel launched the operation on Wednesday in what it said was an effort to end months of rocket fire out of the Hamas-ruled territory. It began the offensive with an unexpected airstrike that killed Hamas' powerful military chief, and since then has relentlessly targeted suspected rocket launchers and storage sites.

In all, 46 Palestinians, including 15 civilians, have been killed and more than 400 civilians wounded, according to medical officials. Three Israeli civilians have been killed and more than 50 wounded. Israeli military officials expressed satisfaction with their progress Saturday, claiming they have inflicted heavy damage to Hamas. "Most of their capabilities have been destroyed," Maj. Gen. Tal Russo, Israel's southern commander, told reporters. Asked whether Israel is ready to send ground troops into Gaza, he said: "Absolutely." The White House said President Barack Obama was also in touch with the Egyptian and Turkish leaders. The U.S. has solidly backed Israel so far.

Speaking on Air Force One, deputy national security adviser Ben Rhodes said that the White House believes Israel "has the right to defend itself" against attack and that the Israelis will make their own decisions about their "military tactics and operations." The White House, which like Israel considers Hamas a terrorist organization, also continued to support Israel. "We believe Israel has a right to defend itself, and they'll make their own decisions about the tactics they use in that regard," deputy national security adviser Ben Rhodes told reporters on Air Force One. Despite the bruising offensive, Israel has failed to slow the barrages of rockets from Gaza.

The Israeli military said 160 rockets were launched into Israel on Saturday, raising the total number to roughly 500 since this week's fighting began. Eight Israelis, including five civilians, were lightly wounded Saturday, the army said. Israel carried out at least 300 airstrikes on Saturday, the military said, and it broadened its array of targets. One air raid flattened the three-story office building used by Hamas' prime minister, Ismail Haniyeh. He was not inside the building at the time. In southern Gaza, aircraft went after the tunnels that militants use to smuggle in weapons and other contraband from neighboring Egypt. Tunnel operators said the intensity of the bombing was unprecedented, and that massive explosions could be heard kilometers (miles) away, both in Gaza and in Egypt.

More Israel bombards Gaza Strip, shoots down rocket - Yahoo! News

 

[wavingrl]

The United States has allocated a total of $275 million for Iron Dome...

Iron Dome: Missile defense system a game changer, Israelis say
Sat November 17, 2012 - Israel's missile system targets rockets fired from Gaza; In 2011, Israeli military said Iron Dome had 70% success rate, IHS Jane's says; The system is highly mobile and can be set up in hours

I had a chance to ask my neighbor he sort of explained the Iron Dome concept to me.

Thanks for your fyi--I'll read it when I have a chance.

So--I guess the US feels since we chipped in for the Iron Dome that we have done 'enough' for the present?

We should never allow any entity to manipulate or pressure us--I agree with that.


I hope Russia and China are also receiving that message. Who can say? 'Everbody' wants something---sometimes the answer has to be 'No'--not at this time and for some, 'Never'?

I think so.

 

[saveliberty]

Tanks pushing the Palestinians into the sea will work even better.

 

[Franticfrank]

Good to see the missile defenses working well.

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

If it wasn't for this Iron Dome system, I suspect scores more of Israeli men, women and children would be being killed due to these rockets being fired by Hamas. And, I suspect, the poor Palestinians will act like 10-year-olds and call "no fair", as if there's anything "fair" in life. I notice the left-wing Muslim sympathizing media is making sure they get their film footage of dead and wounded Palestinian children but, of course, don't mention much of anything about the dead and wounded Israeli children. And, not to mention, the media ignoring the fact that if it wasn't for that Iron Dome system, there would be untold numbers more dead and wounded Israeli children.

Watching just a three minute news segment at this very moment on CBS, they've shown two minutes and 59 seconds of screaming, crying and waling Palestinians and one second of Israelis firing their Iron Dome missiles. As if to say there's not a single Israeli citizen suffering from and being terrified of these missiles Hamas is firing. The media's bias is so transparent it's pathetic. It's like...No, there aren't any Israelis screaming, crying and waling due to these Hamas missiles. They're all sitting home all nice and comfy watching TV and having a good ol' time, to watch the media portray it.

 

[georgephillip]

Did CBS mention the nearly one hundred UNSC Resolutions that Israel is violating by maintaining an illegal occupation in Palestine?

Have you ever heard any corporate media point out how, in 1948, one-third of the population of Mandate Palestine inflicted a Jewish State by force of arms upon the Arab majority?

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

Did CBS mention the nearly one hundred UNSC Resolutions that Israel is violating by maintaining an illegal occupation in Palestine?

Have you ever heard any corporate media point out how, in 1948, one-third of the population of Mandate Palestine inflicted a Jewish State by force of arms upon the Arab majority?

Is this opposed to the untold UN violations initiated by Palestinians and the rest of their Muslim bro's? Further, there is no "illegal occupation" of Palestine. You clearly are exceptionally ignorant of the history of that region.

Further, don't talk to me about the Partition of Palestine plan. In that plan, the Palestinians would have gained more than half the area which is now Israel and the Palestinians rejected it outright and them and their Muslim bro's proceeded to try and invade Israel and, then, Israel proceeded to wipe the desert floor with their asses and, now, boo hoo, Israel gets to enjoy the spoils of that war it was the Palestinians and their Muslim bro's started.

 

[georgephillip]

Why are Jews the only nation on the planet allowed to steal land their ancestors conquered thousands of years ago?
Do the Lenape have equal rights to Manhattan?
Or are you just another ignorant racist?

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

Why are Jews the only nation on the planet allowed to steal land their ancestors conquered thousands of years ago?
Do the Lenape have equal rights to Manhattan?
Or are you just another ignorant racist?

Allowed to steal whose land whose ancestors conquered thousands of years ago? Do you even know what the hell you're talking about? Have you even ever actually picked up a history book or an encyclopedia? Or, are you too busy being indoctrinated by propagandists who vomit nothing but lies and made up stories? The only ones who stole land here were the Palestinians and the rest of their Muslim horde.

Further, that land has been invaded and conquered by so many different entities throughout the centuries that, for you to imply that you have license on the area because Muslims once conquered the area is a laughable joke. The Ptolomies of Egypt and the Seleucids of Syria conquered it. The Romans conquered it. Later, the Crusaders conquered it. Napoleon conquered it. All kinds of entities conquered it. But, the fact of the matter is this. Prior to all this, it was the Semites such as the Amorites, Canaanites, Aramaeans and Hebrews who occupied this territory.

 

[georgephillip]

Why are Jews the only nation on the planet allowed to steal land their ancestors conquered thousands of years ago?
Do the Lenape have equal rights to Manhattan?
Or are you just another ignorant racist?

Allowed to steal whose land whose ancestors conquered thousands of years ago? Do you even know what the hell you're talking about? Have you even ever actually picked up a history book or an encyclopedia? Or, are you too busy being indoctrinated by propagandists who vomit nothing but lies and made up stories? The only ones who stole land here were the Palestinians and the rest of their Muslim horde.

Further, that land has been invaded and conquered by so many different entities throughout the centuries that, for you to imply that you have license on the area because Muslims once conquered the area is a laughable joke. The Ptolomies of Egypt and the Seleucids of Syria conquered it. The Romans conquered it. Later, the Crusaders conquered it. Napoleon conquered it. All kinds of entities conquered it. But, the fact of the matter is this. Prior to all this, it was the Semites such as the Amorites, Canaanites, Aramaeans and Hebrews who occupied this territory.

"The 1993 Oslo Accords declared the final status of the West Bank to be subject to a forthcoming settlement between Israel and the Palestinian leadership. Following these interim accords, Israel withdrew its military rule from some parts of the West Bank, which was divided into three administrative divisions of the Oslo Accords..."

"Area A, 2.7%, full civil control of the Palestinian Authority, comprises Palestinian towns, and some rural areas away from Israeli settlements in the north (between Jenin, Nablus, Tubas, and Tulkarm), the south (around Hebron), and one in the center south of Salfit.[37]

"Area B, 25.2%, adds other populated rural areas, many closer to the center of the West Bank.

"Area C contains all the Israeli settlements, roads used to access the settlements, buffer zones (near settlements, roads, strategic areas, and Israel), and almost all of the Jordan Valley and the Judean Desert.

Areas A and B are themselves divided among 227 separate areas (199 of which are smaller than 2 square kilometres (1 sq mi)) that are separated from one another by Israeli-controlled Area C. [38] Areas A, B, and C cross the 11 Governorates used as administrative divisions by the Palestinian National Authority, Israel, and the IDF and named after major cities.

"The mainly open areas of Area C were to be handed over to the Palestinians by 1999 under the Oslo Accords. This was never done."

Not only was it never done, Jews are now ready annex Area C into Israel proper.
Stealing land and water, in other words.

West Bank - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

Why are Jews the only nation on the planet allowed to steal land their ancestors conquered thousands of years ago?
Do the Lenape have equal rights to Manhattan?
Or are you just another ignorant racist?

Allowed to steal whose land whose ancestors conquered thousands of years ago? Do you even know what the hell you're talking about? Have you even ever actually picked up a history book or an encyclopedia? Or, are you too busy being indoctrinated by propagandists who vomit nothing but lies and made up stories? The only ones who stole land here were the Palestinians and the rest of their Muslim horde.

Further, that land has been invaded and conquered by so many different entities throughout the centuries that, for you to imply that you have license on the area because Muslims once conquered the area is a laughable joke. The Ptolomies of Egypt and the Seleucids of Syria conquered it. The Romans conquered it. Later, the Crusaders conquered it. Napoleon conquered it. All kinds of entities conquered it. But, the fact of the matter is this. Prior to all this, it was the Semites such as the Amorites, Canaanites, Aramaeans and Hebrews who occupied this territory.

"The 1993 Oslo Accords declared the final status of the West Bank to be subject to a forthcoming settlement between Israel and the Palestinian leadership. Following these interim accords, Israel withdrew its military rule from some parts of the West Bank, which was divided into three administrative divisions of the Oslo Accords..."

"Area A, 2.7%, full civil control of the Palestinian Authority, comprises Palestinian towns, and some rural areas away from Israeli settlements in the north (between Jenin, Nablus, Tubas, and Tulkarm), the south (around Hebron), and one in the center south of Salfit.[37]

"Area B, 25.2%, adds other populated rural areas, many closer to the center of the West Bank.

"Area C contains all the Israeli settlements, roads used to access the settlements, buffer zones (near settlements, roads, strategic areas, and Israel), and almost all of the Jordan Valley and the Judean Desert.

Areas A and B are themselves divided among 227 separate areas (199 of which are smaller than 2 square kilometres (1 sq mi)) that are separated from one another by Israeli-controlled Area C. [38] Areas A, B, and C cross the 11 Governorates used as administrative divisions by the Palestinian National Authority, Israel, and the IDF and named after major cities.

"The mainly open areas of Area C were to be handed over to the Palestinians by 1999 under the Oslo Accords. This was never done."

Not only was it never done, Jews are now ready annex Area C into Israel proper.
Stealing land and water, in other words.

West Bank - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh, you mean the Oslo Accord? THE...Oslo Accord? The Accord of which Hamas doesn't recognize since their charter refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist in Palestine? Is that the Accord you're talking about? Since recognition of Israel's right to exist in Palestine was one of the conditions of the Accord and, since Hamas doesn't recognize Israel's right to exist in Palestine, I think this, for all intents and purposes, renders the Oslo Accord null and void...doesn't it? Further, who are you to be talking about the Oslo Accord when Palestinians intensified their attacks against Israel almost immediately after the Accord was signed?

 

[wavingrl]

US sends Clinton to Mideast to try to end conflict | General Headlines | Comcast


<A deputy White House national security adviser said U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton would depart for the Mideast on Tuesday from Cambodia, where she had accompanied Obama on a visit to Southeast Asia. The official said Clinton would begin her Mideast diplomacy by meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in Jerusalem, then she would meet with senior officials of the Palestinian government in the West Bank before heading to Cairo to meet with Egyptian leaders.

The U.S. considers Hamas, which has killed hundreds of Israelis in suicide and other attacks, to be a terror group and does not meet with its officials. The Obama administration blames Hamas for the latest eruption of violence and says Israel has the right to defend itself. At the same time, it has warned against a ground invasion, saying it could send casualties spiraling.>

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

US sends Clinton to Mideast to try to end conflict | General Headlines | Comcast


<A deputy White House national security adviser said U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton would depart for the Mideast on Tuesday from Cambodia, where she had accompanied Obama on a visit to Southeast Asia. The official said Clinton would begin her Mideast diplomacy by meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in Jerusalem, then she would meet with senior officials of the Palestinian government in the West Bank before heading to Cairo to meet with Egyptian leaders.

The U.S. considers Hamas, which has killed hundreds of Israelis in suicide and other attacks, to be a terror group and does not meet with its officials. The Obama administration blames Hamas for the latest eruption of violence and says Israel has the right to defend itself. At the same time, it has warned against a ground invasion, saying it could send casualties spiraling.>

Maybe Obama should have met with Netanyahu some time ago, rather than party it up with Beyonce and Jay-Z and, perhaps, this whole thing could have been nipped in the bud in the first place. But, Obama was too interested in yucking it up with his Hollywood buds and filling his pockets with campaign cash. And, additionally, if a ground invasion is what Israel needs to engage in, Obama can shut his trap and refrain from warning against anything.

 

[wavingrl]

US sends Clinton to Mideast to try to end conflict | General Headlines | Comcast


Maybe Obama should have met with Netanyahu some time ago, rather than party it up with Beyonce and Jay-Z and, perhaps, this whole thing could have been nipped in the bud in the first place. But, Obama was too interested in yucking it up with his Hollywood buds and filling his pockets with campaign cash. And, additionally, if a ground invasion is what Israel needs to engage in, Obama can shut his trap and refrain from warning against anything.

Preaching to the choir. They talked by phone--good enough for me. Since the days of Jimmy Carter, at least, diplomacy/talking has been tried.

Sick of what goes on in the Middle East. Blow themselves off the face of the earth. Tired of being patient and tolerant for many reasons--religious beliefs being at the top of the list.

We have to attend to other things---North Korea always wants/needs attention. 'Iran'--begging for attention from US. China and Russia----bothersome and also dying for attention.

We have too much to do at home to even be sending SOS all over the globe. hmmmph---If I were Hillary--I would not want to go anywhere or do anything after what she has had to put up with in this JOB. just me. lol--run in 2016---surely you jest. that is what I would say.

Maybe Chelsea will produce a grandchild, maybe she would prefer to focus on her family. lol--Focus on the Family---subversive group? I don't really worry overly about them. fyi.

 

[georgephillip]

Allowed to steal whose land whose ancestors conquered thousands of years ago? Do you even know what the hell you're talking about? Have you even ever actually picked up a history book or an encyclopedia? Or, are you too busy being indoctrinated by propagandists who vomit nothing but lies and made up stories? The only ones who stole land here were the Palestinians and the rest of their Muslim horde.

Further, that land has been invaded and conquered by so many different entities throughout the centuries that, for you to imply that you have license on the area because Muslims once conquered the area is a laughable joke. The Ptolomies of Egypt and the Seleucids of Syria conquered it. The Romans conquered it. Later, the Crusaders conquered it. Napoleon conquered it. All kinds of entities conquered it. But, the fact of the matter is this. Prior to all this, it was the Semites such as the Amorites, Canaanites, Aramaeans and Hebrews who occupied this territory.

"The 1993 Oslo Accords declared the final status of the West Bank to be subject to a forthcoming settlement between Israel and the Palestinian leadership. Following these interim accords, Israel withdrew its military rule from some parts of the West Bank, which was divided into three administrative divisions of the Oslo Accords..."

"Area A, 2.7%, full civil control of the Palestinian Authority, comprises Palestinian towns, and some rural areas away from Israeli settlements in the north (between Jenin, Nablus, Tubas, and Tulkarm), the south (around Hebron), and one in the center south of Salfit.[37]

"Area B, 25.2%, adds other populated rural areas, many closer to the center of the West Bank.

"Area C contains all the Israeli settlements, roads used to access the settlements, buffer zones (near settlements, roads, strategic areas, and Israel), and almost all of the Jordan Valley and the Judean Desert.

Areas A and B are themselves divided among 227 separate areas (199 of which are smaller than 2 square kilometres (1 sq mi)) that are separated from one another by Israeli-controlled Area C. [38] Areas A, B, and C cross the 11 Governorates used as administrative divisions by the Palestinian National Authority, Israel, and the IDF and named after major cities.

"The mainly open areas of Area C were to be handed over to the Palestinians by 1999 under the Oslo Accords. This was never done."

Not only was it never done, Jews are now ready annex Area C into Israel proper.
Stealing land and water, in other words.

West Bank - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh, you mean the Oslo Accord? THE...Oslo Accord? The Accord of which Hamas doesn't recognize since their charter refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist in Palestine? Is that the Accord you're talking about? Since recognition of Israel's right to exist in Palestine was one of the conditions of the Accord and, since Hamas doesn't recognize Israel's right to exist in Palestine, I think this, for all intents and purposes, renders the Oslo Accord null and void...doesn't it? Further, who are you to be talking about the Oslo Accord when Palestinians intensified their attacks against Israel almost immediately after the Accord was signed?

Hamas is not a sovereign government.
Whether it endorses Oslo or not doesn't matter.
Except for those subject to abject ignorance.

BTW, it's not Hamas or Arabs who've been blocking a two-state settlement for forty years:

"Chomsky: Well for several years Hamas has been very clear and explicit, repeatedly, that they favor a two state settlement on the international border. They said they would not recognize Israel but they would accept a two state settlement and a prolonged truce, maybe decades, maybe 50 years.

"Now, that's not exactly the international consensus but it's pretty close to it.

"On the other hand, the United States and Israel flatly reject it.

"They reject it in deeds, that's why they are building all the construction development activities in the West Bank, not only in violation of international laws, US and Israel know that the illegal constructions are designed explicitly to convert the West Bank into what the architect of the policy, Arial Sharon, called bantustan. Israel takes over what it wants, break up Palestine into unviable fragments."

Chomsky On Gaza, Noam Chomsky interviewed by Christiana Voniati

Now convince me a brain-dead bigot understands Oslo better than Chomsky does.

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

"The 1993 Oslo Accords declared the final status of the West Bank to be subject to a forthcoming settlement between Israel and the Palestinian leadership. Following these interim accords, Israel withdrew its military rule from some parts of the West Bank, which was divided into three administrative divisions of the Oslo Accords..."

"Area A, 2.7%, full civil control of the Palestinian Authority, comprises Palestinian towns, and some rural areas away from Israeli settlements in the north (between Jenin, Nablus, Tubas, and Tulkarm), the south (around Hebron), and one in the center south of Salfit.[37]

"Area B, 25.2%, adds other populated rural areas, many closer to the center of the West Bank.

"Area C contains all the Israeli settlements, roads used to access the settlements, buffer zones (near settlements, roads, strategic areas, and Israel), and almost all of the Jordan Valley and the Judean Desert.

Areas A and B are themselves divided among 227 separate areas (199 of which are smaller than 2 square kilometres (1 sq mi)) that are separated from one another by Israeli-controlled Area C. [38] Areas A, B, and C cross the 11 Governorates used as administrative divisions by the Palestinian National Authority, Israel, and the IDF and named after major cities.

"The mainly open areas of Area C were to be handed over to the Palestinians by 1999 under the Oslo Accords. This was never done."

Not only was it never done, Jews are now ready annex Area C into Israel proper.
Stealing land and water, in other words.

West Bank - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh, you mean the Oslo Accord? THE...Oslo Accord? The Accord of which Hamas doesn't recognize since their charter refuses to recognize Israel's right to exist in Palestine? Is that the Accord you're talking about? Since recognition of Israel's right to exist in Palestine was one of the conditions of the Accord and, since Hamas doesn't recognize Israel's right to exist in Palestine, I think this, for all intents and purposes, renders the Oslo Accord null and void...doesn't it? Further, who are you to be talking about the Oslo Accord when Palestinians intensified their attacks against Israel almost immediately after the Accord was signed?

Hamas is not a sovereign government.
Whether it endorses Oslo or not doesn't matter.
Except for those subject to abject ignorance.

What the hell would you call it then?

Since June 2007 Hamas has governed the Gaza portion of the Palestine Territories, after it won a majority of seats in the Palestinian Parliament in the January 2006 Palestinian parliamentary elections and then defeated the Fatah political organization in a series of violent clashes.

Further, whether you figure Hamas endorsing Oslo or not doesn't matter, I doubt, matters to the Israelis. I highly doubt the Israelis give a flying fuck whether you think whether Hamas endorses Oslo or not doesn't matter.

Also, where do you get the idea any government in Palestine is a sovereign government? If they haven't achieved statehood, how can they possibly have a sovereign government...dope? The sovereign government of Palestine is Israel...DUH!

Also, you ignored the rest of what I said, hoping I wouldn't see it. You ignore the part where I inform you that the Palestinians intensified their attacks against Israel immediately after the Accord was signed. Again, another action which, for all intents and purposes, rendered the Accord null and void.

BTW, it's not Hamas or Arabs who've been blocking a two-state settlement for forty years:

Sure it is.

"Chomsky

: Well for several years Hamas has been very clear and explicit, repeatedly, that they favor a two state settlement on the international border. They said they would not recognize Israel but they would accept a two state settlement and a prolonged truce, maybe decades, maybe 50 years.

"Now, that's not exactly the international consensus but it's pretty close to it.

"On the other hand, the United States and Israel flatly reject it.

"They reject it in deeds, that's why they are building all the construction development activities in the West Bank, not only in violation of international laws, US and Israel know that the illegal constructions are designed explicitly to convert the West Bank into what the architect of the policy, Arial Sharon, called bantustan. Israel takes over what it wants, break up Palestine into unviable fragments."

Chomsky On Gaza, Noam Chomsky interviewed by Christiana Voniati

Now convince me a brain-dead bigot understands Oslo better than Chomsky does.

First, LOL@someone quoting Chomsky. Second, what recent construction has been taking place? Cite it. And, by the way, insofar as being a bigot towards the Palestinians? Damn rights...chump! Give me one damn good reason NOT to be bigoted towards them. You can bet your ass they'd have plenty of bigotry to offer up to me.

Third, this horseshit claim that, somehow, Israel's construction is illegal? Give it a rest. Israel can build anywhere it wants, anytime it wants, and there's nothing "illegal" about it.

 

[georgephillip]

If you think Israel is subject to international law, then their building in Area C is illegal.

"The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."

Fourth Geneva Convention - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

See if you can find any proof that Palestinians intensified their attack after Gaza was signed.

 

[CrotchetyGeezer]

If you think Israel is subject to international law, then their building in Area C is illegal.

"The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies."

Fourth Geneva Convention - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

See if you can find any proof that Palestinians intensified their attack after Gaza was signed.

Apparently you missed the part where Palestinians rendered the Accord null and void.

According to the Israeli government, the Israeli's trust in the accords was undermined by the fact that after the signing, the attacks against Israel intensified, which some explained as an attempt by certain Palestinian organizations to thwart the peace process. Others believed that the Palestinian Authority had no interest in stopping these attacks and was instead endorsing them. As evidence, they showed that when violence flared up in September 1996, Palestinian police turned their guns on the Israelis in clashes which left 61 Palestinians and 15 Israeli soldiers dead. Important sections of the Israeli public opposed the process; notably, the Jewish settlers feared that it would lead to them losing their homes.

Furthermore, where is it you get the idea this Accord was somehow international law? And, this part? It's funnier than hell. "shall not transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies." LOL!

So, now, why don't you elaborate a little further on how it is you presume the Oslo Accord was, somehow, international law? They didn't even expect it to last five years.

It was anticipated that this arrangement would last for a five-year interim period during which a permanent agreement would be negotiated (beginning no later than May 1996). Permanent issues such as positions on Jerusalem, Palestinian refugees, Israeli settlements, security and borders were deliberately left to future negotiations. In 1995, the Oslo I Accord was followed by Oslo II. Neither promised Palestinian statehood.

And oh...lastly, with respect to your citation of the Fourth Geneva Convention? It conflicts with the UN's own actions and it conflicts with the agreements made when Israel became a recognized state. Sorry...try again.

 

[georgephillip]

The Fourth Geneva Convention is international law.
Between 1995 and 2012 Jews living in Area C increased from 133,000 to 300,000.
Can you do that math?

Israel's settlement building activity in Area C after Oslo II directly violates the Fourth Geneva Convention's prohibition of transferring its civilian population into territory it occupies.

Of course, "creeping annexation" and "creeping transfer" have been integral to the Zionist plan of a racist, apartheid Jewish State ruling over the historical Land of Israel in spite of the demographic "facts on the ground."

Right, Creep?