Methods off preaching, conversion, spreading the Faith and religious tolerance

[Said1]

It's in the UserCP, on the left hand side towards the bottom.

 

[Shattered]

Got it - Thanky muchly.

 

[Eightball]

Ok, here's the bottom line with me. I've been a bible believing Christian for many years. I've gone through many changes in my thoughts and approaches to what my life as a Christian means, and what ways to the non-Christian world, my faith should make application.

When I first became a believer(Christian), I experienced such dramatic change from my previous ways of life, that it was all I could do to not contain the joy, and want to share it with others. As, I gradually matured in this new faith/life, I realized that the Christ hadn't taught in the bible that this new faith in Him was to be pushed, forced, or presented in any manner that would put Him in a bad light. With that said, previous threads about Christians being arrested at a Gay festival for broadcasting biblical statements about Homosexuality, hits right where I'm going with this statement. In their exuberance to share this new faith that frees humanity from the yoke of sins, and sinful behaviour they appear to be insulting or upsetting those that don't see their way.

If you noticed in the bible, Jesus's performed miracle after miracle, but it seems that the Lord became exasperated with the way people continued to want more miracles. They never got the perverbial, "light". They wanted constant signs and wonders, or they just lost interest in Jesus. They totally overlooked His message, and just wanted the "flash-bang" part of God, and not His substance, and character that He brought to share with them.

Being a Christian involves maturing in a way that's not much different than maturing from childhood to adulthood. Christians often start out with a lot of "flash-bang", and think that this is what Christianity is all about, while forgetting that Christianity is a life, of dependency in God, through the restorative work of Christ's death, and ressurrection to new life for all who believe in Him. Yes, there should be release of pent up guild, with insuing peace, but many Christians continue to crave the "flash-bang" part of their initial conversion, and never grow beyond that infancy of faith.

A good example is in the work place. I no more than any other person would love for everyone of my co-workers to know Christ in a personal way, but if I were to tap each person on the shoulder and ask them if they are "saved", I would most likely get a weird stare, and probably become lables as a strange one, and even start to be avoided. Now I may feel rejected, but that's minor compared to the portrait of Christianity I have presented to my co-workers. First of all, the bible says emphatically that Christians should be good and dilligent workers at the work place or in an endeavor. If I try to hand out bible tracts, and try to generate conversations about the Christian faith on the job, am I being considerate of the fact that I might be interferring in people's productivity, and possibly causing my employer to lose hourly employee productivity?

Not knowing that I was a Christian, I actually have had other Christians accost me during working hours and want to start a conversation about Jesus and the bible. On one occassion I politely informed a Christian that I needed to continue to work, and that he was not only stopping me from working, but was also stopping from his work too. I further informed him that I didn't think that God wanted it this way.

So many Christians don't realize that Paul's mention of Watering, and Seed Planting, held just as much importance as those who got to be harvesters, or those that led others to conversion in Christianity.

Christians, can say so much to the world without even opening their mouths. The way they live their lives. The way they handle hardships, tragedies, mishaps, and even the good times.

I remember years ago, when my boss approached me, and asked me if I was a Christian. I was so startled, it nearly made me speechless! I said, "yes", and then asked him why he asked. He said, I noticed that when we all sit around at lunch, and most of the other guys, swear and tell "off color" jokes, you don't. I also noticed that you still enjoy sitting with the guys, and don't act like your better than them.

Folks, I'm not trying to brag about my self. Please understand that I am not perfect in my conduct 100% of the time. I do have my days when I anything, but the picture of Christianity. I will say that I don't like those days, and I know that in myself, and have this tendency to do wrong, but I thank God, that my conscience gets to me, and makes me ask God for strength to say, "no". Maybe that's what my boss has seen in me. Yes, with that little opening that day on the job, I actually, with a lot of humbleness, told my boss about what it means to be a Christian. I actually told him about Jesus, sin, and forgiveness, but in a very respectful, and humble way. My boss has continued to be very open with me.

Do you see what I'm saying. Now, I know that there are some on my Job(I'm a commersial construction electrician) that probably don't like the fact that I'm a little different from them. In fact there will be those that will not like me, because my way of living or looking at life makes them feel guilty. It wasn't my intention to make people feel guilty. Sometimes people feel guilty, because something or someone reminds them of something in their own life that they are not heeding, and as a result they respond negatively.

I just feel that a lot of negativity towards Christians could be alleviated if Christians would let their lives reflect Christ's life, rather than going on the offensive against the non-Christian world. The bible distinctly says that we are to put on armour in a spiritual sense, and I noticed that the armour is not offensive armour, but defensive armour. So it seems that the weapons of the Christian are in the realm of being prepared to share the good news to whom the time arises. With my boss, the time came. He asked, I didn't provoke or prod. My job was to be prepared to answer questions, and to do it in a way that didn't embarrass Christ, but to show that Christ was a friend.

Well, I hope I got my point across. I know there are times when Christians will need to step up in fast, tough ways, such as stopping a poor baby from being aborted, or stopping a person doing something immediately life threatening. In most other cases, I think Christ wanted His follower's lives to point others to the One that made the change in the follower's life.

Regards, Eightballsidepocket

 

[Shattered]

Now that, I can agree with wholeheartedly.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Let there be no mistake here...I'm not playing. So, did anyone say what you
eluded to in this thread or not? You know no one did. So what the hell was your point?
You don't intend to do to this thread what you did to the other do you?

First of all, can the 'tude. 'Kay, big guy.

This creep is here to force his opinion that religion is ALWAYS a source of tension. My contension that that is not always the case, and furthermore that if it IS the case that religion is causing a problem then the people involved are simply not mature, or perhaps, THEY are intolerant, and oversensitive. The law supports my position. A workplace standard, as we previously discussed, is the perogative solely of the employer, taking into consideration the litigiousness of society and the legal risk level he feels comfortable with, as he decides whether or not to take up the cause of "offense proofing" society which the radical left is pushing. We have a legitimate difference of opinion. Make no mistake that libs will use the fed to make blanket policy if they must. This is how much they hate religion. So if you're comfortable blithely ignoring the decay of the world around then by all means, stand by the wayside, a good man, willing to do nothing. That's all it takes.

There is a place for harassment complaints and workplace policy. But a decision as a society that relgious speech is inherently offensive, is a win for beelzebub and his minions. satan rules the world. remember that.

 

[Mr. P]

First of all, can the 'tude. 'Kay, big guy.

This creep is here to force his opinion that religion is ALWAYS a source of tension. My contension that that is not always the case, and furthermore that if it IS the case that religion is causing a problem then the people involve and simply not mature, or perhaps, THEY are intolerant, and oversensitive. The law supports my position. A workplace standard, as we previously discussed, is the perogative solely of the employer, taking into consideration the litigiousness of society and the legal risk level he feels comfortable with, as he decides whether or not to take up the cause of "offense proofing" society which the radical left is pushing. We have a legitimate difference of opinion. Make know mistake that libs will use the fed to make blanket policy if they must. This is how much they hate religion. So if you're comfortable blithely ignoring the decay of the world around then by all means, stand by the wayside, a good, willing to do nothing. That's all it takes.

There is a place for harassment complaints and workplace policy. But a decision as a society that relgious speech is inherently offensive, is a win for beelzebub and his minions. satan rules the world. remember that.

Sorry, I have no idea what you are trying to say, but somehow I don't think it has anything to do with the Thread topic.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Sorry, I have no idea what you are trying to say, but somehow I don't think it has anything to do with the Thread topic.

I'm saying he's pushing an opinion at odds with the Free Speech our constitution provides us. It's my position that determining as a society that religious speech is inherently offensive is a step in the wrong direction.

I'm also saying that if that's ok with you, then you have a problem.

 

[Said1]

I'm saying he's pushing an opinion at odds with the Free Speech our constitution provides us. It's my position that determining as a society that religious speech is inherently offensive is a step in the wrong direction.

I'm also saying that if that's ok with you, then you have a problem.

Are you forgetting he's Canadian? Technically, we don't have freedom of expression here.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Are you forgetting he's Canadian? Technically, we don't have freedom of expression here.

Oh yes. He probably likes that way. The fascist.

 

[Mr. P]

I'm saying he's pushing an opinion at odds with the Free Speech our constitution provides us. It's my position that determining as a society that religious speech is inherently offensive is a step in the wrong direction.

I'm also saying that if that's ok with you, then you have a problem.

I disagree...seem to me he's saying there's a time and place, and that's not
stifling freedom at all, it's just common sense. For most people anyway.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I disagree...seem to me he's saying there's a time and place, and that's not
stifling freedom at all, it's just common sense. For most people anyway.

It is stifling if you decide the only time and place is in private at home with others of like mind. That is his position. It's stifling. For a society which claims to value free speech and freedom of religion, the two in combination being deemed "unseemly" does not logically follow. Capiche, Morton?

 

[Mr. P]

It is stifling if you decide the only time and place is in private at home with others of like mind. That is his position. It's stifling. For a society which claims to value free speech and freedom of religion, the two in combination being deemed "unseemly" does not logically follow. Capiche, Morton?

Nope sorry...I think ya got it all wrong. Think harassment, think trespass, think inconsiderate MORON!!.
You can take your " free speech" argument right to the local theater and yell FIRE! Then wait for your arrest.

 

[MissileMan]

I disagree...seem to me he's saying there's a time and place, and that's not
stifling freedom at all, it's just common sense. For most people anyway.

You're right, it is a matter of common sense. There can be no argument that certain topics of discussion routinely become divisive. There is a right of freedom of speech, but it is not absolute. Just as one doesn't have the right to yell "fire" in a theater, a reasonable person would agree that one can't use the right of freedom of speech to create a hostile work environment.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Nope sorry...I think ya got it all wrong. Think harassment, think trespass, think inconsiderate MORON!!.
You can take your " free speech" argument right to the local theater and yell FIRE! Then wait for your arrest.

Religous discussion = harrassment? that perception is only the perception of a Theophobe. You're bigoted and biased. Religious discussion = trespass? Only if one IS TRESPASSING. You're insane. Yelling fire in a theare would endanger others and charges would most likely be brought. That absurdly extreme case has no bearing on this discussion, Cyril.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

You're right, it is a matter of common sense. There can be no argument that certain topics of discussion routinely become divisive. There is a right of freedom of speech, but it is not absolute. Just as one doesn't have the right to yell "fire" in a theater, a reasonable person would agree that one can't use the right of freedom of speech to create a hostile work environment.

But religion is only perceived as hostile by bigots.

Maybe some complainers should be informed of the western notion of religious tolerance.

 

[MissileMan]

But religion is only perceived as hostile by bigots.

Maybe some complainers should be informed of the western notion of religious tolerance.

A quick example of how religious speech could create a hostile work environment: Two employees having a religious discussion, quoting all of the passages in the bible dealing with homosexuality within hearing range of a third employee who is gay. Or if you prefer same two employees having a discussion of all the wonderful things that the bible says that those who aren't saved have in store for them within earshot of an atheist.

 

[Shattered]

A quick example of how religious speech could create a hostile work environment: Two employees having a religious discussion, quoting all of the passages in the bible dealing with homosexuality within hearing range of a third employee who is gay. Or if you prefer same two employees having a discussion of all the wonderful things that the bible says that those who aren't saved have in store for them within earshot of an atheist.

That one doesn't really hold any water.. If you said that to me, I'd tell you that you're full of shit, since there's no such thing as Heaven, Hell, God, or Satan.. What would I have to be afraid of? When I die, I'm going to have my tail laid out in a nice pine box, and will eventually become worm food. Simple as that.

 

[Annie]

But religion is only perceived as hostile by bigots.

Maybe some complainers should be informed of the western notion of religious tolerance.

Can't say I agree with you completely on this RtwngAvngr. Granted you have the right to free speech about your religion. However, common courtesy says that there are times to 'back off'.

For instance, GopJeff and I have had a very cordial relationship going back quite a long time. I recognize he is an evangelical. He recognizes I am Catholic. We converse along the lines we agree with, but at least on my part, as seldom as feasible regarding religion. We both have strong beliefs.

I respect his views, I believe he respects mine. If we were to pick at either though, I doubt we would be civil long. We choose not to pick at each others beliefs. Rather we enjoy each others company, for some reason each of our beliefs have made us people each other respects. I hope I made the mud clear.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

That one doesn't really hold any water.. If you said that to me, I'd tell you that you're full of shit, since there's no such thing as Heaven, Hell, God, or Satan.. What would I have to be afraid of? When I die, I'm going to have my tail laid out in a nice pine box, and will eventually become worm food. Simple as that.

that's right shattered. Anti religious speech is also protected. You can tell them why you think they're bassackwards if you want to!

 

[MissileMan]

That one doesn't really hold any water.. If you said that to me, I'd tell you that you're full of shit, since there's no such thing as Heaven, Hell, God, or Satan.. What would I have to be afraid of? When I die, I'm going to have my tail laid out in a nice pine box, and will eventually become worm food. Simple as that.

Sure, but who wants to hear "you're going to hell" all day long? So, it's not an atheist; same scenario, but it's a Hindi or Muslim.