Meet the green who doubts ‘The Science’

[Oddball]

Translation: I got nothin'.

Translation...if you and your pea brain coalition are THAT naive and stupid to believe huge corporate interests haven't been represented in the climate change debate. Or that those same corporations making billions of dollars in profit from delaying or undermining clean energy legislation are not spending millions of dollars to discredit the REAL scientists, then maybe we need to start by teaching you to cross the street without adult supervision.

Ad hominems aren't a list of sources of information that you'd accept, either.

 

[westwall]

Translation...if you and your pea brain coalition are THAT naive and stupid to believe huge corporate interests haven't been represented in the climate change debate. Or that those same corporations making billions of dollars in profit from delaying or undermining clean energy legislation are not spending millions of dollars to discredit the REAL scientists, then maybe we need to start by teaching you to cross the street without adult supervision.

Hey bfgrn,

Cat got your tongue? I notice you studiously ignoring my posts...how about answering those. Oh wait that's right you can't because they verify everything you say is a lie....I get it.

Actually, you are the only one that has presented any valid points. I did find an article on the MTBE debacle. The EPA really fucked up. They were making an honest effort to reduce airborne pollution, which they accomplished by adding MTBE to gasoline. But they didn't listen to their own scientists that the chemical properties of MTBE made it likely that, if leaked or spilled, the gasoline additive would find its way into groundwater, where it would quickly spread. That is not acceptable.

But here is a question for you to ponder...do you believe the manufacturers of MTBE were ALSO aware of it's dangers? And if they were, should they be responsible to make those dangers known, or are they only responsible to the shareholders and profit margins?

Yes Chevron knew of the dangers and did nothing about it which is why fuel systems on cars were burning up all over the place. Also it rotted the underground storage tanks which caused the leakage into the aquifers. The California Air Resources Board ALSO knew of the dangers and likewise did nothing about it either.

Everyone who had a hand in that debacle (government and oil company alike) should be brought up on criminal charges for that.

 

[gslack]

Translation...if you and your pea brain coalition are THAT naive and stupid to believe huge corporate interests haven't been represented in the climate change debate. Or that those same corporations making billions of dollars in profit from delaying or undermining clean energy legislation are not spending millions of dollars to discredit the REAL scientists, then maybe we need to start by teaching you to cross the street without adult supervision.

Hey bfgrn,

Cat got your tongue? I notice you studiously ignoring my posts...how about answering those. Oh wait that's right you can't because they verify everything you say is a lie....I get it.

Actually, you are the only one that has presented any valid points. I did find an article on the MTBE debacle. The EPA really fucked up. They were making an honest effort to reduce airborne pollution, which they accomplished by adding MTBE to gasoline. But they didn't listen to their own scientists that the chemical properties of MTBE made it likely that, if leaked or spilled, the gasoline additive would find its way into groundwater, where it would quickly spread. That is not acceptable.

But here is a question for you to ponder...do you believe the manufacturers of MTBE were ALSO aware of it's dangers? And if they were, should they be responsible to make those dangers known, or are they only responsible to the shareholders and profit margins?

Anyone else notice the not-so subtle attempt at diversion here??

yeah tell tale sign of a douchebag... He can't come up with valid points of debate for anything westwall said, in true asshole fashion he tries to change the topic..

Nice try useless.. But we are not impressed....

 

[Bfgrn]

Hey bfgrn,

Cat got your tongue? I notice you studiously ignoring my posts...how about answering those. Oh wait that's right you can't because they verify everything you say is a lie....I get it.

Actually, you are the only one that has presented any valid points. I did find an article on the MTBE debacle. The EPA really fucked up. They were making an honest effort to reduce airborne pollution, which they accomplished by adding MTBE to gasoline. But they didn't listen to their own scientists that the chemical properties of MTBE made it likely that, if leaked or spilled, the gasoline additive would find its way into groundwater, where it would quickly spread. That is not acceptable.

But here is a question for you to ponder...do you believe the manufacturers of MTBE were ALSO aware of it's dangers? And if they were, should they be responsible to make those dangers known, or are they only responsible to the shareholders and profit margins?

Anyone else notice the not-so subtle attempt at diversion here??

yeah tell tale sign of a douchebag... He can't come up with valid points of debate for anything westwall said, in true asshole fashion he tries to change the topic..

Nice try useless.. But we are not impressed....

Yes, I noticed. WHY do you keep doing this gslack? This is not all about YOU every minute of the day. I did address what westwall said. We were having an adult conversation...

Children should be seen and not heard.

 

[skookerasbil]

More about "settled science".

The author of Chill explains why he’s sceptical about manmade global warming — and why greens are so intolerant.

The science around climate change is not as settled as it’s presented as being. I used to think it was, until about 2003 – and then, feeling that the remedies being proposed for climate change would be more damaging to the environment than climate change itself, I took it upon myself to look at the science.

In my book on biodiversity, Beyond Conservation, I had mentioned in one of the chapters that perhaps the man-made global warming theory was not all it was being cracked up to be. The changes we are seeing now, I wrote, suggested that some other processes were at work. I then took time out, visited the science libraries, and checked the original science upon which today’s models are based.

I was shocked by what I found. Firstly, there’s no real consensus among the scientists in the UN working groups, especially around oceanography and atmospheric physics. The atmospheric physics of carbon dioxide for example is presented as being pretty straightforward: it is a greenhouse gas, therefore it warms up the planet. But even that isn’t settled. There’s a huge amount of scientific disagreement on how much extra heating in the atmosphere you will get from carbon dioxide. It is even broadly accepted that carbon dioxide on its own is not a problem. So, you can double the amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere and get half to one degree warming, which is within the natural variability range over a period of 50 years from now at the current rate of emissions.

<snip>

We’re seeing the dangerous development here of a very intolerant political ideology. It is a very strange political and scientific situation, in which vast sums of money are underwriting a bureaucracy of climate accountants and auditors, and in which academic funding is easier to obtain if you put man-made climate change at the top of your research proposal. I have never seen anything like it in the 40 years of my scientific and environmental career.

spiked debate: Meet the green who doubts ‘The Science’ by Peter Taylor

l.......m.........b.....o.........

once again, DUDE pwns the k00ks!!!

 

[skookerasbil]

How funny is it to watch the handful of OCD environmental k00ks go mental falling all over themselves to defend the global warming fraud....................

Whats up with that?

How does your life get so fuckking miserable that this alarm clock is always going off in your head that, "Oooops................gotta go defend my buddy alarmists!!!".........strap on the superhero save the world outfit and park your ass in front of the PC for 17 hours straight!!!


How does life possibly become THAT devoid of meaning?? That your #1 priority in life becomes falling all over yourself defending Al Gore???

HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!!!!!!!

You read these posts by asshats like Bfgone, OldRocks et. al.............these people are no different than those sorry asses you see on The Discovery Channel who cant leave their house in the morning because they think they missed a spot washing their hands!!

 

[Bfgrn]

How funny is it to watch the handful of OCD environmental k00ks go mental falling all over themselves to defend the global warming fraud....................

Whats up with that?

How does your life get so fuckking miserable that this alarm clock is always going off in your head that, "Oooops................gotta go defend my buddy alarmists!!!".........strap on the superhero save the world outfit and park your ass in front of the PC for 17 hours straight!!!


How does life possibly become THAT devoid of meaning?? That your #1 priority in life becomes falling all over yourself defending Al Gore???

HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!!!!!!!

You read these posts by asshats like Bfgone, OldRocks et. al.............these people are no different than those sorry asses you see on The Discovery Channel who cant leave their house in the morning because they think they missed a spot washing their hands!!

This is the typical right wing response...projection. You fear-filled and cowardly right wingers have decided climate change CAN'T be real. It would fill your fear filled little brains with SO much anxiety, angst and fear, it would drive you off a cliff...literally.

 

[skookerasbil]

How funny is it to watch the handful of OCD environmental k00ks go mental falling all over themselves to defend the global warming fraud....................

Whats up with that?

How does your life get so fuckking miserable that this alarm clock is always going off in your head that, "Oooops................gotta go defend my buddy alarmists!!!".........strap on the superhero save the world outfit and park your ass in front of the PC for 17 hours straight!!!


How does life possibly become THAT devoid of meaning?? That your #1 priority in life becomes falling all over yourself defending Al Gore???

HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!!!!!!!

You read these posts by asshats like Bfgone, OldRocks et. al.............these people are no different than those sorry asses you see on The Discovery Channel who cant leave their house in the morning because they think they missed a spot washing their hands!!

This is the typical right wing response...projection. You fear-filled and cowardly right wingers have decided climate change CAN'T be real. It would fill your fear filled little brains with SO much anxiety, angst and fear, it would drive you off a cliff...literally.

analysis fAiL..............naahhh.............we decided nothing. We've always known this was a gigantic hoax.

A looooooooooooooong time after that, the poop came out.................

 

[skookerasbil]

And then...........3 months after the alarmist k00ks got publically pwned, nobody showed up at Copenhagen because the whole global warming thing became politically radioactive!!!!

 

[skookerasbil]

Global warming ‘hoax’ will waste billions
<snip>
There are two ice sheets, Greenland and Antarctic. It’s not melting sea ice that causes sea levels to rise, but when land sheets melt. As climate scientist Patrick J. Michael’s states: “What has happened is that Antarctica has been gaining ice.” Only one tiny portion of the continent —- the Antarctic Peninsula — has been warming and the ice melting and the peninsula only constitutes about 2 percent of the Antarctica’s total area. This is the area people like Sestak, Gore and the ICLEI (International Council of Local Environmental Initiatives) concentrate on and try to alarm the public.

Curt Davis, using satellite measurements to calculate changes in the ice sheets elevation, found it gained 45 billion tons of ice per year between 1992 and 2003, which is enough to lower sea levels by about 0.12 millimeters annually. Today’s alarmists only look at what’s falling off the sides and not what’s building up top.

As they claim, if today’s temperatures are causing Greenland’s coastal ice to slide into the sea, it must have been 10 times worse 80 years ago. Between 1915 and 1965 it was even warmer. All this was before fossil fuel burning could have triggered global warming.

There is no scientific evidence that the Greenland ice sheet is melting due to increased temperatures caused by atmospheric concentrations of carbon dioxide.

Richard Lindzen of MIT thinks that, while most scientists were originally agnostic on the question whether human activity was causing global warming “environmentalists and the media would exaggerate,” (and) build up the public concern. Politicians responded by throwing research dollars at scientists. You’ve developed a scientific community that will do whatever it needs to do to make sure the answer isn’t obtained. Why should taxpayers pay for people not to find an answer?”

Finally, the Kyoto Protocol would cost the American taxpayers some $300 to $400 billion and wouldn’t stop whatever warming is caused by greenhouse-gas emissions. In fact, Tom Wigley of the National Center for Atmosphere Research calculated that the full global implementation of Kyoto would only prevent 0.07 degrees Celsius of global warming by 2050, which is all but undetectable.

Full text HERE




Global warming ?hoax? will waste billions - The Delaware County Daily Times : Serving Delaware County, PA(DelcoTimes.com)









Oooooooooooooops!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

How funny is it to watch the handful of OCD environmental k00ks go mental falling all over themselves to defend the global warming fraud....................

Whats up with that?

How does your life get so fuckking miserable that this alarm clock is always going off in your head that, "Oooops................gotta go defend my buddy alarmists!!!".........strap on the superhero save the world outfit and park your ass in front of the PC for 17 hours straight!!!


How does life possibly become THAT devoid of meaning?? That your #1 priority in life becomes falling all over yourself defending Al Gore???

HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!!!!!!!

You read these posts by asshats like Bfgone, OldRocks et. al.............these people are no different than those sorry asses you see on The Discovery Channel who cant leave their house in the morning because they think they missed a spot washing their hands!!

This is the typical right wing response...projection. You fear-filled and cowardly right wingers have decided climate change CAN'T be real. It would fill your fear filled little brains with SO much anxiety, angst and fear, it would drive you off a cliff...literally.

I just want one repeatable laboratory experiment where you eliminate all other variables and can show us how a 200 part per million increase in CO2 causes any warming. Just one experiment.

Hopefully you understand that 200PPM is a small number but the responses I've gotten back indicate that math is not a Warmer strong suit

 

[Bfgrn]

Patrick J. Michaels

Michaels is Editor of the World Climate Report, a blog published by New Hope Environmental Services, "an advocacy science consulting firm" he founded and runs.

Michaels' firm does not disclose who its clients are, but leaked documents have revealed that several were power utilities which operate coal power stations. On a 2007 academic CV, Michaels disclosed that prior to creating his firm he had received funding from the Edison Electric Institute and the Western Fuels Association. He has also been a frequent speaker with leading coal and energy companies as well as coal and other industry lobby groups.

Michaels is also associated with a number of think tanks and advocacy groups which dispute global warming. He is a Visiting Scientist with the George C. Marshall Institute, a Senior Fellow in Environmental Studies with the Cato Institute and a member of the Advisory Board of the Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow.

Between December 1998 and September 2001 he was listed as a "Scientific Advisor" to the Greening Earth Society, a group that was funded and controlled by the Western Fuels Association (WFA), an association of coal-burning utility companies.

But during 1989 and 1990 it was as a global warming skeptic that Michaels was really making a name for himself. In 1989 Michaels made several appearances before Congressional committees, an appearance at a Brookings Institution event and invitations to speak to a smattering of industry groups. Some of the invitations he accepted were to speak to the Executive Board of the National Coal Association in Phoenix, Arizona, the annual meeting of the Western Fuels Association in Denver and the International Pittsburgh Coal Conference, the Edison Electric Institute and Basin Electric Power Cooperative.

Subsequently, Michaels was a favored speaker for corporate, think tank and conservative advocacy group events. Between 1990 and 1993, Michaels spoke at events organized by the Consumer Alert, the North Carolina Coal Institute, the Pacific Research Institute, the Kentucky Coal Operators Association, the Chemical Manufacturers Association, the Virginia Coal Council, the National Rural Electric Cooperative Association, AMAX Energy Corporation, Consolidation Coal Corporation, Cincinnati Gas and Electric, Chief Executive Conference on Global Warming, the National Association of Manufacturers, the National Aerosol Association, the Massie Coal Corporation, the Indiana Coal Mining Institute, the Arizona Electric Power Cooperative, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the Virginia Petroleum Council, the Heritage Foundation, the American Legislative Exchange Council, the Wyoming Mining Association, Virginia Power, Amax Energy Corporation, American Electric Power, Alabama Electric Power Cooperative, the American Policy Center, the World Coal Conference, American Public Power Association, American Mining Congress, Maine Conservation Rights Institute, the Federalist Society, the Kentucky Mining Institute, Denver Coal Club and the Ashland Oil Corporation.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Of COURSE, this is just leftist kook stuff, everyone knows the corporations, industries and mining cartels that make billions of dollars in industries and minerals that would effected by alternative energy legislation just sit on the sidelines benignly and peacefully. Probably out picking daisies to give to their wives or secretaries...

 

[gslack]

Actually, you are the only one that has presented any valid points. I did find an article on the MTBE debacle. The EPA really fucked up. They were making an honest effort to reduce airborne pollution, which they accomplished by adding MTBE to gasoline. But they didn't listen to their own scientists that the chemical properties of MTBE made it likely that, if leaked or spilled, the gasoline additive would find its way into groundwater, where it would quickly spread. That is not acceptable.

But here is a question for you to ponder...do you believe the manufacturers of MTBE were ALSO aware of it's dangers? And if they were, should they be responsible to make those dangers known, or are they only responsible to the shareholders and profit margins?

Anyone else notice the not-so subtle attempt at diversion here??

yeah tell tale sign of a douchebag... He can't come up with valid points of debate for anything westwall said, in true asshole fashion he tries to change the topic..

Nice try useless.. But we are not impressed....

Yes, I noticed. WHY do you keep doing this gslack? This is not all about YOU every minute of the day. I did address what westwall said. We were having an adult conversation...

Children should be seen and not heard.

Really? Funny but it looks like you diverted again... kind of your MO now....

You talk shit calling everyone else ignorant and try pretend you are so much wiser, but when confronted on it you divert or try to argue some irrelevant side point...

here is a sample of what its like debating you...

poster: The world is not flat but round...

bfgrn: thats not true, you are just to stupid to know that...

poster: uh? it is so here is the proof..

bfgrn: perhaps but would you think it was round if the vast right wing conpiracy didn't tell you so?

poster: wtf?

bfgrn: yeah can't debate your topic and so you try and change it now...


Yeah thats exactly how debates go with bfgrn...

 

[gslack]

Patrick J. Michaels

Michaels is Editor of the World Climate Report, a blog published by New Hope Environmental Services, "an advocacy science consulting firm" he founded and runs.

Michaels' firm does not disclose who its clients are, but leaked documents have revealed that several were power utilities which operate coal power stations. On a 2007 academic CV, Michaels disclosed that prior to creating his firm he had received funding from the Edison Electric Institute and the Western Fuels Association. He has also been a frequent speaker with leading coal and energy companies as well as coal and other industry lobby groups.

Michaels is also associated with a number of think tanks and advocacy groups which dispute global warming. He is a Visiting Scientist with the George C. Marshall Institute, a Senior Fellow in Environmental Studies with the Cato Institute and a member of the Advisory Board of the Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow.

Between December 1998 and September 2001 he was listed as a "Scientific Advisor" to the Greening Earth Society, a group that was funded and controlled by the Western Fuels Association (WFA), an association of coal-burning utility companies.

But during 1989 and 1990 it was as a global warming skeptic that Michaels was really making a name for himself. In 1989 Michaels made several appearances before Congressional committees, an appearance at a Brookings Institution event and invitations to speak to a smattering of industry groups. Some of the invitations he accepted were to speak to the Executive Board of the National Coal Association in Phoenix, Arizona, the annual meeting of the Western Fuels Association in Denver and the International Pittsburgh Coal Conference, the Edison Electric Institute and Basin Electric Power Cooperative.

Subsequently, Michaels was a favored speaker for corporate, think tank and conservative advocacy group events. Between 1990 and 1993, Michaels spoke at events organized by the Consumer Alert, the North Carolina Coal Institute, the Pacific Research Institute, the Kentucky Coal Operators Association, the Chemical Manufacturers Association, the Virginia Coal Council, the National Rural Electric Cooperative Association, AMAX Energy Corporation, Consolidation Coal Corporation, Cincinnati Gas and Electric, Chief Executive Conference on Global Warming, the National Association of Manufacturers, the National Aerosol Association, the Massie Coal Corporation, the Indiana Coal Mining Institute, the Arizona Electric Power Cooperative, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the Virginia Petroleum Council, the Heritage Foundation, the American Legislative Exchange Council, the Wyoming Mining Association, Virginia Power, Amax Energy Corporation, American Electric Power, Alabama Electric Power Cooperative, the American Policy Center, the World Coal Conference, American Public Power Association, American Mining Congress, Maine Conservation Rights Institute, the Federalist Society, the Kentucky Mining Institute, Denver Coal Club and the Ashland Oil Corporation.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Of COURSE, this is just leftist kook stuff, everyone knows the corporations, industries and mining cartels that make billions of dollars in industries and minerals that would effected by alternative energy legislation just sit on the sidelines benignly and peacefully. Probably out picking daisies to give to their wives or secretaries...

Sourcewatch has been busted lying twice now in this forum.... its a left wing PR firm itself... Nice try douchebag...

 

[Bfgrn]

Anyone else notice the not-so subtle attempt at diversion here??

yeah tell tale sign of a douchebag... He can't come up with valid points of debate for anything westwall said, in true asshole fashion he tries to change the topic..

Nice try useless.. But we are not impressed....

Yes, I noticed. WHY do you keep doing this gslack? This is not all about YOU every minute of the day. I did address what westwall said. We were having an adult conversation...

Children should be seen and not heard.

Really? Funny but it looks like you diverted again... kind of your MO now....

You talk shit calling everyone else ignorant and try pretend you are so much wiser, but when confronted on it you divert or try to argue some irrelevant side point...

here is a sample of what its like debating you...

poster: The world is not flat but round...

bfgrn: thats not true, you are just to stupid to know that...

poster: uh? it is so here is the proof..

bfgrn: perhaps but would you think it was round if the vast right wing conpiracy didn't tell you so?

poster: wtf?

bfgrn: yeah can't debate your topic and so you try and change it now...


Yeah thats exactly how debates go with bfgrn...

You know, I've heard your narrative style before, I just can't recall where.........................




Oh, now I remember...

I believe my response should be: "I know you are, but what am I?"

 

[skookerasbil]

Patrick J. Michaels

Michaels is Editor of the World Climate Report, a blog published by New Hope Environmental Services, "an advocacy science consulting firm" he founded and runs.

Michaels' firm does not disclose who its clients are, but leaked documents have revealed that several were power utilities which operate coal power stations. On a 2007 academic CV, Michaels disclosed that prior to creating his firm he had received funding from the Edison Electric Institute and the Western Fuels Association. He has also been a frequent speaker with leading coal and energy companies as well as coal and other industry lobby groups.

Michaels is also associated with a number of think tanks and advocacy groups which dispute global warming. He is a Visiting Scientist with the George C. Marshall Institute, a Senior Fellow in Environmental Studies with the Cato Institute and a member of the Advisory Board of the Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow.

Between December 1998 and September 2001 he was listed as a "Scientific Advisor" to the Greening Earth Society, a group that was funded and controlled by the Western Fuels Association (WFA), an association of coal-burning utility companies.

But during 1989 and 1990 it was as a global warming skeptic that Michaels was really making a name for himself. In 1989 Michaels made several appearances before Congressional committees, an appearance at a Brookings Institution event and invitations to speak to a smattering of industry groups. Some of the invitations he accepted were to speak to the Executive Board of the National Coal Association in Phoenix, Arizona, the annual meeting of the Western Fuels Association in Denver and the International Pittsburgh Coal Conference, the Edison Electric Institute and Basin Electric Power Cooperative.

Subsequently, Michaels was a favored speaker for corporate, think tank and conservative advocacy group events. Between 1990 and 1993, Michaels spoke at events organized by the Consumer Alert, the North Carolina Coal Institute, the Pacific Research Institute, the Kentucky Coal Operators Association, the Chemical Manufacturers Association, the Virginia Coal Council, the National Rural Electric Cooperative Association, AMAX Energy Corporation, Consolidation Coal Corporation, Cincinnati Gas and Electric, Chief Executive Conference on Global Warming, the National Association of Manufacturers, the National Aerosol Association, the Massie Coal Corporation, the Indiana Coal Mining Institute, the Arizona Electric Power Cooperative, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the Virginia Petroleum Council, the Heritage Foundation, the American Legislative Exchange Council, the Wyoming Mining Association, Virginia Power, Amax Energy Corporation, American Electric Power, Alabama Electric Power Cooperative, the American Policy Center, the World Coal Conference, American Public Power Association, American Mining Congress, Maine Conservation Rights Institute, the Federalist Society, the Kentucky Mining Institute, Denver Coal Club and the Ashland Oil Corporation.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Of COURSE, this is just leftist kook stuff, everyone knows the corporations, industries and mining cartels that make billions of dollars in industries and minerals that would effected by alternative energy legislation just sit on the sidelines benignly and peacefully. Probably out picking daisies to give to their wives or secretaries...

What a fcukking dummy..............this guy, like so many of the k00ks think that alternative energy is a zero sum game.
Its all about what Ive been saying for years............these asshats are staunch anti-capitalists.........nothing else, thus, my frequent references to their "misery level". Thses losers are miserable about their existence and spend their lives trying to blame somebody else for their own fcukked up personal life decisions that have left them as cellar dwellers. They care about nothing........as long as the capitalist gets fcukked!!!

Its never been about the environment for one single solitary second.






EDIT>>>>> Memo to the k00ks.................trivia question oft he day..............what multinational corporation stands to make tens of billions through passage of Cap and Trade??? <<<<EDIT






stupid morons

 

[Bfgrn]

Patrick J. Michaels

Michaels is Editor of the World Climate Report, a blog published by New Hope Environmental Services, "an advocacy science consulting firm" he founded and runs.

Michaels' firm does not disclose who its clients are, but leaked documents have revealed that several were power utilities which operate coal power stations. On a 2007 academic CV, Michaels disclosed that prior to creating his firm he had received funding from the Edison Electric Institute and the Western Fuels Association. He has also been a frequent speaker with leading coal and energy companies as well as coal and other industry lobby groups.

Michaels is also associated with a number of think tanks and advocacy groups which dispute global warming. He is a Visiting Scientist with the George C. Marshall Institute, a Senior Fellow in Environmental Studies with the Cato Institute and a member of the Advisory Board of the Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow.

Between December 1998 and September 2001 he was listed as a "Scientific Advisor" to the Greening Earth Society, a group that was funded and controlled by the Western Fuels Association (WFA), an association of coal-burning utility companies.

But during 1989 and 1990 it was as a global warming skeptic that Michaels was really making a name for himself. In 1989 Michaels made several appearances before Congressional committees, an appearance at a Brookings Institution event and invitations to speak to a smattering of industry groups. Some of the invitations he accepted were to speak to the Executive Board of the National Coal Association in Phoenix, Arizona, the annual meeting of the Western Fuels Association in Denver and the International Pittsburgh Coal Conference, the Edison Electric Institute and Basin Electric Power Cooperative.

Subsequently, Michaels was a favored speaker for corporate, think tank and conservative advocacy group events. Between 1990 and 1993, Michaels spoke at events organized by the Consumer Alert, the North Carolina Coal Institute, the Pacific Research Institute, the Kentucky Coal Operators Association, the Chemical Manufacturers Association, the Virginia Coal Council, the National Rural Electric Cooperative Association, AMAX Energy Corporation, Consolidation Coal Corporation, Cincinnati Gas and Electric, Chief Executive Conference on Global Warming, the National Association of Manufacturers, the National Aerosol Association, the Massie Coal Corporation, the Indiana Coal Mining Institute, the Arizona Electric Power Cooperative, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the Virginia Petroleum Council, the Heritage Foundation, the American Legislative Exchange Council, the Wyoming Mining Association, Virginia Power, Amax Energy Corporation, American Electric Power, Alabama Electric Power Cooperative, the American Policy Center, the World Coal Conference, American Public Power Association, American Mining Congress, Maine Conservation Rights Institute, the Federalist Society, the Kentucky Mining Institute, Denver Coal Club and the Ashland Oil Corporation.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Of COURSE, this is just leftist kook stuff, everyone knows the corporations, industries and mining cartels that make billions of dollars in industries and minerals that would effected by alternative energy legislation just sit on the sidelines benignly and peacefully. Probably out picking daisies to give to their wives or secretaries...

What a fcukking dummy..............this guy, like so many of the k00ks think that alternative energy is a zero sum game.
Its all about what Ive been saying for years............these asshats are staunch anti-capitalists.........nothing else, thus, my frequent references to their "misery level". Thses losers are miserable about their existence and spend their lives trying to blame somebody else for their own fcukked up personal life decisions that have left them as cellar dwellers. They care about nothing........as long as the capitalist gets fcukked!!!

Its never been about the environment for one single solitary second.






EDIT>>>>> Memo to the k00ks.................trivia question oft he day..............what multinational corporation stands to make tens of billions through passage of Cap and Trade??? <<<<EDIT






stupid morons

I don't know anything about being unhappy, I've made a shit load of money in this capitalist society. But let me ask you some questions that you will have NO CLUE what I'm even talking about. Do you understand the reason for cap & trade? Can you name a multinational corporation that pollutes the environment where their product(s) reflect the ACTUAL cost, and it is not externalized? Do you know what a free market REALLY is? I thought you right wing pea brains were opposed to socialism and welfare? Learn something new every day...

Get back to me before 2012...

 

[gslack]

Yes, I noticed. WHY do you keep doing this gslack? This is not all about YOU every minute of the day. I did address what westwall said. We were having an adult conversation...

Children should be seen and not heard.

Really? Funny but it looks like you diverted again... kind of your MO now....

You talk shit calling everyone else ignorant and try pretend you are so much wiser, but when confronted on it you divert or try to argue some irrelevant side point...

here is a sample of what its like debating you...

poster: The world is not flat but round...

bfgrn: thats not true, you are just to stupid to know that...

poster: uh? it is so here is the proof..

bfgrn: perhaps but would you think it was round if the vast right wing conpiracy didn't tell you so?

poster: wtf?

bfgrn: yeah can't debate your topic and so you try and change it now...


Yeah thats exactly how debates go with bfgrn...

You know, I've heard your narrative style before, I just can't recall where.........................




Oh, now I remember...

I believe my response should be: "I know you are, but what am I?"

Home movie pic?

Yeah you pretty much said that already punk.... You say that every time you try and divert to save face.... You got busted again talking out your ass and thinking you are brilliant, so you try and divert, confound and bullshit your way out...

You are ridiculous man.... Every one here except your sock has a good laugh every time you try this tactic...

 

[Bfgrn]

Really? Funny but it looks like you diverted again... kind of your MO now....

You talk shit calling everyone else ignorant and try pretend you are so much wiser, but when confronted on it you divert or try to argue some irrelevant side point...

here is a sample of what its like debating you...

poster: The world is not flat but round...

bfgrn: thats not true, you are just to stupid to know that...

poster: uh? it is so here is the proof..

bfgrn: perhaps but would you think it was round if the vast right wing conpiracy didn't tell you so?

poster: wtf?

bfgrn: yeah can't debate your topic and so you try and change it now...


Yeah thats exactly how debates go with bfgrn...

You know, I've heard your narrative style before, I just can't recall where.........................




Oh, now I remember...

I believe my response should be: "I know you are, but what am I?"

Home movie pic?

Yeah you pretty much said that already punk.... You say that every time you try and divert to save face.... You got busted again talking out your ass and thinking you are brilliant, so you try and divert, confound and bullshit your way out...

You are ridiculous man.... Every one here except your sock has a good laugh every time you try this tactic...

Are you ever going to come back with anything but bluster? As a parent, I learned to be patient with children, but you are running out of time sonny...

 

[westwall]

Patrick J. Michaels

Michaels is Editor of the World Climate Report, a blog published by New Hope Environmental Services, "an advocacy science consulting firm" he founded and runs.

Michaels' firm does not disclose who its clients are, but leaked documents have revealed that several were power utilities which operate coal power stations. On a 2007 academic CV, Michaels disclosed that prior to creating his firm he had received funding from the Edison Electric Institute and the Western Fuels Association. He has also been a frequent speaker with leading coal and energy companies as well as coal and other industry lobby groups.

Michaels is also associated with a number of think tanks and advocacy groups which dispute global warming. He is a Visiting Scientist with the George C. Marshall Institute, a Senior Fellow in Environmental Studies with the Cato Institute and a member of the Advisory Board of the Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow.

Between December 1998 and September 2001 he was listed as a "Scientific Advisor" to the Greening Earth Society, a group that was funded and controlled by the Western Fuels Association (WFA), an association of coal-burning utility companies.

But during 1989 and 1990 it was as a global warming skeptic that Michaels was really making a name for himself. In 1989 Michaels made several appearances before Congressional committees, an appearance at a Brookings Institution event and invitations to speak to a smattering of industry groups. Some of the invitations he accepted were to speak to the Executive Board of the National Coal Association in Phoenix, Arizona, the annual meeting of the Western Fuels Association in Denver and the International Pittsburgh Coal Conference, the Edison Electric Institute and Basin Electric Power Cooperative.

Subsequently, Michaels was a favored speaker for corporate, think tank and conservative advocacy group events. Between 1990 and 1993, Michaels spoke at events organized by the Consumer Alert, the North Carolina Coal Institute, the Pacific Research Institute, the Kentucky Coal Operators Association, the Chemical Manufacturers Association, the Virginia Coal Council, the National Rural Electric Cooperative Association, AMAX Energy Corporation, Consolidation Coal Corporation, Cincinnati Gas and Electric, Chief Executive Conference on Global Warming, the National Association of Manufacturers, the National Aerosol Association, the Massie Coal Corporation, the Indiana Coal Mining Institute, the Arizona Electric Power Cooperative, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the Virginia Petroleum Council, the Heritage Foundation, the American Legislative Exchange Council, the Wyoming Mining Association, Virginia Power, Amax Energy Corporation, American Electric Power, Alabama Electric Power Cooperative, the American Policy Center, the World Coal Conference, American Public Power Association, American Mining Congress, Maine Conservation Rights Institute, the Federalist Society, the Kentucky Mining Institute, Denver Coal Club and the Ashland Oil Corporation.
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Of COURSE, this is just leftist kook stuff, everyone knows the corporations, industries and mining cartels that make billions of dollars in industries and minerals that would effected by alternative energy legislation just sit on the sidelines benignly and peacefully. Probably out picking daisies to give to their wives or secretaries...

You are falling into the same trap that old fraud did many moons ago. If you attack the messenger and not his message you lose. We found out that almost all of the warmist proponent scientists have been fraudulently manipulating data. In a court of law they would be guilty of perjury and sent to prison.

Furthermore, once someone has been found guilty of perjury they are no longer useful in a court situation. An Expert Winess who lies is toast. They will no longer be allowed to testify for anyone, prosecution or defence.

We are attacking the fraudulent data that your side is espousing. We are not specifically attacking the perpetrators...yet. All you people do is attack the messenger. Guess what we don't care! So long as the messengers have not comitted fraud like your folks have, we don't care. We care about the evidence which you folks don't give a cfrap about. All you care about is the fear that you can generate in the un-educated so you can force your agendas down the populaces throats.

Sorry to tell you chum but the unwashed have figure out you are all a bunch of dickhead liars and they don't listen to liars.