Liberal Colleges and Universities - Why and How Did They Get That Way?

[Quantum Windbag]

Who even knows what point you want to make? Just weird "imaginings". Garbage collector? Bouncer?

Sorry, I forgot there were people like you around here.

What is Mensa?

Mensa was founded in England in 1946 by Roland Berrill, a barrister, and Dr. Lance Ware, a scientist and lawyer. They had the idea of forming a society for bright people, the only qualification for membership of which was a high IQ. The original aims were, as they are today, to create a society that is non-political and free from all racial or religious distinctions. The society welcomes people from every walk of life whose IQ is in the top 2% of the population, with the objective of enjoying each other's company and participating in a wide range of social and cultural activities.

What kind of people are Members of Mensa?

There is simply no one prevailing characteristic of Mensa members other than high IQ. There are Mensans for whom Mensa provides a sense of family, and others for whom it is a casual social activity. There have been many marriages made in Mensa, but for many people, it is simply a stimulating opportunity for the mind. Most Mensans have a good sense of humor, and they like to talk. And, usually, they have a lot to say. Mensans have ranged in age from 2 to more than 100, but most are between 20 and 60. In education they range from preschoolers to high school dropouts to people with multiple doctorates. There are Mensans on welfare and Mensans who are millionaires. As far as occupations, the range is staggering. Mensa has professors and truck drivers, scientists and firefighters, computer programmers and farmers, artists, military people, musicians, laborers, police officers, glassblowers--the diverse list goes on and on. There are famous Mensans and prize-winning Mensans, but there are many whose names you wouldn't know. Have a look at our list of prominent Mensans here.

About Mensa International | Mensa International

Now you know that there people out there who are actually smart.

Getting a degree from Texas Tech is a pretty big deal. Look at a tiny bit of their curriculum:

Cell Biology & Biochemistry
Cell Physiology and Molecular
Biophysics
Dermatology
Microbiology and Immunolog
Ophthalmology
Pathology

This is a "research University".

As far as the University of Alabama, they have a great biology department and teach "evolution", which of course, is the foundation science for biology, botany and physiology.

Department of Biological Sciences, The University of Alabama

Because you list some "great universities" in some southern states doesn't address the issue that the right has only contempt for education. They down evolution. I bet the universities you listed are chock full of "liberal elitist scientists" teaching there.

Are you totally incapable of comprehending English?

I could just as easily have used WSU and URI as my examples. The point was that there are some schools that are considered elite, and some that are not. What makes the real difference is the person, not the school they go to.

This is something you obviously do not understand, which makes you part of the problem. Maybe you should grow up and start being part of the solution.

Even Michael Behe, the father of the "Irreducible Complexity" phrase, while on the stand at Dover, Penn, was asked, "If following the same criteria that makes ID "science", would "Astrology" and "Alchemy" also be "science"?" And he said, "Yes".

Interesting.

But exactly what does it have to do with my post, or this thread? Are you just trolling the boards in a desperate attempt to make me look stupid after I slapped you down in the thread where you tried to argue that a press release proved that dark matter exists? If so, this is a complete failure because I have never advocated ID or Creation Science.

So, Alchemy, Astrology and Intelligent Design are "equal". And we want to teach this at "universities"? Many members of the right do. Probably even the majority. To me, that would be a major embarrassment to even seriously suggest something so nonsensical.

And this is why you always loose when you attempt to debate me, you are incapable of sticking to facts.

Kitzmiller v. Dover: Day 10, AM: Michael Behe

There is the transcript of Behe's testimony, and I will challenge you to point out where it mentions alchemy in any way, shape, or form.

 

[asterism]

A common cry of many conservatives is that, in general, our institutions of higher learning in this country (colleges, universities, etc.) are "liberal." They teach "liberal concepts," they cater to liberals, all of the professors are liberals, and so forth. Let's assume, for sake of argument, that this is correct - that our colleges and universities are, for the most part, liberal.

What is it about our colleges and universities that makes them liberal, in your opinion and why do you think they became so, as opposed to leaning more toward conservative thought?

I think it's a function of the idealogical struggle and the positions of power each ideology had. Academic theory was sidelined in favor of practical solutions. Observation and study of those solutions led to other theories that worked well, but as always there is a team mentality. A contingent of people who had the only option of academia strove for notoriety and credence, and introduced an alternative set of concepts meant to surreptitiously garner support for their causes in one area by means of convincing people in other areas that this was a valid path.

The industrial revolution was the opposite of this, it was the academics who ruled because they had the ear of the moneyed powers that be so the industrialists prospered with their pragmatic innovations. Then the same team mentality emerged with some accomplished industrialists introducing stealth ideals using the same tactic.

 

[asterism]

It's simple really. Credible colleges all teach science. Many conservatives belief systems don't allow for real scientific facts and accepted theories. That excludes most of the religious fundamentalists by their own choice. Also to expand on the religious theme... History and archeology defies much of the religious dogma and flies in the face of those that choose the bible and other religious doctrine as their historical guide.

Excellent answer. Thank you.

And therein lies the reason why there is no debate. The 'excellent answer' is the one that fits your own political view. You take as fact anything you agree with, and refuse to consider view that contradicts it.

That is why I say the left are incapable of individual thought. You're so fucking borg-like in your thought process - and that is what is wrong with our colleges. They don't teach kids how to think, they teach them what to think. And, I suspect, you don't even recognize the difference. Moron.

I agree. It's funny to watch a bunch of "free thinkers" all agree on everything, down to which wine tastes best and what art is worthy.

Stupid fucks don't even have basic understanding of effective marketing and its purpose. You'll note many of the carry iPhones and rail against AT&T because they can't make phone calls. Do they switch carriers? Of course not! They have to have an iPhone! A phone that can't make calls reliably, on a network that is underpowered. It's positively astounding. Steve Jobs is one of the best capitalists yet, second only to Noam Chomsky.

 

[asterism]

Definitions of conservative:

•resistant to change

Interesting, since the entire conservative population is openly clamoring for change, change away from the liberal Keynesian micromanagement of the economy that's going on right now.

It's the "liberals" who want to stay the course.

If that initial broadbrush doesn't fit, do any of your others?

 

[asterism]

The hippies grew up, had no money and realized they were losers. They got teaching jobs and are now geriatric hippies who teach.

I know smart mouth answer but that is how i see it. Look at the ages of professor's and you will see their genera. They are for the most part the 60's 70's teens and young adults. Being liberal or conservative does not effect the ability to teach. It does at times slant the style of that teaching.

There's not much money in teaching so generally it can be said that those who can do and those who can't teach.

Mind you, there are millions of teachers that are very very good and they come in all political persuasions. Many actually see teaching as a vocation, one as righteous as clergy or military service. Those are the good ones.

But there are plenty of History majors who chose that direction because they flunked Calculus (and therefore couldn't get into Physics, Engineering, Biology, Business, etc.) and couldn't get into law school have become teachers.

The scary part is I know some who actually teach Math. They don't understand it, and they emphasize that the curriculum is set and the materials are provided. And people wonder why Math education is deteriorating.

 

[asterism]

Good for you. I applaud your education for what it's worth.

The truth is, the Republican Party, as a whole, does not respect education. It's true that college professors voted 12 to 1 for Obama and it's also true, according to Pew research, that very few scientists will identify themselves as Republican.

But is that any surprise? Take a good hard look at the Republican Party. At Texas and their attempt to rewrite history, or Dover and their attempt to add "mysticism" to science.

It's no surprise that education in the sciences has declined as Republicans have gained power. Republicans have taught their children to disrespect teachers and scientists and worse, education.

When Republicans talk about "those darned liberal" professors, what would they teach differently? They have their own Christian colleges. No "remarkable discoveries" are coming out of those campuses. Nothing truly innovative or new.

Take evolution away from science and what possible discoveries will be found in biology, botany and physiology?

The right just wants an "imaginary" world where their ideology "becomes" science. Well, it's not gonna happen.

Interesting.

Are you a student of Science? If so, what discipline?

 

[rdean]

Who even knows what point you want to make? Just weird "imaginings". Garbage collector? Bouncer?

Sorry, I forgot there were people like you around here.

What is Mensa?

Mensa was founded in England in 1946 by Roland Berrill, a barrister, and Dr. Lance Ware, a scientist and lawyer. They had the idea of forming a society for bright people, the only qualification for membership of which was a high IQ. The original aims were, as they are today, to create a society that is non-political and free from all racial or religious distinctions. The society welcomes people from every walk of life whose IQ is in the top 2% of the population, with the objective of enjoying each other's company and participating in a wide range of social and cultural activities.

About Mensa International | Mensa International

Now you know that there people out there who are actually smart.



Are you totally incapable of comprehending English?

I could just as easily have used WSU and URI as my examples. The point was that there are some schools that are considered elite, and some that are not. What makes the real difference is the person, not the school they go to.

This is something you obviously do not understand, which makes you part of the problem. Maybe you should grow up and start being part of the solution.

Even Michael Behe, the father of the "Irreducible Complexity" phrase, while on the stand at Dover, Penn, was asked, "If following the same criteria that makes ID "science", would "Astrology" and "Alchemy" also be "science"?" And he said, "Yes".

Interesting.

But exactly what does it have to do with my post, or this thread? Are you just trolling the boards in a desperate attempt to make me look stupid after I slapped you down in the thread where you tried to argue that a press release proved that dark matter exists? If so, this is a complete failure because I have never advocated ID or Creation Science.

So, Alchemy, Astrology and Intelligent Design are "equal". And we want to teach this at "universities"? Many members of the right do. Probably even the majority. To me, that would be a major embarrassment to even seriously suggest something so nonsensical.

And this is why you always loose when you attempt to debate me, you are incapable of sticking to facts.

Kitzmiller v. Dover: Day 10, AM: Michael Behe

There is the transcript of Behe's testimony, and I will challenge you to point out where it mentions alchemy in any way, shape, or form.

But does he mention "astrology"????????????

Astrology is scientific theory, courtroom told - science-in-society - 19 October 2005 - New Scientist

Astrology would be considered a scientific theory if judged by the same criteria used by a well-known advocate of Intelligent Design to justify his claim that ID is science, a landmark US trial heard on Tuesday.

Under cross examination, ID proponent Michael Behe, a biochemist at Lehigh University in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, admitted his definition of "theory" was so broad it would also include astrology.

 

[rdean]

Good for you. I applaud your education for what it's worth.

The truth is, the Republican Party, as a whole, does not respect education. It's true that college professors voted 12 to 1 for Obama and it's also true, according to Pew research, that very few scientists will identify themselves as Republican.

But is that any surprise? Take a good hard look at the Republican Party. At Texas and their attempt to rewrite history, or Dover and their attempt to add "mysticism" to science.

It's no surprise that education in the sciences has declined as Republicans have gained power. Republicans have taught their children to disrespect teachers and scientists and worse, education.

When Republicans talk about "those darned liberal" professors, what would they teach differently? They have their own Christian colleges. No "remarkable discoveries" are coming out of those campuses. Nothing truly innovative or new.

Take evolution away from science and what possible discoveries will be found in biology, botany and physiology?

The right just wants an "imaginary" world where their ideology "becomes" science. Well, it's not gonna happen.

Interesting.

Are you a student of Science? If so, what discipline?

I am not a scientist and never said I was. I am only a lowly engineer.

But to understand the right wing's opinion on education, one only needs to be able to read. They don't exactly hide their disdain.

 

[xotoxi]

I go to a college that I suppose would be considered Liberal. In my personal experiences, only one professor talked about anything related to current events and it was to inform students about the goings on in Asia. Makes sense since it was a Non-Western World class focused on Japan and China.

Though another professor had us go to the local Jewish Community Center to listen to someone speak who lived in Nazi Germany before World War II and how she barely escaped with her family.

Though this semester, taking Global Competition: The United States and Its Trading Partners. It should be a interesting class.

We have both a Democrat group and Republican group on campus. I'm involved with neither though. Oh, and of course the Socialists. Funny enough, last semester they were walking around the campus with a huge picture of Obama with a Hitler mustache. Turns out they dislike Obama as much as the right on here who think he's a socialist. Though I know some people on USMB do not want to hear that.

Are you going to University of Southern Massachusetts at Barnstable?

(Lets see how many people get that)

 

[xotoxi]

Let's assume, for sake of argument, that this is correct - that our colleges and universities are, for the most part, liberal.

Why do we have to assume that?

And what would a conservative change in a college curriculum that would make it no longer liberal and make it conservative?

Just one specific.

Thinking back to my experience in college, I don't recall anything in any of my classes that was in any way political.

 

[asterism]

Good for you. I applaud your education for what it's worth.

The truth is, the Republican Party, as a whole, does not respect education. It's true that college professors voted 12 to 1 for Obama and it's also true, according to Pew research, that very few scientists will identify themselves as Republican.

But is that any surprise? Take a good hard look at the Republican Party. At Texas and their attempt to rewrite history, or Dover and their attempt to add "mysticism" to science.

It's no surprise that education in the sciences has declined as Republicans have gained power. Republicans have taught their children to disrespect teachers and scientists and worse, education.

When Republicans talk about "those darned liberal" professors, what would they teach differently? They have their own Christian colleges. No "remarkable discoveries" are coming out of those campuses. Nothing truly innovative or new.

Take evolution away from science and what possible discoveries will be found in biology, botany and physiology?

The right just wants an "imaginary" world where their ideology "becomes" science. Well, it's not gonna happen.

Interesting.

Are you a student of Science? If so, what discipline?

I am not a scientist and never said I was. I am only a lowly engineer.

But to understand the right wing's opinion on education, one only needs to be able to read. They don't exactly hide their disdain.

I'm a student of Science and I am conservative. I don't know for sure, but I'd bet money you'd consider me "right wing." It seems another one of your broadbrush comments has been proven false.

I don't see a disdain for education by the right wing, I see a challenge to the structure that has decimated the advancement of free thinking in education.

Your charts that show a virtual consensus on political ideology by Scientists doesn't prove that left of center perspective is correct and here's all these Scientists who substantiate it. It could quite possibly show groupthink and team mentality in action. There is also a protectionist structure - "we can't accredit him, he doesn't agree with us." See the University of East Anglia situation for some evidence of that. When a journal published a study counter to the authoritative "experts," they reacted by trying to undermine the journal as an entity instead of just refuting the position with facts.

The most brilliant and lauded Scientists in history are those who went against conventional thought of the day. Which liberal Scientist does that now?

For someone who is liberal and lauds Science so much, I'd have at least thought you gave it the respect it deserves by at least studying it. I have.

Maybe your back of the hand logic doesn't fit?

 

[asterism]

Let's assume, for sake of argument, that this is correct - that our colleges and universities are, for the most part, liberal.

Why do we have to assume that?

And what would a conservative change in a college curriculum that would make it no longer liberal and make it conservative?

Just one specific.

Thinking back to my experience in college, I don't recall anything in any of my classes that was in any way political.

What was your major?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Excellent answer. Thank you.

And therein lies the reason why there is no debate. The 'excellent answer' is the one that fits your own political view. You take as fact anything you agree with, and refuse to consider view that contradicts it.

That is why I say the left are incapable of individual thought. You're so fucking borg-like in your thought process - and that is what is wrong with our colleges. They don't teach kids how to think, they teach them what to think. And, I suspect, you don't even recognize the difference. Moron.

I agree. It's funny to watch a bunch of "free thinkers" all agree on everything, down to which wine tastes best and what art is worthy.

Stupid fucks don't even have basic understanding of effective marketing and its purpose. You'll note many of the carry iPhones and rail against AT&T because they can't make phone calls. Do they switch carriers? Of course not! They have to have an iPhone! A phone that can't make calls reliably, on a network that is underpowered. It's positively astounding. Steve Jobs is one of the best capitalists yet, second only to Noam Chomsky.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FL7yD-0pqZg]YouTube - iPhone4 vs HTC Evo[/ame]

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Definitions of conservative:

•resistant to change

Interesting, since the entire conservative population is openly clamoring for change, change away from the liberal Keynesian micromanagement of the economy that's going on right now.

It's the "liberals" who want to stay the course.

If that initial broadbrush doesn't fit, do any of your others?

They don't, trust me.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

But does he mention "astrology"????????????

Astrology is scientific theory, courtroom told - science-in-society - 19 October 2005 - New Scientist

Astrology would be considered a scientific theory if judged by the same criteria used by a well-known advocate of Intelligent Design to justify his claim that ID is science, a landmark US trial heard on Tuesday.

Under cross examination, ID proponent Michael Behe, a biochemist at Lehigh University in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, admitted his definition of "theory" was so broad it would also include astrology.

Since I posted the trial transcript I did tacitly admit he admitted astrology meets his definition of theory.

Funny thing though, until rdean mentioned it, this thread was about why universities are considered to be liberal. You will learn that he cannot talk about anything without mentioning that only 6% of scientist self identify as Republicans. Please do not ask him for the link to prove that though, as he will just tell you that Google is your friend, while insisting that you provide links to back up your posts.

 

[asterism]

And therein lies the reason why there is no debate. The 'excellent answer' is the one that fits your own political view. You take as fact anything you agree with, and refuse to consider view that contradicts it.

That is why I say the left are incapable of individual thought. You're so fucking borg-like in your thought process - and that is what is wrong with our colleges. They don't teach kids how to think, they teach them what to think. And, I suspect, you don't even recognize the difference. Moron.

I agree. It's funny to watch a bunch of "free thinkers" all agree on everything, down to which wine tastes best and what art is worthy.

Stupid fucks don't even have basic understanding of effective marketing and its purpose. You'll note many of the carry iPhones and rail against AT&T because they can't make phone calls. Do they switch carriers? Of course not! They have to have an iPhone! A phone that can't make calls reliably, on a network that is underpowered. It's positively astounding. Steve Jobs is one of the best capitalists yet, second only to Noam Chomsky.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FL7yD-0pqZg]YouTube - iPhone4 vs HTC Evo[/ame]

Funny.

People who spend all their time on political message boards have no idea how the world actually works. You want the message board equivalent of combat? Debate technology. They need to put on their big boy underwear though, it's so brutal that it makes this place seem like a utopia.

Just imagine running a forum to discuss video cards and those who disagree don't just get nasty, they hack the site on a daily basis. Every counter hacking strategy was employed, but then the owner of the datacenter who hosted the site pulled the trump card and edited posts.

But then we all later laughed about it!

Yeah, that was 1987. It's good to see society catching up.

 

[ConHog]

Did someone really say conservatives hate history?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Not really, unless you are counting rdean as someone.

 

[asterism]

Not really, unless you are counting rdean as someone.

rdean is funny. He lauds Science but doesn't endeavor himself as someone who bothers to study Science. Telling.

He trusts that which he does not understand. Something tells me he thinks that would be foolish if the same situation were applied to an ignorant (according to the Engineer) person who accepts Christianity.

It's human dynamic and typical power acquisition folks. This stuff isn't complicated.

rdean hasn't taken 7 vacations this year, but he'll gladly say that you should pay for his leader'[s prerogative to do it.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

A common cry of many conservatives is that, in general, our institutions of higher learning in this country (colleges, universities, etc.) are "liberal." They teach "liberal concepts," they cater to liberals, all of the professors are liberals, and so forth. Let's assume, for sake of argument, that this is correct - that our colleges and universities are, for the most part, liberal.

What is it about our colleges and universities that makes them liberal, in your opinion and why do you think they became so, as opposed to leaning more toward conservative thought?

Liberal Arts