Let's talk a little bit about Reality Winner.

[pknopp]

I am also anti-Trump, but actually Trump broke no law.
When president, he was totally above and explicitly exempt from any classified doc law.
So then he could legally give copies of any classified doc, to anyone he wanted, including himself, forever.

You can post the law stating that?

 

[Rigby5]

I guess we must all ignore the Presidential Records Act & the various cases that have proven the President has ultimate authority on document classifications.
If the President declares something declassified, that is exactly what it is.
The rest is just semantics & power struggles over authority.

BTW- A classified document is not the same as a document with classified markings

I agree all president have total discretion over all classified docs.
They can give copies to whomever they want, forever.

But do not call it "declassifying", because that is something different.
That is where you make it public, and you have to tell everyone who has a copy, that it is now public.
What Trump really is covered by is executive privilege.
When Truman read the Manhattan Project classified docs, he did not have to have a security clearance, due to executive privilege.
When Truman gave the Manhattan Project docs to England, then England did not need a security clearance either.
And when Truman went out of office, England did not have to give the docs back.

The closest that this comes to "declassifying", is that effectively all classified docs are as if declassified, to all presidents and anyone they have extended executive privilege to.

 

[Rigby5]

You can post the law stating that?

Sure.
From EO13526:
{...
Sec. 1.3. Classification Authority.

(a) The authority to classify information
originally may be exercised only by:

(1) the President and the Vice President;
...}

And of course having the peak of authority to classify, implies the authority to declassify, ignore, etc.
And that of course if obvious, since the government routinely gives out copies of classified docs, to our allies, generals, ambassadors, research labs, etc.
And it is also obvious from the fact EO 13526 is written by a president in 2009.

 

[pknopp]

Sure.
From EO13526:
{...
Sec. 1.3. Classification Authority.

(a) The authority to classify information
originally may be exercised only by:

(1) the President and the Vice President;
...}

And of course having the peak of authority to classify, implies the authority to declassify, ignore, etc.
And that of course if obvious, since the government routinely gives out copies of classified docs, to our allies, generals, ambassadors, research labs, etc.
And it is also obvious from the fact EO 13526 is written by a president in 2009.

Nothing is implied.

 

[Rigby5]

The double standard I brought up is in regards to the way Trump thinks about the mishandling of classified docs when someone else does it and when he does it.

Trump not only did not mishandle any papers, but was incapable of it since his executive privilege does not end when out of office.
Did anyone who presidents give classified docs to ever return them because a new president was elected?
Never happens.
So Trump gets to legally keep any papers he gave to himself, while president.

 

[Rigby5]

Nothing is implied.

Yes it is.
It says the President is the SOURCE of all classified doc authority.
That implies not just the authority to give copies to anyone he wants, including himself, but to ignore, rewrite, or deliberately violate any classified doc law he wants.
And of course that is intentional, since the whole point of classified docs is to share them with the right people.
If they never could be shared by anyone, then you might as well just burn them all.
And this specifically is stating the president is above and immune to all classified doc laws.

This is not like the normal source or law, which is inherent rights of individuals.
Then presidents are not the source authority at all, but the potential victims are.
So when a law is made against something, like murder, the person writing the law is not immune to it.
But with classified doc law, there is no inherent right as the source of authority.
It is totally arbitrary, and the president is the arbitrary source, so then IS ABOVE the law.

 

[pknopp]

Yes it is.
It says the President is the SOURCE of all classified doc authority.

No, it says what it says. That he has the ability to classify information.

He also is not the source of all classified information.

That implies not just the authority to give copies to anyone he wants, including himself, but to ignore, rewrite, or deliberately violate any classified doc law he wants.
And of course that is intentional, since the whole point of classified docs is to share them with the right people.
If they never could be shared by anyone, then you might as well just burn them all.
And this specifically is stating the president is above and immune to all classified doc laws.

Nothing in the law is "implied".

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

There’s your “two tiered justice system”

Correct.

In a truly equal justice system Trump would likewise spend five years in prison.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The subject of double standards has been broached endlessly by defenders of all things Don, suggesting he is being targeted unfairly for his violations of law regarding classified docs. A subject, BTW, he spent quite a lot of time talking about during the 2016 campaign in reference to the matter of Hillary's server. Saying repeatedly we can't have a prez who treats classified info carelessly. Hmmmmmm.



When given the opportunity, Don's DoJ certainly did take mishandling classified docs, or in this case one document, very seriously.

Reality Winner says she's 'blown away' by details in indictment against Trump

Reality Winner, the former intelligence contractor imprisoned for leaking a top secret report on Russian hacking, said Friday that she was "blown away" by the level of detail in the unsealed indictment against Donald Trump.

Winner became the first person to be prosecuted and then sentenced under the Trump administration for defying the Espionage Act by leaking classified information. Now Trump faces 31 counts of willful retention of national defense information — in violation of the Espionage Act — as well as other counts related to making false statements and conspiring to obstruct justice.

"This is probably one of the most egregious and cut-and-dry cases," Winner, 31, said in a phone interview with NBC News of the allegations that Trump held onto sensitive government documents and attempted to mislead investigators.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/po...blown-away-details-indictment-trump-rcna88612

She got more than 5 years for revealing a doc on the subject of Russia having successfully hacked in to a number of state's voting data bases. A sore subject for Don.


Russians penetrated U.S. voter systems, top U.S. official says
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/el...trated-u-s-voter-systems-says-top-u-s-n845721

5 years, one document. No witness tampering, no refusal to comply with a subpoena, no lying to the DoJ, no conspiracy to conceal the possession of docs. 5 years. Now there's a double standard.

The **** wasn’t President when she mishandled Classified Documents!!

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

How so?

“Despite a 34-count indictment against Donald Trump, experts who spoke with Law&Crime say the former president is unlikely to see the inside of a prison cell.”

Conviction or not, this probably isn’t the case that’ll send Donald Trump to jail, experts say

Despite a 34-count indictment against Donald Trump, experts who spoke with Law&Crime say the former president is unlikely to see the inside of a prison cell.

lawandcrime.com

That’s how.

 

[Lesh]

The **** wasn’t President when she mishandled Classified Documents!!

Neither was Trump

 

[whitehall]

You gotta laugh that the post claims that there is no double standard but only cites Trump's issues.

 

[meaner gene]

I am also anti-Trump, but actually Trump broke no law.
When president, he was totally above and explicitly exempt from any classified doc law.
So then he could legally give copies of any classified doc, to anyone he wanted, including himself, forever.

I think you have the situation twisted. The president does have power to declassify any classified information, not any classified document.
The information in the document is what gets declassified. Then all documents with that same information in it, are subsequently declassified, and marked declassified as well.

The president can also grant a presidential security clearance. Where he can bestow upon anyone, a security clearance, like he did for Jared Kushner. That way he could give people of his choice, classified documents, without having to declassify them.

 

[meaner gene]

Sure.
From EO13526:
{...
Sec. 1.3. Classification Authority.

(a) The authority to classify information
originally may be exercised only by:

(1) the President and the Vice President;
...}

And of course having the peak of authority to classify, implies the authority to declassify, ignore, etc.
And that of course if obvious, since the government routinely gives out copies of classified docs, to our allies, generals, ambassadors, research labs, etc.
And it is also obvious from the fact EO 13526 is written by a president in 2009.

Actually there is a section in the EO of declassification authority. It has to be specifically granted, and not presumed due to being granted classification authority.

The EO grants agency heads original classification authority, and also grants those with original classificaiton authority, declassification authority.

 

[miketx]

Trump had every opportunity to hand back the classified material without penalty.
That the stupid fuck CHOSE to defy the LAW shows that he is unworthy to be the president.

LIES, ALL LIES.

 

[miketx]

I think you have the situation twisted. The president does have power to declassify any classified information, not any classified document.
The information in the document is what gets declassified. Then all documents with that same information in it, are subsequently declassified, and marked declassified as well.

The president can also grant a presidential security clearance. Where he can bestow upon anyone, a security clearance, like he did for Jared Kushner. That way he could give people of his choice, classified documents, without having to declassify them.

More leftist bullshit,

 

[Lesh]

I think you have the situation twisted. The president does have power to declassify any classified information, not any classified document.
The information in the document is what gets declassified. Then all documents with that same information in it, are subsequently declassified, and marked declassified as well.

The president can also grant a presidential security clearance. Where he can bestow upon anyone, a security clearance, like he did for Jared Kushner. That way he could give people of his choice, classified documents, without having to declassify them.

Regarding the docs he wakes showing around at Bedminster… he was NOT President at that time and had no such authority