Less than 1/2 of the victims of the Holocaust remembered

[patrickcaturday]

Defining the Holocaust
In 1979, the President's Commission on the Holocaust provided the following definition to help guide the Council and its observances:

The Holocaust was the systematic, bureaucratic annihilation of six million Jews by the Nazis and their collaborators as a central act of state during the Second World War; as night descended, millions of other peoples were swept into this net of death. It was a crime unique in the annals of human history, different not only in the quantity of violence -- the sheer numbers killed -- but in its manner and purpose as a mass criminal enterprise organized by the state against defenseless civilian populations. The decision to kill every Jew everywhere in Europe: the definition of Jew as target for death transcended all boundaries.... The concept of the annihilation of an entire people, as distinguished from their subjugation, was unprecedented; never before in human history had genocide been an all-pervasive government policy unaffected by territorial or economic advantage and unchecked by moral or religious constraints.... The Holocaust was not simply a throwback to medieval torture or archaic barbarism, but a thoroughly modern expression of bureaucratic organization, industrial management, scientific achievement, and technological sophistication. The entire apparatus of the German bureaucracy was marshaled in the service of the extermination process.[5 ]
Days of Remembrance of the Victims of the Holocaust - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We must never forget, however, that for each person who was rescued and survived the Holocaust, countless more were killed. As we remember stories of rescue, therefore, we must first honor the memory of Holocaust victims by countering indifference with vigilance and apathy with action.
2012 Days of Remembrance

It is truly right and fitting that we remember all of the victims of the Holocaust;

A ) the 6,000,000 Jews that were killed

B ) the approximately 1,800,000 Polish Slavs that were killed

C ) the approximately ( estimates vary ) 7 to 12 million Russian Slavs ( including 3,200,000 POWs ) that were killed

D ) the approximately 1,500,000 Romani that were killed.

E ) also the physically and mentally disabled, the homosexuals, the Muslims, and others that were killed.
All of these were killed by the same means as the Jews were killed !!!



If we only remember the Jewish victims then we are being indifferent to the millions of others that suffered the same horrors ! If we do not tell the true history of the Holocaust and learn all of it's lessons, then we will not remain vigilant , and thus NOT be prepared to counter the conditions that will allow another Holocaust to occur ! So everyone here should take an oath that when the Holocaust is remembered they will do their best to tell the whole story



I SWEAR TO DO SO

Well, then, you've got your work cut out for you. The Jews have done their best to remember every Jew by name who was killed in the Holocaust, so you need to get busy remembering all 1,800,000 Poles, 7,000,000 to 12,000,000 Russians and 1,500,000 Romani by name. Be sure to check back in when your memorial list is complete.

It appears to me that your comment is a bit snide. I will attempt to however not treat it that way. The Jewish people are to be commended for their dilligent research in this area.
Vad Yashem was established in 1953 and given the task of recording all of the names of the Jews that were killed in the Holocaust, and even after almost 60 years they are still only able to document 2/3 of the 6,000,000 killed;

Yad Vashem, together with its partners, has collected and recorded here the names and biographical details of two thirds of the six million Jews murdered by the Nazis and their accomplices. Two million more still remain unidentified: It is our collective duty to persist until all their names are recovered

http://db.yadvashem.org/names/search.html?language=en

Still concidering the difficulties that are involved this in itself is a remarkable feat ! The difficulties that other ethnicities have faced are in some respects even greater.

Take for example the difficulties that the Romani have faced. First of all they have never been a very literate people in that their lifestyle is nomadic and thus they are not able to acess oppertunities foe education very easily. Add to that the fact that almost all of their tradition keepers were killed in the Holocaust and their reluctance to talk to outsiders means that most of their stories have been lost. The descimination that the Romani faced before the war continued after the war. For example the Germans began paying reperations to the Jews for the Holocaust in 1953. When the Romani applied the Germans said they would not receive them because the reason they were in the concentration camps was because they were criminals, however the law that the Romani brike was simply the fact that they were simply Romani. It took untill 1985 before the Germans would begin to pay reperations and by that time many of the survivors were dead.

Jewish Responses : Center for Holocaust & Genocide Studies : University of Minnesota

Please note that descrimination against the Romani is still practiced by law in such places as Italy, France, England and Germany.

My point is simply this just as I do not need all of the 6,000,000 name of the Jews to remember them, We should not need the names of all of the other victims to recognize them. It really is the only human thing to do !!!

 

[Sunni Man]

Don't show off your ignoracny.

Shower rooms and gas rooms were totally different. the captives were taken to shower rooms after being head-shaved so they could be cleaned.

The gas rooms were totally closed and different.

Sad, really, that the Holocaust is amusing you

Then why is saying "go take a shower" considered offensive to the Jews?

Is it about personal hygiene or something else?

 

[JStone]

Don't show off your ignoracny.

Shower rooms and gas rooms were totally different. the captives were taken to shower rooms after being head-shaved so they could be cleaned.

The gas rooms were totally closed and different.

Sad, really, that the Holocaust is amusing you

Then why is saying "go take a shower" considered offensive to the Jews?

Is it about personal hygiene or something else?

Have a nice islimic mental illness day.

Arab-American Psychiatrist And Human Rights Activist Dr. Wafa Sultan, Among "Time Magazine's 100 Men and Women Whose Power, Talent or Moral Example Is Transforming Our World" Wafa Sultan - The 2006 TIME 100 - TIME

ISLAM IS A MENTAL DISORDER

When I examined the Koran, the hadiths and the Islamic books under my microscope, I came to the absolute conviction that it is impossible--IMPOSSIBLE-- for any human being to read the biography of Muhammad and believe in it and yet emerge a psychologically and mentally healthy person.

Do you remember the way that Muhammad killed Asma bint Marwan? His followers tore her body apart limb from limb while she was breastfeeding her child. When they returned to him shouting, "Allah Akbar," he said: "Two goats would lock horns over her." As you know, goats lock horns over the most inconsequential thing. For Muhammad, however, the killing of a woman while breastfeeding was too trivial an incident for goats to lock horns over. Is this a prophet of God?

The language of Islam is a negative, dead language, replete with violence, anger, hatred and racism. Man is a product of his language, the outcome of the negative and positive language to which he is exposed in his lifetime. If his life is dominated by negative language, he will emerge as a negative, reckless and non-productive person who rejects everything. This is why the negative language of Islam has failed. It has failed to produce people with a positive outlook. It has produced negative people. If we take a look at Islamic societies, we see what that negative man [Muhammad] did.

Islam is a political doctrine which imposes itself by force. Any doctrine whatsoever that calls to kill those who do not believe in it is not a religion. It is a totalitarian doctrine that imposes itself by force.

Read about the life of Muhammad. What do you find there? Nothing but his raids and and his wives. I shudder when I hear the hadith: A woman's paradise is under her husband's foot. The Islamc teachings have become dreadful in the skulls of the Muslims. I see no alternative butr to open these skulls and to clean the life-threatening cancerous cells in these brains.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_g4cMjpiBpA]Islam & Mental Illness (Arabic with Subs.) - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Lipush]

Don't show off your ignoracny.

Shower rooms and gas rooms were totally different. the captives were taken to shower rooms after being head-shaved so they could be cleaned.

The gas rooms were totally closed and different.

Sad, really, that the Holocaust is amusing you

Then why is saying "go take a shower" considered offensive to the Jews?

Is it about personal hygiene or something else?

You just don't get it, do you? it's the whole picutre that counts.

 

[Sunni Man]

You just don't get it, do you? it's the whole picutre that counts.

Sorry, but I refuse to see the world through distorted zionist colored glasses.

 

[JStone]

You just don't get it, do you? it's the whole picutre that counts.

Sorry, but I refuse to see the world through distorted zionist colored glasses.

You see the world through islimic mental illness.

Arab-American Psychiatrist And Human Rights Activist Dr. Wafa Sultan, Among "Time Magazine's 100 Men and Women Whose Power, Talent or Moral Example Is Transforming Our World" Wafa Sultan - The 2006 TIME 100 - TIME

Islime Is A Mental Disorder

When I examined the Koran, the hadiths and the Islamic books under my microscope, I came to the absolute conviction that it is impossible--IMPOSSIBLE-- for any human being to read the biography of Muhammad and believe in it and yet emerge a psychologically and mentally healthy person.

Do you remember the way that Muhammad killed Asma bint Marwan? His followers tore her body apart limb from limb while she was breastfeeding her child. When they returned to him shouting, "Allah Akbar," he said: "Two goats would lock horns over her." As you know, goats lock horns over the most inconsequential thing. For Muhammad, however, the killing of a woman while breastfeeding was too trivial an incident for goats to lock horns over. Is this a prophet of God?

The language of Islam is a negative, dead language, replete with violence, anger, hatred and racism. Man is a product of his language, the outcome of the negative and positive language to which he is exposed in his lifetime. If his life is dominated by negative language, he will emerge as a negative, reckless and non-productive person who rejects everything. This is why the negative language of Islam has failed. It has failed to produce people with a positive outlook. It has produced negative people. If we take a look at Islamic societies, we see what that negative man [Muhammad] did.

Islam is a political doctrine which imposes itself by force. Any doctrine whatsoever that calls to kill those who do not believe in it is not a religion. It is a totalitarian doctrine that imposes itself by force.

Read about the life of Muhammad. What do you find there? Nothing but his raids and and his wives. I shudder when I hear the hadith: A woman's paradise is under her husband's foot. The Islamc teachings have become dreadful in the skulls of the Muslims. I see no alternative butr to open these skulls and to clean the life-threatening cancerous cells in these brains.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_g4cMjpiBpA]Islam & Mental Illness (Arabic with Subs.) - YouTube[/ame]

 

[patrickcaturday]

I would ask the people who have posted on this thread to accept the number of Jews killed as 6,000,000 as I gave it in the opening post on this thread. The reason that I used that number is that in my research ( consisting of many hours if not days ) that is the number that seems to at this point in time to have the most historical reliability ! I would suggest that if people want to debate the number they start a different thread to do so. The purpose of this thread was to recognise the millions of others that were also killed in the Holocaust, can we please get back to that !!!


Obviously we can't because the thought that his Nazi comrades have been blamed for 6 million when perhaps only 5.5 million Jews were slaughtered causes him to lose sleep. As much as you might like to believe you are on the side of truth and justice, you are simply fodder for the hate mill of bigoted idiots like "Truthseekeer." One day you will face the fact that you are either with him and his comrades or against them. There is no middle ground.

These Islamist worshippers are funny. The Nazis, if anything, were meticulous at keeping records and numbers. By their own admission and all the Nazi leaders that got caught, they admitted to killing 6 million Jews, and showed the records for it. The modern German government also confirms this. Yet, we suddenly have some Neo Nazis, White Supremacists, KKK, Islamists, and Arabs that seem to know better than the Nazis and Germans themselves! That's why they passed anti Holocaust denying laws in Germany itself. I bet you Everytime that idiot Ahmadinejad rants with his Holocaust denying crap,the Germans are watching him on TV laughing, going "look at this chimp, WTF does he know?"

MY GOD PEOPLE THIS IS NOT A GAME
We are talking about the death of millions of people. The true horror of the deaths are beyond mere words to give justice. Children medically expermented on dying screaming in their parents arms which is the only comfort their parents can offer. People forced to dig their own graves. Children being ripped from their parents arms and then they are either forced into the gas chambers or forced to watch their parents go to the gas chambers.

Yet we sit here and play games with their lives !!! We argue back and forth about numbers as if it really makes a difference weather it was 4,000,000 or 6,000,000. We ask inane questions like weather or not Jews could break windows and escape the gas chambers. We yell stomp scream and call each other names like Nazi, Islamist, Holocaust deniar and Holocaust exagerator ( sp ). This is rediculous, we are denigrating their deaths. They ( Jews, Slavs, Romani, physically and mentally disabled, homosexuals Jehovahs Witnesses, Blacks, and others ) died in their millions get over your petty bickering and remember them so it does not happen again !!!

We say that the Nazis kept meticulous records so the numbers have to be right. Yet we are so ignorant that we fail to realize that the eizengruppen did not keep records. they just rounded people up made them dig their own graves and then killed then.

It is time we put our petty little spats aside and recognise the dead, all of them. Let's not defile their deaths any longer

 

[ima]

I'm fucking sick of hearing about the holocaust. Give it up already! 100 million+ people died in WWII, only 6 mil were Jews. So shut the fuck up already! You'd think no one else has ever died before or since. 20 million Ukrainians were starved by Stalin, do you hear Ukrainian giving people shit every five minutes about that?

 

[patrickcaturday]

MY GOD PEOPLE THIS IS NOT A GAME
We are talking about the death of millions of people. The true horror of the deaths are beyond mere words to give justice. Children medically expermented on dying screaming in their parents arms which is the only comfort their parents can offer. People forced to dig their own graves. Children being ripped from their parents arms and then they are either forced into the gas chambers or forced to watch their parents go to the gas chambers.

Yet we sit here and play games with their lives !!! We argue back and forth about numbers as if it really makes a difference weather it was 4,000,000 or 6,000,000. We ask inane questions like weather or not Jews could break windows and escape the gas chambers. We yell stomp scream and call each other names like Nazi, Islamist, Holocaust deniar and Holocaust exagerator ( sp ). This is rediculous, we are denigrating their deaths. They ( Jews, Slavs, Romani, physically and mentally disabled, homosexuals Jehovahs Witnesses, Blacks, and others ) died in their millions get over your petty bickering and remember them so it does not happen again !!!

We say that the Nazis kept meticulous records so the numbers have to be right. Yet we are so ignorant that we fail to realize that the eizengruppen did not keep records. they just rounded people up made them dig their own graves and then killed then.

It is time we put our petty little spats aside and recognise the dead, all of them. Let's not defile their deaths any longer

 

[Hossfly]

BELZEC, CHELMNO, SOBIBOR , TREBLINKA, MAJDANEK, BERGEN BELSEN, BUCHENWALD, the list goes on

The first FOUR were EXTERMINATION camps like Auschwitz, along with T.II. The next, concentration camps where hundreds of thousands died. Add in Sachsenhausen, Treblinka, and Theresienstadt. SIX million is a conservative number.

There was also Flossenberg in Germany....i got to visit that camp a couple yrs ago when visiting my son that's in the service, he was stationed at Graffenweir (sp?) which is about 45 minutes from the camp...here's a few pics....

Flossenberg Memorial area

Oven (they had only 1 so many were buried in a big mound in the memorial area)

"Shower" room

Flossenberg yard

This was a smaller camp that most, only had 1 oven. The picture of the Memorial area...to the left (that i didn't get a pic of!!) is a huge mound that is covered with grass, which was all the bodies that didn't get put in the oven. Very sobering place!!!

In 7 years stationed in Germany, I have been to Grafenwohr training area many times. Also visited Flossenberg twice. My first visit was in Sep 1958 and the ovens smelled the same as the ovens at Dachau. I was living in Munich then at Warner Kaserne (SS baracks) and when the wind blew from Dachau, we didn't feel like eating. The smell would make a Holocaust denier change his mind.

 

[Sunni Man]

I'm fucking sick of hearing about the holocaust. Give it up already! 100 million+ people died in WWII, only 6 mil were Jews. So shut the fuck up already! You'd think no one else has ever died before or since. 20 million Ukrainians were starved by Stalin, do you hear Ukrainian giving people shit every five minutes about that?

It's about keeping the Holocaust image fresh in the minds of people.

So that the Zionists Jews can keep extorting money from the western nations.

Basically, a perpetual guilt trip.

Quite a money making scam they have got going.

 

[Artevelde]

Defining the Holocaust
In 1979, the President's Commission on the Holocaust provided the following definition to help guide the Council and its observances:

The Holocaust was the systematic, bureaucratic annihilation of six million Jews by the Nazis and their collaborators as a central act of state during the Second World War; as night descended, millions of other peoples were swept into this net of death. It was a crime unique in the annals of human history, different not only in the quantity of violence -- the sheer numbers killed -- but in its manner and purpose as a mass criminal enterprise organized by the state against defenseless civilian populations. The decision to kill every Jew everywhere in Europe: the definition of Jew as target for death transcended all boundaries.... The concept of the annihilation of an entire people, as distinguished from their subjugation, was unprecedented; never before in human history had genocide been an all-pervasive government policy unaffected by territorial or economic advantage and unchecked by moral or religious constraints.... The Holocaust was not simply a throwback to medieval torture or archaic barbarism, but a thoroughly modern expression of bureaucratic organization, industrial management, scientific achievement, and technological sophistication. The entire apparatus of the German bureaucracy was marshaled in the service of the extermination process.[5 ]
Days of Remembrance of the Victims of the Holocaust - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We must never forget, however, that for each person who was rescued and survived the Holocaust, countless more were killed. As we remember stories of rescue, therefore, we must first honor the memory of Holocaust victims by countering indifference with vigilance and apathy with action.
2012 Days of Remembrance

It is truly right and fitting that we remember all of the victims of the Holocaust;

A ) the 6,000,000 Jews that were killed

B ) the approximately 1,800,000 Polish Slavs that were killed

C ) the approximately ( estimates vary ) 7 to 12 million Russian Slavs ( including 3,200,000 POWs ) that were killed

D ) the approximately 1,500,000 Romani that were killed.

E ) also the physically and mentally disabled, the homosexuals, the Muslims, and others that were killed.
All of these were killed by the same means as the Jews were killed !!!



If we only remember the Jewish victims then we are being indifferent to the millions of others that suffered the same horrors ! If we do not tell the true history of the Holocaust and learn all of it's lessons, then we will not remain vigilant , and thus NOT be prepared to counter the conditions that will allow another Holocaust to occur ! So everyone here should take an oath that when the Holocaust is remembered they will do their best to tell the whole story



I SWEAR TO DO SO

What you write is false.

 

[Sunni Man]

In 7 years stationed in Germany, I have been to Grafenwohr training area many times. Also visited Flossenberg twice. My first visit was in Sep 1958 and the ovens smelled the same as the ovens at Dachau. I was living in Munich then at Warner Kaserne (SS baracks) and when the wind blew from Dachau, we didn't feel like eating. The smell would make a Holocaust denier change his mind.

I didn't know that "fraud" had a smell?

 

[Artevelde]

I'm fucking sick of hearing about the holocaust. Give it up already! 100 million+ people died in WWII, only 6 mil were Jews. So shut the fuck up already! You'd think no one else has ever died before or since. 20 million Ukrainians were starved by Stalin, do you hear Ukrainian giving people shit every five minutes about that?

A neat combination of ignorance of the facts and intolerance. Are you just completely uninformed or is your lying intentional? (probably the latter).

 

[JStone]

I'm fucking sick of hearing about the holocaust. Give it up already! 100 million+ people died in WWII, only 6 mil were Jews. So shut the fuck up already! You'd think no one else has ever died before or since. 20 million Ukrainians were starved by Stalin, do you hear Ukrainian giving people shit every five minutes about that?

It's about keeping the Holocaust image fresh in the minds of people.

So that the Zionists Jews can keep extorting money from the western nations.

Basically, a perpetual guilt trip.

Quite a money making scam they have got going.

There's that islimic mental illness surfacing.

Arab-American Psychiatrist And Human Rights Activist Dr. Wafa Sultan, Among "Time Magazine's 100 Men and Women Whose Power, Talent or Moral Example Is Transforming Our World" Wafa Sultan - The 2006 TIME 100 - TIME

Islime Is A Mental Disorder

When I examined the Koran, the hadiths and the Islamic books under my microscope, I came to the absolute conviction that it is impossible--IMPOSSIBLE-- for any human being to read the biography of Muhammad and believe in it and yet emerge a psychologically and mentally healthy person.

Do you remember the way that Muhammad killed Asma bint Marwan? His followers tore her body apart limb from limb while she was breastfeeding her child. When they returned to him shouting, "Allah Akbar," he said: "Two goats would lock horns over her." As you know, goats lock horns over the most inconsequential thing. For Muhammad, however, the killing of a woman while breastfeeding was too trivial an incident for goats to lock horns over. Is this a prophet of God?

The language of Islam is a negative, dead language, replete with violence, anger, hatred and racism. Man is a product of his language, the outcome of the negative and positive language to which he is exposed in his lifetime. If his life is dominated by negative language, he will emerge as a negative, reckless and non-productive person who rejects everything. This is why the negative language of Islam has failed. It has failed to produce people with a positive outlook. It has produced negative people. If we take a look at Islamic societies, we see what that negative man [Muhammad] did.

Islam is a political doctrine which imposes itself by force. Any doctrine whatsoever that calls to kill those who do not believe in it is not a religion. It is a totalitarian doctrine that imposes itself by force.

Read about the life of Muhammad. What do you find there? Nothing but his raids and and his wives. I shudder when I hear the hadith: A woman's paradise is under her husband's foot. The Islamc teachings have become dreadful in the skulls of the Muslims. I see no alternative butr to open these skulls and to clean the life-threatening cancerous cells in these brains.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_g4cMjpiBpA]Islam & Mental Illness (Arabic with Subs.) - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Hossfly]

Don't show off your ignoracny.

Shower rooms and gas rooms were totally different. the captives were taken to shower rooms after being head-shaved so they could be cleaned.

The gas rooms were totally closed and different.

Sad, really, that the Holocaust is amusing you

Then why is saying "go take a shower" considered offensive to the Jews?

Is it about personal hygiene or something else?

Do Muslims get offended when told to "Go shower with your billy goat and don't forget the Vaseline?"

 

[Artevelde]

It is truly right and fitting that we remember all of the victims of the Holocaust;

A ) the 6,000,000 Jews that were killed

B ) the approximately 1,800,000 Polish Slavs that were killed

C ) the approximately ( estimates vary ) 7 to 12 million Russian Slavs ( including 3,200,000 POWs ) that were killed

D ) the approximately 1,500,000 Romani that were killed.

E ) also the physically and mentally disabled, the homosexuals, the Muslims, and others that were killed.
All of these were killed by the same means as the Jews were killed !!!



If we only remember the Jewish victims then we are being indifferent to the millions of others that suffered the same horrors ! If we do not tell the true history of the Holocaust and learn all of it's lessons, then we will not remain vigilant , and thus NOT be prepared to counter the conditions that will allow another Holocaust to occur ! So everyone here should take an oath that when the Holocaust is remembered they will do their best to tell the whole story



I SWEAR TO DO SO

it's not 6 million. That is before they changed the bogus number of 4 million dying at Auschwitz to between 1 million and 1.5 million all of which couldn't have been Jewish.

BELZEC, CHELMNO, SOBIBOR , TREBLINKA, MAJDANEK, BERGEN BELSEN, BUCHENWALD, the list goes on "Truth"............................................

You are throwing together extermination camps with concentration camps here. This muddies the issues and only provides comfort to Holocaust deniers.

 

[Hossfly]

In 7 years stationed in Germany, I have been to Grafenwohr training area many times. Also visited Flossenberg twice. My first visit was in Sep 1958 and the ovens smelled the same as the ovens at Dachau. I was living in Munich then at Warner Kaserne (SS baracks) and when the wind blew from Dachau, we didn't feel like eating. The smell would make a Holocaust denier change his mind.

I didn't know that "fraud" had a smell?

I was in Dachau June 2011 during a visit as part of my "bucket list" and it may have been my imagination but I could still smell that puke inducing odor. You seem to know what fraud is all about,Adolph.

 

[ima]

In 7 years stationed in Germany, I have been to Grafenwohr training area many times. Also visited Flossenberg twice. My first visit was in Sep 1958 and the ovens smelled the same as the ovens at Dachau. I was living in Munich then at Warner Kaserne (SS baracks) and when the wind blew from Dachau, we didn't feel like eating. The smell would make a Holocaust denier change his mind.

I didn't know that "fraud" had a smell?

I was in Dachau June 2011 during a visit as part of my "bucket list" and it may have been my imagination but I could still smell that puke inducing odor. You seem to know what fraud is all about,Adolph.

So we're arguing with some grampa's grampa? How old are you? 110?

Maybe the smell was your Depends being full!

 

[Sunni Man]

I was in Dachau June 2011 during a visit as part of my "bucket list" and it may have been my imagination but I could still smell that puke inducing odor. You seem to know what fraud is all about, Adolph.

So if someone doesn't automatically buy into the Holocaust myth.

They are somehow associated with Adolph?

Standard tactic used to try and shut down any discussion of the inconsistencies found in the "official" Holocaust story.