John Kerry: War Hero

[sambino510]

...i find it hard to believe that liberals are responsible for all the evils of this world. That's all I'm saying.

Not "all". 99%

Ah, how generous of you to leave 1% for the alternative point of view.

 

[whitehall]

Kerry was a subversive who built a fake resume as a "War Hero" just come out later to undermine public support for our troops, so of course he'd have a stellar career in the DemoCCCPrat Party

Tell us about your service CrusaderFrank. Oh yeah, 4-F, I forgot. Was it mental or physical? I'd bet both.

Personal attacks on fellow posters do not bolster Kerry's credibility. In fact they are an admission the defense of Kerry's legacy is hopeless.

 

[Bloodrock44]

Tell us about your service CrusaderFrank. Oh yeah, 4-F, I forgot. Was it mental or physical? I'd bet both.

That's all you got, Freddo?

I was in high school while Kerry was putting himself in for Purple Hearts and traveling up the Do Long river to assassinate Col. Kurtz during Christmas in Cambodia

Seems like Freddo has got plenty. It's one thing for veterans to go negative on another vet, and I don't much like that, but hey, they were there and they earned the right. For a guy who is not a combat vet to challange a combat vet's courage or whether he earned his awards is just beyond despicable. Make no mistake, you have every right to go negative on Kerry for what he did when he returned from the war and his politics of today, but there is no way you have the right to judge that mans behavior under combat if you have never been under combat yourself.

There is no way I have the right to judge? So now you're denying my 1st amendment right? I thought this was a major reason Americans fought and died for so we could have the right to opine whether or not we were experienced in the subject we speak of. Sad that people wish to deny others of a basic God given right.

 

[PrometheusBound]

The ruling class nominated Kerry in order to make war heroes look bad and sissyboy draftdodgers like Bush and Cheney look good. Like Benedict Arnold, who had been instrumental in freeing us from the British aristocracy, Kerry's medals were honorably gained but he betrayed the troops when he came home. The protesters he joined in loyalty to his class were not anti-war; they were snobbish brats of the rich who wanted to make the working-class GIs look like baby-killers.

While my fellow combat veterans and I were brought up on movies glorifying war, the preppies saw the same movies as implying that working-class GIs had saved the nation. They couldn't let the common people have any pride, so they made sure that the Vietnam heroes would be looked at as psychotic killers or pathetic losers.

 

[PrometheusBound]

Kerry was an obscure officer on some obscure ship before the Navy allowed him to volunteer for "Swift Boat" duty. Most of the Swift Boat skippers (God bless 'em) honorably served but Kerry was a savvy politician long before he ran for office. Times changed during the Vietnam war. It seems that Kerry took shrapnel to his butt from his own grenade when he tossed it into a cache of VC rice. For Heart #2 apparently some explosive device was triggered in the retrieval of a mine and Kerry suffered a wound to his finger that didn't even require a bandaid. Kerry 's boat took fire from a single VC on shore and instead of delegating authority to his crew to dispatch the threat, the freaking skipper grabbed a .45 and chased the unarmed single VC kid and shot him dead. Kerry wrote himself up for a Silver Star for his valor and it was systematically forwarded.

While serving as a Marine infantryman in Vietnam, I had a ricochet throw dirt in my face and buzz my ear. Because it didn't break the skin it didn't qualify for a Purple Heart. But the trauma was so great that I was temporarily paralyzed. The sergeant told us to move forward and I couldn't move. Lucky for me, the other Marines disobeyed the order because they were afraid to move up even though they could.

Because we were rushed over there with insufficient training, many Marines were shell-shocked the first time they heard enemy gunfire. Our generals asked for more territory ( Tactical Area Of Responsibility) than they could possibly hold with the insufficient number of properly trained Marines they had. It was right up against North Vietnam. When the enemy swarmed across during Operation Prairie, Westmoreland had to take much of I Corps away from us and assign it to the Army's Americal Division.

I'm sorry if I make Chickenhawk-lovers squirm in guilt by telling what war is really like. But I personally know of two Marines who died just because of inadequate training, which is Off-Topic because John Kerry was trained properly and showed it by his bravery in battle.

 

[PrometheusBound]

Tell us about your service CrusaderFrank. Oh yeah, 4-F, I forgot. Was it mental or physical? I'd bet both.

That's all you got, Freddo?

I was in high school while Kerry was putting himself in for Purple Hearts and traveling up the Do Long river to assassinate Col. Kurtz during Christmas in Cambodia

Seems like Freddo has got plenty. It's one thing for veterans to go negative on another vet, and I don't much like that, but hey, they were there and they earned the right. For a guy who is not a combat vet to challange a combat vet's courage or whether he earned his awards is just beyond despicable. Make no mistake, you have every right to go negative on Kerry for what he did when he returned from the war and his politics of today, but there is no way you have the right to judge that mans behavior under combat if you have never been under combat yourself.

They are transferring their guilt from supporting gutless unpatriotic pukes like Bush, Cheney, Quayle, Gingrich, Lott, Romney, Ashcroft, Gramm, Limbaugh, Kemp, Ted Nugent, and boytoy Michael Reagan among thousands of other flag-waving traitors. They have contempt for unprivileged Americans and want us to be proud to die taking a rich kid's place. Any real man would have grabbed that preppy pipsqueak Bush by the ear when he was 18 and marched him down to the active-duty Induction Station, telling the Sergeant there, "Here, take this spoiled little sissy; he owes the country more than I do."

 

[PrometheusBound]

Seems like Freddo has got plenty. It's one thing for veterans to go negative on another vet, and I don't much like that, but hey, they were there and they earned the right. For a guy who is not a combat vet to challange a combat vet's courage or whether he earned his awards is just beyond despicable. Make no mistake, you have every right to go negative on Kerry for what he did when he returned from the war and his politics of today, but there is no way you have the right to judge that man's behavior under combat if you have never been under combat yourself.

There is no way I have the right to judge? So now you're denying my 1st amendment right? I thought this was a major reason Americans fought and died for so we could have the right to opine whether or not we were experienced in the subject we speak of. Sad that people wish to deny others of a basic God given right.

Just like Chickenhawk hypocrites, Netties won't support something when it applies to themselves or the plastic idols they worship. As long as we have the Ignore function, there is no need for moderators. But all the talk about freedom of speech is muffled when it comes to the self-enslaving Internet. I dare you to send your post, exactly as written, to the Mod Squad of Netiquette Nannies.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Tell us about your service CrusaderFrank. Oh yeah, 4-F, I forgot. Was it mental or physical? I'd bet both.

That's all you got, Freddo?

I was in high school while Kerry was putting himself in for Purple Hearts and traveling up the Do Long river to assassinate Col. Kurtz during Christmas in Cambodia

Seems like Freddo has got plenty. It's one thing for veterans to go negative on another vet, and I don't much like that, but hey, they were there and they earned the right. For a guy who is not a combat vet to challange a combat vet's courage or whether he earned his awards is just beyond despicable. Make no mistake, you have every right to go negative on Kerry for what he did when he returned from the war and his politics of today, but there is no way you have the right to judge that mans behavior under combat if you have never been under combat yourself.

I think the year I spend in high school in the South Bronx in 1973 was on par with John Kerry's service. I've been close, and I mean real fucking close to gunfire twice in my life and I had to pick my uncle's brains off the wall after the police left and the Coroner's office took the body away. So you can join Wry in the go fuck yourself club

 

[daveman]

The ruling class nominated Kerry in order to make war heroes look bad and sissyboy draftdodgers like Bush and Cheney look good. Like Benedict Arnold, who had been instrumental in freeing us from the British aristocracy, Kerry's medals were honorably gained but he betrayed the troops when he came home. The protesters he joined in loyalty to his class were not anti-war; they were snobbish brats of the rich who wanted to make the working-class GIs look like baby-killers.

While my fellow combat veterans and I were brought up on movies glorifying war, the preppies saw the same movies as implying that working-class GIs had saved the nation. They couldn't let the common people have any pride, so they made sure that the Vietnam heroes would be looked at as psychotic killers or pathetic losers.

 

[Bloodrock44]

Seems like Freddo has got plenty. It's one thing for veterans to go negative on another vet, and I don't much like that, but hey, they were there and they earned the right. For a guy who is not a combat vet to challange a combat vet's courage or whether he earned his awards is just beyond despicable. Make no mistake, you have every right to go negative on Kerry for what he did when he returned from the war and his politics of today, but there is no way you have the right to judge that man's behavior under combat if you have never been under combat yourself.

There is no way I have the right to judge? So now you're denying my 1st amendment right? I thought this was a major reason Americans fought and died for so we could have the right to opine whether or not we were experienced in the subject we speak of. Sad that people wish to deny others of a basic God given right.

Just like Chickenhawk hypocrites, Netties won't support something when it applies to themselves or the plastic idols they worship. As long as we have the Ignore function, there is no need for moderators. But all the talk about freedom of speech is muffled when it comes to the self-enslaving Internet. I dare you to send your post, exactly as written, to the Mod Squad of Netiquette Nannies.

WTF are you talking about? Lay off the sauce and seek help...soon.

 

[regent]

If people are upset about the way the navy awards decorations the place to complain is to the navy. The navy, however, when this ruckus started said it reviewed the records and all was shippy-shape. Kerry, and others, veterans or not, had a right to protest the war. Is Vietnam today considered a war America needed to fight and needed to win? Did My Lai happen?

 

[whitehall]

If people are upset about the way the navy awards decorations the place to complain is to the navy. The navy, however, when this ruckus started said it reviewed the records and all was shippy-shape. Kerry, and others, veterans or not, had a right to protest the war. Is Vietnam today considered a war America needed to fight and needed to win? Did My Lai happen?

In the greatest Country in the world the Military still works for the people. We have the right and some would say the duty to review awards that the Navy sanctioned weather or not the Navy wants to address the claims. It's an insult to real Veterans who were wounded in combat to read about Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts when the statutes clearly indicate that intentional or unintentional self inflicted wounds do not qualify. One of Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts concerned an incident where he threw a grenade into a cache of V.C. rice and a grain of rice or a piece of shrapnel bit him in the ass. The Military's policy was three Hearts and you got a ticket home and it's clear that the chicken shit Navy Lt. was determined to get his ass out of combat and the best way was to get three Hearts. Kerry's tour lasted three months.

 

[Billo_Really]

Was watching a program where they were showing Kerry testifying before a Senate committee in the '70's where he called American troops war criminals and baby killers. The truth about Kerry was he was a gutless coward. The policy at the time he was in Viet Nam was that if you were awarded 3 Purple Hearts you got sent home. Kerry served a total of 120 days in country on a gunboat. He was awarded 3 Purple Hearts but did not spend 1 day in a field hospital. How is that possible? He was sent home, joined a group of veterans against the war, led protests and threw his medals over the fence at the Whitehouse. That made him enough of a hero to the commies in the Peoples Republic of Massachusetts to get him elected to the senate. Now the SOB is the Secretary of State. Great job America!

That's a lot better than having an AWOL as CINC, like when Bush43 was President.

 

[Camp]

If people are upset about the way the navy awards decorations the place to complain is to the navy. The navy, however, when this ruckus started said it reviewed the records and all was shippy-shape. Kerry, and others, veterans or not, had a right to protest the war. Is Vietnam today considered a war America needed to fight and needed to win? Did My Lai happen?

In the greatest Country in the world the Military still works for the people. We have the right and some would say the duty to review awards that the Navy sanctioned weather or not the Navy wants to address the claims. It's an insult to real Veterans who were wounded in combat to read about Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts when the statutes clearly indicate that intentional or unintentional self inflicted wounds do not qualify. One of Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts concerned an incident where he threw a grenade into a cache of V.C. rice and a grain of rice or a piece of shrapnel bit him in the ass. The Military's policy was three Hearts and you got a ticket home and it's clear that the chicken shit Navy Lt. was determined to get his ass out of combat and the best way was to get three Hearts. Kerry's tour lasted three months.

The insult is that by alleging Kerry was able to obtain these awards without earning them, is the insult you hoist on every man who was awarded the same honor. You and your kind don't care about how your bullcrap effects the status of other PH awarded vet's. You question the honor of vet's as you try to rewrite the criteria for being awarded a PH with the notion that you have the right to do so. You place the stigma on those vet's that perhaps they didn't earn their PH. You ignore the fact that Kerry was also awarded the Silver Star, and so you challange every man that has earned that honor. What you are saying is that just because a vet was awarded a Medal does not mean he actually earned it. You insult all vet's that have earned awards from all wars. So, you tell us, where does that put you on the scale of honor and decency?

 

[9thIDdoc]

If people are upset about the way the navy awards decorations the place to complain is to the navy. The navy, however, when this ruckus started said it reviewed the records and all was shippy-shape. Kerry, and others, veterans or not, had a right to protest the war. Is Vietnam today considered a war America needed to fight and needed to win? Did My Lai happen?

In the greatest Country in the world the Military still works for the people. We have the right and some would say the duty to review awards that the Navy sanctioned weather or not the Navy wants to address the claims. It's an insult to real Veterans who were wounded in combat to read about Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts when the statutes clearly indicate that intentional or unintentional self inflicted wounds do not qualify. One of Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts concerned an incident where he threw a grenade into a cache of V.C. rice and a grain of rice or a piece of shrapnel bit him in the ass. The Military's policy was three Hearts and you got a ticket home and it's clear that the chicken shit Navy Lt. was determined to get his ass out of combat and the best way was to get three Hearts. Kerry's tour lasted three months.

The insult is that by alleging Kerry was able to obtain these awards without earning them, is the insult you hoist on every man who was awarded the same honor. You and your kind don't care about how your bullcrap effects the status of other PH awarded vet's. You question the honor of vet's as you try to rewrite the criteria for being awarded a PH with the notion that you have the right to do so. You place the stigma on those vet's that perhaps they didn't earn their PH. You ignore the fact that Kerry was also awarded the Silver Star, and so you challange every man that has earned that honor. What you are saying is that just because a vet was awarded a Medal does not mean he actually earned it. You insult all vet's that have earned awards from all wars. So, you tell us, where does that put you on the scale of honor and decency?

I disagree. If you are a VIP, or are willing to bargain, or part of the system medals are not that hard to get. Which explains why there are so many highly decorated company clerks. That truth doesn't besmirch those that do not game the system; only those who do and those that aid them for whatever reason. Kerry's biggest critics are those who served with him and actually earned whatever honors they received. You have a right to question their honor but not Kerry's? Does not compute.

 

[AquaAthena]

Was watching a program where they were showing Kerry testifying before a Senate committee in the '70's where he called American troops war criminals and baby killers. The truth about Kerry was he was a gutless coward. The policy at the time he was in Viet Nam was that if you were awarded 3 Purple Hearts you got sent home. Kerry served a total of 120 days in country on a gunboat. He was awarded 3 Purple Hearts but did not spend 1 day in a field hospital. How is that possible? He was sent home, joined a group of veterans against the war, led protests and threw his medals over the fence at the Whitehouse. That made him enough of a hero to the commies in the Peoples Republic of Massachusetts to get him elected to the senate. Now the SOB is the Secretary of State. Great job America!

You mean THIS guy, John Kerry Heinz?!??!?!?

 

[regent]

If people are upset about the way the navy awards decorations the place to complain is to the navy. The navy, however, when this ruckus started said it reviewed the records and all was shippy-shape. Kerry, and others, veterans or not, had a right to protest the war. Is Vietnam today considered a war America needed to fight and needed to win? Did My Lai happen?

In the greatest Country in the world the Military still works for the people. We have the right and some would say the duty to review awards that the Navy sanctioned weather or not the Navy wants to address the claims. It's an insult to real Veterans who were wounded in combat to read about Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts when the statutes clearly indicate that intentional or unintentional self inflicted wounds do not qualify. One of Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts concerned an incident where he threw a grenade into a cache of V.C. rice and a grain of rice or a piece of shrapnel bit him in the ass. The Military's policy was three Hearts and you got a ticket home and it's clear that the chicken shit Navy Lt. was determined to get his ass out of combat and the best way was to get three Hearts. Kerry's tour lasted three months.

I'm not sure there was ever a time element involved in the requirement for a Purple Heart. Some may have earned the award on the first day of their tour. Self inflicted wounds can qualify, might want to check it out.
If we have the right to review military awards, and you have now reviewed the claim, and...?
One mistake the military might have made is giving a bonus to people awarded medals. In WWII they gave the purple heart some points for going home and no longer did GI's ignore wounds but now got medical attention for minor wounds.

 

[daveman]

Was watching a program where they were showing Kerry testifying before a Senate committee in the '70's where he called American troops war criminals and baby killers. The truth about Kerry was he was a gutless coward. The policy at the time he was in Viet Nam was that if you were awarded 3 Purple Hearts you got sent home. Kerry served a total of 120 days in country on a gunboat. He was awarded 3 Purple Hearts but did not spend 1 day in a field hospital. How is that possible? He was sent home, joined a group of veterans against the war, led protests and threw his medals over the fence at the Whitehouse. That made him enough of a hero to the commies in the Peoples Republic of Massachusetts to get him elected to the senate. Now the SOB is the Secretary of State. Great job America!

That's a lot better than having an AWOL as CINC, like when Bush43 was President.

Dan Rather's memos were fakes. You do know this, right?

Let me guess -- you've been shown the proof countless times, but still believe they're real.

 

[Bloodrock44]

Was watching a program where they were showing Kerry testifying before a Senate committee in the '70's where he called American troops war criminals and baby killers. The truth about Kerry was he was a gutless coward. The policy at the time he was in Viet Nam was that if you were awarded 3 Purple Hearts you got sent home. Kerry served a total of 120 days in country on a gunboat. He was awarded 3 Purple Hearts but did not spend 1 day in a field hospital. How is that possible? He was sent home, joined a group of veterans against the war, led protests and threw his medals over the fence at the Whitehouse. That made him enough of a hero to the commies in the Peoples Republic of Massachusetts to get him elected to the senate. Now the SOB is the Secretary of State. Great job America!

You mean THIS guy, John Kerry Heinz?!??!?!?

Thanks for reminding us that he teamed up with Hanoi Jane...who should have gone to prison.

 

[Camp]

In the greatest Country in the world the Military still works for the people. We have the right and some would say the duty to review awards that the Navy sanctioned weather or not the Navy wants to address the claims. It's an insult to real Veterans who were wounded in combat to read about Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts when the statutes clearly indicate that intentional or unintentional self inflicted wounds do not qualify. One of Kerry's self recommended Purple Hearts concerned an incident where he threw a grenade into a cache of V.C. rice and a grain of rice or a piece of shrapnel bit him in the ass. The Military's policy was three Hearts and you got a ticket home and it's clear that the chicken shit Navy Lt. was determined to get his ass out of combat and the best way was to get three Hearts. Kerry's tour lasted three months.

The insult is that by alleging Kerry was able to obtain these awards without earning them, is the insult you hoist on every man who was awarded the same honor. You and your kind don't care about how your bullcrap effects the status of other PH awarded vet's. You question the honor of vet's as you try to rewrite the criteria for being awarded a PH with the notion that you have the right to do so. You place the stigma on those vet's that perhaps they didn't earn their PH. You ignore the fact that Kerry was also awarded the Silver Star, and so you challange every man that has earned that honor. What you are saying is that just because a vet was awarded a Medal does not mean he actually earned it. You insult all vet's that have earned awards from all wars. So, you tell us, where does that put you on the scale of honor and decency?

I disagree. If you are a VIP, or are willing to bargain, or part of the system medals are not that hard to get. Which explains why there are so many highly decorated company clerks. That truth doesn't besmirch those that do not game the system; only those who do and those that aid them for whatever reason. Kerry's biggest critics are those who served with him and actually earned whatever honors they received. You have a right to question their honor but not Kerry's? Does not compute.

I disagree with you on the "those who served with him". While it is true that the Swift Boat community challanged his awards, his actual crew members and the Green Beret that was rescued by Kerry and the crew have stood behind him. So it depends on what you consider "those that served with him". Not sure if your comment "You have the right to question their honor but not Kerry's?" is in reference to something I said, but if it does it is a misinterpretation. I do not question anyones awards or honor in how they earned them. I question the honor and decency of people who have never served who judge specific individuals that have served with heresy and rumor and data that can not be confirmed one way or the other. Until the Swift Boat campaign to discredit Kerry, I can not recall this kind of challange having ever occured. It opened up a can of worms that did not need to be opened, all for the use of his political opponents in a political campaign. It's not as though there wasn't plenty of stuff to attack him on. IMO the Swift Boat guys were used for politics without concern for how it would effect them and Vietnam Vet's in the long run. It is still being used. In my mind these challages should be off limits. Ofcourse that will not stop people from doing it because it is only my opinion. I just hope this is the last man who is challanged in such a way and men and women in the future do not have to defend themselves and how they earned awards if they decide to enter politics.