Is Violence Against Women EVER Justified?

[KissMy]

you can't live without a pancreas

It was that or the spleen. I believe it was the pancreas though. He has to take pills now after that.

it was the spleen- you can live without that- pancreas is mandatory

WebMD: Q: Can you live without a pancreas? - A: Yes. The pancreas has two main functions: secretion of insulin, which controls blood sugar levels, and secretion of digestive enzymes and hormones. Although not a perfect solution, these functions can be replaced through insulin injections and oral pancreatic enzymes with meals.

 

[Unkotare]

Unkotare, STOP

Moderator notice. ~ alan1

Ok, sure. Stop what? I have not advocated violence against women. I have not insulted people's family. Tell me what to stop and I'll stop it.

Sorry,
I meant Sealybobo, edited my other post.
Sorry.

No prob. I'm sure there is something I should stop anyway.

 

[Unkotare]

My married friends are all jealous. They say I'm living their dream. !!!!

They are trying to spare your feelings.

 

[sealybobo]

My married friends are all jealous. They say I'm living their dream. !!!!

They are trying to spare your feelings.

If that's it, they go into great detail to spare my feelings. And I try to make them feel better about their situations. I tell them I sometimes wish I had a kid and they swear I'm not missing anything. Especially the way I take care of my nephews. They are better than kids. I don't have to pay for the braces or college. Not my words, theirs.

And I say it sucks being single on xmas or valentines day. They say those are just two days a year that suck for me. They say 358 days a year suck for them.

Of course they're kidding! Right?

 

[koshergrl]

Well let's hope for the sake of their kids they are, anyway.

 

[BDBoop]

My married friends are all jealous. They say I'm living their dream. !!!!

They are trying to spare your feelings.

If that's it, they go into great detail to spare my feelings. And I try to make them feel better about their situations. I tell them I sometimes wish I had a kid and they swear I'm not missing anything. Especially the way I take care of my nephews. They are better than kids. I don't have to pay for the braces or college. Not my words, theirs.

And I say it sucks being single on xmas or valentines day. They say those are just two days a year that suck for me. They say 358 days a year suck for them.

Of course they're kidding! Right?

I hear ya! It's good you found a like-minded individual on the child-free front.

 

[sealybobo]

Well let's hope for the sake of their kids they are, anyway.

They love their kids and they love their wives. They probably would just like to go out and taste a little strange every now and again but can't. Or be able to sleep in and watch westerns on Saturdays like I do when they are at the Home Depot or Soccer practice.

 

[koshergrl]

I love soccer and baseball practice. It beats westerns any day..

but then I don't need much sleep. I can watch tv at night.

 

[sealybobo]

They are trying to spare your feelings.

If that's it, they go into great detail to spare my feelings. And I try to make them feel better about their situations. I tell them I sometimes wish I had a kid and they swear I'm not missing anything. Especially the way I take care of my nephews. They are better than kids. I don't have to pay for the braces or college. Not my words, theirs.

And I say it sucks being single on xmas or valentines day. They say those are just two days a year that suck for me. They say 358 days a year suck for them.

Of course they're kidding! Right?

I hear ya! It's good you found a like-minded individual on the child-free front.

I'm 41. I'm looking to retire, not pay for college in 20 years. My parents still hold out hope. And if I met a woman with money and she wanted to have kids and me be the stay at home dad, sure. But that's probably not going to happen. It could have with this doctor but she's 12 years older and I'm not even attracted to her now so imagine her in 10 years in her 60's. But she owns a $3 million dollar home in Birmingham Michigan and another one in Florida.

And funny thing is, she didn't need me. One day she just showed up with a kid and said she had a baby. We never saw her pregnant, she has no boyfriend, but then we never saw her at all in those 9 months so we don't know for sure either way, but we think she adopted him. No one had the balls to ask. But it's probably not her biological kid. Her brother acts as her husband. Not really but he takes care of her estates and he has never been married. Don't undestand why but he could be secretly gay. He was able to retire early from teaching and just take care of her estates. Man I wish I could love for money but I can't. No matter how rich, I can not be a gold digger. I gotta be attracted to ya. I would be a terrible hooker.

 

[Unkotare]

My married friends are all jealous. They say I'm living their dream. !!!!

They are trying to spare your feelings.

If that's it, they go into great detail to spare my feelings. :

Friends are good like that.

 

[sealybobo]

I love soccer and baseball practice. It beats westerns any day..

but then I don't need much sleep. I can watch tv at night.

I like going to my nephews games too. But not on Saturday or Sunday morning. Let me know when they have a 2pm game. This is one reason I don't go to church more often. Too early on Sunday.

And I will admit, I love going shopping with a woman I'm in love with on the weekend or going out on Friday nights for dinner and drinks. Or to a wedding. Or a party. Or a lake party.

Better when you have someone to go with than go alone.

But when I am single, I have a lot of single friends. Some are even girls. We hang out and are good friends but I'll be honest, we all want out of the gang.

 

[IndependntLogic]

So I was having a discussion with the wife about if and when it is ever ok for a man to hit a women. Now the stereotypical answer is “never”. But is that really realistic? Let me toss out some scenarios where a man hit a women. Each of these I have personally witnessed (no I wasn’t the one doing the hitting) and in each case I felt the girl got exactly what she deserved.

Example 1: A buddy of mine had a girlfriend who made no secret that in her opinion she could hit him as much as she wanted because the moment he dared to hit back he would go to jail instead of her and no court would ever convict a woman of being abusive toward a man. I mean she actually bragged about it. She beat on that guy like a drum constantly until one day he finally had enough and “returned the treatment”. (Note: He would have simply left her but they had a child together and he couldn’t leave the child with an abusive woman until he could prove in court she was abusive – eventually that did happen.)

Example 2: To make a long story short, a beautiful woman stole our table at a crowded bar. My brother asked her politely to leave several times and offered to buy her a drink if she would depart. She refused every time told him “beautiful women only take orders when they feel like it so there’s not much you can do about it is there?” and then she blew smoke in his face. He asked her to leave again and warned her that if she blew smoke in his face again he would punch her dead in the face. She said “oh really? I dare you”, leaned directly into his face and exhaled a cloud of smoke around my brothers head….he broke her nose.

Example 3: A woman stood behind her boyfriend screaming at this other guy calling him every name in the book, making reference to his questionable parentage…I mean you name it and she said it. Her boyfriend stood between them and although he wasn’t being aggressive toward the other guy neither was he telling his girlfriend to shut the hell up either. Finally her boyfriend said “you will have to go through me first to shut her up”. The guy said “I accept your terms” and after he beat the shit out of her boyfriend he walked up to the women and punched her dead in the mouth and told her “you got your boyfriends ass kicked you should share his pain.”

Now as I said…..these were thing I witnessed where I said to myself “normally I would never endorse violence of any kind let alone against women…..but in this case….the bitch was begging for it.”

I welcome thoughts.

A woman hit me from behind once. She was drunk and threw a strong punch, hitting me right on the ear. Before I could even think, I swung an elbow back hitting ribs and then rotated into a palm strike to the solar plexus, sending her across the bar. All that because she was the little queen of the pool table and I beat her a game. I mean seriously???
Her boyfriend approached and I told him I really hadn't meant to hit her but if he came closer it wasn't going to go well. By the time I was done talking, the bouncer and bartender were there. Like ten people saw it so they just asked ME to leave the bar. I wasn't a regular and they weren't sure how others might react. Seemed wise to me.
I seem to recall a girl in Tijuana (also drunk) trying to hit me once. Again, a bouncer was close by and all I did was deflect a couple swings. In that case, he kicked her out.
It's tricky. I tend to think in terms of only defensive moves are allowed but then again, I think about some of the women in the dojo where I used to train. Very dangerous individuals. One of them had a pretty hardocre ax to grind with men for whatever reason. Used to cheat in sparring pretty often. Kicked a couple guys in the balls. One guy finally decked her and she quit.
I really don't know what to think! I'd say if it's some drunk chick who is easily handled, just handle her. Put her in a wristlock or something and hand her off to a bouncer. I just asked my wife and she said if a gal attacks a guy, she has it coming. He should hit or slap her once and see if she stops. If she does, he does. If she doesn't, he does what he needs to do.

 

[sealybobo]

They are trying to spare your feelings.

If that's it, they go into great detail to spare my feelings. :

Friends are good like that.

I live on a lake. You should see how these guys act when they get away from the wife and kids for a day. But they rarely come out. Do you think its because they

a. Don't want to or

b. Can't?

I have buddies with wives and kids and we play poker at my house 1 or 2 days a week. Almost always on Friday's and usually a Tuesday or Wednesday game. These guys always have the best time when they come. But they rarely come. For every 1 time they come, we have 10 or 20 games. Do you think its that they

a. Don't want to come or

b. Can't?

 

[koshergrl]

Drunken brawls.
It's one thing to have to fend off a drunken stranger in a bar who has attacked you...and I don't think it's abuse to throw a woman you're sparring with on the mat.

 

[sealybobo]

Example 1: A buddy of mine had a girlfriend who made no secret that in her opinion she could hit him as much as she wanted because the moment he dared to hit back he would go to jail instead of her and no court would ever convict a woman of being abusive toward a man. I mean she actually bragged about it. She beat on that guy like a drum constantly until one day he finally had enough and “returned the treatment”. (Note: He would have simply left her but they had a child together and he couldn’t leave the child with an abusive woman until he could prove in court she was abusive – eventually that did happen.)

Example 2: To make a long story short, a beautiful woman stole our table at a crowded bar. My brother asked her politely to leave several times and offered to buy her a drink if she would depart. She refused every time told him “beautiful women only take orders when they feel like it so there’s not much you can do about it is there?” and then she blew smoke in his face. He asked her to leave again and warned her that if she blew smoke in his face again he would punch her dead in the face. She said “oh really? I dare you”, leaned directly into his face and exhaled a cloud of smoke around my brothers head….he broke her nose.

Example 3: A woman stood behind her boyfriend screaming at this other guy calling him every name in the book, making reference to his questionable parentage…I mean you name it and she said it. Her boyfriend stood between them and although he wasn’t being aggressive toward the other guy neither was he telling his girlfriend to shut the hell up either. Finally her boyfriend said “you will have to go through me first to shut her up”. The guy said “I accept your terms” and after he beat the shit out of her boyfriend he walked up to the women and punched her dead in the mouth and told her “you got your boyfriends ass kicked you should share his pain.”

I welcome thoughts.

.

This is for bluephantom's 3 examples.

1. Example one should have just been a better wrestler. You don't need to punch a woman, just wrestle her into total submission. If you let her up and she does it again, take her down again and maybe be a little rougher. And continue and repeat the process until done, but you never have to swing and punch one woman. What kind of loser does that?

2. That's funny but fucked up. I knew some Muslim football players at MSU who if the girl was a bitch and turned around and walked away, they lit her hair on fire. And they would knock a white woman out too no problem. I don't approve. Broke her nose? Wow! I'm sure she deserved it but damn!

3. You must be a redneck. Only a white trash hick would have these stories.

 

[Unkotare]

Her brother acts as her husband. Not really but he takes care of her estates and he has never been married. Don't undestand why but he could be secretly gay. .

Can't blame you for suspecting so. After all, he is probably over 40, still unattached...


...

 

[Unkotare]

If that's it, they go into great detail to spare my feelings. :

Friends are good like that.

I live on a lake. You should see how these guys act when they get away from the wife and kids for a day. But they rarely come out. Do you think its because they

a. Don't want to or

b. Can't?

I have buddies with wives and kids and we play poker at my house 1 or 2 days a week. Almost always on Friday's and usually a Tuesday or Wednesday game. These guys always have the best time when they come. But they rarely come. For every 1 time they come, we have 10 or 20 games. Do you think its that they

a. Don't want to come or

b. Can't?

You sad little thing...

 

[sealybobo]

Her brother acts as her husband. Not really but he takes care of her estates and he has never been married. Don't undestand why but he could be secretly gay. .

Can't blame you for suspecting so. After all, he is probably over 40, still unattached...


...

Except we never see him with women and I have one over right now. You will wake her up. I don't have a lot of chloraform left.

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

The morality's way too gray for me to take a hard stand on this one. Like a poster or two before me, I've been attacked/swung on by drunk girls in bars and nightclubs several times (luckily usually while working and rarely while drinking). Luckily, those situations have never necessitated that I actually -strike- the offending female. Worst occasion that comes to mind was a large hawaiian/pacific islander mixed breed woman sucker punched me because I had asked her to either put out the joint she was smoking, or take it outside. At about 6'2", this girl had 3'ish inches on me and probably 20-30 lbs, on top of which it was a pretty stiff cross that caught me right on the tip of my chin, and I'm not afraid to say that she straight rung my bell. If I hadn't been dazed, I might have swung back and gone up and up with her like she was a man. In stead, I kept my footing simply by half-falling and half-charging her, then half-tackling and half-fireman carrying her out the front entrance. By the time we get to the sidewalk, I'm halfway back to capacity and thinking clearly again and pissed off by the realization that this b*tch just f*ckin hit me, so I accelerated toward the curb and shot-putted that chunky broad into the street. Now, she hadn't followed up the initial punch with anything, and in retrospect, she really didn't struggle or fight to keep me from carrying her out, and if I'm being totally honest pitching her into slow moving traffic was not, in the strictest sense of the term, self defense. More along the lines of impulsive retribution.

I did however feel it was justified and I would do it again if it happened again. I'm also not above blasting another man in the mouth for intentionally disrespecting me, even in a purely verbal fashion. The pervading attitude where I grew up was that respect must be given to be deserved, that you don't play with people you don't know, and that you don't run your mouth if you're not willing to reap the consequences of what you say. The flip side of that coin is that, if I get my jaw jacked for disrespecting someone, though I'll do what I can to defend myself, I'll accept that his/her reaction is justified.

Anyway, lemme tie this back in before I go too far off into tangent land. . . as someone who's practiced this method, I feel that there is sometimes potential moral justification for a -controlled- violent response in situations outside of what could be called self defense. (Mind you, I don't believe that a society or law should follow this standard. I'm speaking purely to situations between individuals). My personal code doesn't allow -me- to instate this standard when the other party is female. . . I can't bring myself to striking a woman when no physical confrontation exists otherwise. I am, however, loose enough regarding other peoples' standards in relation to my own that I wouldn't -necessarily- condemn a man for implementing a similar standard that -did- include women.

In this regard, I'm also pretty lucky. Two of my female friends and my female cousin, all of whom are off-and-on central cast characters among my drinking buddies, can all scrap like men (the cousin I actually grew up fist fighting with. She was the 2nd person I ever punched in the face at like, age 6 lol). I say that I'm lucky because I've had more than a few occasions over the years when one of them was there to check retarded drunk girls before situations spilled over into that, "Can I hit her yet?" gray area. Girls should honestly chin check each other more often for running off at the mouth.

If everybody. . . -EVERYBODY- was in constant danger of being put in check physically for being a dick, I honestly believe the world would be far, far more tolerable.

 

[BluePhantom]

Oh don't be so melodramatic. Look at the title of this thread. Look at the men who are posting in it. Then consider the conversations they've had in the past.

And if I'm asked a specific question I'm going to give an answer. BF is the asshole who claims sexual abuse of underaged girls, and now physical abuse of women, can be justified.

I assume you mean me. Try reading what I said again. I never said any of those examples were "justified" In fact I said several times that they weren't justified, but that both sides were in the wrong. Just because the women in those examples were begging for it (and God knows they were), I said multiple times that the right thing to do was to walk away. So the guys were wrong and the girls sure as hell were wrong. And if you would be so kind as to point out where I said that the sexual abuse of children is justified I would appreciate it because I would really like to see that one.

It is my field. I've worked in this field for years and years. I've worked with the professionals who counsel and treat the victims and the batterers, I've BEEN ONE MYSELF.

And as I said before....don't you think that just might make you lack a little objectivity?

These guys get into these discussions and start defending reprehensible behavior...and then women flock to their defense and tell me I'M the one who is out of line. LOOK AT THE SUBJECT MATTER OF THE THREAD. These guys are discussing under what circumstances it's okay to knock a woman around.

Yeah and what we all pretty much decided until you came in here and blew the whole thing to shit with your fat mouth, libelous statements, and man-hating holier than thou attitude is that it's acceptable to defend yourself against a woman who is attacking you...or is that too much too? We're not allowed to defend ourselves either right?

Think about it. I know it's not your field, but before you attack me, give it some consideration, and for God's sakes, educate yourself. And if you aren't knowledgeable about it, at least don't say anything at all.

Oh you mean like telling someone that person A is abusive when you have no idea that you are talking to that guy's fucking wife? And you are telling other people to educate themselves and be knowledgeable about their statements? Fucking hypocrite.