Is Black Culture the Primary Cause of the ills that plague the Black Community?

[FA_Q2]

Is Black Culture the Primary Cause of the ills that plague the Black Community?

The left often wants to blame racism as the primary cause of the ill's experienced by the black community. This issue has worked its way deep into policy decisions to help "level the playing field." So I ask the question, is it really racism that plagues the black community or black culture?

Some yes...some no.

I encourage all who see no racism to look into how the criminal justice system treats blacks insofar as sentencing and verdicts.

On the other side of the coin, when your role models are absentee fathers, women who sing about the virtues of spouse abuse, and the music is consistently profanity laced, that isnt racism, that is culture self fulfillment.

Indeed, repetitive criminals get longer sentences.

True but blacks and whites with similar backgrounds criminally get drastically different sentences. When blacks are represented on juries, the sentencing levels out. I can find some graphics for you to back that up. But that's not the question at hand.

Your poll question was about the culture's effect on the race as a whole. The effect is unmistakable. I think anyone looking at the thug culture or rap music that glorifies violence and the rough language can't honestly say that the culture has nothing to do with the situation blacks find themselves in.

Holy, shit.
Did CC actually say something that I agree with. Mayhap I should check my arguments again

 

[FA_Q2]

Nope. Try again.

Oh, then you said that black kids need to be bussed to school in white areas because black people are net takers of the tax system and contribute nothing to their own schools (Despite the fact that intercity schools have more funding per pupil than any white district I am aware of)?

Nope. One more try? Please remember that I began your lesson with a question about how public schools are funded. I know you can do it!

You allowed a link to do your arguing for you. What is your claim?

Clearly......my claim is that institutionalized and legal segregation.....based on economic factors.....such as low levels of property tax revenue....which has impacted minorities to a greater degree than it has impacted white people....when coupled with the school to prison pipeline....is DIRECTLY responsible for the "thug" culture that you are so interested in discussing.

Get it, professor?

I love the low property tax revenue portion. If only the government would take more money from home owners, Death Row Records would never have gained so much traction back in the early '90's.

Essentially, in order for this argument to make sense, you'd have to find consistency in other cultures that exist(ed) largely in poverty in our country.

Virtually every ethnic migration that happened prior to the turn of the 20'th century was met with open, mainstream hostility, and immigrant communities were largely segregated and impoverished during the first generation of their arrival. So, if the cause is simply that the government didn't redistribute enough wealth, why didn't -all- immigrant communities evolve with the same per capita violent crime rate as what currently exists in impoverished black communities?

IF you ask me, the difference is not only not primarily economic, but almost -purely- cultural. Modern mainstream culture doesn't condone random violence from Irish people, despite the "Irish need not apply" epidemic that once existed. It doesn't condone random violence from Chinese immigrants (or wouldn't, if we even witnessed much of it). It doesn't condone rampant criminality from the descendants of Italian immigrants. Granted, with all three of these ethnicities, there are counter-culture forces that glorify gang violence and criminality, but they aren't endorsed by the mainstream. At no point did any law abiding, sane people harbor ideals that John Gotti was morally justified in his criminal activities. Only counter-culture voices (mostly rappers lol) glorified John Gotti. In the other two examples, Irish and Chinese culture, the counter-culture glorification of criminality largely revolves around images and terminology made popular by, you guessed it, rap music, and thus can't be held completely separate from African American counter-culture.

Now, stay with me, I'm not saying one counter-culture is to blame over the others. The problem is when our mainstream culture morally condones the criminality pushed by those counter-culture voices. Only with African Americans do you really see this happening. Guilty white liberals and black apologists wag fingers in the faces of the judgemental and tell us to temper our outrage regarding black criminals, in particular, because of the economic factors and historical and perceived white oppression that factor into the criminal's current circumstance, which is apparently to blame for their actions. You can see it in mainstream news. White people at a tea party rally accused of spitting at a black politician? Universally inexcusable, regardless of how they feel about taxation or their perception of government oppression. Black people committing acts of random violence against parties not responsible in response to their perception of systemic racism being the cause of individual police officers abusing their power? Not only is there news article after news article condoning it, but they go a step further and inform you that you're racially insensitive for thinking there's something wrong with rioting when African Americans are largely the ones doing the looting, because this is the only way they feel like they'll be heard. The Free Mumia movement is actually politically acceptable, even though the guy made his political statement by murdering a random white police officer who wasn't personally responsible for anything the guy was rallying against. I've yet to hear of a single school teacher or college professor involved with a Free Gotti campaign.

ONLY with African Americans does our mainstream News Media condone random criminality. ONLY with African Americans do our educators push for the philosophical acceptance of random acts of violence. Only with black culture does the mainstream accept and support the glorification of violence and criminality pushed by the counter-culture. While other counter-culture gang images are deemed "cool", but remain morally reprehensible, the same moral tempering is virtually non-existent where the image of black criminality is concerned, and in fact much of the mainstream culture goes so far as to name it morally virtuous (the noble rioter, doing what he must to affect positive change).

Well said.

 

[SUPERMAN1929]

The fact is that most black people don't want an education and to mix with society. They want to burn white people's shit down (end up burning half their own shit) and then get paid for it as payback for slavery.

 

[FA_Q2]

i wonder about the culture which makes police officers think it's okay to assign themselves judge, jury and executioner of criminals.

no matter the culture or color of the criminal, unless there is an imminent threat, deadly force is uncalled for...

It's called society looking the other way.

i think every case is a different story, and often times things are difficult to prove which can give a false impression of someone "getting away with" something unlawful as if a blind eye was turned (on either end of justice) but i think our society has tried to be earnest in living by the rule of law.

police officers are human and their job is not easy, but sometimes they can turn out to be thugs themselves.

still doesn't mean we justify burning down police stations or violently looting neighborhoods, etc...

we can't go back in time and make up for past injustices, we can only move forward and build communities which foster better understanding and mutual respect for the rule of law...

Good point, except cops get away with things no one else does.

Cops also have an express duty charged to no one else. Particularly dangerous duties expected of no one else. So it would only be natural that they often run into situations where they get away with things no one else does.

No, it is exactly the opposite.
Cops are given extraordinary powers over our rights and lives. With that power comes a responsibility to discharge it properly. Cops should get away with FAR less than normal people. The extra power they are given should come with the requirement to follow the law they are so empowered to enforce.

 

[LoneLaugher]

I spend quite a bit of time in the burbs. Imagine my surprise to find oodles of black middle class people acting just like normal people.

And that is the entire point.

Those middle class black Americans act like other middle class Americans. Those that are acting like thugs are not middle class.

It is that culture that brings them down – not their race or racists.

And........why has that culture developed?

Utterly irrelevant to be honest. There are a lot of reasons but I am not really going to get into it because you do not solve problems that way. You solve them by identifying the problem and the formulating solutions around it. Get your head out of the fact that we used to have slavery in this nation over a hundred years ago and get it into dealing with the effects that it has left.

If you want to talk about current causes, that is a different story but I have a strong feeling that you want to focus on the past. If you were interested in current drivers you would have simply stated them rather than ask a loaded question.

I assure you...I was not referring to slavery. I find it odd that you would think I was.

We won't solve he problems until their causes are identified.

You seem to have some thoughts. Why are you unwilling to share them?

I am willing to share them. I am just not going to get dragged into the asinine racism and calling others racists that tend to permeate threads on race based subjects or the constant focus on slavery when that is no longer a base cause. It set the stage but has nothing to do with current solutions.

If you are looking at the here and now, what do you think contributes?

I could certainly cite current law enforcement sentencing and the drug war as one such cause that I think you might agree with. Another would be rampant poverty. The single greatest problem IMHO lies in the single motherhood rate or, more precisely, the complete lack of family values that it represents. We can go on but it will boil down to the chicken or the egg here - are those causes or are they EFFECTS of the underlying sub culture that so many black Americans embrace. I would say they are effects of that sub culture - a sub culture that does not value education but does value the quick buck. A culture that values sex but does not value family. A culture that does not value temperance but values violence. I see it as quite pervasive within black communities. It is the core problem and I believe the reality that those who reject those cultural values can and do succeed but those that do not simply do not succeed.

Embrace? That's an odd choice of words.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Solutions American Leaders Speak Out on Criminal Justice Brennan Center for Justice

 

[FA_Q2]

And that is the entire point.

Those middle class black Americans act like other middle class Americans. Those that are acting like thugs are not middle class.

It is that culture that brings them down – not their race or racists.

And........why has that culture developed?

Utterly irrelevant to be honest. There are a lot of reasons but I am not really going to get into it because you do not solve problems that way. You solve them by identifying the problem and the formulating solutions around it. Get your head out of the fact that we used to have slavery in this nation over a hundred years ago and get it into dealing with the effects that it has left.

If you want to talk about current causes, that is a different story but I have a strong feeling that you want to focus on the past. If you were interested in current drivers you would have simply stated them rather than ask a loaded question.

I assure you...I was not referring to slavery. I find it odd that you would think I was.

We won't solve he problems until their causes are identified.

You seem to have some thoughts. Why are you unwilling to share them?

I am willing to share them. I am just not going to get dragged into the asinine racism and calling others racists that tend to permeate threads on race based subjects or the constant focus on slavery when that is no longer a base cause. It set the stage but has nothing to do with current solutions.

If you are looking at the here and now, what do you think contributes?

I could certainly cite current law enforcement sentencing and the drug war as one such cause that I think you might agree with. Another would be rampant poverty. The single greatest problem IMHO lies in the single motherhood rate or, more precisely, the complete lack of family values that it represents. We can go on but it will boil down to the chicken or the egg here - are those causes or are they EFFECTS of the underlying sub culture that so many black Americans embrace. I would say they are effects of that sub culture - a sub culture that does not value education but does value the quick buck. A culture that values sex but does not value family. A culture that does not value temperance but values violence. I see it as quite pervasive within black communities. It is the core problem and I believe the reality that those who reject those cultural values can and do succeed but those that do not simply do not succeed.

Embrace? That's an odd choice of words.

Why? It is the correct term for what I was referring to.

 

[LoneLaugher]

And........why has that culture developed?

Utterly irrelevant to be honest. There are a lot of reasons but I am not really going to get into it because you do not solve problems that way. You solve them by identifying the problem and the formulating solutions around it. Get your head out of the fact that we used to have slavery in this nation over a hundred years ago and get it into dealing with the effects that it has left.

If you want to talk about current causes, that is a different story but I have a strong feeling that you want to focus on the past. If you were interested in current drivers you would have simply stated them rather than ask a loaded question.

I assure you...I was not referring to slavery. I find it odd that you would think I was.

We won't solve he problems until their causes are identified.

You seem to have some thoughts. Why are you unwilling to share them?

I am willing to share them. I am just not going to get dragged into the asinine racism and calling others racists that tend to permeate threads on race based subjects or the constant focus on slavery when that is no longer a base cause. It set the stage but has nothing to do with current solutions.

If you are looking at the here and now, what do you think contributes?

I could certainly cite current law enforcement sentencing and the drug war as one such cause that I think you might agree with. Another would be rampant poverty. The single greatest problem IMHO lies in the single motherhood rate or, more precisely, the complete lack of family values that it represents. We can go on but it will boil down to the chicken or the egg here - are those causes or are they EFFECTS of the underlying sub culture that so many black Americans embrace. I would say they are effects of that sub culture - a sub culture that does not value education but does value the quick buck. A culture that values sex but does not value family. A culture that does not value temperance but values violence. I see it as quite pervasive within black communities. It is the core problem and I believe the reality that those who reject those cultural values can and do succeed but those that do not simply do not succeed.

Embrace? That's an odd choice of words.

Why? It is the correct term for what I was referring to.

Nobody is embracing the negative aspects of any culture. Not being able to reject something does not equal embracing it.

Rich Kid Poor Kid For 30 Years Baltimore Study Tracked Who Gets Ahead NPR Ed NPR

 

[Redfish]

i wonder about the culture which makes police officers think it's okay to assign themselves judge, jury and executioner of criminals.

no matter the culture or color of the criminal, unless there is an imminent threat, deadly force is uncalled for...

It's called society looking the other way.

i think every case is a different story, and often times things are difficult to prove which can give a false impression of someone "getting away with" something unlawful as if a blind eye was turned (on either end of justice) but i think our society has tried to be earnest in living by the rule of law.

police officers are human and their job is not easy, but sometimes they can turn out to be thugs themselves.

still doesn't mean we justify burning down police stations or violently looting neighborhoods, etc...

we can't go back in time and make up for past injustices, we can only move forward and build communities which foster better understanding and mutual respect for the rule of law...

Good point, except cops get away with things no one else does.

Cops also have an express duty charged to no one else. Particularly dangerous duties expected of no one else. So it would only be natural that they often run into situations where they get away with things no one else does.

No, it is exactly the opposite.
Cops are given extraordinary powers over our rights and lives. With that power comes a responsibility to discharge it properly. Cops should get away with FAR less than normal people. The extra power they are given should come with the requirement to follow the law they are so empowered to enforce.

very true. if a cop tells you to stop doing something, stop doing it. if he tells you to put the gun down, put it down.

if the cop does something wrong he will be punished.

 

[Publius1787]

i wonder about the culture which makes police officers think it's okay to assign themselves judge, jury and executioner of criminals.

no matter the culture or color of the criminal, unless there is an imminent threat, deadly force is uncalled for...

It's called society looking the other way.

i think every case is a different story, and often times things are difficult to prove which can give a false impression of someone "getting away with" something unlawful as if a blind eye was turned (on either end of justice) but i think our society has tried to be earnest in living by the rule of law.

police officers are human and their job is not easy, but sometimes they can turn out to be thugs themselves.

still doesn't mean we justify burning down police stations or violently looting neighborhoods, etc...

we can't go back in time and make up for past injustices, we can only move forward and build communities which foster better understanding and mutual respect for the rule of law...

Good point, except cops get away with things no one else does.

Cops also have an express duty charged to no one else. Particularly dangerous duties expected of no one else. So it would only be natural that they often run into situations where they get away with things no one else does.

No, it is exactly the opposite.
Cops are given extraordinary powers over our rights and lives. With that power comes a responsibility to discharge it properly. Cops should get away with FAR less than normal people. The extra power they are given should come with the requirement to follow the law they are so empowered to enforce.

Cops should be held to a higher standard, but that does not negate the fact that police are often placed into situations that require split second decision making whereas mistakes could be made. The only question is whether those mistakes were reasonable considering the circumstances. Quite often they are which is why cops "get away" with so much. And rightfully so.

 

[FA_Q2]

Utterly irrelevant to be honest. There are a lot of reasons but I am not really going to get into it because you do not solve problems that way. You solve them by identifying the problem and the formulating solutions around it. Get your head out of the fact that we used to have slavery in this nation over a hundred years ago and get it into dealing with the effects that it has left.

If you want to talk about current causes, that is a different story but I have a strong feeling that you want to focus on the past. If you were interested in current drivers you would have simply stated them rather than ask a loaded question.

I assure you...I was not referring to slavery. I find it odd that you would think I was.

We won't solve he problems until their causes are identified.

You seem to have some thoughts. Why are you unwilling to share them?

I am willing to share them. I am just not going to get dragged into the asinine racism and calling others racists that tend to permeate threads on race based subjects or the constant focus on slavery when that is no longer a base cause. It set the stage but has nothing to do with current solutions.

If you are looking at the here and now, what do you think contributes?

I could certainly cite current law enforcement sentencing and the drug war as one such cause that I think you might agree with. Another would be rampant poverty. The single greatest problem IMHO lies in the single motherhood rate or, more precisely, the complete lack of family values that it represents. We can go on but it will boil down to the chicken or the egg here - are those causes or are they EFFECTS of the underlying sub culture that so many black Americans embrace. I would say they are effects of that sub culture - a sub culture that does not value education but does value the quick buck. A culture that values sex but does not value family. A culture that does not value temperance but values violence. I see it as quite pervasive within black communities. It is the core problem and I believe the reality that those who reject those cultural values can and do succeed but those that do not simply do not succeed.

Embrace? That's an odd choice of words.

Why? It is the correct term for what I was referring to.

Nobody is embracing the negative aspects of any culture. Not being able to reject something does not equal embracing it.

Rich Kid Poor Kid For 30 Years Baltimore Study Tracked Who Gets Ahead NPR Ed NPR

Yes they are.
There are a TON of people that constantly embrace negative cultural aspects. One that is easy is promiscuity over family. Or easy money over saving. Or getting that new 100 dollar pair of shoes that you cannot afford. Those are cultural norms that are embraced by many people and it drags them down.

 

[candycorn]

Is Black Culture the Primary Cause of the ills that plague the Black Community?

The left often wants to blame racism as the primary cause of the ill's experienced by the black community. This issue has worked its way deep into policy decisions to help "level the playing field." So I ask the question, is it really racism that plagues the black community or black culture?

Some yes...some no.

I encourage all who see no racism to look into how the criminal justice system treats blacks insofar as sentencing and verdicts.

On the other side of the coin, when your role models are absentee fathers, women who sing about the virtues of spouse abuse, and the music is consistently profanity laced, that isnt racism, that is culture self fulfillment.

Indeed, repetitive criminals get longer sentences.

True but blacks and whites with similar backgrounds criminally get drastically different sentences. When blacks are represented on juries, the sentencing levels out. I can find some graphics for you to back that up. But that's not the question at hand.

Your poll question was about the culture's effect on the race as a whole. The effect is unmistakable. I think anyone looking at the thug culture or rap music that glorifies violence and the rough language can't honestly say that the culture has nothing to do with the situation blacks find themselves in.

Holy, shit.
Did CC actually say something that I agree with. Mayhap I should check my arguments again

Well, it's just common sense. Glad to see you've come around to using it.

This is why the poor stay poor (quite often anyway) and why the affluent often remain affluent. Their expectations are different. It's not the only reason but internal drive is a powerful factor in determining how far you go in this world. When the thug life is glorified, the drive is directed to that end and whatdoyaknow....it stops there.

 

[Pheonixops]

A minority of "that population" excuses or supports the looters and hooligans perpetrating those acts.
You have yet to define "Black culture", though in a sense the so-called "Black culture" is American culture and the byproduct thereof. The majority of Black people I know and am related to are employed, want to get ahead on their own and support their families. My Black maternal grandfather put five daughters through college and had one son as a great Jazz musician and then a catholic priest. The offspring of those daughters all went through college except one, the Black husbands of those daughters were and are professionals and entrepreneurs. Others include lawyers, professors, neurosurgeons, teachers , police, bus drivers, postal workers etc.

That's the so-called "Black culture" I know. If you and others choose to focus on the minority that is fucking up and try to make them as representatives of "the Blacks", what does that say about you?

It's the left that says minorities can make it without government help. They must not be aware of all the successful blacks that are living the American dream and didn't buy into the hype that they are too stupid to get an ID, finish school or get a job without affirmation action.

There are a lot of poor people of all races and they do have things in common. Many were raised by uneducated, poor parents and never learned the skills to achieve anything. If parents and grandparents were high school drop outs, did time in jail, lived on welfare or were raised in single parent homes, they never had role models. It's a vicious cycle and making them comfortable in poverty isn't working. Unless we nudge them from the nest, the cycle will never be broken. And the race baiters can shut the hell up and stop teaching people that they are doomed because of all the racists.

Good points. I'm not sure what you specifically mean when you state that "It's the left that says minorities can make it without government help. ". In my opinion the Left is concerned about a "safety net" for all Americans, it's also "the Left" who are advocates for more education and job training programs.

I don't think that anyone is stating that people need affirmative action to get an ID. In my opinion, if you can't get an ID, voting is the least of your worries. I may be wrong but "the Left" also have programs (private) to help people get the proper ID to vote.

I think that your last sentence in bold is an oversimplification and a generalization.

Excellent points nonetheless.

 

[MaryL]

Why can't you type n I g g er on the USMB? Not that I need to, but put it together. Do the math. Figure it out.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

Why can't you type n I g g er on the USMB? Not that I need to, but put it together. Do the math. Figure it out.

Just post a picture instead. It will sail right through the filter.

 

[candycorn]

Why can't you type n I g g er on the USMB? Not that I need to, but put it together. Do the math. Figure it out.

Just post a picture instead. It will sail right through the filter.

The best the GOP has to offer folks...and they wonder why the world is passing them by.

 

[saintmichaeldefendthem]

Why can't you type n I g g er on the USMB? Not that I need to, but put it together. Do the math. Figure it out.

Just post a picture instead. It will sail right through the filter.

The best the GOP has to offer folks...and they wonder why the world is passing them by.

How sad you people have absolutely no sense of humor. I'd rather shoot myself in the head than to go through life angry like you Leftists.

 

[GHook93]

Is Black Culture the Primary Cause of the ills that plague the Black Community?

The left often wants to blame racism as the primary cause of the ill's experienced by the black community. This issue has worked its way deep into policy decisions to help "level the playing field." So I ask the question, is it really racism that plagues the black community or black culture?

Sorry, but it's starting to become apparent that it's the black gene that is the cause. Blacks are more prone to violence, corruption, lawless and lower IQ. There are many exceptions to this.

 

[Publius1787]

Why can't you type n I g g er on the USMB? Not that I need to, but put it together. Do the math. Figure it out.

Just post a picture instead. It will sail right through the filter.

The best the GOP has to offer folks...and they wonder why the world is passing them by.

I pictured you as above making such sweeping generalizations. Then again, I don't care who you are, ... black ... white ... Asian ... Hispanic .... that photo is funny!

 

[candycorn]

Why can't you type n I g g er on the USMB? Not that I need to, but put it together. Do the math. Figure it out.

Just post a picture instead. It will sail right through the filter.

The best the GOP has to offer folks...and they wonder why the world is passing them by.

I pictured you as above making such sweeping generalizations. Then again, I don't care who you are, ... black ... white ... Asian ... Hispanic .... that photo is funny!

It's classic GOP tastelessness on display. And they wonder why the world hates them.