Immigration & Politics

[Kosh]

..trying to slip in snarky comments doesn't make you look very honest.

I'm against the left leaving the border open to allow illegals to come in and be exploited for their cheap labor.

Trying to slip in snarky comments like the above does not make you look very honest.

Was George Bush a Republican? I believe he was. And what did he do to shut down the border? I forget.
Refresh my memory.

Is obama the president now? Why is the border still open?
Using misconduct from the past as an excuse for misconduct in the present is absurd. Grow up.

Is there a comprehensive immigration bill that passed the Senate sitting somewhere in the House waiting for a vote? Why there sure is. And why won't Bohoner bring it up for a vote? Why?

I see that zeke is ecstatic about this, now he has 5 million people he can exploit legally..
Who cares? We don't need "reform"..we have laws in place. Enforce them.

You think illegals only started arriving since Obama was elected. Right?

No. That's ridiculous. Why would you even say something like that? Distraction?

As to whether or not illegals will self deport. Sure they will. I have seen it. When there is snow on the roofs up north and roofing can't be done, there are no illegals around. They went back home to live like kings on the money they made on the Americans roofs.

We don't allow lawbreakers to determine our immigration laws or whether or not they'll "self deport"..it isn't up to them..It's a law enforcement matter..They broke the law..

If no roofing companies would give them a job, they might come back, once. Then they are gonna stay home.

If they can't sneak in illegally..or when they get caught they get handcuffed and put on the next truck to the border, they won't come at all.

You all act like this is rocket science.

I'm not "acting" like anything. Why are you trying to change the subject?

Illegals come here for work.

So? Illegal means illegal.

If no one will hire them, they won't come here for work.

Close and enforce the border.
Deport all illegals.

No more cheap labor and human rights abuses for the left and their corporate sponsors.

 

[zeke]

Just further proof there is little difference between BO and W...and by extension, Rs and Ds.

But sadly, many progs and cons can't see the deception.

I actually believe that George Bush had a better understanding of the illegals than Obama does. Something about living in Texas and being exposed to illegal labor for a long time.

I have been exposed to illegals for some time as well. It is hard to hate a person that shows up to work on time and busts their ass all day, 7 days a week if need be, doesn't complain and are good at their job. And they work cheap by our standards. Though by Mexican standards, they think they are getting paid pretty well.

And you know how Repub hate the idea of an increase in MW. What do they think is gonna happen when they push this low cost labor out of the country? Americans will demand an increase in earnings. With no competition willing to work cheaper. And if they (Americans) won't work for what is offered, the employer has no fall back labor to use. That'll show em.

When construction costs increase by 20%, can you hear the bitching?

 

[Kosh]

Just further proof there is little difference between BO and W...and by extension, Rs and Ds.

But sadly, many progs and cons can't see the deception.

I actually believe that George Bush had a better understanding of the illegals than Obama does. Something about living in Texas and being exposed to illegal labor for a long time.

I have been exposed to illegals for some time as well. It is hard to hate a person that shows up to work on time and busts their ass all day, 7 days a week if need be, doesn't complain and are good at their job. And they work cheap by our standards. Though by Mexican standards, they think they are getting paid pretty well.

And you know how Repub hate the idea of an increase in MW. What do they think is gonna happen when they push this low cost labor out of the country? Americans will demand an increase in earnings. With no competition willing to work cheaper. And if they (Americans) won't work for what is offered, the employer has no fall back labor to use. That'll show em.

When construction costs increase by 20%, can you hear the bitching?

You should be happy you have 5 million people now you can exploit legally!

 

[Rotagilla]

Just further proof there is little difference between BO and W...and by extension, Rs and Ds.

But sadly, many progs and cons can't see the deception.

I actually believe that George Bush had a better understanding of the illegals than Obama does. Something about living in Texas and being exposed to illegal labor for a long time.

So? Illegal means against the law. We don't need to "understand" them.

I have been exposed to illegals for some time as well. It is hard to hate a person that shows up to work on time and busts their ass all day, 7 days a week if need be, doesn't complain and are good at their job. And they work cheap by our standards. Though by Mexican standards, they think they are getting paid pretty well.

Border security has nothing to do with race or hatred.

Yes..we know they work cheap..that's why the left wants to keep the border open. Exploiting them for profit.

And you know how Repub hate the idea of an increase in MW.

You can't raise minimum wages with an open border...You can't have a welfare state with an open border.

What do they think is gonna happen when they push this low cost labor out of the country? Americans will demand an increase in earnings. With no competition willing to work cheaper. And if they (Americans) won't work for what is offered, the employer has no fall back labor to use. That'll show em.

Speculation..Let's try it and see...or do you want to continue human rights abuses against illegals so the left can profit?

When construction costs increase by 20%, can you hear the bitching?

Oh...only 20%..Why not 50%..why not 200%?
Making up random numbers doesn't make you look informed.

You'd rather keep "construction costs" low by exploiting illegals cheap labor...That's morally wrong.

Close and enforce the border.
Deport all illegals.

 

[zeke]

Is obama the president now? Why is the border still open?
Using misconduct from the past as an excuse for misconduct in the present is absurd. Grow up

Pointing out hypocrisy is never "nuts". Except to the hypocrite. Like you.

So? Illegal means illegal.

Dude, don't ever break the speed limit. Illegal means illegal. Right.

 

[gipper]

Just further proof there is little difference between BO and W...and by extension, Rs and Ds.

But sadly, many progs and cons can't see the deception.

I actually believe that George Bush had a better understanding of the illegals than Obama does. Something about living in Texas and being exposed to illegal labor for a long time.

I have been exposed to illegals for some time as well. It is hard to hate a person that shows up to work on time and busts their ass all day, 7 days a week if need be, doesn't complain and are good at their job. And they work cheap by our standards. Though by Mexican standards, they think they are getting paid pretty well.

And you know how Repub hate the idea of an increase in MW. What do they think is gonna happen when they push this low cost labor out of the country? Americans will demand an increase in earnings. With no competition willing to work cheaper. And if they (Americans) won't work for what is offered, the employer has no fall back labor to use. That'll show em.

When construction costs increase by 20%, can you hear the bitching?

Yes many Mexicans work very hard and that is an admirable trait.

However what is often not recognized, is the overall societal costs of adding millions of illiterate non-English speaking people to our nation. Many studies have shown the costs for healthcare, welfare, education far exceed the monetary benefit they provide.

 

[Disir]

Just further proof there is little difference between BO and W...and by extension, Rs and Ds.

But sadly, many progs and cons can't see the deception.

I actually believe that George Bush had a better understanding of the illegals than Obama does. Something about living in Texas and being exposed to illegal labor for a long time.

I have been exposed to illegals for some time as well. It is hard to hate a person that shows up to work on time and busts their ass all day, 7 days a week if need be, doesn't complain and are good at their job. And they work cheap by our standards. Though by Mexican standards, they think they are getting paid pretty well.

And you know how Repub hate the idea of an increase in MW. What do they think is gonna happen when they push this low cost labor out of the country? Americans will demand an increase in earnings. With no competition willing to work cheaper. And if they (Americans) won't work for what is offered, the employer has no fall back labor to use. That'll show em.

When construction costs increase by 20%, can you hear the bitching?

That's pretty interesting. I know that it is a point that you repeatedly bring up.

I would like to point something out. Take it or leave it.

Do you know what changed the tide in the feudal society?

The plague.

 

[zeke]

Close and enforce the border.
Deport all illegals.

I am sure the Republican are getting ready to do that. Aren't you. You whine and whine about a Democrat President not bending to your wishes. That's funny. Whine to the Republicans. They have as much or more to blame for this situation and 100% of the blame for not fixing it.

Repubs hate it, won't fix it.
Dems don't hate it and won't fix it and you are all mystified why they won't.
That's funny as hell.

 

[zeke]

Many studies have shown the costs for healthcare, welfare, education far exceed the monetary benefit they provide.

Agreed. Almost. The study I would like to see is what the cheap labor contributes to the profit of the companies hiring them. How much does the cheap labor contribute to the low food costs so that employed Americans can still buy food at a reasonable cost.

It is normal for some corporations of this country to maximize earnings by using cheap labor and socializing the cost of that cheap labor on the rest of us tax payers. If a legal American working at Walmart can qualify for food stamps and that's ok with us taxpayers, who are we to bitch about them low wage workers who help keep our pantry's full. Or a roof over our heads. Pay them more and they wouldn't qualify either.

 

[kaz]

.

If the GOP were smart -- and I'm tempted to bold the word "if" and use the largest possible font -- they would avoid hysterics and hyperbole over Obama's immigration move and calmly and clearly point out the obvious:

Low-income Americans are about to see five million job competitors legalized. All at once.

Okay, proceed with the hysterics and hyperbole.

.

Democrats love poor people, and they are making as many of them as they can.

 

[kaz]

Many studies have shown the costs for healthcare, welfare, education far exceed the monetary benefit they provide.

Agreed. Almost. The study I would like to see is what the cheap labor contributes to the profit of the companies hiring them. How much does the cheap labor contribute to the low food costs so that employed Americans can still buy food at a reasonable cost.

It is normal for some corporations of this country to maximize earnings by using cheap labor and socializing the cost of that cheap labor on the rest of us tax payers. If a legal American working at Walmart can qualify for food stamps and that's ok with us taxpayers, who are we to bitch about them low wage workers who help keep our pantry's full. Or a roof over our heads. Pay them more and they wouldn't qualify either.

Yes Karl, corporations blah blah.

Here's how economics work. Companies hire the cheapest qualified labor for a job. People get the best job they are qualified to get. When you have a match, a deal is done and a worker gets a job.

Now you support flooding the market with cheap low end labor. And that makes the low end wages staying low the fault of ... businesses?

A mirror would change your life, my friend.

 

[zeke]

Now you support flooding the market with cheap low end labor. And that makes the low end wages staying low the fault of ... businesses?

And you have put your complete fucking ignorance on display again.

You dumb shit, I don't care how much the companies want cheap labor. Who forces the companies to hire illegals?

 

[zeke]

Here's how economics work. Companies hire the cheapest qualified labor for a job. People get the best job they are qualified to get. When you have a match, a deal is done and a worker gets a job.

You can tell you are a Republican who supports illegals. That's not going to make you very popular with your butt buddies.

 

[TooTall]

If the Democrats were smart they would be hammering everyday on the House...that could pass an immigration reform bill today if the Boehner would just let it up for a full floor vote.

Americans want immigration reform.

No..americans want immigration laws ENFORCED..."immigration reform" = amnesty and americans do not want amnesty for illegals.

Good thing nobody is granting "amnesty" (well, except Reagan...I wonder if the GOP wants to dig up zombie Reagan and impeach him).

Americans support the Dream Act and other comprehensive immigration reform including a path to citizenship.

I have been told that Reagan issued an executive order that clarified an immigration law that was passed by Congress. That is not what Obama did, and IMO he acted outside of his Constitutional authority. He did tell the Hispanic community and others in speeches at least 24 times that he did not have that authority. He either exceeded his authority one time or he lied about it 24 times.

 

[Kosh]

Here's how economics work. Companies hire the cheapest qualified labor for a job. People get the best job they are qualified to get. When you have a match, a deal is done and a worker gets a job.

You can tell you are a Republican who supports illegals. That's not going to make you very popular with your butt buddies.

So you are jealous that other did what you did and used illegals as slave labor to build your fortune?

 

[kaz]

Now you support flooding the market with cheap low end labor. And that makes the low end wages staying low the fault of ... businesses?

And you have put your complete fucking ignorance on display again.

You dumb shit, I don't care how much the companies want cheap labor. Who forces the companies to hire illegals?

So you want them to have free access to come here, water stations in the desert, border guards with squirt guns who just ask them to not come in, and you want them to get free education, fee health care and welfare and you don't want the government to be able to do anything about deporting them. But you think they shouldn't be able to get jobs so they have to live on welfare and get free education and health care because of course they would not turn to crime, people who come here illegally would never commit a crime. That's your argument. And I thought you were being disingenuous in your argument blaming the mess on business. I was right...

BTW, the majority of companies who don't hire illegals suffer at the hands of those who do. Your argument is like blaming honest priests for the behavior of the pedophile priests.

 

[kaz]

Here's how economics work. Companies hire the cheapest qualified labor for a job. People get the best job they are qualified to get. When you have a match, a deal is done and a worker gets a job.

You can tell you are a Republican who supports illegals. That's not going to make you very popular with your butt buddies.

You can tell that because you are an idiot. I'm not Republican and I oppose illegal immigration. Unlike you on the latter, I mean it.

 

[TooTall]

Low income Americans didn't want to do those jobs to start with.

That has nothing to do with it. You get yet another A+ for missing the point entirely.

Congrats, Job.

I've finally determined that the intellectual capacity just isn't there.

Not one moment of thought given to wage structure.

.

.

If the GOP were smart -- and I'm tempted to bold the word "if" and use the largest possible font -- they would avoid hysterics and hyperbole over Obama's immigration move and calmly and clearly point out the obvious:

Low-income Americans are about to see five million job competitors legalized. All at once.

Okay, proceed with the hysterics and hyperbole.

.

If you support capitalism you support the rich to exploit the poorer against the poor...

Your perception of capitalism.

I know how much you folks dislike it, I get it.

.

Since I am an entrepreneur/self employed business owner, you don't know shit from shinola....I am the one doing the hiring and the last person I would hire is an illegal.

As a business owner with +/- 80 business owner clients - with whom I work very closely on their finances - I do happen to know shit from shinola.

And these five million are no longer going to be illegal.

That's the whole point.

.

Neither will they be full US citizens. They will, however, start paying more taxes instead of working "under the table".

So Mac, do you support the enforcement of immigration laws?

Those that are low wage workers do not make enough to pay federal and state income taxes. Many of them are presently working with false, stolen or no Social Security numbers. Are you sure they will rush to get a legal Social Security card so they can pay Social Security and Medicare taxes?
Some of them may do that as soon as they learn they can get a nice check from Uncle Sugar with the earned income tax credit. Then again, they may just keep working off the books for cash. It remains to be seen how many of the 4 or 5 million do the right thing. I am not optimistic since they broke US law to come here.

 

[JoeB131]

how about close and enforce the border and they won't be back and some new ones won't replace them.

Why do you want the border left open?

The border can't be closed. It's 2000 miles long.

 

[JoeB131]

An anarchist wouldn't recognize borders, moron.

Shhhhh, don't hit him with logic.

When he says that he supports anarchy, what he means is he wants government to protect his White Privilage.