Illinois governor strikes blow for taxapyers...q

[Jroc]

You idiot he's not talikng about the public sector they don't produce anything

So when your house burns down, the fire department doesn't do anything when it comes by and saves it and your life? Because, hey, they're public sector, they aren't producing anything.

We have a public sector because there are some things the private sector won't do or can't be trusted to do.

Your Lincoln quote is not relevent so why post it? The thread was on public sector unions

 

[Trajan]

You idiot he's not talikng about the public sector they don't produce anything

So when your house burns down, the fire department doesn't do anything when it comes by and saves it and your life? Because, hey, they're public sector, they aren't producing anything.

We have a public sector because there are some things the private sector won't do or can't be trusted to do.

 

[Trajan]

Never said they were.

They are largely responsible for the bad shape the country is in, though.

Same difference. You HATE wealth. You believe in redistribution without cause.

No, I believe in a very good cause.

The wealthy have too much, the rest of us have too little. This is never a good thing..

For reference, look up-

France 1787
Russia 1917
Cuba 1959
Iran 1979

To see what happens when that continues for too long.

gosh yes it was wealth that drove all of that.


and lets see how those all turned out-

- Napoleon rises and takes France on a 20 year bloodbath building an empire.

- Russia 1917 ( what about China btw?) the ultimate actionable argument for or against the war on wealth in the hands of 'to few', so, how did that turn out?

- Cuba 1959 another one, a vibrant isolated society of no mean intellectual or productive capacity as a petri dish for another grand experiment in the control of wealth and how its distributed, so nhow thats goiing?

- Iran 1979 oh for god sakes.... same supposed issue, different application in the capture of that society, so, again, hows that going?

THE US had been and has been moving forward and past those nations since their inception, standard of living, technical achievement, etc.....


You have a juvenile fascination with insisting the perfect is the enemy of good.


You refuse apparently to recognize its intrusive statist GOVERNMENT, in all its forms not necessarily wealth that drives upheaval that results in the overturning of 'the system', like it or not democracy in its republican form is the best so far, taking it all into account. There always has been and always will be the 10-15%, humans can be indolent and don't always work in their bests interest and gov. cannot change human nature, thats why communism in all its forms ultimately fails.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Skull,

I'm old enough to remember when we had race riots in the 1960's,and my father showed my mom how to use a gun just in case.

Race riots had many more complicated origins than income.

Thankfully, we had people put some things into place then so they didn't get out of hand. Even Republicans. We stepped back from the abyss.

ibid.

You clowns think that we need to jump right over it. And gosh darn, if you see it's a problem that we are the richest country in the world with one of the highest poverty rates in the industrialized world. well, that's just dandy. Those people working two jobs for minimum wage just ain't working hard enough. Suck it up, pull yourself up by your bootstraps.

Oh, wait. No? You're voting for the socialist? Why are you doing that?

I guess you and I don't define poverty in the same way. I don't call having a car a cell phone and a TV living in poverty.

And there is no reason for you not to get off your ass and make more money except your paralyzing jealousy and overblown sense of entitlement.

And I have never once called Bam Bam a socialist so don't go there with me.

 

[Papageorgio]

Skull,

I'm old enough to remember when we had race riots in the 1960's,and my father showed my mom how to use a gun just in case.

Thankfully, we had people put some things into place then so they didn't get out of hand. Even Republicans. We stepped back from the abyss.

You clowns think that we need to jump right over it. And gosh darn, if you see it's a problem that we are the richest country in the world with one of the highest poverty rates in the industrialized world. well, that's just dandy. Those people working two jobs for minimum wage just ain't working hard enough. Suck it up, pull yourself up by your bootstraps.

Oh, wait. No? You're voting for the socialist? Why are you doing that?

Highest poverty rate? Have you been out of the US? In many countries the annual pay is $250, they don't have cell phones, cable TV, games systems and so on.

The race riots were more complicated than rich vs poor, but some people don't get it.

Your whine over people making more than you is a most telling.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Never said they were.

They are largely responsible for the bad shape the country is in, though.

Same difference. You HATE wealth. You believe in redistribution without cause.

No, I believe in a very good cause.

The wealthy have too much, the rest of us have too little. This is never a good thing..

For reference, look up-

France 1787
Russia 1917
Cuba 1959
Iran 1979

To see what happens when that continues for too long.

Good cause..Yes when you get to use the force of government for your own enrichment. After all, that is what this is all about. Redistribution due to a perceived unfair system.
Oh, we are no where near the instability of those nations at those particular times..
And...Oh this is so rich.
Lets see, the Communist revolution in Russia. Hmm, 1989....DONE..
Cuba...90% of the population lives in abject poverty in corrugated tin huts.
Iran has become a religious dictatorship. The people are kept in poverty. Women are denied basic rights. They cannot drive an automobile, are denied educational opportunities, are subject to archaic and barbaric treatment for the slightest transgressions of Sharia Law. Stoning to death for being a rape victim. Honor killings. Yep, that Iranian revolution is working out very well. That country can barely feed it's own people yet it continues to drive toward nuclear weapon capability.
Your examples are nonsense.

 

[thereisnospoon]

[

Holy shit. You exist in a parallel universe.
In any dictatorial or communist system, all wealth is the property of the central government(CG). The CG then decides the procedure to distribute. In all instances, these types of government have small elite ruling classes that are inside the government. These people attempt to convince the people they are benevolent. The government takes care of only the bare essentials. In each case the people are supplied just enough to keep them in line and out of the way of government policy.
Socialist governments offer certain freedoms. Government largess is achieved through extremely high tax rates as well as value added sales taxes. These systems work in places where societies are orderly relatively crime free and have small generally homogeneous populations.
Communist and dictatorial states control ALL wealth and control every aspect of the society.
Police officers are professionals. They may belong to unions but they would never pull the kind o shit the everyday union thug pulls by saying, "fuck you...I'm only getting paid "X", so I will do a shitty job"..
Police officers are professionals. They don't do the job just for the money.
I cannot believe there exists a person such as yourself with such archaic ideas.

Guy, it wasn't an endorsement of communism. Go back and read what I had to say slowly, and then have someone help you with the big words.

People chose Stalin (and yes, Stalin was fantastically popular with the Russian people and STILL is!) because the Tsars and the Romanovs fucked it up so badly.

Not saying what he did was good. Not saying it was a model to emulate. I'm saying that the thing was, people were sooo miserable under the Tsars that they got behind the communists, and after a particularly bitter civil war (that the west prolonged by backing the losing side) that's what they ended up with.

Hmmmm... wealth inequality and unpopular pointless wars? Hmmmm... Where have we seen that before?

How you can make that great leap so as to equate the Russian Revolution to the 21st century US is a mystery.

 

[thereisnospoon]

No, I believe in a very good cause.

The wealthy have too much, the rest of us have too little. This is never a good thing..

For reference, look up-

France 1787
Russia 1917
Cuba 1959
Iran 1979

To see what happens when that continues for too long.

If you want more then go out and get it. No one is stopping you

The solution to Douchebags is not to become a douchebag.

If you want more then go out and get it. No one is stopping you

 

[thereisnospoon]

If you want more then go out and get it. No one is stopping you

The solution to Douchebags is not to become a douchebag.

That statement is most telling.

People who want more than you and therefore work more than you are douche bags.

But people like you who want more but don't want to work to get it are not douche bags.

If I were you I'd seek some mental health counseling in order to deal with those debilitating feelings of inadequacy and jealousy.

Joe's ideas are borne of a general feeling of entitlement combined with a belief in the myth of "fairness".

 

[thereisnospoon]

Never said they were.

They are largely responsible for the bad shape the country is in, though.

Same difference. You HATE wealth. You believe in redistribution without cause.

No, I believe in a very good cause.

The wealthy have too much, the rest of us have too little. This is never a good thing..

For reference, look up-

France 1787
Russia 1917
Cuba 1959
Iran 1979

To see what happens when that continues for too long.

The zero sum game is a myth. There is no "pie" or finite amount of wealth from which we all draw.
This is true beyond any doubt. Yet you libs continue to base your ideology on this notion.
Your idea that if one has more then another must have less is pure fallacy.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I should probably report you for bringing family members into a conversation, as that's against the rules, but for the record, my parents taught me to work hard, which is what I've done my whole life. I got my first job at 16 and I'm 50 now.

You injected your parents into the thread on the 73rd post.

Yes, I can talk about my parents.

You can't.

Check it out in the rules, in case you are confused on the issue.

He can post whatever he wants as long as the mods do not find it to be unacceptable.

 

[thereisnospoon]

You idiot he's not talikng about the public sector they don't produce anything

So when your house burns down, the fire department doesn't do anything when it comes by and saves it and your life? Because, hey, they're public sector, they aren't producing anything.

We have a public sector because there are some things the private sector won't do or can't be trusted to do.

Essential function of government.
And as proven in 25 states, labor collectives are not a prerequisite to performance of these essential functions.
In fact, in the vast majority, for example, firefighters are VOLUNTEERS..
Kind of blows your "unions are essential" out of the water.

 

[thereisnospoon]

It's not an issue of envy, guy

It's an issue of practicality. Again, look at history. when you have a gilded upper class that no longer connects with the masses inany way, bad stuff usually follows.

The Plutocrats have made a muddle of things. My guess is the next GOP candidate is going to be a religous populist, and frankly, things are going to spiral out of control after that.

Unless we restore some balance.

If the rich are not responsible for your failures, who is?

Despite your denial, you sound very much like one of these people whose parents told them the world owes them a living and your resentment at not being as wealthy as you think you should be is channeled at those who are. It is in fact called envy.

I should probably report you for bringing family members into a conversation, as that's against the rules, but for the record, my parents taught me to work hard, which is what I've done my whole life. I got my first job at 16 and I'm 50 now.

I'm opposed to those rich who behave badly.

The kind that wreck the banking industry, demand goverment bailouts, and then insist they are still entitled to their bonuses.

You know... those kinds of assholes.

Fact is, I'm not the one who wrecked the economy in 2008, they did. I was simply doing my job like a lot of us were.

No, you are opposed to the rich entirely. Just admit it.

 

[JoeB131]

You idiot he's not talikng about the public sector they don't produce anything

So when your house burns down, the fire department doesn't do anything when it comes by and saves it and your life? Because, hey, they're public sector, they aren't producing anything.

We have a public sector because there are some things the private sector won't do or can't be trusted to do.

Your Lincoln quote is not relevent so why post it? The thread was on public sector unions

It was completely and totally relevent, Mr. "I like SOcialism when Zionists Do It"

 

[JoeB131]

If the rich are not responsible for your failures, who is?

Despite your denial, you sound very much like one of these people whose parents told them the world owes them a living and your resentment at not being as wealthy as you think you should be is channeled at those who are. It is in fact called envy.

I should probably report you for bringing family members into a conversation, as that's against the rules, but for the record, my parents taught me to work hard, which is what I've done my whole life. I got my first job at 16 and I'm 50 now.

I'm opposed to those rich who behave badly.

The kind that wreck the banking industry, demand goverment bailouts, and then insist they are still entitled to their bonuses.

You know... those kinds of assholes.

Fact is, I'm not the one who wrecked the economy in 2008, they did. I was simply doing my job like a lot of us were.

No, you are opposed to the rich entirely. Just admit it.

I thought I made my position pretty clear. Go ahead and have someone help you with the big words if you were having a hard time following along.

 

[JoeB131]

You idiot he's not talikng about the public sector they don't produce anything

So when your house burns down, the fire department doesn't do anything when it comes by and saves it and your life? Because, hey, they're public sector, they aren't producing anything.

We have a public sector because there are some things the private sector won't do or can't be trusted to do.

Essential function of government.
And as proven in 25 states, labor collectives are not a prerequisite to performance of these essential functions.
In fact, in the vast majority, for example, firefighters are VOLUNTEERS..
Kind of blows your "unions are essential" out of the water.

I'm not sure what "vast majority" you are talking about.

You do see a difference between the firefighter who is a volunteer auxillery who only comes out in a large scale emergency and the professional who is on call all the time.. I mean, I'm hoping you aren't that dense, are you?

 

[JoeB131]

[

The zero sum game is a myth. There is no "pie" or finite amount of wealth from which we all draw.
This is true beyond any doubt. Yet you libs continue to base your ideology on this notion.
Your idea that if one has more then another must have less is pure fallacy.

Uh, guy, it doesn't matter how much pie gets made if most of us see less and less of it even though we are working harder and harder...

Printing up more money because the rich don't have enough of it is not a solution.

 

[thereisnospoon]

So when your house burns down, the fire department doesn't do anything when it comes by and saves it and your life? Because, hey, they're public sector, they aren't producing anything.

We have a public sector because there are some things the private sector won't do or can't be trusted to do.

Your Lincoln quote is not relevent so why post it? The thread was on public sector unions

It was completely and totally relevent, Mr. "I like SOcialism when Zionists Do It"

Relevant to YOU.
That is an opinion...It is disconnected however from reality.

 

[Skull Pilot]

[

The zero sum game is a myth. There is no "pie" or finite amount of wealth from which we all draw.
This is true beyond any doubt. Yet you libs continue to base your ideology on this notion.
Your idea that if one has more then another must have less is pure fallacy.

Uh, guy, it doesn't matter how much pie gets made if most of us see less and less of it even though we are working harder and harder...

Printing up more money because the rich don't have enough of it is not a solution.

Working harder and harder?

You can't be serious.

The average work week isn't even 40 hours anymore in fact it's less than 35.

Table B-2. Average weekly hours and overtime of all employees on private nonfarm payrolls by industry sector, seasonally adjusted

I haven't worked less than 50 hours a week for the past 5 years and for a few of the past 5 years I've worked 80 to 100 hours a week.

So stop whining that you don't have enough even though you "work hard". If you ain't putting in the hours you can't complain.

 

[thereisnospoon]

[

The zero sum game is a myth. There is no "pie" or finite amount of wealth from which we all draw.
This is true beyond any doubt. Yet you libs continue to base your ideology on this notion.
Your idea that if one has more then another must have less is pure fallacy.

Uh, guy, it doesn't matter how much pie gets made if most of us see less and less of it even though we are working harder and harder...

Printing up more money because the rich don't have enough of it is not a solution.

Oh bullshit. It is up to each of us to improvise overcome and adapt.
Yours is the mentality of the entitled.
As for your last sentence. This is an example of your lack of understanding of "wealth is created"...Creation of wealth is not printing of money...In fact that REDUCES wealth by devaluing the currency.
Here is an example....Let's go with this...A retiree from New jersey decides to buy a vacation home in the Adirondacks of Upstate NY. Instead of just using it a few weeks per year he comes up with the idea of renting it out as a short term vacation rental. He get's $1500 per week in rent. The house is booked every week from Memorial Day through Labor Day.. BINGO!! Creation of wealth.
Oh...The house needed some renovations before he could rent it out. So he hired a local contractor and spent $40k in upgrades.. Creation of wealth. The trickle down effect....All the things needed for the renovation were purchased locally. Cabinets, flooring, etc. The contractor took three weeks to get the job done. Meaning his people all had three solid weeks of work. They in turn spent their money on a few new tools, and other needs for their trade.
Now , tell me where the problem exists.
Without the retiree that had WEALTH, none of the other things would have happened. Wealth creating wealth.
You union knuckleheads don't have a scintilla of imagination.